Al-Qaeda to Canada: You're next!

Aug 14, 2001
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http://www.canada.com/national/nationalpost/news/story.html?id=aed9d12f-689e-4725-b652-12d25afe4ebe

ISLAMABAD - The Al-Qaeda terror network views Canada as a legitimate target because it is a "selfish" nation committing "terrorism" against Muslims around the world, an unofficial spokesman for jihadists waging holy war against the West said Friday.

Khalid Khawaja, a friend of Osama bin Laden's who calls the Saudi terrorist and his followers "the most wonderful people of the world," told the National Post that Canadians should not be surprised if suicide bombers want to strike their country.

"It is very simple," he said. "As Bush says, either you are a friend or you are an enemy. So if you are not my friend, you are our enemy. So it is very simple. When you are supporting the enemy [the United States] then you are a target."

He also said Canada was hated because of its military presence in Afghanistan and its treatment of the Khadr family, notably Abdul Karim, the teen who set off a public outcry when he returned to Toronto for medical treatment after he was wounded in a shootout in Pakistan that left his al-Qaeda father dead.

"Look at these Canadians. They have millions and millions of dollars to fight against Muslims, to send their troops, to send their weapons, and all of them put together, they have objections to giving treatment to this 14 year-old-boy who has been a victim of your terrorism."

Bin Laden first publicly encouraged attacks against Canada in a statement broadcast on Nov. 12, 2002. In March, 2004, an al-Qaeda manual posted on the Internet ranked Canadians as the fifth most important targets.

But al-Qaeda and its ideological theorists have provided little explanation as to why. Canada did not send troops to Iraq, its foreign policy is not particularly pro-Israel and Ottawa has not been overly aggressive in fighting terror.

A top Canadian terrorism expert said Mr. Khawaja's comments were typical of the way al-Qaeda followers view the world, as divided between two conflicting religious and cultural camps: Dar ul-Islam, the perfect Muslim world, and Dar ul-Harb, the immoral rest of the world.

"Canada, as a secular democratic society, is by definition assigned to Dar ul-Harb. From the perspective of al-Qaeda and associated Islamic militants, it is incumbent upon Muslims to wage a jihad, a holy war, against Dar ul-Harb in order to destroy its perceived evils and transform those societies into Dar ul-Islam," said Professor Martin Rudner.

"According to this doctrine, Canada is a religiously sanctioned target for terrorism, suicide bombing and political violence," said Prof. Rudner, Director of the Canadian Centre of Intelligence and Security Studies at Carleton University's Norman Paterson School of International Affairs.

A Canadian intelligence report written shortly after bin Laden first urged attacks against Canada said the country was singled out "in view of its support of the U.S." The more recent al-Qaeda manual explains only that Canada is a "Christian" country.

According to a translation of an article written by Abu Ayman al-Hilali, a senior al-Qaeda leader and ideologist, the United States, Britain, France, Italy, Canada, Germany, and Australia are "enemies" and attacks against their civilians are justified. Since Western governments are engaged in a war against Islam, he argued, the civilian voters who elect those governments cannot be considered non-combatants and are legitimate targets for terrorists.

In an interview in Islamabad yesterday, Mr. Khawaja, who fought with bin Laden in Afghanistan and openly admits he supports jihad activities, provided a rare explanation of why terrorists wish to bring violence to Canada.

Suicide bombers are simply fighting back against the Western assault on their faith and Canadians should just learn to "take it," he said.

"Today you have the power in your hand. The other day the suicide bomber also has power. So you use your cruise missiles and atom bombs and all that, so he uses his power. So why do you cry at that time? When you say we are fighting a war against you, so better take it then.

"They are also fighting a war against you. They are fighting their way, you are fighting your way. So let's be happy. But only thing is, your faces are pulled down, you are scared, sitting in America and Canada. You are scared of a man sitting in the cave."

"We are not scared of you."

He described life as a "cage" and a "prison" from which he hoped to escape. "We love it like we want to live in a toilet, and we just want to get out of it." And the best way to leave life is in jihad, he said. "So how can you fight with us?"

Mr. Khawaja would not say when he last spoke with bin Laden but his recent activities include helping the families of al-Qaeda members killed in a 1998 U.S. cruise missile strike on a terror training camp in Afghanistan, and helping the Khadr family of Ontario.

The return of Mrs. Khadr and her youngest son Abdul Karim to Canada, and the broadcast of comments in which the mother and her daughter praised suicide bombings, outraged many Canadians. Thousands signed a petition calling for the deportation of the family.

"You have paralyzed [Abdul Karim], your system has paralyzed him -- although of course he's been paralyzed by Pakistan Army, but it was under order of this coalition. To me I call them governments of terrorists, the coalition of terrorists.

"So you paralyzed this boy with no thought, you paralyzed his father with no thought, now the whole Canadian nation put together, they are bothered about taxpayers' money, that this boy should not be treated with this money.

"You have all the money to kill the people, you have all the billions of dollars to make the people slaves, you have billions of dollars to torture the people, you have billions of dollars to put up in the media to create false enemies and you have no money to give treatment to one of your victims. So what treatment do you deserve?

"Your civilization is selfish and self-centred. Just you want to live and enjoy yourselves and that is all, you don't give."

He said terrorist attacks would end only when the West stopped trying to dominate the Muslim world.

"We don't believe in killing innocent people but we would certainly like to send you into the Stone Age the same way you have sent us into the Stone Age."

I like the canada.com subtitle headline..they were mean! :)

I think it's weird that they don't like Canada and that it's one of the main targets.
 

conjur

No Lifer
Jun 7, 2001
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"We don't believe in killing innocent people but we would certainly like to send you into the Stone Age the same way you have sent us into the Stone Age."



The perfect reason to get the Arab governments to start moving on their own to democracies and providing education, equal rights, and job opportunities to its citizens.

Thomas Friedmann nailed it:

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/05/09/opinion/09FRIE.html

Cursed by Oil
I visited the Japanese cellphone company DoCoMo in Tokyo 10 days ago. A robot made by Honda gave me part of the tour, even bowing in perfect Japanese fashion. My visit there coincided with yet another suicide bomb attack against U.S. forces in Iraq. I could not help thinking: Why are the Japanese making robots into humans, while Muslim suicide squads are making humans into robots?

The answer has to do in part with the interaction between culture and natural resources. Countries such as Japan, Korea, Taiwan and China have relatively few natural resources like oil. As a result, in the modern age, their first instinct is to look inward, assess their weaknesses, try to learn as much as they can from foreigners and then beat them at their own game. In order to beat the Westerners, they have even set aside many of their historical animosities so they can invest in each other's countries and get all the benefits of free trade.

The Arab world, alas, has been cursed with oil. For decades, too many Arab countries have opted to drill a sand dune for economic growth rather than drilling their own people ? men and women ? in order to tap their energy, creativity, intellect and entrepreneurship. Arab countries barely trade with one another, and unlike Korea and Japan, rarely invent or patent anything. But rather than looking inward, assessing their development deficits, absorbing the best in modern knowledge that their money can buy and then trying to beat the West at its own game, the Arab world in too many cases has cut itself off, blamed the enduring Palestine conflict or colonialism for delaying reform, or found dignity in Pyrrhic victories like Falluja.

To be sure, there are exceptions. Jordan, Qatar, Bahrain, Dubai, Morocco and Tunisia are all engaged in real experiments with modernization, but the bigger states are really lost. A week ago we were treated again to absurd Saudi allegations that "Zionists" were behind the latest bombing in Saudi Arabia, because, said Saudi officials, "Zionists" clearly benefit from these acts. Someone ought to tell the Saudis this: Don't flatter yourselves. The only interest Israelis have in Saudi Arabia is flying over it to get to India and China ? countries that actually trade and manufacture things other than hatred of "infidels."

The Bush team has made a mess in Iraq, but the pathologies of the Arab world have also contributed ? and the sheer delight that some Arab media take in seeing Iraq go up in flames is evidence of that. It's time for the Arab world to grow up ? to stop dancing on burning American jeeps and claiming that this is some victory for Islam.

One thing about countries like Singapore, Korea, Taiwan and Japan, they may not have deserts but they sure know the difference between the mirage and the oasis ? between victories that come from educating your population to innovate and "victories" that come from a one-night stand by suicidal maniacs like 9/11.

As I said, the Bush team has made a mess in Iraq. And I know that Abu Ghraib will be a lasting stain on the Pentagon leadership. But here's what else I know from visiting Iraq: There were a million acts of kindness, generosity and good will also extended by individual U.S. soldiers this past year ? acts motivated purely by a desire to give Iraqis the best chance they've ever had at decent government and a better future. There are plenty of Iraqis and Arabs who know that.

Yes, we Americans need to look in a mirror and ask why we've become so radioactive. But the Arabs need to look in a mirror too. "They are using our mistakes to avoid their own necessity to change, reform and modernize," says the Mideast expert Stephen P. Cohen.

A senior Iraqi politician told me that he recently received a group of visiting Iranian journalists in his home. As they were leaving, he said, two young Iranian women in the group whispered to him: "Succeed for our sake." Those Iranian women knew that if Iraqis could actually produce a decent, democratizing government it would pressure their own regime to start changing ? which is why the Iranian, Syrian and Saudi regimes are all rooting for us to fail.

But you know what? Despite everything, we still have a chance to produce a decent outcome in Iraq, if we get our eye back on the ball. Of course, if we do fail, that will be our tragedy. But for the Arabs, it will be a huge lost opportunity ? one that will only postpone their future another decade. Too bad so few of them have the courage to stand up and say that. I guess it must be another one of those "Zionist" plots.
 

Martin

Lifer
Jan 15, 2000
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Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
appeasement payback...

time to join the fight..

Either appeasement has some new meaning I have not yet heard of, or you're a dumbass.

I'd bet on the latter.
 

biostud

Lifer
Feb 27, 2003
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I guess that Al-Queda United just can't stand loosing in Hockey :D

The goal for the terrorist is to stir up the political situation, so that they get the "good vs evil" going, and since US has already been drawn into this, they move to the next country.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
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Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
appeasement payback...

time to join the fight..

Canada has Appeased no one and will not Appease Bush in Iraq either!
 

klah

Diamond Member
Aug 13, 2002
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Top Saudi cleric to visit Canada.

May 13, 2004

Sheikh Abd Al-Rahman Al-Sudayyis, the Saudi government appointed imam of the Grand Mosque in Mecca, will give a series of lectures in Canada next week

The themes of his sermons are characterized by confrontation toward non-Muslims. Al-Sudayyis calls Jews "scum of the earth" and "monkeys and pigs" who should be "annihilated." Other enemies of Islam, he says, are "worshippers of the cross" and "idol-worshipping Hindus" who should be fought. Al-Sudayyis has been consistent in calling for jihad in Kashmir and Chechnya, for Jerusalem to be liberated, and for the "occupiers in Iraq" to also be fought.

"the Jews of yesterday are the evil fathers of the Jews of today, who are evil offspring, infidels, distorters of [others'] words, calf-worshippers, prophet-murderers, prophecy-deniers ... the scum of the human race 'whom Allah cursed and turned into apes and pigs....' These are the Jews, an ongoing continuum of deceit, obstinacy, licentiousness, evil, and corruption...."
Isn't promoting hatred against an identifiable group a felony in Canada?
 

Genesys

Golden Member
Nov 10, 2003
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Originally posted by: conjur
...The perfect reason to get the Arab governments to start moving on their own to democracies and providing education, equal rights, and job opportunities to its citizens.

Thomas Friedmann nailed it...

the thing is, Arab governments don't want to move to democracies, they're perfectly content to stay in their current archaic govenments. the only way to get them to move on is to force them to do it. i know it sounds kind of harsh to the bleeding hearts on the board, but reality dictates otherwise.

and yes, Thomas Friedmann did nail it, I thought that was a good piece.
 

jagec

Lifer
Apr 30, 2004
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wow, I thought Canada was the ultimate "everyone likes or at worst light-heartedly mocks me" country.
 

viivo

Diamond Member
May 4, 2002
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This is odd since Canada's national and foreign policy has long been "We're not the United States! We promise! We do the opposite of everything they do! We say 'eh' and 'aboot' which people find cute! We're friendly, god dammit!"

Which is fine by me, and it's something I hope we soon adopt as well.
 

AnImuS

Senior member
Sep 28, 2001
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i still wonder till this day why we haven't invaded canada. it should take only a couple days to conquer it.
 

jagec

Lifer
Apr 30, 2004
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Originally posted by: AnImuS
i still wonder till this day why we haven't invaded canada. it should take only a couple days to conquer it.

well, we don't have a good reason to...

/thinks back to the last few US wars.

Screw that!
Invade Canada to liberate them from weed and free health care!
we can call it "Operation The United States Is Altruistic, No Really"
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
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Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
appeasement payback...

time to join the fight..
What are they doing in Afghanistan then but to fight and destroy Al Qaeda? HS sh!ts the bed again!
 

EagleKeeper

Discussion Club Moderator<br>Elite Member
Staff member
Oct 30, 2000
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Originally posted by: conjur
"We don't believe in killing innocent people but we would certainly like to send you into the Stone Age the same way you have sent us into the Stone Age."



The perfect reason to get the Arab governments to start moving on their own to democracies and providing education, equal rights, and job opportunities to its citizens.

Why do we have the need/authorization to perform this action.
We have gone into Iraq because of a percieved threat and previous actions.


Should the Arab governments try to impliment the Western democratic values, they may loose their control.

Most times when a regieme changes, there are drastic problems for the people of the area.

Most populations are not able to handle changes of that magnitude. We have tried to impliment this change in Iraq and it is not succeeding very well.

Democracy did not work well in the Balkans.
Has not worked very well in the old USSR.

If a population is used to a authoritarian government, they function very well on their own. the shock to the system is to great.

Change takes time, The Western values look for short term result (2 - 5 -10) years), not 5 - 10 generations. Time is needed to remove the experience of what originally existed. That requires the death of any generations that may have had interaction with the old system or direct exposure to those that did.
 

Klixxer

Diamond Member
Apr 7, 2004
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Originally posted by: RabidMongoose
Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
appeasement payback...

time to join the fight..

Aren't Canadians in Afghanistan? I don't understand this appeasement payback thing.

It's simple, if your country is one of the 180 that thought that Iraq may have WMD's but not sure and want to inspect, then you have appeased Al Quaida.

No, i can't explain why, i doubt anyone can but that is the way the minds of these people works.
 

Iron Woode

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 10, 1999
31,396
12,872
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Originally posted by: RabidMongoose
Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
appeasement payback...

time to join the fight..

Aren't Canadians in Afghanistan? I don't understand this appeasement payback thing.

We accpeted known Al Qeada terrorists because they had Canadian passports. Paul Martin thought if we let them in, we wouldn't be a target any more.

Guess his appeasement strategy failed.
 
Aug 14, 2001
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Originally posted by: jagec
wow, I thought Canada was the ultimate "everyone likes or at worst light-heartedly mocks me" country.

Yeah, that's why I posted this...I thought it was interesting and kind of funny (in a bad way) because of that.
 

conjur

No Lifer
Jun 7, 2001
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Isn't their new PM more along the styles of Bush? Thought I read an article recently where he was pretty much supporting Bush in many ways.

That could explain some things.