Alabama Republicans refuse to draw a second Black congressional district in defiance of Supreme Court

[akugami]

Alabamans racist? No way. I won't believe it until I hear it.

 

[kage69]

I agree with the sentiment, but do we really want the courts to be able to mandate the legislator pass certain legislation under the threat of arrest? Having a special master redraw the maps I think is the proper way of handling it.

Allowing them to stall for years, is bullshit, though.

No, we want to the courts to mandate compliance with established Constitutional law under threat of arrest. In short, legislatures shouldn't be allowed to thumb their nose at the law and disenfranchise voters simply because they are racist pieces of shit. If they do, there should be consequences. Should judges enforce that? Absolutely.

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

Again, this goes back to my question of how the SCOTUS can make their rulings stick. What can they do? You can't arrest and entire legislature. Maybe just the Speaker or Majority Leader or whatever that position is called in each state. What kind of uproar would that cause?

Maybe impose financial sanctions? Freeze Federal funding? Who would that hurt? Most likely the public, contractors, state employees and so on. What would that accomplish? Make the public mad at the state or the Feds?


And what happens when a SCOTUS ruling is just flat out wrong like CU or Hobby Lobby and a state rightfully doesn't want to accept it?

 

[kage69]

Again, this goes back to my question of how the SCOTUS can make their rulings stick. What can they do? You can't arrest and entire legislature. Maybe just the Speaker or Majority Leader or whatever that position is called in each state. What kind of uproar would that cause?

Maybe impose financial sanctions? Freeze Federal funding? Who would that hurt? Most likely the public, contractors, state employees and so on. What would that accomplish? Make the public mad at the state or the Feds?


And what happens when a SCOTUS ruling is just flat out wrong like CU or Hobby Lobby and a state rightfully doesn't want to accept it?

Why can't suspects be arrested? Why is the response to the crime the thing to worry about, rather than the crime? We have a DoJ and US Fed Marshals Service, under a system where Federal law takes precedence over state law. We have over 1,700 Marshals to call on. I'm sure something can be done. It's Alabama; the public, contractors and state employees are already being screwed. I don't see how Alabama improves if the rednecks get to play pick and choose over what laws they follow.

It's a red welfare state, halting the funds from D.C until Alabama fulfills it's Constitutional obligations would be a good start. Alabama understands the whole hostage thing, ain't that right Tommy Tuberville? Feds should adopt some language these assholes understand. Gut Huntsville, move everything of space program worth to Colorado, or some other state more worthy of it. Fuck around = find out. Take the gloves off with these hillbillies, it's time Alabama join the rest of us in the 21st century.

 

[Zorba]

No, we want to the courts to mandate compliance with established Constitutional law under threat of arrest. In short, legislatures shouldn't be allowed to thumb their nose at the law and disenfranchise voters simply because they are racist pieces of shit. If they do, there should be consequences. Should judges enforce that? Absolutely.

They are enforcing it by forcing a new map.

Forcing the legislative branch to pass things under the threat of arrest puts the courts well over the legislator.

What if the supreme court bans abortion and then they ordered the arrest of any state legislator that didn't immediately vote for a full abortion ban.

 

[kage69]

They are enforcing it by forcing a new map.

Forcing the legislative branch to pass things under the threat of arrest puts the courts well over the legislator.

What if the supreme court bans abortion and then they ordered the arrest of any state legislator that didn't immediately vote for a full abortion ban.

Got that part, my question was regarding what happens after certain Alabamians again acted on their intent to disenfranchise voters? Has this kind of belligerence in Alabama become tradition because nothing ever comes of it? New maps don't seem to be punitive enough to change behavior it would seem.

What if one state continuing to flip off the Voting Rights Act leads to others deciding to do the exact same kind of thing from here on out? 5 or 6 states with GQP controlled legislatures suddenly decide racial discrimination is perfectly fine and things will get unpleasant I imagine.

 

[HomerJS]

They are enforcing it by forcing a new map.

Forcing the legislative branch to pass things under the threat of arrest puts the courts well over the legislator.

What if the supreme court bans abortion and then they ordered the arrest of any state legislator that didn't immediately vote for a full abortion ban.

Federal troops were sent in to allow black students to enter school when the Governer was attempting to stop desegregation. Why isn't that good now? What you are also saying is if Alabama manages to stall until after the 2024 election we just let that slide. What we are all saying is the civil rights of black citizens in that state doesn't matter.

Arkansas troops block "Little Rock Nine" from entering segregated high school | September 4, 1957 | HISTORY

Arkansas governor Orval Faubus enlists the National Guard to prevent nine African American students from entering Central High School in Little Rock. The armed Arkansas militia troops surrounded the school while an angry crowd of some 400 whites jeered, booed, and threatened to lynch the...

www.history.com

 

[outriding]

You know... If i stopped doing my job i would not get paid..

They are not doing their job should not get a paycheck..

Everyday they dont fix this it is a week without pay.. and not delay pay.. no unemployment.. nothing...

I feel the only way to get people to do the right thing is jail or hit them financially

 

[tweaker2]

So holding Alabama in contempt of the Court's decision and fining and jailing the state's political leadership under that common practice is legal, yes? If so, I wonder why that course of action hasn't been taken when this same action is practiced every day in Courts throughout the nation?

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

It's one thing to charge individuals with Contempt of Court (or Congress like a certain MAGAt recently found out). How do you charge an entire state?

 

[HomerJS]

Like I predicted, the stall continues. Where is all this law and order fervor? What happens to ordinary citizens who flout court decisions?

Alabama Attorney General to Appeal Redistricting Decision to Supreme Court

A panel of judges on Tuesday rejected a map drafted by the state Legislature that did not contain a Black-opportunity district

themessenger.com

 

[Pens1566]

Like I predicted, the stall continues. Where is all this law and order fervor? What happens to ordinary citizens who flout court decisions?

Alabama Attorney General to Appeal Redistricting Decision to Supreme Court

A panel of judges on Tuesday rejected a map drafted by the state Legislature that did not contain a Black-opportunity district

themessenger.com

And they'll either shadow docket it in favor of the state or they'll grant cert with a stay which pushes it past '24.

 

[sandorski]

It's one thing to charge individuals with Contempt of Court (or Congress like a certain MAGAt recently found out). How do you charge an entire state?

Revoke their Statehood. Part them out to neighbouring States.

 

[Zorba]

Got that part, my question was regarding what happens after certain Alabamians again acted on their intent to disenfranchise voters? Has this kind of belligerence in Alabama become tradition because nothing ever comes of it? New maps don't seem to be punitive enough to change behavior it would seem.

What if one state continuing to flip off the Voting Rights Act leads to others deciding to do the exact same kind of thing from here on out? 5 or 6 states with GQP controlled legislatures suddenly decide racial discrimination is perfectly fine and things will get unpleasant I imagine.

I would think the next step would be to refuse to sit their reps in congress. But probably easier to start fining the state by withholding funds.

 

[Zorba]

Federal troops were sent in to allow black students to enter school when the Governer was attempting to stop desegregation. Why isn't that good now? What you are also saying is if Alabama manages to stall until after the 2024 election we just let that slide. What we are all saying is the civil rights of black citizens in that state doesn't matter.

Arkansas troops block "Little Rock Nine" from entering segregated high school | September 4, 1957 | HISTORY

Arkansas governor Orval Faubus enlists the National Guard to prevent nine African American students from entering Central High School in Little Rock. The armed Arkansas militia troops surrounded the school while an angry crowd of some 400 whites jeered, booed, and threatened to lynch the...

www.history.com

I am not saying that.

Are you saying we should send in the army and force the legislators to vote a certain way? Feels pretty 1932 Germany to me. The whole "Too close to the election" BS needs to stop, there should be an immediate removal of the ill-gotten seat.

The real problem is maps drawn by politicains, that is what needs to end.

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

You have to be careful not to do anything to plant the seed of secession.

 

[kage69]

It's one thing to charge individuals with Contempt of Court (or Congress like a certain MAGAt recently found out). How do you charge an entire state?

Why would the entire state be charged? I haven't seen anyone submit that, even in jest. I think everyone understands the culprits are the confederate windbag of a governor and her good ol boys in Montgomery. You know, the people who were proudly telling Federal judges 'no thanks, we're entitled to keep the coloreds down in the great state of 'Bama - we know it better.'

Craven, racist repugs involved who took oaths of office != the entire state of Alabama

 

[sdifox]

Just withhold federal transfer fund.

 

[sdifox]

You have to be careful not to do anything to plant the seed of secession.

LoL the welfare queen state is gonna secede?

 

[kage69]

You have to be careful not to do anything to plant the seed of secession.

Not really, it's already a hot topic among the losers and traitors but thankfully they're all pretty much incompetent cowards.

What we have to do is not tolerate ridiculous un Constitutional behavior from christofascists.

 

[HomerJS]

I am not saying that.

Are you saying we should send in the army and force the legislators to vote a certain way? Feels pretty 1932 Germany to me. The whole "Too close to the election" BS needs to stop, there should be an immediate removal of the ill-gotten seat.

The real problem is maps drawn by politicains, that is what needs to end.

There is nothing to vote on. SCOTUS has given the order. I say send in troops to enforce like they did for civil rights violations in the 50s and 60s. Are you saying troops should NOT have been sent in then?

 

[Lost_in_the_HTTP]

Johnson sent troops to protect children going to school because he felt the state guard under Wallace could not be trusted (or something like that).

Johnson also sent the 82nd and 101st Airborne to Detroit to quell riots

There are no children going to school here and so far there are no riots.

 

[HomerJS]

Johnson sent troops to protect children going to school because he felt the state guard under Wallace could not be trusted (or something like that).

Johnson also sent the 82nd and 101st Airborne to Detroit to quell riots

There are no children going to school here and so far there are no riots.

In Arkansas the Governer send in state troops to stop black students from entering schools in defiance of an order from SCOTUS in Brown v Board of Ed. President Eisenhower sent in federal troops to enforce the court's ruling. This case is VERY similar.

I want to see the same kind of fight for voting rights by this government.

 

[Zorba]

There is nothing to vote on. SCOTUS has given the order. I say send in troops to enforce like they did for civil rights violations in the 50s and 60s. Are you saying troops should NOT have been sent in then?

Troops were protecting children from violence not forcing school boards to vote a certain way. Pretty big difference in the facts and potential consequences.

 

[Zorba]

In Arkansas the Governer send in state troops to stop black students from entering schools in defiance of an order from SCOTUS in Brown v Board of Ed. President Eisenhower sent in federal troops to enforce the court's ruling. This case is VERY similar.

I want to see the same kind of fight for voting rights by this government.

Did the troops arrest the governor or protect the children? What you are asking for is extremely different.