America going back to dark ages - cities removing light poles

[3chordcharlie]

I don't know why the freeways need to be lit all night, cars have headlights. At the very least the lights should be on motion sensors, the lights around me are like that and are off until someone drives through. We have way too much light pollution.

So the lights turn on after they were needed, and then uselessly stay on for a while longer, when they once again aren't needed.

A perfect solution!

 

[blackangst1]

Detroit may be a shell of what it once was, but to say its irrelevant and a shithole is disingenuous. It boasts some of the most important architecture in the US.

 

[Capt Caveman]

Thankfully not in my city, I actually was able to get the city to install lights at the local dog park last year. Now, just need to get them to complete the installation of running water.

 

[Doppel]

Thankfully not in my city, I actually was able to get the city to install lights at the local dog park last year. Now, just need to get them to complete the installation of running water.

You must be lying. Don't you realize that Detroit is a bellwether for America and a flawless indicator of the greater USA?!

 

[MagnusTheBrewer]

One of the things that bothered me about the article was the sentence, "In late August, contractors from DTE Energy Co. began rolling through the streets, taking out two-thirds of the light poles."

The only way to turn out the lights was to remove the entire light pole?

 

[dmcowen674]

One of the things that bothered me about the article was the sentence, "In late August, contractors from DTE Energy Co. began rolling through the streets, taking out two-thirds of the light poles."

The only way to turn out the lights was to remove the entire light pole?

Exactly. Could have just removed the bulbs if they weren't going to put in high efficiency ones.

Like I said, they sent the metal to China for the money.

This was "Cash for Street Poles"

 

[Fear No Evil]

One of the things that bothered me about the article was the sentence, "In late August, contractors from DTE Energy Co. began rolling through the streets, taking out two-thirds of the light poles."

The only way to turn out the lights was to remove the entire light pole?

So the power company should maintain thousands of polls and lights that aren't being used or paid for? You do realize these things have maintenance required to keep them from falling over, shocking people, etc? Why let thousands of lights sit idle when they can be recycled or used somewhere else and why let thousands of polls sit idle where they can cause damage or injury if not maintained?

Again, just so people understand, these polls and equipment were NOT property of the city. They were owned by the power company. Just like the cable company has you send back the equipment when you are not using it, the power company did the same thing.. they don't let it sit in the house so in case the next person decides to use it they can have it available.

 

[bradley]

LOL crack a history book open and educate yourself.

I "hate the country" because the OP habitually creates whimsical subject lines. While he was busy occupying your attention 36k times, I had travelled across almost every state and major city in the US, including a visit to Detroit's decades old ghost towns and urban decay with my car doors locked.

Don't expect to get to the heart of Detroit via Amtrack either… a 'giant sucking sound' has preceded the closing of Michigan Central Station (at the time the world's tallest train station.) You could make a stop in Jackson, which has the oldest running train station in the US, built around early 1940.

Being as NY's Grand Central was designed by the same firm as MCS, perhaps we can stretch it as representative and expect abandonment any day now? Too bad the forum wasn't around in 1988. LOL is right, but enjoy your cheap entertainment.

Michigan Central Depot 2011

BTW, some excellent videos on Youtube of the interior of MCS as well as Detroit's abandoned towns.

 

[dmcowen674]

I "hate the country" because the OP habitually creates whimsical subject lines.

While he was busy occupying your attention 36k times, I had travelled across almost every state and major city in the US, including a visit to Detroit's decades old ghost towns and urban decay with my car doors locked.

So what is your point that you have "traveled across the country with your doors locked??

How does that indicate anything other than your hate for the country?

 

[OutHouse]

The lights could be LED based which is negligible power.

LED streetlights would be 100% useless. they dont project far enough or bright enough.

 

[dmcowen674]

LED streetlights would be 100% useless. they dont project far enough or bright enough.

You're kidding right?

Have you've seen LED bulbs?

Have you've been to Home Depot in the last year?

I've personally seen this kit and it is brighter than anything I have ever seen

http://www.digikey.com/us/en/ph/Cree/cxa-kit.html

CXA2011 - The industry's most flexible highest performing LED array


The kit would work well with a down light, an outdoor area light, or most any other lighting design. Overall, the CXA2011 XLamp kit highlights just how easy a lighting solution can be, and is perfect for anyone looking into a switch to LED lighting.

 

[Fear No Evil]

You're kidding right?

Have you've seen LED bulbs?

Have you've been to Home Depot in the last year?

I've personally seen this kit and it is brighter than anything I have ever seen

http://www.digikey.com/us/en/ph/Cree/cxa-kit.html

CXA2011 - The industry's most flexible highest performing LED array


The kit would work well with a down light, an outdoor area light, or most any other lighting design. Overall, the CXA2011 XLamp kit highlights just how easy a lighting solution can be, and is perfect for anyone looking into a switch to LED lighting.

You didn't address the previous posters point who said they aren't bright enough and don't project far enough. How does you link address either of those issues? Have you put that kit at the top of a 50 foot poll and tried to light a highway with it??

 

[Modelworks]

LED streetlights would be 100% useless. they dont project far enough or bright enough.

LED can do what streetlights do , but not at the same cost. LED produce light, the same light as anything else. Light is generally measured in lumens. 60Watt incandescent bulb produces 750 lumen. The LED in something like a power light on your monitor would require about 25 to produce 1 lumen, so 750x25 = 18,750 LED to produce the light of a single 60 watt light. That is the lowest end of LED lighting though and Cree has the new series that output 1000 lumen . The power cost is about 10 watts. The modules sell for around $75 each with heatsink and lens. To mount that in a street light enclosure and provide the necessary power supply you are at about $225 not including install cost. Estimate install at $200 max and for about $425 you can equip streetlights with LED.

So why not re-do all the lights ? Cost. A replacement bulb for a street light is $6.

I support CREE though because they are a major USA employer and my state benefits a lot from them since they are headquartered here.

They do offer a ready made streetlight
http://www.betaled.com/us-en/LEDProducts/LEDStreetLight.aspx

One other thing LED can do that current street lights cannot is DIM. LED can go from 0 to full bright and anywhere in between in seconds. Sodium based lights cannot.

 

[Modelworks]

S
Again, just so people understand, these polls and equipment were NOT property of the city. They were owned by the power company.

I don't think many people are aware of this. Power companies own every pole in a city. If you look there is a metal plate or ID number where they inventory the poles. If you get in a car accident and damage a pole you will receive a bill from the utility for the pole, my niece had this happen in Charlotte, NC. Her car was forced off the road and damaged a pole causing it to crack. A few months later she got a letter demanding $2520.00 for the pole replacement.

 

[Ronstang]

Hey Dave, if America is going back to the dark ages then you have to blame the Democrats, especially in Michigan. This is a case of a state and local government that is so inept it has essentially ruined the local economy over the last 40 or so years so you only have them to blame if there is not enough money to steal from the productive citizens for the government to keep the lights turned on.

 

[dmcowen674]

Hey Dave, if America is going back to the dark ages then you have to blame the Democrats, especially in Michigan. This is a case of a state and local government that is so inept it has essentially ruined the local economy over the last 40 or so years so you only have them to blame if there is not enough money to steal from the productive citizens for the government to keep the lights turned on.

Negative, the Dems are not in control of the Corporations.

 

[dmcowen674]

LED can do what streetlights do , but not at the same cost. LED produce light, the same light as anything else. Light is generally measured in lumens. 60Watt incandescent bulb produces 750 lumen. The LED in something like a power light on your monitor would require about 25 to produce 1 lumen, so 750x25 = 18,750 LED to produce the light of a single 60 watt light. That is the lowest end of LED lighting though and Cree has the new series that output 1000 lumen . The power cost is about 10 watts. The modules sell for around $75 each with heatsink and lens. To mount that in a street light enclosure and provide the necessary power supply you are at about $225 not including install cost. Estimate install at $200 max and for about $425 you can equip streetlights with LED.

So why not re-do all the lights ? Cost. A replacement bulb for a street light is $6.

I support CREE though because they are a major USA employer and my state benefits a lot from them since they are headquartered here.

They do offer a ready made streetlight
http://www.betaled.com/us-en/LEDProducts/LEDStreetLight.aspx

One other thing LED can do that current street lights cannot is DIM. LED can go from 0 to full bright and anywhere in between in seconds. Sodium based lights cannot.

Thanks on your report from Cree

Certainly some mighty pownage in this thread.

Those claiming LEDs cannot replace streetlamps need to edumicate themselves.

It's clear the power savings from switching to LED is against the self preservation of extreme profits by the Energy Companies so they would rather screw the population than do the right thing of course.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Thanks on your report from Cree

Certainly some mighty pownage in this thread.

Those claiming LEDs cannot replace streetlamps need to edumicate themselves.

It's clear the power savings from switching to LED is against the self preservation of extreme profits by the Energy Companies so they would rather screw the population than do the right thing of course.

The only person getting pwned in this thread is you. You've provided no evidence LED is technically able or economically able to replace existing street lights.

Perhaps you should go into business providing LED street lights to cities if it's such a good idea? Or do you hate America so much you won't actually do it?

 

[DrPizza]

Our school recently switched all the outdoor lights around the school and in the parking lots to LED lights. There were all sorts of grants available; the power company gives the school kickbacks for cutting the electricity usage, etc. Otherwise, I doubt we'd ever break even with the costs. But, those suckers are bright! Blindingly bright if you glance directly at them; but the lighting in the parking lots, overall, doesn't seem quite as bright. Close maybe.

 

[Doppel]

If only Detroit had consulted the expertise of Dave McOwen before undertaking this they could have made a much better decision.

 

[Modelworks]

Our school recently switched all the outdoor lights around the school and in the parking lots to LED lights. There were all sorts of grants available; the power company gives the school kickbacks for cutting the electricity usage, etc. Otherwise, I doubt we'd ever break even with the costs. But, those suckers are bright! Blindingly bright if you glance directly at them; but the lighting in the parking lots, overall, doesn't seem quite as bright. Close maybe.

One of the benefits they are stating with LED lighting for large areas is it is easier to light the areas they want lit without lighting other areas lowering light pollution. That might be why they don't seem quite as bright.

I don't think people realize that some of the lights they see every day are actually LED, the new models blend in with the old and look identical. Gallery of places that are using LED lighting, including airports, warehouses, etc
http://www.betaled.com/us-en/LEDApplications/ProjectGallery.aspx

 

[Wordplay]

I work for DTE, so here's a few things I could find.

Dear rcpratt,

I hate your stinking guts...


It would be interesting to see what would happen if they did turn off all the public lights at night in Highland Park. :hmm:

 

[rcpratt]

Dear rcpratt,

I hate your stinking guts...

:|

 

[sao123]

I've hated that orange sky glow since they blotted out the sky before most here were born. Maybe someone will get to see the stars now. Some lighting is needed but we went crazy. Hopefully they'll turn more off. It's a waste of resources and an ecological cluster.

I applaud the removal of public street and city lighting. We should even create a light pollution tax, which would be attached to all lighting fixtures and bulbs. This money could then be used to pay for research on how to eliminate light pollution.