Affirmative Action vs Equal Opportunity Employer

[Kelemvor]

I see lots of ads for companies where they end by writing or saying "Equal Opportunity Affirmative Action Employer". My question is, don't those two things contradict each other?

My understanding is that Affirmative Action means that they hire people in certain percentages baed on race, sex, etc to keep a certain number of people represented from each ethnicity and gender group.

Equal Opportunity means that everyone is considered equal and your race, sex, etc doesn't matter.

So, how can you be both. One says you give weight to people based on their race and one says you don't. I'm confused.

 

[notfred]

There are only the "equal opportunity employer" ads in California, since we banned affirmative action.

 

[Marshallj]

Originally posted by: FrankyJunior
I see lots of ads for companies where they end by writing or saying "Equal Opportunity Affirmative Action Employer". My question is, don't those two things contradict each other?

My understanding is that Affirmative Action means that they hire people in certain percentages baed on race, sex, etc to keep a certain number of peopel represented from each ethnicity and gender group.

Equal Opportunity means that everyone is considered equal and your race, sex, etc doesn't matter.

So, hwo can you be both. One sayd you give weight to people based on their race and oen says you don't. I'm confused.

I know, it doesn't make sense. They do contradict each other since one says "we don't discriminate based on race" and the other says "we do choose based on race".

 

[BatmanNate]

Originally posted by: FrankyJunior
I see lots of ads for companies where they end by writing or saying "Equal Opportunity Affirmative Action Employer". My question is, don't those two things contradict each other?

My understanding is that Affirmative Action means that they hire people in certain percentages baed on race, sex, etc to keep a certain number of peopel represented from each ethnicity and gender group.

Equal Opportunity means that everyone is considered equal and your race, sex, etc doesn't matter.

So, hwo can you be both. One sayd you give weight to people based on their race and oen says you don't. I'm confused.

Sorry if I can't help much with your proposed question, but I thought I'd chime in that the idea of hiring based on race is ridiculous at best. Hire whoever is best for the job if you're a smart employer, and give no regard to the race of the person. Should we start forcing Boeing to hire every kind of person for an engineer, even those who are "mentally challeneged"? It's an exageration of the situation but you see my point...if you are the employer, your top concern should be self interest and that means getting the best person for the job that your budget allows, not worrying about keeping percentages in proportion based on race if it means you'd have to forgo good job candidates on the grounds that you already had too many of one particular group and not enough of another or some such thing.

 

[silverpig]

[PC nazi] Are you attacking affirmative action/equal opportunity? How dare you, you oppressive white chauvinist bastard! You are a racist! RACIST!!! [/PC nazi]

Yeah, it don't make much sense, but you have to remember, there are stupid people in the world you know (at least, until the world is mine).

 

[BatmanNate]

Originally posted by: silverpig
[PC nazi] Are you attacking affirmative action/equal opportunity? How dare you, you oppressive white chauvinist bastard! You are a racist! RACIST!!! [/PC nazi]

Yeah, it don't make much sense, but you have to remember, there are stupid people in the world you know (at least, until the world is mine).

What's so ironic is that the idea of affirmative action is just as racist as what it "aims to prevent."

 

[Kelemvor]

Just wandered by the American Association for Affirmative Action's website where their main line is:

Founded in 1974, the American Association for Affirmative Action (AAAA) is dedicated to the advancement of affirmative action, equal opportunity and the elimination of discrimination on the basis of race, gender, ethnic background or any other criterion that deprives people of opportunities to live and work.

But the whole pint of Aff Action is specifically TO discriminate based on race, gender, etc. Do these people not have a clue or what...

 

[dullard]

"So, hwo can you be both. One sayd you give weight to people based on their race and oen says you don't. I'm confused."

There are many ways to be both. Here are some of them:
1) Hire whoever is the most qualified. If two people are virtually tied (ie same education, same experience, did the same in the interviews) then choose the race/gender that your company needs more.
2) Hire whoever is the most qualified. But you actively seek out applicants from races/genders your company is lacking in. Thus encourage women and minorities to apply, but if they are bested by a white male, then you hire the white male. Just the fact that your encouragement of minorities to apply will on average mean you are more likely to find the most qualified person in that pool.

 

[KC5AV]

Jayson Blair = Afirmative Action?
I don't know... you tell me.

 

[xochi]

The company i work for hires only the best engineers.

every one of them lives and works in India.

:Q

 

[Marshallj]

Originally posted by: xochi
The company i work for hires only the best engineers.

every one of them lives and works in India.

:Q

lol, I'm sure the pay rate in India had nothing to do with that.

 

[notfred]

Originally posted by: xochi
The company i work for hires only the best engineers.

every one of them lives and works in India.

:Q

What company do you work for?

 

[xochi]

Originally posted by: Tyler

Originally posted by: xochi
The company i work for hires only the best engineers.

every one of them lives and works in India.

:Q

What company do you work for?

not saying.

but its small, i work in another dept.

Outsourcing, is becomming a common business practice.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: xochi

Originally posted by: Tyler

Originally posted by: xochi
The company i work for hires only the best engineers.

every one of them lives and works in India.

:Q

What company do you work for?

not saying.

but its small, i work in another dept.

Outsourcing, is becomming a common business practice.

Unfortunately I haven't seen much quality software come out of India. But damn, that $.33/hr is great!

 

[Marshallj]

Originally posted by: xochi

Outsourcing, is becomming a common business practice.

That is the sad truth. People are being laid off and being brought back on as "contractors" at an alarming rate. And those are the people lucky enough to keep their job. Many jobs are being outsourced to third world countries. Cost cutting is reason #1. An American cannot live on the salary that people in other countries are willing to work for. Why pay an engineer $30 an hour in the US when there are starving ones in China and India that will work for $3 an hour?

 

[TommyVercetti]

Outsourcing is really really cheap. I realized that after doing some quick calculations.

Lets say an Indian software developer makes 16,000 rupees per month.

RS 16,000 = $320
$320/month is $80/week
$80/week is $11/day
$11/day is $1.4/hour

That is what you pay the person. I am sure you pay some more to the outsourcing company and related costs.

DAMN!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: TommyVercetti
Outsourcing is really really cheap. I realized that after doing some quick calculations.

Lets say an Indian software developer makes 16,000 rupees per month.

RS 16,000 = $320
$320/month is $80/week
$80/week is $11/day
$11/day is $1.4/hour

That is what you pay the person. I am sure you pay some more to the outsourcing company and related costs.

DAMN!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Of course, you don't help the US economy, you put US citizens out of work, and you get crap software. But that's all good in the name of the lord dollar!

And no, not all Indian programmers are crap.

 

[Kelemvor]

Originally posted by: xochi
The company i work for hires only the best engineers.

every one of them lives and works in India.

:Q

I loved that at my old job. We have big conference calls and then afterwards we'd all go try to figure out what the hell they were saying.

 

[athithi]

Originally posted by: FrankyJunior

Originally posted by: xochi
The company i work for hires only the best engineers.

every one of them lives and works in India.

:Q

I loved that at my old job. We have big conference calls and then afterwards we'd all go try to figure out what the hell they were saying.

LOL I bet they were doing the same thing at the other end I still remember my first project meeting here in the US - there was this guy who sat there with a puzzled look on his face and after the 15th time I said "ee-vent" (event), he went "Oh! 'ih'-vent"

"ee-vent" (event), he went "Oh! 'ih'-vent" - that phrase turned out really weird, didn't it

 

[rh71]

I've never seen mention of both in the same sentence.

Nowadays:
Affirmative Action = bad
EOE = good

That's all there is to it.