Afghanistan on fire, troops hater more than ever before, innocent workers killed.

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Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
3
0
Zebo says we have rights because of, "We have rights because of organized violence. We lose rights because of organized violence. Muslims use organized violence to push their world view."

So not to lose Christian rights, we use organized Christian violence to advance Zebo's rights.

Proving once again, we humans must all agree to keep killing each others until we think only like Zebo. Because that is the only possible definition of world peace.

Meanwhile, kill kill kill for world peace.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Zebo says we have rights because of, "We have rights because of organized violence. We lose rights because of organized violence. Muslims use organized violence to push their world view."

So not to lose Christian rights, we use organized Christian violence to advance Zebo's rights.

Proving once again, we humans must all agree to keep killing each others until we think only like Zebo. Because that is the only possible definition of world peace.

Meanwhile, kill kill kill for world peace.

What Christian rights you fool? Chritainty is just as bad we are just lucky they don't take it too serious anymore. Believe it if they could still kill blasphemers they would.

Where the fuck you think this comes from?

"Wherever you encounter (non-believers), kill them, seize them, besiege them, wait for them at every lookout post ..."

"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword."

"If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, 'Let us go and worship other gods' ... do not yield to him or listen to him. Show him no pity. Do not spare him or shield him. You must certainly put him to death."

" Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man."

Answers

Quran (9:5)
Bible
Matthew 10:34
Deuteronomy 13:6-9
Numbers 31:17-18

Not a dime worth of difference but in following.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
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Wrong wrong wrong. They're NOT like you and me. Read the article I linked to earlier. They lack initiative as a culture. They lack the desire to better their lives. They lack trust for anyone outside of their family. They are not a community based culture at all. The assumption we had that all people were naturally inquisitive and would learn and troubleshoot as part of their instincts was proven wrong. Again and again. There are examples in the article, and I encountered numerous similar situations in Afghanistan.

You know the biggest issue with the Afghan national police force, other than desertion? Raping little boys. We just could not get them to stop raping little boys.

If NATO\ISAF\USA has a policy problem, it's simply that our policy doesn't acknolwedge that Afghanistan is hopeless.

And JoS, at this point I'm totally fine with letting the perpetrators of 9/11 go free. They're not worth the trouble. We've crippled their ability to launch attacks out of Afghanistan, and in the process spread their network into operable cells all over the world. Terrorism is a fact of the future. It's going to happen, we'll be attacked again. But spending the interim period in between acts of terrorisms sacrificing soldiers life in a worthless country while spending billions of dollars on people that still hate us is just adding insult to injury.

This. Anyone who has spent time in a muslim country knows about Insallah fatalism preventing any kind of economic or social advancement. What do you think Saudi has 1/3 of their population imported to do the real work? Or Qatar over 75% for? If it weren't for accident of geology which the west found for them, drilled for them and made a market for them they'd be living exactly like Afghanistan and happy as pigs in shit.
 

Generator

Senior member
Mar 4, 2005
793
0
0
I'm curious how the mob received the information about the burning. Obviously our media kept it under wraps and yet it still made its way to the Afghans. It very well could be possible that the whole massacre was stoked on word of mouth only. If thats the case, then why wouldn't Abh Gharib be revisited or the recent trophy killings? What would these barbarians do when they learn that the Quran was shit and pissed on by American "imperialist" soldiers?

10 fucking years in this shit hole and America is still dancing on egg shells trying to build a nation out of illiterate barbarian fagots! Now is the time to wash our hands of this goddamn bullshit. It really is time, RIGHT FUCKING NOW TO LEAVE. Every republican and democrat needs to put the politics and the gotcha games away over Afghanistan. I don't want to hear no stupid rhetoric about cutting and running. Just fucking leave.

Besides we got a new more interesting war in Libya. The military welfare complex will still be milking this cash cow, but enough is enough.
 

WelshBloke

Lifer
Jan 12, 2005
31,409
9,301
136
...

There is nothing ironic with the comparison of either situations. One person broke the law and the other was exercising their freedom of speech/expression even if some do not agree with his actions. The results of the former were caused by a bunch of savages who cannot reason and the former was caused by someone who did not pay heed to the oath they swore and the legal and legitimate consequences of breaking said oath.

Yeah but on the one hand they are blaming the 'savages' for the violence following the pastures actions but blaming the leaker for the violence following his.
 
May 11, 2008
20,202
1,149
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Fail. Afghans have free will just like any other human being. No one MADE them murder because someone burned a Koran an ocean away.

I vote we get the fuck out now and the next time we get hit from a terrorist organization hosted by or funded by Afghanistan, we turn every Afghan major city (i.e. any city with an airport, sea port, or train station) into nice smooth glass. Either they act like human beings, or they should be exterminated like any other mad animals. Grab your Koran and pick a lane to Heaven, the slow lane (~60 years ending in bed) or the fast lane (instantaneously as a group, courtesy of a B-2 bomber.)

This indeed. The people in these countries should be free to make their own decisions based upon education not making decisions based on outdated fundamental freak lies. If the west is willing to attack the Libya dictator, then the west should be willing to attack the taliban and their supporters. But the west will and can only do this when the people in Afghanistan will revolt and cause a revolution, effectively demanding democracy and the freedom of choice in a social setting. Because then we can help them. Otherwise we cannot do anything. IMHO The reason the west will not do anything now is twofold.

a: The Afghanistan people do not want a revolution.
b: The neighboring country is Iran, and a large influx of western armies into Afghanistan will provoke Iran.


As a side note :
Even tho Iran should be working together with the west in this case, just because of the opium poppies.
The magic word here is i suspect morphine and codeine... Many possibilities, some more relevant then others. I do wonder how much of that Afghan opium ends up as a pharmaceutical ingredient for various companies all around the world. I do hope none, but that would not make sense in reality.

EDIT:

Forgot to mention one thing. Stupid green left politicians as for example in the Netherlands, think that a nice gesture is enough. The dutch let themselves get sucker punched once again with their trainee police force. Certain rules where enforced by dutch green left politicians which made the entire dutch mission in Afghanistan a waste of time. Because they are stupid enough to believe that the values of a save social system as is present in the Netherlands will be welcomed and have the same effect in Afghanistan. Talking about being stupid when it comes to not understanding culture differences...

As a metaphor : Social rules of heaven do not work in hell...
There is no place for altruism when the daily life experience is eat or be eaten...
 
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Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,266
126
Some nut burns a book. Big friggin deal. China has been locking up and killing religious people and no one shoots anyone because of it. The only guilty people are the murderers. If that's all it takes then so be it. GTFO now and let them deal with their own shit.
 

DucatiMonster696

Diamond Member
Aug 13, 2009
4,269
1
71
These guys got pissed off because one Koran was defaced but in Indonesia 5,000 bibles were defaced by that government prior to this incident. Where was the tolerance then from these assholes then in this instance?? Why weren't they just as equally outraged by the defacement of those bibles??

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42125224

Edit: Or better yet where was the tolerance from these savages when they blew up those ancient Buddhist statues?

This guy never made more sense then today IMHO.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjS0Novt3X4&feature=related
 
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DucatiMonster696

Diamond Member
Aug 13, 2009
4,269
1
71
Yeah but on the one hand they are blaming the 'savages' for the violence following the pastures actions but blaming the leaker for the violence following his.

Who is they?? The government has arrested him for BREAKING THE LAW and releasing classified documents. No other argument need be made to condemn the "leaker" because he BROKE THE LAW.
 

DucatiMonster696

Diamond Member
Aug 13, 2009
4,269
1
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There's wrong, and really wrong... you're both. I do not support censorship and didn't come close to saying that. Censorship is government control, I said personal discretion under certain circumstances... don't be a leftist prick and equate the two.

Okay so you rather use a fallacy laden appeal to implied consequences to get people to forfeit their rights.

And I can care less about people being offended, so get that out of your closed mind.

No you DO CARE about them being offended because you are scared of their reactions it seems.

I care about innocent people dying, and when you're ready to sacrifice your child, or yourself, to make a statement about how screwed up Islamic fanatics are then you won't be so full of shat.

Baseless appeal to emotion that could be easily turned around an applied to the 2nd amendment and those exercising their right to own and use firearms. And again you blame those who are exercising their right as granted by the US Constitution as being the root cause of the problem instead of attacking those who actually are committing murder because of their lack of self control.


Because it's easy to say that book should be burned when other people die as a result you stupid hypocrite.

Other people died because these savages do not understand how to operate in a free world in which people are free to express their opinions.


It's easy to be all sanctimonious and noble over liberty when other people are being affected with death.


Liberty isn't defended by taking 2 steps back every time someone draws a line in the sand.

Notice, I haven't said he does not have the right to burn the koran, of course he does. I am saying that just because you have a right to do something doesn't mean you necessarily should-- like my opinion about flag burning.

Appeals to implied consequences aren't valid. The right is there to be used. Anyone that takes offense and commits violence because someone exercises their right is at fault because they lack the frontal lobes to control to prevent them from killing people.

If a certain situation exists, show some common sense restraint when exercising that right. Whether you like it or not that asshole just made life harder, and more dangerous, for our Soldiers.

Again your request for censorship via the fear of implied consequences is not valid at all. Our rights are there to be exercised and trying to dissuade people from doing so out fear of how some savage might react to it is no better then saying you actually support government censorship of individuals expressing themselves because you don't want to offend anyone as you are scared as to what they may do in response.
 
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davmat787

Diamond Member
Nov 30, 2010
5,512
24
76
Are people really saying that we need to watch what we lawfully say, think, or do legally here in the US for fear of pissing off some caveman thousands of miles away who would gladly kill you or I anyway for much less? Please tell me I am misunderstanding this...
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,266
126
Are people really saying that we need to watch what we lawfully say, think, or do legally here in the US for fear of pissing off some caveman thousands of miles away who would gladly kill you or I anyway for much less? Please tell me I am misunderstanding this...

Yep, that about sums it up.
 

Infohawk

Lifer
Jan 12, 2002
17,844
1
0
Are people really saying that we need to watch what we lawfully say, think, or do legally here in the US for fear of pissing off some caveman thousands of miles away who would gladly kill you or I anyway for much less? Please tell me I am misunderstanding this...

Yep. If we're just nice enough and tolerant enough they'll stop being crazy muslims.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,266
126
What the guy did was stupid, whether it was his "Right" or not.

So he's stupid. We get that. The point is that others murdered because they could. Somehow you are going to have a tough time convincing me there's a moral equivalency. Someone burned a Koran and others slaughtered people who had nothing to do with it.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,225
5,801
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So he's stupid. We get that. The point is that others murdered because they could. Somehow you are going to have a tough time convincing me there's a moral equivalency. Someone burned a Koran and others slaughtered people who had nothing to do with it.

No, there isn't a Moral equivalency. However, defending this "Pastor" for his attention whoring is just plain stupid. Everyone knew what the reaction would be, so what was his point?
 

DucatiMonster696

Diamond Member
Aug 13, 2009
4,269
1
71
No, there isn't a Moral equivalency. However, defending this "Pastor" for his attention whoring is just plain stupid. Everyone knew what the reaction would be, so what was his point?

Here is how your reasoning and logic translates:

"Everyone knew what the reaction would be **if that 14 year old girl wore a skirt and rebuked her cousin's sexual advances**, so what was her point?"

Hint: Its not the Pastor's responsibility to control other peoples behavior to his actions.

Edit: Actions which I might add did not warrant or justify the killing of 7 innocent people.

Remove religion and insert political views (say someones fervent belief in Communism), remove the Koran and insert Mao Zedong's little red book of stupidity and now see if your points have any actual merit behind them.
 
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Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,266
126
No, there isn't a Moral equivalency. However, defending this "Pastor" for his attention whoring is just plain stupid. Everyone knew what the reaction would be, so what was his point?


It depends on what people are defending. If it's regarding his incredibly ignorant act, then I'm in your camp. If it's that he has the right to do incredibly ignorant things then we part ways. Sure he's fair game for ridicule and I'm all over that, but there's a lot of inflammatory things said regarding religion on these forums. The difference is in the person being on the receiving end of the disrespect doesn't go and kill because of it. Not the case in Afghanistan.

As far as I'm concerned we have no business being there at this point. When we get killed for such things it's time to part ways.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,225
5,801
126
Here is how your reasoning and logic translates:

"Everyone knew what the reaction would be **if that 14 year old girl wore a skirt and rebuked her cousin's sexual advances**, so what was her point?"

Hint: Its not the Pastor's responsibility to control other peoples behavior to his actions.

Edit: Actions which I might add did not warrant or justify the killing of 7 innocent people.

Remove religion and insert political views (say someones fervent belief in Communism), remove the Koran and insert Mao Zedong's little red book of stupidity and now see if your points have any actual merit behind them.

You have 2 kids, one kid behaves a certain way when teased that is annoying as hell and drives you nuts. The other kid knows this and teases its' sibling. You punish both for being wankers.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
What's "stupid" is blaming the Florida pastor for anything instead of the blood thristy savages that did kill people or the Islamic world who doesnt speak out against this madness. I guess that would cause you to stop pretending and put delusions aside though.

Freedom of expression and freedom of speech MUST be maintained at all cost. They are the single most important value of enlightened societies have so I applaud him for exercising unpopular speech and shinning light on the darkness that exists in some Muslims heads. We all should start a bonfire.
 
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1prophet

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
5,313
534
126
If a pastor burns a Koran it is stupid and provocative,

but on the other hand if a gay rights activist does the same it is considered art.

Artist Burns Rare Koran in Protest of Muslim Homophobia

Charles Merrill Burns Gift of the Late King Jordan

By Ana Martinez
Takeaways


  • Koran Burning
  • Gay Activism
  • Bible Defacing

Artist Burns Koran to Make Gay Rights StatementRecently, the artist Charles Merrill burned an expensive Koran to make a statement against Muslim views against homosexual behavior. He burned an expensive copy of the Koran that had been bequeathed to him by his late wife, Evangeline Johnson Merrill, who received it from the late King of Jordan in 1950s. The tome had a value of approximately $60,000. Koran Burning Follows Bible EditingThe Koran burning comes after his recent decision to edit the Christian bible with black marker and scissors. Merrill's purpose in the defacing of the books is to "eliminate homophobic hate" in th Abrahamic Holy Books. Merrill described the ancient books of the Bible and the Koran as "terrorist manuals." Merrill considers these Abrahamic books that consider homosexuality not a normative state of human affairs to be hateful. He believes the Koran and the Bible encourage terrorism. He links terrorism with hate crimes against gays saying that "airplanes are flow into buildings because of words, and hate crimes against gays." Merrill hoped that his defacement of the sacred documents of the Abrahamic faiths of Christianity and Islam would call attention to homophobia across the world. Merrill is a self described atheist. Koran Acquired from Late Wife of Gay ArtistThe Koran burned was valued at $60,000. Merrill acquired the volume from his late wife Evangeline Johnson Merrill. Johsnson was the daughter of the man who founded Johnson and Johnson of q-tip fame. She received the volume as a gift back in the 1950s. As an international socialite, she traveled the globe during the 1950s. She also served as a representative of the United Nations during the decade of the 1950s. During a trip to Jordan, the now deceased King gave her the old rare manuscript of the Koran. Merrill who nows describes himself as gay burned the volume his deceased wife had acquired in her international
travels. Background of Artist MerrillCharles Merrill, the man who burned the Koran and defaced the Bible, considers himself an atheist. Like his wife, he has prominent society relatives. His cousin was the co-founder of Merrill Lynch. Lynch is a well-known artist. His current exhibition at the Broadway Gallery in NYC is an exploration of Lesbian Gay Bisexual Transgender (LGBT) activism and of the spirituality of native cultures through the medium of paint. One feature of his current work is an obsession with pink triangles. His recent exhibitors describe him as an inconclast and that his recent defacement of sacred Abrahamic scriptures is a reflection of his noted altruism. Merrill considers his recent painting to be part of a move in his work towards Cubism. For Merrill, the defacement of the Koran is considered performance art.
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/328488/artist_burns_rare_koran_in_protest.html?cat=7
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,266
126
You have 2 kids, one kid behaves a certain way when teased that is annoying as hell and drives you nuts. The other kid knows this and teases its' sibling. You punish both for being wankers.

You have two people. One makes faces and annoys people. One is a mass murderer of those who annoy him. Guess which goes to jail?