AGP 8X Card and RAM upgrade - Asus mobo

[bigfoot99]

Hi All,

My rig config (old i know but its working fine !) is Asus A7V8X MX SE mobo
(product link is http://www.asus.com/product.aspx?P_ID=1guVBT1qV5oqhHyZ
and manual at http://dlsvr03.asus.com/pub/ASUS/mb/socka/KM400/a7v8x-mx se/e1493_a7v8x-mx_se.pdf)
paired with an AMD Athlon 2600+ XP (barton core as per CPUID - so runs at 1.9 GHz)
and on 1GB Hynix PC2700 DDR SDRAM.

Had the following upgrade queries - looking for stability over performance since this
machine is mostly for family usage :

1. Whats the best AGP 8x card that i can use on this mobo (and the memory size - 256mb or 512mb) ?
I definitely need to support an exact resolution of atleast 1600 x 900 for a new LED Monitor and a possible
Windows 7 installation soon (ran the upgrade advisor - it suggested new GPU is needed but does the
rig seem fine for win7 otherwise ?) Looking at a sub $100 nvidia or ATI card from a good vendor for playing HD

movies decently and moderate gaming usage (AoE 3, Medal of Honor, Farcry).

2. I`m purchasing 1gb of RAM so wanted to confirm if I can use PC3200 (Single or Double Bank
- crucial memory advisor says its supported at
http://www.crucial.com/upgrade/compa...X+SE/list.html)
but anyone has tried it out and found it to be stable ?
The mobo spec does state it uses 333Mhz FSB (not sure if this affects RAM config ?) and upto PC2700
but if PC3200 works would sell my existing RAM and pick up 2GB of it (assuming of course that
the extra performance kick is worth it ?). Else i`ll go back to picking up an extra 1gb of PC2700 itself.

I checked out a few AGP 8x cards on the nvidia website but they seem to use GDDR2 or GDDR3 -
does this mean they wont run on a DDR SDRAM based mobo and need a DDR3 based mobo instead ?

Thanks !

 

[toyota]

I would not spend a dime on an 8 year old computer. buying ram, a gpu and especially Windows 7 to put on there is silly IMO. if this is for family use then you can buy a brand new pc for 300 bucks that will be like a supercomputer compared to what you have now.

 

[Termie]

I'm going to go ahead and agree with Toyota here. That machine is quite old, and you really aren't getting good value for the money upgrading it.

To answer your question, something like an ATI HD4650 would probably work, at fairly high cost given its performance ($66AR): http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814102851

As to your memory question, I think you can usually use faster memory than your motherboard supports, as the memory will simply downclock (from 400 to 333MHz). The lowest price I can find for 2x1GB DDR-400 on Newegg is $72: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820161161.

Add the cost of W7 OEM ($100), and you've got yourself a terrible investment. You're talking about putting over $230 into that rig. Again, in this case, don't do it.

 

[Rifter]

x3 what they said, dont spend the cash on old system.

 

[sMiLeYz]

I second what everyone's saying: for slightly more than the price of a new ram and new AGP card you could buy a whole new system light years faster.

 

[betasub]

Is the graphics upgrade driven by Windows7? The "upgrade advisor" is only looking for some check-box features for extras like Aero.

And RAM on-board the graphics card bears no relation to the type of RAM used by the motherboard: http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2098709

 

[cusideabelincoln]

If you have a budget set for these upgrades then let us know, but it seems like $150 is what you're planning on spending. You would be best off buying a new processor, motherboard, and RAM

Now if you still want to upgrade the old rig:

Your motherboard doesn't offer drivers for Windows 7, so if Windows 7 does run you'll be using default drivers. Just stick with Windows XP on that machine if you intend to use it as a spare. A fresh XP install will be pretty snappy if you get 1-2GB of RAM.

2. You can use PC3200, but it will just downclock to PC2700 speeds to match the FSB of your processor. So if PC2700 is cheaper then just get it instead. Also just go to Ebay to pick up your RAM, or visit a local used computer shop, and you should be able to get 1-2GB for cheap.

1. Don't go overboard with the video card. Again if you were to get one check out used stuff and get a card from the Geforce 6000, Geforce 7000, Radeon X1000, Radeon HD2000, Radeon HD30000, or Radeon HD4000 series. The video card is self contained. As long as it is AGP it should work with your motherboard. The video memory has no bearing on the motherboard memory. Some model numbers for you to look for are: 6600GT, 6800GT, 6800LE, 7600GS, 7600GT, X1600 Pro or XT, X1650 Pro or XT, HD2600 Pro or XT, HD 3650. These cards should be good enough to play older games fine, but I wouldn't count on them playing any game released within the last 3 years well at all.

 

[fffblackmage]

I'd save up on an uber low-budget rig. 8-year-old rig is just waaay too old to be spending money on.

But if you're really set on it... you could try the For Sale/Trade subforum. Most people still have working old crap lying around.

 

[veri745]

I'd save up on an uber low-budget rig. 8-year-old rig is just waaay too old to be spending money on.

But if you're really set on it... you could try the For Sale/Trade subforum. Most people still have working old crap lying around.

I second this. If you're going to spend the money on that old rig, check the for sale/trade forum. I would not buy new components.

A new budget system would net you a much larger performance/$ increase.

 

[Skiprudder]

One of the major problems you're up against is that there is a significant price premium places on AGP cards--I'm guessing this is because they not only need a bridge chip to convert them to AGP, but they also don't have a lot of competition, so prices stay high. Termie linked you a 4650, which is a decent card, but about the slowest one could go gaming rig wise these days. The AGP price was $60 the PCI-E is $36, and this is one of the faster AGP cards still made. It's honestly the best price I've seen on a new AGP card in quite awhile now, but you're still paying more for older tech. There are also sometimes driver issues. In many cases you can't use the latest AMD or nVidia drivers, but will instead have to go to the card manufacturer's drivers, which are often several months older.

Of more serious concern is that you're really being crippled by an old, slow single-core CPU. You'll find that more and more programs are using at least two threads these days, and even in the cases they aren't the difference when multitasking is night and day. You want at least a dual-core CPU, and if you are intending to do some gaming at 3 or 4-core would be better.

Here's a little mobo/cpu/ram/gpu combo I picked out. it's going for being cost effective and cheap. One could boost things here, and the parts would change if you inteded to overclock (but I get th feeling you're not intending to). It will cost more than an AGP card and DDR Ram for your old board, but even the cheapest setup here will be many times faster than your old machine.

Mobo: BIOSTAR A770E3 AM3 AMD 770 ATX AMD Motherboard $50
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813138179
This is a DDR3 board that takes everything up to 6-core Phenom II CPUs, so you have some upgrade room.

Ram: G.SKILL NS 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666) $60
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820231396
But 4GB of ram if you'll be gaming. Windows 7 will thank you for it, and it doesn't cost much more than 2GB.

CPU: AMD Athlon II X2 250 Regor 3.0GHz $60
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819103903
A fast solid dual-core CPU. This is the low end for any modern system that you might game on I'd say, and it'll be light years faster than your old CPU.

GPU: PowerColor AX5550 1GBK3-H Radeon HD 5550 1GB 128-bit DDR3 PCI Express 2.1 $50
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...-361-_-Product
A solid low-end gaming card, and faster than the 4650. It's not going to run Crysis, but will do jsut fine on older games, plus it has all the 5000 series features, and a nice price at less than $50 with the rebate.

This give you a total cost of $220 for basically a new system. If you wanted to spend a little bit more, you can do a significant'y more powerful system:

CPU: AMD Athlon II X4 640 Propus 3.0GHz 4 x 512KB L2 Cache Socket AM3 $100
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819103871
Modern fast 4-core CPU. Let's multitasking and newer multi-threaded games fly, and it's the best bang for one's buck at $100.

GPU:HIS H485FM512H Radeon HD 4850 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 $92
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...-297-_-Product
The 4850 is getting hard to find, but for under $100 it's still hard to beat. I own one myself!

So $200 gets you a good low end but modern system, $300 gets you a solid mid range system, it's the better deal if you can swing the extra cash.

 

[TurtleCrusher]

I was going to post what Skiprudder was going to, in shorter words of course. Don't throw any money into that old build. Even if you upgrade to the basic system listed above it would be unbelievably faster.

If I was upgrading on a budget, I'd still get the quad, but I'd stick with the 5550 instead of the 4850 and get a new hard disk drive. Many 500GB-1TB drives are around $50-60 or so.

Athlon X4 + 5550 + 1TB HDD > Athlon X4 + 4850 + Slow old HDD.

If you have the money to get a new HDD, the quad and a 4850 then by all means get that instead.

 

[MangoX]

The OP is still missing a power supply. His PSU doesn't have the necessary 24pins for ATX I'm pretty sure, plus the 8pin power. My recommendation would be the Corsair 430CX. I have put it in a few budget builds and it's a good unit for the price. It can usually be had for less than $50.

 

[happy medium]

I'd buy a used low power Agp card, like a 6600 agp. 20$ at most.
Make sure you have 2 gb of ram.
Buy a retail copy of Windows 7 and use it again when you upgrade.

Thats your cheapest and easiest option.

 

[bigfoot99]

First off thanks to everyone for the replies - y`all totally rock !!!
The upgrade reason was for the new LED Monitor i picked up after my CRT went *pfzzzt*and more RAM never hurts.Max upgrade budget is $100.

I saw a couple of posts online that Win7 works on my mobo based system
but at $100 OEM will definitely stick to WinXP !

Some background info here - i`m based out of India so the rates mentioned
for the mobos and CPU`s will definitely be higher here (1USD = Rs.45 right now rates are linked here - http://www.aashirwadcomp.com/download.php
but can add a 10% discount since its from Aug)

ok the way i see it theres 2 alternatives but the overwhelming advice is to
go in for a new machine - would still like to get all the info for the old rig as well since if i upgrade now wont be doing it again for like 2 more years.

1. stick to the old rig and selective upgrade. I`m a bit jittery going in for used components since i`ve burned my fingers in the past-but like Skiprudder said, there is a significant premium for outdated stuff ! As Termie stated, since the PC3200 will downclock makes sense to use 1GB of PC2700 - downtown price is $40 here.
On the GPU front, the 4650 at $60 is better than what i`m getting here - but like AznBoi36 said - would i need a new PSU for this card as well ? @cusideabelincoln: many thanks for the numbers-hunting for the same now

2. I hadnt really considered the upgrade option since i`m woefully out of touch with the current scene. @cusideabelincoln : yup i`d be looking at a $200 range upgrade budget.
The budget rig specs mentioned by Skiprudder look super though ! Street prices for it add up to around 16k (still $350!!!).
Trading in this rig shud deffo get me around $100 off which makes it $250.
I`ll need to save up for a while though for this - will totally skip out on spending on the old rig and go in for a complete new system in that case! Can i fit this into my existing ATX chassis and again, will a new PSU be required here ?

 

[Skiprudder]

Hey Bigfoot,

Glad it was helpful. Scholzpdx makes a really good point in regards to the hard drive. I at least don't tend to think about them as getting faster because they do so at a much slower rate than everything else in a computer, but it adds up. I was actually working on a clients Athlon system that nearly matches yours and out of curiosity ran Crystalmark on it. The hdd sees a read speed of about 50MB/sec. Even a green series drive will see roughly 2x that these days, so big difference!

If you just want to put a new card in for now I'd grab the 4650, it's a not great but reasonable price in AGP. The good news is it's a rather power efficient card, so your PSU should be able to handle it. The AGP version does have an external power connector however, so you'll want to make sure your case has a 6-pin connector. If it doesn't, you should be able to get by with something like this:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...-120-_-Product

Happily everything is still ATX, so new stuff will fit in, but I would go for a new PSU when you build a new machine like AZNBoi said. Long story short, it's ok to spend a little bit on your current rig (Goodness knows I love seeing what I can get out of old systems myself!) but don't spend too much, you're better saving that money for new parts.

Cheers!

 

[cusideabelincoln]

If you get an entirely new rig you should also update the power supply.

If you just upgrade the video card you probably don't have to get a new power supply, unless the one you have is really bad. The 4650 and other video cards don't use that much power.

To cut costs on a full upgrade you can probably get a good mobo with a decent integrated video card.

 

[betasub]

bigfoot: thanks for the update post providing more background info. It definitely helps for getting advice better tailored to your personal situtation.

1GB DDR should help you keep truckin' with WinXP, and the 4650 is a good low-powered card for your new monitor.

In the longer run, saving for a completely new pre-built budget box should be the plan. That will get you up-to-date in terms of hardware, OS and features.

 

[DEFIANT!]

The mention of the FS/FT forums is spot-on. I just picked-up an AGP 6800GS to replace a failing Radeon 9800 pro for my media server, a couple of weeks ago...for $17 shipped. There's a plethora of "old" stuff there to choose from, updated all the time.

 

[bigfoot99]

guys, i just ran cpuid and noticed something - in the mainboard tab - graphic interface panel shows agp version 2.0 and max supported as 4x !!! the mobo specs clearly state 8x is supported...
is cpuid wrong?or is it showing value for my default onboard AGP (via s3g unichrome graphics) ?

 

[happy medium]

is it showing value for my default onboard AGP

yes

 

[OnePingOnly]

Stop being stubborn and just build a new computer with the $300 example above. Not only is your current setup slow, it's power inefficiency is costing you more money than if you'd build a modern system. Every day that you use that slow computer to conduct your daily business you are wasting time. Think about it.

 

[bigfoot99]

@happy medium - thanks for confirming that!

@JRussellDMD - yup appreciate the points u made. not being stubborn - am saving towards the $300 setup but imm. need to scale up this rig and am on a really tight budget squeeze !

 

[MustangSVT]

Recommand used parts. it will be cheaper and will hold you over till the big upgrading day Dunno how it will ship over to india though.