American student finds GPS tracker stuck to car, FBI reclaims its 'federal property'

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pcgeek11

Lifer
Jun 12, 2005
21,620
4,675
136
DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE PATRIOT ACT?

I don't think you do.

Under these conditions:

Originally Posted by pcgeek11
1. You find an unknown something attached to your car.
2. You remove it and it is not labeled.
3. You toss it break it or just dispose of it.
4. How can they hold you accountable for it?

It wouldn't hold water in a court of law. Hell they can't even convict known terrorist in the US.

http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2603003/posts
 

MotionMan

Lifer
Jan 11, 2006
17,123
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81
Originally Posted by alkemyst
DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE PATRIOT ACT?

I don't think you do.

Originally Posted by train
Please cut and paste the parts of the patriot act that would allow you to be prosecuted for disposing of an unknown device you find attached to your car.

I am curious about this as well.

MotionMan
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
no need to, you idiots.

become a significant target and you lose all rights.

You guys denying the power of the Patriot Act or just trolling?
 

pcgeek11

Lifer
Jun 12, 2005
21,620
4,675
136
no need to, you idiots.

become a significant target and you lose all rights.

You guys denying the power of the Patriot Act or just trolling?


Or are you trolling?

You brought up the Patriot Act, but cannot back it up. So yes there is a need.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
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http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A50524-2004Jun17.html

also from the simple wiki which you can go and verify...if you had been paying attention to the news you should have read about it already.
On March 9, 2007, a Justice Department audit found that the FBI had "improperly and, in some cases, illegally used the USA PATRIOT Act to secretly obtain personal information" about United States citizens. [1]

On June 15, 2007, following an internal audit finding that FBI agents abused the USA PATRIOT Act power more than 1000 times, U.S. District Judge John D. Bates ordered the agency to begin turning over thousands of pages of documents related to the agency's national security letters program.[2]

Are you people denying that the Patriot Act is real?
 

MotionMan

Lifer
Jan 11, 2006
17,123
12
81
no need to, you idiots.

become a significant target and you lose all rights.

You guys denying the power of the Patriot Act or just trolling?

That is not quite the issue, though.

What part of the Patriot Act (or any law) makes it a crime to dispose of an unknown item you find in or on your car?

MotionMan
 

waggy

No Lifer
Dec 14, 2000
68,143
10
81
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A50524-2004Jun17.html

also from the simple wiki which you can go and verify...if you had been paying attention to the news you should have read about it already.


Are you people denying that the Patriot Act is real?

thats not what you are arguing though. IT is NOT against the law to dispose of something that is on your car that you do not own. there is no law. not in the patriot act or anywhere else.

BUT i do agree that if they wanted they would find a reason to charge you with something.

not sure it would stick though.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
thats not what you are arguing though. IT is NOT against the law to dispose of something that is on your car that you do not own. there is no law. not in the patriot act or anywhere else.

BUT i do agree that if they wanted they would find a reason to charge you with something.

not sure it would stick though.

That's the point though.

You guys aren't the sharpest tools at this kind of stuff I guess since you think all the world works 'fair' or something.

Chances are if a GPS was placed by the 'government' on your vehicle they have a reason.

While yes there would be no crime in and of you disposing of the GPS, at the same time they'd easily invoke the next step...Patriot Act.

Why would anyone but a terrorist need to remove a government tracking device (whether you know or not)...of course this would be spun by the media showing out of context photos they surely already have gathered.
 

FDF12389

Diamond Member
Sep 8, 2005
5,234
7
76
That's the point though.

You guys aren't the sharpest tools at this kind of stuff I guess since you think all the world works 'fair' or something.

Chances are if a GPS was placed by the 'government' on your vehicle they have a reason.

While yes there would be no crime in and of you disposing of the GPS, at the same time they'd easily invoke the next step...Patriot Act.

Why would anyone but a terrorist need to remove a government tracking device (whether you know or not)...of course this would be spun by the media showing out of context photos they surely already have gathered.

Because I don't want that shit on my car? SO you would leave a tracking device on your car? Because "hey, I'm not a terrerist, I should just let the government track me"
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
31,413
9,307
136
Because I don't want that shit on my car? SO you would leave a tracking device on your car? Because "hey, I'm not a terrerist, I should just let the government track me"

More to the point, you wouldn't know what it was.

Theres no way I'd drive round (knowingly)with a thing like that on my car.
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
Because I don't want that shit on my car? SO you would leave a tracking device on your car? Because "hey, I'm not a terrerist, I should just let the government track me"

Right. You can do this and believe all you want.

However; it's the perception of you in those eyes that will determine it.

All they really have to do is declare they have reason to believe you are a terrorist and your ass gets put away until they decide otherwise.

The object attached to the vehicle is really the least of ones worries.
 

MotionMan

Lifer
Jan 11, 2006
17,123
12
81
Right. You can do this and believe all you want.

However; it's the perception of you in those eyes that will determine it.

All they really have to do is declare they have reason to believe you are a terrorist and your ass gets put away until they decide otherwise.

The object attached to the vehicle is really the least of ones worries.

Let's go back to the beginning:

Originally Posted by pcgeek11
If it is attached to My Car it is My Property.

Not when they invoke the Patriot Act.

What part of the Patriot Act are you referring to?

Or are you just saying that the government will generally "invoke" the Patriot Act, make something up, and throw you in jail? If that is the case, can you just admit that there it not anything actually in the Patriot Act that covers the situation where you remove an unknown item from your car and dispose of it?

MotionMan (A confirmed adult and licensed attorney who knows a little bit about laws and such stuff.)
 

ModerateRepZero

Golden Member
Jan 12, 2006
1,572
5
81
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUS197061744020100827

according to a cbs news article, the FBI was taking advantage of a federal court allowing warrantless placement of GPS on driveways without gates/no tresspass signs as not being "private property". if true, then alky was wrong; it's judicial permission, not the PATRIOT Act, which is why the FBI placed the GPS.

and btw, if it was true that being a target of govt -> "losing all rights", then I suppose said targets mysteriously receive or are restored their rights when they are found to be innocent/wrongly targetted and sue? I'm pretty sure they're not dismissed because they lack standing to sue....
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
Let's go back to the beginning:



What part of the Patriot Act are you referring to?

Or are you just saying that the government will generally "invoke" the Patriot Act, make something up, and throw you in jail? If that is the case, can you just admit that there it not anything actually in the Patriot Act that covers the situation where you remove an unknown item from your car and dispose of it?

MotionMan (A confirmed adult and licensed attorney who knows a little bit about laws and such stuff.)

As an attorney you'd then you wouldn't be so clueless.

It's not like they stuck this GPS on a vehicle on a whim.

The act of removing the object is hardly the problem (which I have mentioned)...the object is also the least of one's worries in this.

Did they make up a reason with the device has been planted? Did they need too?

Surely your legal expertise is not in this line of law and pretty much the lack of it.
 

MotionMan

Lifer
Jan 11, 2006
17,123
12
81
As an attorney you'd then you wouldn't be so clueless.

It's not like they stuck this GPS on a vehicle on a whim.

The act of removing the object is hardly the problem (which I have mentioned)...the object is also the least of one's worries in this.

Did they make up a reason with the device has been planted? Did they need too?

Surely your legal expertise is not in this line of law and pretty much the lack of it.

Personal attacks aside, you still have not answered my question.

That, in and of itself, is telling.

MotionMan
 

alkemyst

No Lifer
Feb 13, 2001
83,769
19
81
THERE IS NOT A CRIME IN REMOVING THE DEVICE...

clearer.

BEING THAT YOU HAVE THE SAID DEVICE ON YOUR CAR IS WHAT SETS EVERYTHING ELSE IN MOTION.

clearer now?

but yeah you guys just believe it's all rainbows and unicorns when someone in power wants you out of the picture.
 

MotionMan

Lifer
Jan 11, 2006
17,123
12
81
THERE IS NOT A CRIME IN REMOVING THE DEVICE...

clearer.

BEING THAT YOU HAVE THE SAID DEVICE ON YOUR CAR IS WHAT SETS EVERYTHING ELSE IN MOTION.

clearer now?

but yeah you guys just believe it's all rainbows and unicorns when someone in power wants you out of the picture.

So you agree that it is not a crime to remove an unknown device and to dispose of it.

Your point is that, if it is a GPS tracking device placed by the government, you have bigger problems than the device itself.

Right?

MotionMan
 

erikistired

Diamond Member
Sep 27, 2000
9,739
0
0
THERE IS NOT A CRIME IN REMOVING THE DEVICE...

clearer.

BEING THAT YOU HAVE THE SAID DEVICE ON YOUR CAR IS WHAT SETS EVERYTHING ELSE IN MOTION.

clearer now?

but yeah you guys just believe it's all rainbows and unicorns when someone in power wants you out of the picture.

we understand what you're saying. you are saying that the patriot act gives them the right (or assumed right) to do whatever they want. the problem is, you have nothing to back up that this would actually happen. i certainly believe that the government would do what they want, and find a reason to claim it as legal. the point (we?) they are trying to make is that you can't point out anything that says it is illegal to remove a foreign object from your car and dispose of it, and you are just screaming about things that happen in movies that may or may not happen in real life.

all of that said, i would not dispose of it and hope things turn out of the best, because i am not retarded. however, i have no reason to be tracked, and if they did it anyway, they would become bored in about a day of my car going from home to the gym to car pool.