Among The Costs Of War: $20B In Air Conditioning, Says Former Pentagon Official

[Mr. Lennon]

http://www.npr.org/2011/06/25/137414737/among-the-costs-of-war-20b-in-air-conditioning

"The amount the U.S. military spends annually on air conditioning in Iraq and Afghanistan: $20.2 billion."

 

[bfdd]

weird... you would think they would have a much more efficient system for running all that cooling equipment than ship one gallon of fuel at a time over 800 miles from Pakistan.

 

[xj0hnx]

"When you consider the cost to deliver the fuel to some of the most isolated places in the world — escorting, command and control, medevac support — when you throw all that infrastructure in, we're talking over $20 billion,"

So the cost of the air conditioning isn't anywhere close to 20.2 billion, they are including every piece of logistical support to inflate the price. Considering they don't just ship a gallon of fuel at a time, and they don't ship fuel just for air conditioning, and when they ship fuel it is usually with a lot of other items ...Fail title is fail.

 

[BurnItDwn]

It's fvcking 100+ degrees there, every penny spent on AC for the troops is money well spent. We really need to be NOT going into the fvcking desert in the first place.

 

[mchammer187]

It's fvcking 100+ degrees there, every penny spent on AC for the troops is money well spent. We really need to be NOT going into the fvcking desert in the first place.

Agreed but this is pretty ridiculous if true though

Anderson says experiments with polyurethane foam insulation for tents in Iraq cut energy use by 92 percent and took 11,000 fuel trucks off the road. But he adds there's a lack of enthusiasm for a greener military among top commanders

 

[woolfe9999]

Unless I missed something, it isn't clear from the article if that figure is per year or for the entire time we've been there. That strikes me as a rather important piece of information.

 

[senseamp]

They need more solar power over there.

 

[Doppel]

Place is hot as hell and AC is the best invention ever. $15T wouldn't be too much to stay cool. AC is total win.

 

[Mr. Lennon]

It's fvcking 100+ degrees there, every penny spent on AC for the troops is money well spent. We really need to be NOT going into the fvcking desert in the first place.

This isn't a matter of whether troops should be getting AC or not. It's the whole infrastructure over there that is costing us billions of dollars to sustain.

 

[dainthomas]

Agreed but this is pretty ridiculous if true though

Anderson says experiments with polyurethane foam insulation for tents in Iraq cut energy use by 92 percent and took 11,000 fuel trucks off the road. But he adds there's a lack of enthusiasm for a greener military among top commanders

Is this implying that they were running air conditioning in tents with no more insulation than a flap of canvas? It's not about being green, it's about common sense.

 

[the DRIZZLE]

They need more solar power over there.

I've seen a bunch of listings for grants to develop more efficient HVAC and a refrigeration systems for the military. They have been trying to do something about this for a few years already.

 

[bfdd]

Is this implying that they were running air conditioning in tents with no more insulation than a flap of canvas? It's not about being green, it's about common sense.

Basically that's what they're doing, although it is slightly better than a flap of canvas.

 

[Bowfinger]

So the cost of the air conditioning isn't anywhere close to 20.2 billion, they are including every piece of logistical support to inflate the price. Considering they don't just ship a gallon of fuel at a time, and they don't ship fuel just for air conditioning, and when they ship fuel it is usually with a lot of other items ...Fail title is fail.

I'd bet it's your knee-jerk counter-spin that's fail, but there's not enough detail to tell for sure. Generally when talking about shared costs it is customary to allocate them proportionately across all of the "consumers." For example, if 20% of the fuel goes to run air conditioners, then 20% of the cost of fuel convoys is allocated to the "Air Conditioning Expense" bucket.

I'm guessing that's what the general did here (but again, that's an assumption). In any case, it doesn't seem like an unreasonable expense. I have no doubt it's damned expensive to air condition tents, and I fully support offering such comforts to troops whenever we reasonably can. It's really a drop in the bucket compared to the total cost of the wars, and simply underscores that immense cost. It's just another reason why we should get out as fast as is safely possible.

 

[xj0hnx]

I'd bet it's your knee-jerk counter-spin that's fail, but there's not enough detail to tell for sure. Generally when talking about shared costs it is customary to allocate them proportionately across all of the "consumers." For example, if 20% of the fuel goes to run air conditioners, then 20% of the cost of fuel convoys is allocated to the "Air Conditioning Expense" bucket.

I'm guessing that's what the general did here (but again, that's an assumption). In any case, it doesn't seem like an unreasonable expense. I have no doubt it's damned expensive to air condition tents, and I fully support offering such comforts to troops whenever we reasonably can. It's really a drop in the bucket compared to the total cost of the wars, and simply underscores that immense cost. It's just another reason why we should get out as fast as is safely possible.

Nothing "knee-jerk" about it, it's right there in the article, I even quoted it. $20.2 billion has NOT been spent on air conditioning, that's the total cost including all the logistical support to get the fuel there ...which would be going there anyway. And as someone else already pointed out there's another incredibly important piece of information missing, si this total, or per year? Fail, sensationalistic bullshit.

 

[Bowfinger]

Nothing "knee-jerk" about it, it's right there in the article, I even quoted it. $20.2 billion has NOT been spent on air conditioning, that's the total cost including all the logistical support to get the fuel there ...which would be going there anyway. And as someone else already pointed out there's another incredibly important piece of information missing, si this total, or per year? Fail, sensationalistic bullshit.

You also fail at reading. That's exactly the point I addressed, your assumption that he's allocating all of the cost of fuel convoys to AC. You don't know that to be true; it's your knee-jerk reaction to an article you apparently assumed was anti-military (and it really isn't, if you read it objectively).

As I said before, "Generally when talking about shared costs it is customary to allocate them proportionately across all of the "consumers." For example, if 20% of the fuel goes to run air conditioners, then 20% of the cost of fuel convoys is allocated to the "Air Conditioning Expense" bucket." Nothing sensationalistic about that at all.

 

[GuitarDaddy]

Thats what you get when you try and air condition Hell

 

[Throckmorton]

The reaction from anybody who has lived in the South or Southwest should be "that's it?"

 

[Capt Caveman]

Don't see an issue. People don't seem understand the grand scale of the operations and conditions over there.

 

[Lemon law]

I am old enough to remember the Tom Oaks song from the Vietnam War with Lyrics asserting, "were pretty safe when the troops deploy, just don't turn your back on your house boy."

And now we have a vast improvements, US officers of near flag rank can be as cool and calm as a cucumber, while the grunt in the field has to endure the hellish heat along with all the risks of combat.

But still officers in air conditioning are pretty safe when the troops deploy, with the added benefit of air conditioning.

 

[bfdd]

I am old enough to remember the Tom Oaks song from the Vietnam War with Lyrics asserting, "were pretty safe when the troops deploy, just don't turn your back on your house boy."

And now we have a vast improvements, US officers of near flag rank can be as cool and calm as a cucumber, while the grunt in the field has to endure the hellish heat along with all the risks of combat.

But still officers in air conditioning are pretty safe when the troops deploy, with the added benefit of air conditioning.

My brothers last(most recent and final) tour in Iraq had him sitting in one of those tents pretty much the entire time he was there. He's a grunt, so I'm not how sure your whole "the leaders are dick heads" thing is true.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

When I arrived in the Middle East on a deployment just after 9/11, it was 120 degrees outside and pretty much always a cool 68 degrees in every tent in our little tent city base. I must say I appreciated it from a quality-of-life perspective. Each tent had an A/C unit that was bigger than the one in my mom's 3,000-square-foot house.

 

[HeXen]

..and how much do we spend for all the section 8 folks A/C here in the states...hmm? a nice percentage i'm sure, so leave the troops alone, at least their actually working.

 

[Mr. Lennon]

This isn't a matter of whether troops should be getting AC or not. It's the whole infrastructure over there that is costing us billions of dollars to sustain.

Quoting myself since some of you have a hard time seeing the real issue here. The U.S. can not continue to support the infrastructure over there. pulling only 30,000 troops is not enough.

 

[charrison]

Agreed but this is pretty ridiculous if true though



Anderson says experiments with polyurethane foam insulation for tents in Iraq cut energy use by 92 percent and took 11,000 fuel trucks off the road. But he adds there's a lack of enthusiasm for a greener military among top commanders

These general should be fired then. Logistics wins wars. Of course you cant build empires with a smaller footprints either.

 

[Throckmorton]

When I arrived in the Middle East on a deployment just after 9/11, it was 120 degrees outside and pretty much always a cool 68 degrees in every tent in our little tent city base. I must say I appreciated it from a quality-of-life perspective. Each tent had an A/C unit that was bigger than the one in my mom's 3,000-square-foot house.

Sounds like they needed that foam insulation.

And why 68?? 78 would be more appropriate, and it unlike 68 it wouldn't cause as much declimatization from the outside temperature.