All the BS on Israel firing on the GAZA Aid Flotilla....and now this? perhaps Israeli

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
33,981
3,318
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Too many ignorant people so quick to jump on the band wagon against israel firing on the Hamanitarian Aid Flotilla.

Interesting article....
Lets see what those who always oppose anything that Israel is involved in have to say......

Most likely they will just dismiss it or try to change the subject.....
They might even try to question the credibility of the Associated press.

Okay I am finished...pulls up a chair and pops a cold one!1

let the anti- Israel apologist go for it...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100602/ap_on_re_eu/eu_gaza_ships_terror_ties

AP INTERVIEW: Turkish aid group had terror ties

PARIS – The Turkish Islamic charity behind a flotilla of aid ships that was raided by Israeli forces on its way to Gaza had ties to terrorism networks, including a 1999 al-Qaida plot to bomb Los Angeles International Airport, France's former top anti-terrorism judge said Wednesday.

The Istanbul-based Foundation for Human Rights and Freedoms and Humanitarian Relief, known by its Turkish acronym IHH, had "clear, long-standing ties to terrorism and Jihad," former investigating judge Jean-Louis Bruguiere told The Associated Press in a telephone interview.

Bruguiere, who led the French judiciary's counterterrorism unit for nearly two decades before retiring in 2007, didn't indicate whether IHH now has terror ties, but said it did when he investigated it in the late 1990s.

"They were basically helping al-Qaida when (Osama) bin Laden started to want to target U.S. soil," he said.

Some members of an international terrorism cell known as the Fateh Kamel network then worked at the IHH, he said. Kamel, an Algerian-Canadian dual national, had ties to the nascent al-Qaida, Bruguiere said.

Among Kamel's followers was Ahmed Ressam, an Algerian who was arrested in the U.S. state of Washington in December 1999 on his way to bomb Los Angeles International Airport as part of an al-Qaida plot.

"IHH had a role in the organization that led to the plot," Bruguiere said, reiterating sworn testimony he made in a U.S. Federal Court during Ressam's trial. Ressam is serving a 22-year prison sentence.

Bruguiere issued an international warrant for Kamel, Ressam's former mentor, who was extradited from Jordan to France in 1999 and sentenced to eight years in prison on terror-related charges.

IHH vehemently denies ties to radical groups. The group is not among some 45 groups listed as terrorists by the U.S. State Department's Office of the Coordinator for Counterterrorism. Nine people on board the IHH flotilla were killed by Israeli forces on Monday.

"We are a legal organization," IHH board member Omer Faruk Korkmaz said late Wednesday in response to Bruguiere's statements. "We have nothing to do with any illegal organization," he said.

"We don't know Ahmed Ressam or Fateh Kamel," Korkmaz said. "We don't approve of the actions of any terrorist organization in the world."

French investigators found in the 1990s that "several members of Fateh Kamel's network worked at the IHH as a cover," Bruguiere said. "It was too systematic and too widespread for the NGO (non-governmental organization) not to know" their real goal, he said.

The former judge, renowned for tracking down convicted terrorist Carlos the Jackal, said he didn't believe the IHH could have been infiltrated by terrorists without its knowledge.

"It's hard to prove, but all elements of the investigation showed that part of the NGO served to hide jihad-type activities," Bruguiere said. "I'm convinced this was a clear strategy, known by IHH."

The judge said he was personally involved in a raid with French and Turkish police at IHH headquarters in Istanbul in 1998, where they found weapons, false documents and other "incriminating" material.

"It was clearly proven that some of the NGO's work was not charity, it was to provide a facade for moving funds, weapons and mujahedeen to and from Bosnia and Afghanistan" — areas focused on by Islamic militants then.

In Istanbul, Korkmaz, of IHH, confirmed the late '90s police raid but denied that any weapons were found and said there was no evidence found of links to militancy.

Bruguiere would not specify how many members of Kamel's terror cell worked at IHH or give their names, but he said one of the suspects, a man from Bosnia, appeared in another terror-related case as recently as 2005 — though there was no indication at the time that the man still had ties to IHH.

Elements within the charity supported jihadi operations in the 1990s, Bruguiere said, before adding: "I don't know whether they continued to do so" more recently.

"But it seemed clear at the time that it was thanks to a measure of political backing within the Turkish government that it (IHH) could continue to operate," despite the strong suspicions against it, Bruguiere said.

Bruguiere retired from the judiciary in 2007 when he took part in an election to become a lawmaker in the conservative party of French President Nicolas Sarkozy. He lost his bid.

Bruguiere, 67, is now the coordinator for the European Union in a terrorism finance tracking program jointly run with the United States.

In Washington, U.S. State Department spokesman P.J. Crowley told reporters on Wednesday that "we know that IHH representatives have met with senior Hamas officials in Turkey, Syria, and Gaza over the past three years. That is obviously of great concern to us."

But, he said the U.S. could not "validate" that IHH has connections to al Qaida.
 
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dammitgibs

Senior member
Jan 31, 2009
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jump_to_conclusions.jpg

I guess I'll put this away now...
 

irishScott

Lifer
Oct 10, 2006
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*sigh* It never ceases to amaze me how people can never just admit there are idiots on the intertubes and go on with their lives.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
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Jihad Flotilla is a better description since its goal is to remove embargo/inspection for later importation of deadly weapons to use against Israeli Civilians again.
 
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jpeyton

Moderator in SFF, Notebooks, Pre-Built/Barebones
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Aug 23, 2003
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Turkish aid group HAD terror ties

So what? The USA HAD terror ties in the 70s and 80s when we gave weapons, training and support to Osama Bin Laden and Saddam Hussein.

Does that mean everything the USA does is now and forever tainted because we HAD terror ties?
 

Danube

Banned
Dec 10, 2009
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If Turkish group had terror ties then they will become darlings of libs/dems who hate Christianity more than terrorists. America at large SO has their number.
 

theflyingpig

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Mar 9, 2008
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Turkish aid group HAD terror ties

So what? The USA HAD terror ties in the 70s and 80s when we gave weapons, training and support to Osama Bin Laden and Saddam Hussein.

Does that mean everything the USA does is now and forever tainted because we HAD terror ties?

HAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!! The liberal mind at work.
 

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
33,981
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Turkish aid group HAD terror ties

So what? The USA HAD terror ties in the 70s and 80s when we gave weapons, training and support to Osama Bin Laden and Saddam Hussein.

Does that mean everything the USA does is now and forever tainted because we HAD terror ties?

Ignorance at it`s finest!! nice to see when they have nothing of substance to say; people turn to stoopid and idiotic comparisons!! rofl
 

jpeyton

Moderator in SFF, Notebooks, Pre-Built/Barebones
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Aug 23, 2003
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Here's a better question:

Is Israel's BS doing anything at all to turn the argument about the flotilla attack in their favor?

The answer: overwhelmingly not.
 

theflyingpig

Banned
Mar 9, 2008
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Here's a better question:

Is Israel's BS doing anything at all to turn the argument about the flotilla attack in their favor?

The answer: overwhelmingly not.

An even better question:

Why should Israel even care what the international community thinks?

The answer: They won't do a damn thing besides talk. Everyone knows this.
 

Nebor

Lifer
Jun 24, 2003
29,582
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An even better question:

Why should Israel even care what the international community thinks?

The answer: They won't do a damn thing besides talk. Everyone knows this.

Yup. Israel is one of the few nations that acts unilaterally to do the right thing for Israel regardless of the international community's opinion. Do you think the UN is going to try to put boots on Israeli soil? Or even sanction them? It'll never happen. Israel is the world's bad boy: everyone scolds them and scoffs at their rebellious actions, but we all think we can change them and bring them in line.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
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I have no problem with the Blockade, just how they stupidly enforce it. This isn't the Soviets bringing missiles into Cuba.
 

Freshgeardude

Diamond Member
Jul 31, 2006
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I have no problem with the Blockade, just how they stupidly enforce it. This isn't the Soviets bringing missiles into Cuba.


its almost an equivalent, minus the nuclear part.

cuban missile crisis was a problem because they could easily target civilians.

hamas and gaza are a problem because their missiles are ALWAYS directed at civilians. in this case, their technology is not great, so they fly uncontrollably.
 

kylebisme

Diamond Member
Mar 25, 2000
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If the IHH actually had ties to terrorism, they'd be on our State Department's foreign terrorist organizations list.

Besides that, the source of the claim, Jean-Louis Bruguiere, is known for making dubious claims:

His controversial report into the April 1994 assassination of then-Rwandan President, Juvenal Habyarimana and his counterpart Cyprien Ntaryamira of Burundi, was made public on 17 November 2006 [7]. Brugière has indicted Paul Kagame, current President of Rwanda and leader of the FPR, claiming that he deliberately assassinated Habyarimana in order to provoke the genocide against his own ethnic group, in order to take power cynically . Bruguière's thesis has been very controversial, and criticized by Le Figaro, Libération and others newspapers. His investigations are based on two oral sources, Abdul Ruzibiza, a former member of the Rwandan Patriotic Front who lives in exile, and Paul Barril, who was in charge of François Mitterrand's wiretap section at the Elysee Palace, and has had an obscure role in Rwanda before 1994. The Figaro, who points the international dimension of the character and his contacts with intelligence agents, both in Russia and in the United States, cited justice colleagues of Bruguière, who criticize him for "favorizing the raison d'Etat over the law."
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
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its almost an equivalent, minus the nuclear part.

cuban missile crisis was a problem because they could easily target civilians.

hamas and gaza are a problem because their missiles are ALWAYS directed at civilians. in this case, their technology is not great, so they fly uncontrollably.
No it's not. These flotillas were carrying humanitarian aid. The Israelis could intercept them in territorial waters and direct them to port and if the ships didn't comply then they turn them away.
 

SandEagle

Lifer
Aug 4, 2007
16,813
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Looking for anti-Semites? Paging SandEagle.

anti-israeli policy !=antisemitism. you throw that term around so much, that the shock value of it is wearing thin. show me one a/s comment i ever made? stupid loser.



btw, why make another thread on this?
 

rudder

Lifer
Nov 9, 2000
19,441
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No it's not. These flotillas were carrying humanitarian aid. The Israelis could intercept them in territorial waters and direct them to port and if the ships didn't comply then they turn them away.

Do you even know why the blockade was in place? Did you know that Israel announced that it would intercept any ships attempting to run the blockade? Sure there was humanitarian aid... because the group that set up the conflict knew they were going to be boarded. I guess they needed all those knives, axes, and stun grenades to open those boxes of humanitarian aid.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
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Do you even know why the blockade was in place? Did you know that Israel announced that it would intercept any ships attempting to run the blockade? Sure there was humanitarian aid... because the group that set up the conflict knew they were going to be boarded. I guess they needed all those knives, axes, and stun grenades to open those boxes of humanitarian aid.
Did you read where I posted that I had no problem with the blockade, just how they enforced it? The Israelis aren't doing themselves any favors by the clumsy way they enforce it. All they have to do is block the path of the ships in territorial waters if those ships don't comply. No need to board them without permission in International Waters.
 

nageov3t

Lifer
Feb 18, 2004
42,816
83
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Here's a better question:

Is Israel's BS doing anything at all to turn the argument about the flotilla attack in their favor?

The answer: overwhelmingly not.
Israel attempted to deliver the supplies from the flotilla to Gaza and Hamas was like "nah, no thanks."

clearly they're not needed if Hamas doesn't want them, so what's the big deal about the blockade?
 

rudder

Lifer
Nov 9, 2000
19,441
85
91
Did you read where I posted that I had no problem with the blockade, just how they enforced it? The Israelis aren't doing themselves any favors by the clumsy way they enforce it. All they have to do is block the path of the ships in territorial waters if those ships don't comply. No need to board them without permission in International Waters.

The U.S. boards ships all the time in international waters.

http://www.uscg.mil/d8/enforcement/default.asp

Should the U.S coast guard wait until drug smugglers are within 20 miles of the coast? If they have intelligence that a ship is possibly carrying cocaine or who knows what... the USCG is going to board that ship... even if it is 1,500 miles away from the U.S. coast (which incidentally is where the largest cocaine seizure by the USCG occurred).

Can Israel not do the same? Especially when the area they intend to keep weapons out of has a history of being used to fire rockets onto civilian populations?