Am I an Idiot for Having Bought an "Old" Plasma?

[flexy]

We had a very old Samsung Plasma which was only 720p but it had an awesome picture. I know very well plasmas are not built anymore and Oleds are still far out there and not exactly main-stream, also price-wise.

The Plasma broke (repair is not worth it, I already replaced boards etc. with no success, likely a panel problem) - so a new TV it must be.

For the same price I could have gotten a new 4K UHD "SuperDuper" "Oh so Smart" Hisense 50" LCD/LED, the particular Hisense actually got rather good ratings.

But I chose to get an old 60" 2010 LG Plasma (which also got good reviews) because one of my fears is that a LED/LCD cannot have such a bright and brilliant picture like a plasma..and of course the major argument that a 60" is better than a 50". (I really wanted bigger especially if I want to wall-mount which is another foot back).

I don't need "Smart TV" and 4K UHD. First, I wouldn't even know where to get 4K content. Our digital channels here are MAINLY in Spanish...and we never watch actual TV anyway. I am connecting the TV like I did before to the PC and then either play content right from the PC or use Kodi etc...so I don't care about SmartTV etc.

Also..the "new" Plasma would be full 1080p HD finally which I consider "more than well-sufficient" for basically most content out there, and it would already be an improvement to the 2008 plasma which was only 720p, it couldn't even display some actual digital HD channels which transmitted in 1080p, not that we need it since as I said we don't watch TV.

Anyway, I mentioned to my sister WHO IS AS NON-TECHNICAL AS IT CAN EVEN GET that I get a new (used) Plasma and she basically told me I am stupid because "who in the world still has a plasma"?

So...please agree with me that getting a good BIIIIG plasma for the price of a smaller LCD/LED with features we don't even need is a better choice, otherwise I feel awful

 

[poofyhairguy]

I still love my Panasonic plasma TVs, especially the last gen ST60 at night. When I watch any other TV, even the overall better LG OLED, the motion just isn't as clear. It is all about tradeoffs like anything else.

 

[Kartajan]

Anyway, I mentioned to my sister WHO IS AS NON-TECHNICAL AS IT CAN EVEN GET that I get a new (used) Plasma and she basically told me I am stupid because "who in the world still has a plasma"?

So...please agree with me that getting a good BIIIIG plasma for the price of a smaller LCD/LED with features we don't even need is a better choice, otherwise I feel awful

The combination of your preferred content and the room it is situated in have a HUGE impact.
Size: That 10 inch difference in size means a more immersive experience.
Plasma vs LED/LCD: without looking at actual specs per models, Plasma is an "emissive" technology where LED TV/LCD is a "blocking" technology (yes, there is a lot more to it than that, but I am keeping it simple for your tech impaired sister..) In an environment like the typical living room during the day, Plasmas will generally blow the doors off an LED set.
1080p vs UHD: Content tends to look best at it's native resolution. If you don't have any UHD HDR Content, the "better" specs are not really useful (upscaling is not, and never will be, perfect...)

(I have a 55" plasma and a 70" LED, so the wife got the LED in the living room and I get the plasma in the garage... Works for me )

 

[soulcougher73]

Id probably also look for a used plasma right now if my current panny crapped out. Picture is far far superior to anything else out there pretty much that isnt like $4k+.

 

[daveybrat]

My brother has an LG 55" Plasma in their living room and a Vizio 65" LCD in the basement (newer).

The picture quality is night and day between them. The LG Plasma is just gorgeous to look at, especially for sports.

After you view it for a while then go downstairs and watch the Vizio, it just looks so washed out and flat compared the the LG.

Now just to play Devil's Advocate.....The Plasma you bought is definitely a great TV, i just question how long an already 7 year old unit will last.

 

[slag]

I have 4 plasmas and one lcd/led tv in the house. Plasma PQ is very good for the price you pay for a good used plasma. The only LED/LCD tv I have is a seiko 39 inch 4k that is currently my computer monitor.

 

[zinfamous]

We had a very old Samsung Plasma which was only 720p but it had an awesome picture. I know very well plasmas are not built anymore and Oleds are still far out there and not exactly main-stream, also price-wise.

The Plasma broke (repair is not worth it, I already replaced boards etc. with no success, likely a panel problem) - so a new TV it must be.

For the same price I could have gotten a new 4K UHD "SuperDuper" "Oh so Smart" Hisense 50" LCD/LED, the particular Hisense actually got rather good ratings.

But I chose to get an old 60" 2010 LG Plasma (which also got good reviews) because one of my fears is that a LED/LCD cannot have such a bright and brilliant picture like a plasma..and of course the major argument that a 60" is better than a 50". (I really wanted bigger especially if I want to wall-mount which is another foot back).

I don't need "Smart TV" and 4K UHD. First, I wouldn't even know where to get 4K content. Our digital channels here are MAINLY in Spanish...and we never watch actual TV anyway. I am connecting the TV like I did before to the PC and then either play content right from the PC or use Kodi etc...so I don't care about SmartTV etc.

Also..the "new" Plasma would be full 1080p HD finally which I consider "more than well-sufficient" for basically most content out there, and it would already be an improvement to the 2008 plasma which was only 720p, it couldn't even display some actual digital HD channels which transmitted in 1080p, not that we need it since as I said we don't watch TV.

Anyway, I mentioned to my sister WHO IS AS NON-TECHNICAL AS IT CAN EVEN GET that I get a new (used) Plasma and she basically told me I am stupid because "who in the world still has a plasma"?

So...please agree with me that getting a good BIIIIG plasma for the price of a smaller LCD/LED with features we don't even need is a better choice, otherwise I feel awful

I honestly wish I did what you did. Moved across country 1.5 years ago, sold my 42" 10 year-old 720p Samsung Plasma, and paid about $800 (with labor day sale, BB gift card) for a 55" 4K LED when I arrived.

I preferred the PQ on the plasma, at like 1/7th? the resolution. I want another plasma.

 

[poofyhairguy]

Whats crazy to think about is the last Pioneer Kuros came out in 2008. Since then NO tv has be able to compete with the best of those sets.

Panasonic came close with their last generation plasmas (brighter with not quite the black levels), and LG OLEDs can finally beat the blacks (but not the motion), but no single set is overall better than a TV that was last sold almost ten years ago. And unless someone else is going to start making OLEDs (LG just has piss poor post-processing and scaling), we might see that lost decade stretch even further into the future as the reign of shitty edge-lit LEDs seems to have no end.

I can't think of any other modern technology market that has had that sort of stagnation for that long. Could you imagine using a first gen iPhone today, or only using CPUs and GPUs from 2008?

 

[SlitheryDee]

It's not stupid if the price was right. I'd bet that a decent plasma would generally look better under the right conditions than one of the cheaper 4k tvs. Especially considering that both of the tvs would be playing no better than 1080p content most of the time, something that the plasma should be far better at than most anything but another plasma or oled set.

 

[Rifter]

If my panny 55" plasma dies im looking for another one, im not going LED/OLED untill they get the picture quality to at least as good as plasma. IMO we took a huge step back when we decided to go LED from plasma, plasma is just better tech.

 

[zinfamous]

If my panny 55" plasma dies im looking for another one, im not going LED/OLED untill they get the picture quality to at least as good as plasma. IMO we took a huge step back when we decided to go LED from plasma, plasma is just better tech.

Hey! Are you disputing that "better" means cheap, light, and did I say cheap?

 

[poofyhairguy]

Hey! Are you disputing that "better" means cheap, light, and did I say cheap?

I once heard someone I generally respect argue that LED beat plasma because LED is three letters and plasma is six and people are stupid. Suffice to say LED is simply the Beats Headphones of TVs.

 

[Kartajan]

LED is simply the Beats Headphones of TVs.

I disagree. LED = Nissan Leaf, Plasma = Tesla Model S

*** better yet: LED is the supercharged super tech 4 cylinder motor, Plasma is the V10.
Those who didn't know the difference kept going cheap....

 

[poofyhairguy]

I disagree. LED = Nissan Leaf, Plasma = Tesla Model S

*** better yet: LED is the supercharged super tech 4 cylinder motor, Plasma is the V10.
Those who didn't know the difference kept going cheap....

Most of plasma's life it was the cheaper option than LED/LCD at larger sizes. You analogy is a better fit for OLED vs LED.

Plasma's lost because the modern trend is open concept houses with a million windows and a tv hung over the fireplace playing the golf channel all day. Plasma sucks at all of that.

 

[Rifter]

Most of plasma's life it was the cheaper option than LED/LCD at larger sizes. You analogy is a better fit for OLED vs LED.

Plasma's lost because the modern trend is open concept houses with a million windows and a tv hung over the fireplace playing the golf channel all day. Plasma sucks at all of that.

What really killed plasma is 4k, plasma could not make the leap to 4k with current tech, it could have been adapted to 1440p but not to 4k.

 

[jtvang125]

Still rocking a 54" G series panny. The picture is still awesome but I do wish the bezel was a lot slimmer. I'll let the oleds mature a bit more and come down in price to below $1500 before jumping.

 

[zinfamous]

What really killed plasma is 4k, plasma could not make the leap to 4k with current tech, it could have been adapted to 1440p but not to 4k.

talk about a real shame. I'd wager that a 1440p Kuro would be the best image anywhere for the next 10 years or more, no matter what happens with 4k, 8k OLED or whatever.

 

[Rifter]

talk about a real shame. I'd wager that a 1440p Kuro would be the best image anywhere for the next 10 years or more, no matter what happens with 4k, 8k OLED or whatever.

I agree, the jump to 1080P was where it started to go wrong, it was not enough of a jump over 720P, so they didnt make that mistake again and went to 4k and instead made the to much to soon mistake, 4k IMO is to much for the current tech to keep up with. If they had just gone to 1440p instead of 1080P we would likely all be praising the IQ of 1440p plasmas for years to come, and 4k wouldnt even be thought of yet.

 

[zinfamous]

I agree, the jump to 1080P was where it started to go wrong, it was not enough of a jump over 720P, so they didnt make that mistake again and went to 4k and instead made the to much to soon mistake, 4k IMO is to much for the current tech to keep up with. If they had just gone to 1440p instead of 1080P we would likely all be praising the IQ of 1440p plasmas for years to come, and 4k wouldnt even be thought of yet.

Why are you just making me sadder? I won't be able to sleep for weeks now, dreaming about that ~65" 1440p Kuro that will never exist!

lol--earlier today, because of OP , I started scouring EBay for used Kuros. It was always my dream set and I never owned one.

 

[poofyhairguy]

What really killed plasma is 4k, plasma could not make the leap to 4k with current tech, it could have been adapted to 1440p but not to 4k.

By the time we got to the point where Panasonic was carrying the flag (and a 4K leap had to be made) plasma was already dying. It barely made them money and it had little market share. LG was trotting out basically old models and Samsung never saw it as a primary focus (even though their last high end plasma TV was a really nice one).

It is more accurate to say the cost of 4K plasma R&D not being justified by the 1080p and 3D plasma market killed plasma. 3D was the real disaster. Plasma had a real advantage with 3D that the market never appreciated because 3D TVs were a fad not the future. If 3D would have been bigger then maybe plasma would have had a chance. It's like how the Saturn and 32X killed Sega's console business, not the Dreamcast.

Plasma's best hope was always the Kuro, when Pioneer packed it in the market never recovered from a prestige vantage point.

 

[Zivic]

Whats crazy to think about is the last Pioneer Kuros came out in 2008. Since then NO tv has be able to compete with the best of those sets.

Panasonic came close with their last generation plasmas (brighter with not quite the black levels), and LG OLEDs can finally beat the blacks (but not the motion), but no single set is overall better than a TV that was last sold almost ten years ago. And unless someone else is going to start making OLEDs (LG just has piss poor post-processing and scaling), we might see that lost decade stretch even further into the future as the reign of shitty edge-lit LEDs seems to have no end.

I can't think of any other modern technology market that has had that sort of stagnation for that long. Could you imagine using a first gen iPhone today, or only using CPUs and GPUs from 2008?

I have two 9G kuros; a 151fd and a 600M, both ISF calibrated...I have seen the the last gen of panny plasmas and have to say they were AT LEAST as good as the kuros AND available in 65" models. my brother has a last gen panny VT in his house. overall they are pretty comparable, if not possibly even better.

I now have a LG OLED. it is SIGNIFICANTLY better than the kuros and/or the pannies. Sure it took the better part of decade to get there, but the OLED is as good In motion (it has a different feel to it, I'll give you that, but it isn't worse), better in color, better in blacks. and the passive 3D on the OLED is amazing. if every display had 3D like this, it would have really taken hold in the consumer market. my only issue is I can't get my calibrator out here yet and i have an unacceptable amount of black crush in HDR content.

Sure the Kuros are good/great, even by today's standards, but they don't do HDR or Dolby Vision, they don't do 4k, they don't do 3D. Even the LG webOS is good/great. I have to say viewing the kuros side by side with the OLED, sadly they kind of look like dinosaurs.

the OP made an OK choice as I still feel plasma bests LCD (LED). I would have held out for a killer deal on an OLED. I know the 2016 models were going cheap. CES is upon us and in another 3 months you'll see some deep'ishly discounted 2017 models

 

[Kartajan]

Most of plasma's life it was the cheaper option than LED/LCD at larger sizes. You analogy is a better fit for OLED vs LED.

Plasma's lost because the modern trend is open concept houses with a million windows and a tv hung over the fireplace playing the golf channel all day. Plasma sucks at all of that.

the OLED vs LED part I concede to...
I must be remembering the plasma vs LED pricing near the end vice at the middle/ beginning... I think the one that really killed plasma was the whole "thinner and lighter" thing... (In the minimalist's concept house hanging over the fireplace showing slideshows of modern art.....)

 

[flexy]

Someone sold a 60" Kuro for about the same price, WITH awesome speaker columns even.
Problem: The guy was in Las Palmas, I got a shock to see where Las Palmas actually is. (I am in Spain). Las Palmas is basically down "in Africa", shipping alone would have cost €400-€500.

The LG I was looking at (he sent it off today and it MIGHT come today or Monday) is 2 years younger (2010) model and actually looks really good, it also has a very small bezel. (My old Samsung has a HUGE bezel). I had seen several LG Plasma models, like PK, PH, PV etc....and the newer ones seemed to be lacking with the blacks and I had the impression that the PK series (the oldest of them) overall had the best picture quality, including blacks, judging from reviews. So I went with the PK.

* As for lifespan: Well it may be true that an older model might crap out earlier. Should this happen, chances are it's some bulged caps or something which I am able to repair. Since it's not a Samsung, I don't think this will happen tho.

* As for "3DTV" (shudder!) I had 3D on my Samsung, it sucked, there was ghosting and it was overall entirely un-usable/impracticable. I tried it out once (paid premium to have the 1st ever "3D Plasma", and this was it. Besides I have a Rift! So thanks god I don't need to put up with crappy 3DTV any longer. No 3D TV can came close to VR

* As for "LED" in general, I once was in the belief that "LED" stands for some new, amazing and fast display technology. I understand it is actually not (with the exception of OLED of course). "LED" concerns only the type of background lighting and I don't see any visible difference whatsoever for example between an old LCD with fluoro background light and my new Samsung monitor with LED light. It's essentially still the same, an LCD with all its pros/cons. And while I think a LCD ("LED") is fine as a monitor I can't see myself wanting a giant LCD as TV, viewing angles etc. considered. I haven't been able to compare many types of big screen TVs really, but the old plasma had a vibrant and bright and just overall nice picture which was just a joy to look at. And this is why I went plasma again.

* Also, the newer sets (LEDs) I have seen seem very slim and fragile. This is not a problem for normal people, it's actually an advantage. But we have cats who on occasion to stupid things like jumping ONTO the TV. The old plasma seems sturdy while a new set would absolutely break, let alone the new and fancy OLEDs which are basically thin as a credit card. This time I will wall-mount anyway, but there would be no way on Earth I could put a new 4K that is maybe 1/2" slim on a stand, it wouldn't survive long. This stuff needs to be "military quality" to survive here in the house

 

[slag]

I really really like the PQ on our "new" samsung 64 inch plasma. I think its a lot better than the 50 inch panny viera set we had been using before. Maybe its just the size, but its 2 years newer and just looks nicer. The other two plasmas we have are 42 inch samsungs which are nothing to write home about. They look good, but aren't great.

 

[flexy]

Ok the set was delivered yesterday, extremely quick delivery.

This plasma is slimmer than some others, but calling this thing "heavy" would be THE.UNDERSTATEMENT.OF.THE.CENTURY.

According to specs it would be be 42kg (90lbs) with the stand and extra 10kg, but..uhm...no. We have carried laundry machines with less effort. It is, let's put it that way, really, really, REALLY heavy.

To make things more complicated, I expected also a Wall mount in the mail (which I ordered elsewhere) and obviously urgently would have needed it yesterday, but it didn't arrive yet. So I had to put the set on its stand.
Now is a holiday again, so I don't expect the wall mount before Tuesday. Which means should I ever decide to wall mount (and I likely won't simply because the insane weight).

(In our case I had to go through considerable hassles to protect the backside of the set from cats. Main reason for wall mounting and not using a stand. Because our #+&%!*** cats have a habbit to spray on everything, and let me tell you that cat pee is the WORST for electronics, especially keyboards and displays because it dissolves the traces on the foil connectors....eg. if cat pee gets into the plasma it means almost a certain un-repairable plasma/panel failure, which was likely also the reason for the last set being killed. Sorry for too much information, but having cats CAN be a total pain in the ass)

Anyway the set is "nice", I don't see any flaws or whatsoever and the picture is as I expected. With all the tweaking etc. I didn't even really have time to actually "enjoy" the set. At first glance, a 60" actually doesn't look too different in size from a 50" ( I assumed the size difference being more "overwhelming")...but at second glance it's clear the set is bigger ("doh!") also given the bezel is a lot thinner than what the Samsung had.

The weight of the thing nicely explains (IMHO) why people don't want plasmas anymore I guess.