AC not working (no cool) after starter replaced

[zinfamous]

Hey all,

Mom just had her starter replaced in her 2008 Accord (not VTEC, so I think it's either a 1.8 or 2.0; I don't really know the engines for that generation). She hasn't been driving much, for obvious reasons, so the starter died on her, then a couple days after getting the car back, she noticed that her AC wasn't working. It's blowing, just no cooling.

My thought is that the dudes unhooked some hoses when removing the intake manifold, to get things out of the way, and didn't reconnect them, and now her AC isn't working. Or maybe something with a circuit breaker, assuming they disconnected the battery? ...or they are just assholes and purposely broke some shit to get her back in (the starter job was already stupid expensive--they quoted her $800...because it was towed to the shop that she likes, from her house, and well, you know, she's now trapped there).

I dunno...I'm heading down there in a week because she's having her eyes lazered, and she won't do anything with the car until then, but need to communicate with the shop about the AC before then. (she just discovered this on Saturday).

I've never done this job, but from two videos I've watched so far, it doesn't look like the AC has to be involved in a starter replacement, but ...it could be? Or they nicked a hose or something.

The car was sitting idle for about 3 weeks, it wouldn't turn over. Battery was fine, AAA couldn't start it after charge...so, starter? That's when she had it towed. Is it possible that the AC motor was comrpomised in that idle time?

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Need more descripters, but even then it can likely he many things. Search some YouTube videos on diagnosing the AC.

Since I just had this problem, I first checked the compressor to make sure it was spinning up and working.

Also checked the AC filter to make sure it wasn't heavily blocked from not changing it for years.

Freon leak is often the culprit, could be an incredibly tiny leak over the course of years, or could be a leak from something stupid like auto guys disconnecting hoses to install the starter.

 

[pcgeek11]

AC Motor? What motor?
Are you talking about the Compressor that runs off the belt from the cars engine?

Most likely a loss of coolant. Have it checked for proper charge with a gauge set and then if it is low or needing a charge have the leak repaired, then evacuated and recharged with the proper amount weight of coolant.

I advise you not to use one of those quick charges from an autostore or walmart and most of them contain a leak stop which will screw up the system. You also cannot do a proper charge with only on gauge and no temperature calculation...

 

[Paperdoc]

Yeah, lots of possibilities. One not quite so obvious, but I had it happen to me. There is a single wire that runs down to the AC compressor, usually with a connector close to there, that supplies the electrical signal to energize the clutch in the compressor pulley. The pulley is turned constantly by the belt from the engine, but until the clutch is energized, the compressor does not turn. If you can see the compressor and pulley while it is operting nromally, you will see the metal disk in the middle of the pulley alternately spin and stop as the clutch engages and disengages. This is how the AC control system regulates how cold its evaporator coil inside the heater duct gets. If that wire to the clutch is disconnected, no AC at all. It is possible that happened either by mistake, or to get it out of the way during the starter replacement.

 

[zinfamous]

Yeah, lots of possibilities. One not quite so obvious, but I had it happen to me. There is a single wire that runs down to the AC compressor, usually with a connector close to there, that supplies the electrical signal to energize the clutch in the compressor pulley. The pulley is turned constantly by the belt from the engine, but until the clutch is energized, the compressor does not turn. If you can see the compressor and pulley while it is operting nromally, you will see the metal disk in the middle of the pulley alternately spin and stop as the clutch engages and disengages. This is how the AC control system regulates how cold its evaporator coil inside the heater duct gets. If that wire to the clutch is disconnected, no AC at all. It is possible that happened either by mistake, or to get it out of the way during the starter replacement.

awesome, thanks, that is what I am looking for.

Yeah, I know it can be many possible things with the AC, folks, it's just that the single factor between it working perfectly to suddenly not working, is that the starter was replaced. That's all I have to go with, 200 miles away right now. I need a quick check if it's reasonable that that service has anything possible to do with the AC not working. I can't really look at it right now, and I don't want mom taking it in to have them poke around because right now, I don't trust that. My initial thought is that a hose was disconnected, either by mistake or on purpose and they forgot to reattach it. A freon leak...that usually trickles down over time, right? Does it suddenly go from ice cold to nothing? I've been wondering if the car has been spraying freon all through the engine bay, though...

She isn't going to be driving it for another 2 weeks or so because she has cataract surgery starting this week, with the 2nd procedure next week, when I'll be there. Her special lady friend will be around, though, and I think she likes to tinker. I'll chat with her and see if she is willing to look under the hood....wait, can this work with an automatic? The AC should work while parked, anyway, so I guess the disk should be spinning constantly. How to watch it spin and stop, though, if not shifting gears? Does the clutch energize in an auto if you just shift from park to 1 or D, etc? with handbrake/brakes on?

....though I think I will still tell her to make sure someone drives it at least once a week, even if she can't. ...I don't think non-functioning AC is a huge issue that could be made worse by driving it, but honestly I don't know what's wrong with it, so maybe it is? ....did survive a recent trip back from TG, I think, in buddy's aging Fit, that rolled up at the house in NC with a loud, WHHHIIIIRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR when he parked, just as we were about to head back to DC. I was like...wtf. Loud crazy motor noise all the way. We were convinced it was the AC motor, but it seemed to be spinning fine when we checked it at a gas station some time later. ...on the road though, it got unhappy. We got back fine, but that did end up being the problem. Don't know the details, but the car was trashed within a week. Noble steed.

 

[Paperdoc]

A few misunderstandings in there, so let me help a bit. Freon (more likely something like R32) is not a liquid unless compressed. It is a gas at room temperature, and under significant pressure in your AC system. That system is exactly like a refrigerator. Any small leak in it will allow the gas to escape, and you will not see or smell it. You MIGHT hear it when the escape is happening (depends on how fast the leak is), but after a few days at most it will all be gone. That is a very common reason for no AC. But there are others, such as the one I suggested, that do NOT involve a loss of the refrigerant gas.

The clutch I talked about has nothing to do with the transmission or with driving down the road. It is a different device built into the compressor and only affects that item. It is activated and de-activated automatically by the car's systems when the engine is running (to turn the belts), whether you are driving or just parked and idling the engine, and when you set the heater controls to get the AC to cool the car.

The compressor often is mounted very low or under the engine, although some are higher up. It is driven by a belt from the engine around a pulley on the end of the compressor, and the visible clutch cover plate is in the middle of that pulley. So, to observe what that plate is doing you need to be able to see it while the car is idling. Sometimes you can get a look from on top between other items using a flashlight, and sometimes you actually have to crawl under the idling car to see it.

 

[NutBucket]

Honestly I would call it a coincidence.

And definitely agree that there should be no reason the AC stopped working as a result of a starter replacement.

The compressor cycles on and off. It doesn't matter if you're moving, idling, etc. If she's sure it was working before the starter was replaced then I would definitely ask the shop.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

There are also ways to detect the leaks, such as injecting UV dye in the freon and seeing where it leaks.

Another way a mechanic told me IIRC is to spray some water mixed with dish soap on the hoses where you tihnk it might be leaking. If you see it bubbling up around where you sprayed, thats an indication of where it's leaking.

Also, I'm pretty sure just about every car these days (Including my old 2006 Acura TSX) run on R134A

Also - for whats it's worth... Mechanics also told me that gettings like gauges to measure the amount of freon is ultimately not a good solution. With my acura a guy hooked up gauges to both the high and low and the amounts still looked normal. It took going to the mechanic where they suck it all out and weigh it to find out it was about half of what it should be.

 

[EXCellR8]

Honestly I would call it a coincidence.

And definitely agree that there should be no reason the AC stopped working as a result of a starter replacement.

+1 the two components normally have nothing to do with each other, except for the (obvious) fact that if the engine doesn't start, you don't get power on the AC compressor pulley. I'd be more inclined to investigate a possible electrical/switch problem.

 

[NutBucket]

R134 became standard sometime in the mid 90's. In the early 2000's you could still get R12 but it was close to $100 a pound.

 

[BoomerD]

The obvious answer is that the shop either disconnected something electrical...or in some way cut/ pinched/ broke a wire that feeds to the AC circuit. The two components are not in any way connected, so it has to be either just coincidence...or the shop fucked up.

 

[zinfamous]

alright dudes, thanks for the clarifications and further tips. I'll probably head down there sooner rather than later, so will probably get a chance to look at it myself and talk to the shop directly.

 

[zinfamous]

Update:

So I opened the hood to try and poke around and quickly look for "spinning disc thing" where I thought it should be, but didn't really notice anything aloof, before taking it off to the shop. ...I should have looked closer for connectors and things.

The shop discovered that "AC connector was detached. So, reattached." lol. Power cable, I think. It's opposite side of bay from the starter, so should never have been an issue, unless someone inadvertently knocked it off, as unlikely as it is, or it just detached slowly, over the years. Mom also needed her NC inspection, so they did that as well. Inspection passed (well, after running to Autozone and pick up some new wipers, replaced them in the lot--I knew this was a fricking issue driving it in that morning--got some spendy Bosch ones for mom, only the best!). They charged $30 for the inspection. I paid...more than that for the wipers. Service done.

 

[Paperdoc]

Thanks for the update, and glad it was fixed for little cost. As it happens, you got to take care of other items that were needed, too.