AMD Duron 800 Review *AMD has option to do 128k L2 cache with new stepping* :) :)

[NFS4]

Teehee

http://www.gamepc.com/reviews/hardware_review.asp?review=duron800&page=1

New stepping too.

HOLY CRAP


<< The Duron 800 chips are being manufactured with a new core stepping, that being Duron Model 3. Model 3 of the Duron has some interesting characteristics, the most interesting being the option to manufacture the Durons with 128k of L2 cache, as opposed to 64k. AMD's Product Marking Identification Guide for the Duron m.3 has a stepping code for Durons with 128k of L2 cache, which would bring the entire cache of the chip up to 256k, right on par with Intel's Coppermine Pentium III processors. While the Duron 800's currently have 64k of L2, this strongly hints that future Duron chips may be equipped with more cache at higher clock speeds. >>

 

[noxipoo]

like i guessed when it was hinted in their duron specs files on amd.com GO AMD!

 

[WalkingDead]

Hmm....screw my PIII 800e upgrade plan!:Q I'll upgrade to AMD Duron 800 instead. Anybody know how well is AMD Duron performs in 3D Studio Max 3, LightWave 6, Maya, Poser 4, Premiere, Photoshop &amp; Painter 6?

 

[ahfung]

Ooopps.. that means the next stepping T-bird will come with monstrous 384 or 512KB L2!

Die Intel, go hell with your rambus bedmate.

 

[Shockwave]

Hmm, this Intel vs AMD &quot;war&quot; is interesting, but I feel like I'm at war with AMD tryin to keep up with there processors. Bought a 800 Tbird 3 weeks ago, and already feel like I'm gonna hafta upgrade in about 2 more weeks......After all, if they make it, I GOTTA buy it...

 

[Czar]

Sucks when it only takes 6 months to make your CPU and your Video card obsolete. I HATE YOU AMD AND NVIDIA.

 

[Mday]

=)

 

[Shockwave]

Ya, but where else would you wanna spend your money?

 

[NFS4]

AMD has already killed the 100MHz bus Celerons with this, and they're not even out yet

 

[KDOG]

KEWL. I'm definatley gonna wait for them and a DDR or DDR2 chipset mobo. By the way, what will be the diff between DDR and DDR2?

 

[cdrakejr]

WalkingDead,

I know I've seen info on some of your programs in a review somewhere. I'll try to remember which one and post.

If you're thinking about the Duron 800 then you might want to look at the TBird 800 instead. The reason I say that is because, with the pricing right now (before expected official price drops), the low price for a Duron 750 on pricewatch is $125 so the 800 is going to be at least that much. Whereas the low price listed for the Tbird 800 is $135.

You can compare the performance of the two in the GamePC review.

 

[Noriaki]

That would rock.
Duron 800 with 128k L2 Cache, get it on an AMD760 mobo, run it at 133FSB (I'm confident the duron can make a measly 266Mhz OC ), so you get PC2100 DDR SDRAM, a 1Ghz Athlon-class FPU, and 256k Fullspeed Cache That would rock.

WalkingDead, a Duron would perform quite well in those apps thanks to it's powerful FPU. More cache would help to though.

 

[Modus]

Doubling the L2 cache on the Duron would be the wrong direction for AMD to take. If anything, they should be thinking about removing the L2 altogether. Why?

The Duron is already an insane value; its unprecedented price/performance ratio makes it the best CPU in x86 history. Its intended competition, the Celeron, is a lame duck even at 100 MHz FSB. The problem is that the Duron is encroaching on the high end. Since the Duron performs only about 10% slower than an equivalent Athlon or P3 while costing 30-50% less, there is absolutely no reason to buy any other chip. Already, clock speeds past 600 MHz completely bottleneck the video card, so only the rare CPU-inensive apps like professional 3D rendering and video encoding will see any tangible benefit from higher speeds. Thus a smart buyer realizes that not even AMD's Thunderbird can compete with the Duron.

AMD is now in precisely the same situation with the Duron that Intel was in with the Mendoccino Celeron two years ago: their high end parts are rendered moot by overachieving &quot;value&quot; products. They can respond in two ways: first, by keeping the clock speeds of the Duron siginificantly lower than the Athlon, and second, by further crippling the Duron to make it both slower and cheaper.

Although the Duron is just now reaching 800 MHz while the Athlon has hit 1.1 GHz, the fact is that even 600 MHz is more than enough for any modern application or game. So MHz limitations will not work. Instead, AMD should eliminate the L2 cache, which would leave the Duron with 128k total cache, instead of 192k. This is not so drastic as it sounds. The performance hit would be just enough to keep it above the Celeron but safely away from the Athlon. Also, the resultant die shrink would make it that much cheaper to produce and, more importantly, allow for less power dissapation and a perfect mobile solution.

Modus

 

[KarlHungus]

Modus -

You're forgetting that the Mustang core is soon to roll out. I believe that this new core will increase the performance delta between the Athlon and the Duron. The added benefit of this whole situation is that the Duron is now going to be better able to compete with the PIII, leaving the Athlon paired with the PIV.

 

[Modus]

Won't the Mustang have a similar &quot;little brother&quot; to replace the Duron?

Modus

 

[KarlHungus]

Not to my knowledge, but it certainly is possible.

I think AMD is planning on upping the FSB for the Athlon as well, another benefit versus the Duron.

 

[NFS4]

Yes, the Mustang will have a &quot;Little Brother&quot;

http://www.viahardware.com/palomino.htm


<< Taking the baton from the Duron is AMD's Morgan, set to debut 2 months after Mustang. The performance of this processor, however, is far from what we traditionally associate with &quot;value&quot;, as it shares its core with both the Mustang and the Palomino. Debuting at a lower clock-speed, in the 900MHz range, and a lower system bus speed, 100MHz DDR, will assure that it doesn't interfere with the sales of the higher-end parts, and the lower-end Duron. Sporting 64-128K of L2 cache rounds out this attractive value package.

Supporting Morgan will be a number of chipsets, including models designed for the laptop market. VIA's KM133 and SiS's 730S will perform integrated video duty for the low-end desktop market, while VIA's KL-133 will provide a platform for the mobile sector. >>

 

[Noriaki]

You hit the nail right on the head modus. From a business viewpoint anyways, I just thought it would be damn cool from an end user viewpoint

You are right, however, they are possibly going to have 512k L2 cache on the next Athlon, and I think they will leave the Duron at 64k. The next athlon is also moving up to 133FSB, and possibly even 166 in the not so distant future (after all the DDR on the Athlon has to compete with the QDR on the P4, so it needs 2x the base speed). So between those they should be able to keep a decent performance delta. But we have yet to see the performance of the new Duron..but I think that the FSB speed and big cache size will keep a fair difference.

However, I'll still buy the Duron, it still has to good of a price/perfromance ratio to pass up

 

[PCResources]

<< KEWL. I'm definatley gonna wait for them and a DDR or DDR2 chipset mobo. By the way, what will be the diff between DDR and DDR2? >>



Well, the DDR-II is supposed to double the speed of DDR. But there are more differences to it than that, the DDR-II will be used with a serial interface, packeted data bus, similar to the one that Rambus uses.

What impact this will have on the latency i do not know, yet. But if you look at the specs, they do not look all bad...

And there will be something called QDR, but you will all know about this later on.

Patrick Palm

Am speaking for PC Resources

 

[andylawcc]

boy, only if Modus is the AMD CEO we would be in deep misery.
and rejoice if we are the Stockholders...

 

[Remedy]

LMAO@andy

 

[Soccerman]

&quot;Well, the DDR-II is supposed to double the speed of DDR. But there are more differences to it than that, the DDR-II will be used with a serial interface, packeted data bus, similar to the one that Rambus uses.&quot;

where did you get this? all the info I've ever recieved points to DDR 2 being DDR SDRAM running at 200mhz (thus PC3200 SDRAM).

 

[Dark4ng3l]

hmm I dont get it anymore I thought mustang was the high end, palomino low end and corvette mobile. someone please clarify this for me Morgan just mesed me up

 

[andylawcc]

i think Morgan = Corvette, coz Corvette never really came out.

 

[lowtech1]

PCResources &amp; Soccerman,

Where can I get info on DDR-II memory. If DDR-II is going to be 2X DDR speed then what is their transfer rate?

At the moment PC1600 = 1.6GBs, PC2100 = 2.1GBs, so DDR-II/PC3200 is going to be 3.2GBs???

That mean that it would match DR-RAM PC800 + i840 = 3.2GBs.