Abstinence programs: lessons in futility?

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Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
Yes, we agreed about something today, and I have agreed with right wing posters on AT in the past. (granted the quality of points brought up by the right here leaves much to be desired.)
Don't expect me to agree to anything without merit in my eyes, I don't post to make friends but am actually quite friendly and occasionaly talk to right wingers in PM. (moreso then the left actually)

The bush thing was just a partisan jab hence the edit. don't get your panties in a wad. If you think I am beign too much of a dick PM me and ask why.
But you got one pissed off liberal here so in the forum I am not exactly "reaching over the corridor" and I am not a fence sitter either.
"enlightened pretend rock-star" hmm wasen't someone just saying something about personal flames?
(how many months has it been since I have even mentioned working in the music industry on here?)
 

Riprorin

Banned
Apr 25, 2000
9,634
0
0
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: Steeplerot
and do you bring besides spam?

Why bother if you don't have anything to add to this thead?

I've provided a solution that will virtually eliminate STDs and AIDS.

What do you have to offer?

Except you haven't. If your solution worked we wouldn't be discussing the issue.

Like I said, "safe sex" is a lie. If every teen used a condom prefectly, which is an impossibility, there'd still be STDs, AIDS, and unwanted pregnancies.

The only real solution is the one I've put forth.

Any other approach is like playing Russian Roulette.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,226
5,802
126
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: Steeplerot
and do you bring besides spam?

Why bother if you don't have anything to add to this thead?

I've provided a solution that will virtually eliminate STDs and AIDS.

What do you have to offer?

Except you haven't. If your solution worked we wouldn't be discussing the issue.

Like I said, "safe sex" is a lie. If every teen used a condom prefectly, which is an impossibility, there'd still be STDs, AIDS, and unwanted pregnancies.

The only real solution is the one I've put forth.

Any other approach is like playing Russian Roulette.

Yes, there would still be STDs and Pregnancies, but far less than Abstinence Only educated teens.
 

CycloWizard

Lifer
Sep 10, 2001
12,348
1
81
Originally posted by: sandorski
Yes, there would still be STDs and Pregnancies, but far less than Abstinence Only educated teens.
Where's the evidence for this? That's the entire point of this thread, last I checked.
 

Riprorin

Banned
Apr 25, 2000
9,634
0
0
ADOLESCENTS AND PREGNANCY

Sexually active adolescents account for approximately 10% of all births. (12) The consequences are profound. Children of adolescent mothers are more likely than those or older women to be premature and of low birthweight, have poor health, grow up in a household without a father, run away from home, be physically abused, and be abandoned or neglected. Daughters are more likely to become teenage mothers; sons are more likely to be imprisoned than are children born to older women. The economic impact has been estimated at $29 billion per year. (13)

Birth control devices and hormonal formulations are often an ineffective solution in this age-group. Teens have higher pregnancy rates with all birth control methods when compared with adults. Hormonal methods do not protect against STDs. Condoms have a high failure rate for preventing pregnancy, so the rate of failure in protecting against STDs also should be assumed to be high. Additionally, STDs can infect areas of the body not covered by condoms.

Adolescent sexual health

Quite obviously, the goal should be to reduce sexual activity among teens. Abstinence training is clearly effective in doing that.

Teens Who Make Virginity Pledges Have Substantially Improved Life Outcomes
 

3chordcharlie

Diamond Member
Mar 30, 2004
9,859
1
81
Rip - you're confusing the issue - yes, abstinence would virtually eliminate unwanted pregnancies, as well as STDs.

But AO programs != abstinence - they equal not giving teens the tools and knowledge to reduce their risk as much as possible if they don't choose abstinence.

People are gonna screw either way - better they should do so in the safest possible way, than to cling to a pipe-dream that obviously isn't connected to reality.
 

illustri

Golden Member
Mar 14, 2001
1,490
0
0
Originally posted by: CycloWizard
Originally posted by: illustri
i doubt its self control thats keeping the ladies away
Politics and News
A forum for more serious discussions of politics and current events. Passions are always high on all sides of these subjects so keep your posts on topic. PERSONAL FLAMES WILL NOT BE TOLERATED.

Yet, this is all you do. Why are you still here?

we must not have self control
 

Fausto

Elite Member
Nov 29, 2000
26,521
2
0
Originally posted by: CycloWizard
Originally posted by: Fausto
I'm sorry, but do you have any data backing your implied assertion that teaching "safe-sex" actually encourages sexual activity? You're hinging your whole position on this, so I'm curious.
Just personal experience and common sense. Do you have any evidence to the contrary?
One article I came across.

I'll dig up peer-reviewed stuff when I'm at work tomorrow and have access to OVID.
 

petrek

Senior member
Apr 11, 2001
953
0
0
A few hours learning why it's best to abstain from sex, and hundreds of hours being encouraged to practice it...yes it's likely to fail for those that watch tv and read magazines.

Dave
 

aidanjm

Lifer
Aug 9, 2004
12,411
2
0
Unrealistic standards lead to more, not less, dangerous behavior? Interesting article:


Posted 1/11/2004 7:38 PM

Study: Teens who hurry love less likely to use birth control

By Karen S. Peterson, USA TODAY

When teens have intercourse for the first time, it's usually within three months of the start of a relationship. But the longer they wait, the more likely they are to use contraception, a new report says.

If first sex occurs within one month, just 58% of teens say they ?always? use contraception. After four or more months together, 71% do, the study of sexually active teens says. The study was done by the non-profit Child Trends research center.

?The longer teens are together, the more likely they are to have talked about contraception,? and the more likely they are to be prepared, says researcher Suzanne Ryan. For each month a teen delays sex after the start of a romantic relationship, the likelihood of consistent use increases by 5%, the study says.

The report on teens' use of contraception during their first sexual relationship is part of ongoing research by Child Trends to profile teen sexual conduct. This study analyzed data on 1,027 teens, grades seven through 12, who were tracked in the National Longitudinal Study of Adolescent Health. The study was paid for by the federal government.

Findings will be of interest to those who promote abstinence and those who hope teens delay intercourse. Government statistics show that nearly half of teens have had intercourse before 18.

Research from other studies shows that teens who have taken pledges to abstain are more likely to delay sex, Ryan says. But her new study shows that if they do become sexually active, they are 57% less likely to always use contraception than those who have not taken such pledges.

Teens who sign pledges may not be ?diligent every time, because they see contraception as concrete evidence of the activity they pledged to avoid,? Ryan says.


Teens dating older partners are less likely to use contraception consistently; there is an 11% decrease in use for each year of difference in age. The older partner may have a ?power advantage? that can influence sexual activity, Ryan says.

Study findings should alert parents that there is a ?small window of opportunity? to influence teens as they move into a romantic relationship, says Jennifer Manlove, a senior researcher at Child Trends.

White and black teens are more apt to use contraception consistently (66% each) than Hispanic teens (54%). That finding concerns Tamara Kreinin of the Sexuality Information and Education Council of the United States. ?This tells us we have to focus extra effort on the Latino population, on both young men and women.? She says the report is important because ?it tells us much more about teen sexual behavior.?

The study, called ?Patterns of Contraceptive Use Within Teenagers' First Sexual Relationships,? is published in Perspectives on Sexual and Reproductive Health, a periodical from the Alan Guttmacher Institute.

 

Riprorin

Banned
Apr 25, 2000
9,634
0
0
False.


Pledgers have Lower Rates of Unprotected Sexual Activity

Pledgers are significantly less likely than non-pledgers to engage in unprotected sexual activity (i.e., to have intercourse without contraception). While previous reports have suggested that sexually active pledgers are less likely to use contraception than non-pledgers are, examina­tion of the Wave III data of the Add Health survey does not con­firm this. In fact, as Table 5 shows, pledgers who are sexually active are slightly more likely to use contraception than are their counterparts among the non-pledging group. However, the dif­ference between the groups is not statistically significant.

Moreover, examination of sexually active youths presents only part of the picture. As noted previ­ously, pledgers are far more likely to abstain from sexual activity entirely. Thus, when all youths (both those who are sexually active and those who are inactive) are examined, the data show that pledgers are substantially less likely to endanger themselves or others through unprotected sexual activity. As Chart 6 shows, 17.1 percent of strong pledgers reported having engaged in unprotected sex in the last survey year, compared to 28.2 per­cent of non-pledgers.[11] Pledging is linked to a sig­nificant reduction in risky behavior.

Link
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
Originally posted by: Riprorin
False.


Pledgers have Lower Rates of Unprotected Sexual Activity

Pledgers are significantly less likely than non-pledgers to engage in unprotected sexual activity (i.e., to have intercourse without contraception). While previous reports have suggested that sexually active pledgers are less likely to use contraception than non-pledgers are, examina­tion of the Wave III data of the Add Health survey does not con­firm this. In fact, as Table 5 shows, pledgers who are sexually active are slightly more likely to use contraception than are their counterparts among the non-pledging group. However, the dif­ference between the groups is not statistically significant.

Moreover, examination of sexually active youths presents only part of the picture. As noted previ­ously, pledgers are far more likely to abstain from sexual activity entirely. Thus, when all youths (both those who are sexually active and those who are inactive) are examined, the data show that pledgers are substantially less likely to endanger themselves or others through unprotected sexual activity. As Chart 6 shows, 17.1 percent of strong pledgers reported having engaged in unprotected sex in the last survey year, compared to 28.2 per­cent of non-pledgers.[11] Pledging is linked to a sig­nificant reduction in risky behavior.Link
So almost 20% of those who p[ledge have unprotected sex? I wonder how many of them would benefit from real sex education?
 

Ldir

Platinum Member
Jul 23, 2003
2,184
0
0
Originally posted by: Riprorin
False.


Pledgers have Lower Rates of Unprotected Sexual Activity

Pledgers are significantly less likely than non-pledgers to engage in unprotected sexual activity (i.e., to have intercourse without contraception). While previous reports have suggested that sexually active pledgers are less likely to use contraception than non-pledgers are, examina­tion of the Wave III data of the Add Health survey does not con­firm this. In fact, as Table 5 shows, pledgers who are sexually active are slightly more likely to use contraception than are their counterparts among the non-pledging group. However, the dif­ference between the groups is not statistically significant.

Moreover, examination of sexually active youths presents only part of the picture. As noted previ­ously, pledgers are far more likely to abstain from sexual activity entirely. Thus, when all youths (both those who are sexually active and those who are inactive) are examined, the data show that pledgers are substantially less likely to endanger themselves or others through unprotected sexual activity. As Chart 6 shows, 17.1 percent of strong pledgers reported having engaged in unprotected sex in the last survey year, compared to 28.2 per­cent of non-pledgers.[11] Pledging is linked to a sig­nificant reduction in risky behavior.

Link

I think they are reversing cause and effect. Teens who are more likely to have sex are less likely to sign an abstinence pledge. I also think teens who signed a pledge are more likely to lie about breaking it.
 

Ldir

Platinum Member
Jul 23, 2003
2,184
0
0
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: Steeplerot
and do you bring besides spam?

Why bother if you don't have anything to add to this thead?

I've provided a solution that will virtually eliminate STDs and AIDS.

What do you have to offer?

I think we should eliminate Driver Education. Teens will not drive if we do not teach them safe driving techniques. I've provided a solution that will virtually eliminate accidents involving teenage drivers.
 

Riprorin

Banned
Apr 25, 2000
9,634
0
0
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: Riprorin
False.


Pledgers have Lower Rates of Unprotected Sexual Activity

Pledgers are significantly less likely than non-pledgers to engage in unprotected sexual activity (i.e., to have intercourse without contraception). While previous reports have suggested that sexually active pledgers are less likely to use contraception than non-pledgers are, examina­tion of the Wave III data of the Add Health survey does not con­firm this. In fact, as Table 5 shows, pledgers who are sexually active are slightly more likely to use contraception than are their counterparts among the non-pledging group. However, the dif­ference between the groups is not statistically significant.

Moreover, examination of sexually active youths presents only part of the picture. As noted previ­ously, pledgers are far more likely to abstain from sexual activity entirely. Thus, when all youths (both those who are sexually active and those who are inactive) are examined, the data show that pledgers are substantially less likely to endanger themselves or others through unprotected sexual activity. As Chart 6 shows, 17.1 percent of strong pledgers reported having engaged in unprotected sex in the last survey year, compared to 28.2 per­cent of non-pledgers.[11] Pledging is linked to a sig­nificant reduction in risky behavior.Link
So almost 20% of those who p[ledge have unprotected sex? I wonder how many of them would benefit from real sex education?

I'd say that a 40% reduction in risky behavior is pretty significant. You don't agree?

What in you opinion is "real sex education"?
 

Ldir

Platinum Member
Jul 23, 2003
2,184
0
0
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: Riprorin
False.


Pledgers have Lower Rates of Unprotected Sexual Activity

Pledgers are significantly less likely than non-pledgers to engage in unprotected sexual activity (i.e., to have intercourse without contraception). While previous reports have suggested that sexually active pledgers are less likely to use contraception than non-pledgers are, examina­tion of the Wave III data of the Add Health survey does not con­firm this. In fact, as Table 5 shows, pledgers who are sexually active are slightly more likely to use contraception than are their counterparts among the non-pledging group. However, the dif­ference between the groups is not statistically significant.

Moreover, examination of sexually active youths presents only part of the picture. As noted previ­ously, pledgers are far more likely to abstain from sexual activity entirely. Thus, when all youths (both those who are sexually active and those who are inactive) are examined, the data show that pledgers are substantially less likely to endanger themselves or others through unprotected sexual activity. As Chart 6 shows, 17.1 percent of strong pledgers reported having engaged in unprotected sex in the last survey year, compared to 28.2 per­cent of non-pledgers.[11] Pledging is linked to a sig­nificant reduction in risky behavior.Link
So almost 20% of those who p[ledge have unprotected sex? I wonder how many of them would benefit from real sex education?

I'd say that a 40% reduction in risky behavior is pretty significant. You don't agree?

What in you opinion is "real sex education"?

You are reversing cause and effect.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: Riprorin
False.


Pledgers have Lower Rates of Unprotected Sexual Activity

Pledgers are significantly less likely than non-pledgers to engage in unprotected sexual activity (i.e., to have intercourse without contraception). While previous reports have suggested that sexually active pledgers are less likely to use contraception than non-pledgers are, examina­tion of the Wave III data of the Add Health survey does not con­firm this. In fact, as Table 5 shows, pledgers who are sexually active are slightly more likely to use contraception than are their counterparts among the non-pledging group. However, the dif­ference between the groups is not statistically significant.

Moreover, examination of sexually active youths presents only part of the picture. As noted previ­ously, pledgers are far more likely to abstain from sexual activity entirely. Thus, when all youths (both those who are sexually active and those who are inactive) are examined, the data show that pledgers are substantially less likely to endanger themselves or others through unprotected sexual activity. As Chart 6 shows, 17.1 percent of strong pledgers reported having engaged in unprotected sex in the last survey
year, compared to 28.2 per­cent of non-pledgers.[11] Pledging is linked to a sig­nificant reduction in risky behavior.
So almost 20% of those who p[ledge have unprotected sex? I wonder how many of them would benefit from real sex education?

I'd say that a 40% reduction in risky behavior is pretty significant. You don't agree?
Yes but what percentage of the whole teenage population is it? When I was in High School Abstinance was taught but it did little good. They sure didn't push contraceptives.

What in you opinion is "real sex education"?
Teaching them everything about sexual reproduction including abstinance and contraceptives.
 

Riprorin

Banned
Apr 25, 2000
9,634
0
0
What's wrong with this model:

Question:
By teaching abstinence, aren't you ignoring the need for education about contraceptives for those teens who are sexually active?

Answer:
Prevention efforts can be categorized into three levels:

Primary- The focus of root causes of the epidemic,
Secondary- Moving sexually active teens out of sexual behavior whenever possible, and
Tertiary- or the last line of defense of risk reduction- providing temporary risk reductive measures.

FRIENDS FIRST is a primary prevention strategy. Discussion regarding information about birth control is utilized in secondary and tertiary efforts. It is our recommendation that when birth control is discussed at these other levels that it meet the following criteria:

Should be presented in the public schools in a context of marriage and family to encourage committed relationships.

Secondary and tertiary prevention should be conducted one-on-one using full disclosure of contraceptive failure rates within a medical cessation model for sexually active teens, and providing the ideal of abstinence until marriage, and fidelity within marriage as the only truly safe sex.
Factors such as adult-teen relationships and past sexual abuse should not be blindly condoned by irresponsibly distributing contraceptives with the message of "just use a condom or make sure you're protected."

The question is not "if", but when, how and by whom. Adults have the responsibility to tell teens the truth. Condoms are not fool proof and do not always provide adequate risk reduction for diseases spread by skin-to-skin contact such as Human Papilloma Virus, Herpes or Syphllis. Multiple partners are the primary risk factor spreading disease. If teens make other choices, they will be responsible for the consequences. We must be ethical in our response to the younger generation, and not perpetuate unhealthy, uncommitted adult or teen sexual relationships.

Link
 

3chordcharlie

Diamond Member
Mar 30, 2004
9,859
1
81
AO != 'pledging' either, unless you're going to sit the kids down and force them to sign a pledge.
 

aidanjm

Lifer
Aug 9, 2004
12,411
2
0
Originally posted by: Riprorin
False.


Pledgers have Lower Rates of Unprotected Sexual Activity

Pledgers are significantly less likely than non-pledgers to engage in unprotected sexual activity (i.e., to have intercourse without contraception). While previous reports have suggested that sexually active pledgers are less likely to use contraception than non-pledgers are, examina­tion of the Wave III data of the Add Health survey does not con­firm this. In fact, as Table 5 shows, pledgers who are sexually active are slightly more likely to use contraception than are their counterparts among the non-pledging group. However, the dif­ference between the groups is not statistically significant.

Moreover, examination of sexually active youths presents only part of the picture. As noted previ­ously, pledgers are far more likely to abstain from sexual activity entirely. Thus, when all youths (both those who are sexually active and those who are inactive) are examined, the data show that pledgers are substantially less likely to endanger themselves or others through unprotected sexual activity. As Chart 6 shows, 17.1 percent of strong pledgers reported having engaged in unprotected sex in the last survey year, compared to 28.2 per­cent of non-pledgers.[11] Pledging is linked to a sig­nificant reduction in risky behavior.

Link

What is the pattern of findings across similar studies?

 

aidanjm

Lifer
Aug 9, 2004
12,411
2
0
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: Riprorin
False.


Pledgers have Lower Rates of Unprotected Sexual Activity

Pledgers are significantly less likely than non-pledgers to engage in unprotected sexual activity (i.e., to have intercourse without contraception). While previous reports have suggested that sexually active pledgers are less likely to use contraception than non-pledgers are, examina­tion of the Wave III data of the Add Health survey does not con­firm this. In fact, as Table 5 shows, pledgers who are sexually active are slightly more likely to use contraception than are their counterparts among the non-pledging group. However, the dif­ference between the groups is not statistically significant.

Moreover, examination of sexually active youths presents only part of the picture. As noted previ­ously, pledgers are far more likely to abstain from sexual activity entirely. Thus, when all youths (both those who are sexually active and those who are inactive) are examined, the data show that pledgers are substantially less likely to endanger themselves or others through unprotected sexual activity. As Chart 6 shows, 17.1 percent of strong pledgers reported having engaged in unprotected sex in the last survey year, compared to 28.2 per­cent of non-pledgers.[11] Pledging is linked to a sig­nificant reduction in risky behavior.Link
So almost 20% of those who p[ledge have unprotected sex? I wonder how many of them would benefit from real sex education?

I'd say that a 40% reduction in risky behavior is pretty significant. You don't agree?

What in you opinion is "real sex education"?

You can't say with any certainty that making a virginity pledge delays the loss of virginitiy. The alternative explanation, which strikes me as more plausible, is that people willing to make such a pledge were going to delay loss of virginity anyway.


 

imported_tss4

Golden Member
Jun 30, 2004
1,607
0
0
Originally posted by: CycloWizard
Originally posted by: Fausto
I'm sorry, but do you have any data backing your implied assertion that teaching "safe-sex" actually encourages sexual activity? You're hinging your whole position on this, so I'm curious.
Just personal experience and common sense. Do you have any evidence to the contrary?
Originally posted by: tss4
http://www.samsloan.com/world-ab.htm

Researchers said the disparity could be because of the greater availability and use of contraceptives in the west.

The study found that 30 percent of all pregnancies in Africa were unplanned, as were 39 percent in eastern Asia (excluding Japan), 34 percent in the rest of Asia, 52 percent in Latin America, 63 percent in Eastern Europe, 33 percent in the rest of Europe and 45 percent in North America, Australia, New Zealand and Japan.

The study's findings follow recent surveys that showed abortion and teenage pregnancy rates declining in the United States.

The U.S. abortion rate in 1995 and 1996 among women ages 15-44 was the lowest since 1975. Twenty-three of every 1,000 women of childbearing age had an abortion in 1995-96 compared with 22 per 1,000 in 1975, according to a Guttmacher study released in December.
"said a study released Thursday by The Alan Guttmacher Institute, a research organization that receives some funding from Planned Parenthood."
Unfortunately, this study is funded by Planned Parenthood, the single largest supplier of birth control and abortions worldwide. That, and the Guttmacher Institute's mission is to "protect the reproductive choices of all women and men in the United States and throughout the world." Not exactly a reliable source for a study on the merits of birth control.

From The AGI's web site:
The Alan Guttmacher Institute (AGI) is a nonprofit organization focused on sexual and reproductive health research, policy analysis and public education. AGI publishes Perspectives on Sexual and Reproductive Health, International Family Planning Perspectives, The Guttmacher Report on Public Policy and special reports on topics pertaining to sexual and reproductive health and rights. The Institute's mission is to protect the reproductive choices of all women and men in the United States and throughout the world. It is to support their ability to obtain the information and services needed to achieve their full human rights, safeguard their health and exercise their individual responsibilities in regard to sexual behavior and relationships, reproduction and family formation.

So you found bias in one of my sources. You and I both know I could go out and find a bunch more sources that are less biased. And you did not adress or refute the other elements of my post. The point is their is evidence to suggest that using birth control works better than abstinance only. So why dismiss it without further studies. That's not respoonsible to our children.

 

CycloWizard

Lifer
Sep 10, 2001
12,348
1
81
Originally posted by: tss4
So you found bias in one of my sources. You and I both know I could go out and find a bunch more sources that are less biased. And you did not adress or refute the other elements of my post. The point is their is evidence to suggest that using birth control works better than abstinance only. So why dismiss it without further studies. That's not respoonsible to our children.
Feel free to find a bunch more sources. The evidence that you used to support your points were supplied by a clearly biased group. Therefore, I can't put much stock in it. This is like a Kirby vacuum cleaner salesman (which I used to be :D) handing you a study on how much dirt is left behind in your carpet when using another vacuum. Clearly, he has an agenda - he's putting facts in front of you that will likely lead to your investment in his industry. Same thing goes here.
 

imported_tss4

Golden Member
Jun 30, 2004
1,607
0
0
Originally posted by: CycloWizard
Originally posted by: tss4
So you found bias in one of my sources. You and I both know I could go out and find a bunch more sources that are less biased. And you did not adress or refute the other elements of my post. The point is their is evidence to suggest that using birth control works better than abstinance only. So why dismiss it without further studies. That's not respoonsible to our children.
Feel free to find a bunch more sources. The evidence that you used to support your points were supplied by a clearly biased group. Therefore, I can't put much stock in it. This is like a Kirby vacuum cleaner salesman (which I used to be :D) handing you a study on how much dirt is left behind in your carpet when using another vacuum. Clearly, he has an agenda - he's putting facts in front of you that will likely lead to your investment in his industry. Same thing goes here.

Every study has some form of bias to it. The abstiance only camp has there own studies that support their claims but they have their biases too. But I would be pretty dumb if I totally disregarded their evidence based on some bias. Each study ads to a body of evidence and should be wieghed accordingly. There is a lot of evidence that contraception lowers unwanted pregnanaices. There is evidence that teaching abstinace lowers unwanted pregnancies. There is very little in the way of studies to determine which has the greater affect and whether a combination of the two would be most effective. A truly responsible society would not disregard a method (either one) when they have not tested them properly. Its irresponsible and its not putting the children first.
 

aidanjm

Lifer
Aug 9, 2004
12,411
2
0
Originally posted by: tss4
Originally posted by: CycloWizard
Originally posted by: Fausto
I'm sorry, but do you have any data backing your implied assertion that teaching "safe-sex" actually encourages sexual activity? You're hinging your whole position on this, so I'm curious.
Just personal experience and common sense. Do you have any evidence to the contrary?
Originally posted by: tss4
http://www.samsloan.com/world-ab.htm

Researchers said the disparity could be because of the greater availability and use of contraceptives in the west.

The study found that 30 percent of all pregnancies in Africa were unplanned, as were 39 percent in eastern Asia (excluding Japan), 34 percent in the rest of Asia, 52 percent in Latin America, 63 percent in Eastern Europe, 33 percent in the rest of Europe and 45 percent in North America, Australia, New Zealand and Japan.

The study's findings follow recent surveys that showed abortion and teenage pregnancy rates declining in the United States.

The U.S. abortion rate in 1995 and 1996 among women ages 15-44 was the lowest since 1975. Twenty-three of every 1,000 women of childbearing age had an abortion in 1995-96 compared with 22 per 1,000 in 1975, according to a Guttmacher study released in December.
"said a study released Thursday by The Alan Guttmacher Institute, a research organization that receives some funding from Planned Parenthood."
Unfortunately, this study is funded by Planned Parenthood, the single largest supplier of birth control and abortions worldwide. That, and the Guttmacher Institute's mission is to "protect the reproductive choices of all women and men in the United States and throughout the world." Not exactly a reliable source for a study on the merits of birth control.

From The AGI's web site:
The Alan Guttmacher Institute (AGI) is a nonprofit organization focused on sexual and reproductive health research, policy analysis and public education. AGI publishes Perspectives on Sexual and Reproductive Health, International Family Planning Perspectives, The Guttmacher Report on Public Policy and special reports on topics pertaining to sexual and reproductive health and rights. The Institute's mission is to protect the reproductive choices of all women and men in the United States and throughout the world. It is to support their ability to obtain the information and services needed to achieve their full human rights, safeguard their health and exercise their individual responsibilities in regard to sexual behavior and relationships, reproduction and family formation.

So you found bias in one of my sources. You and I both know I could go out and find a bunch more sources that are less biased.

I'd like to point out that simply because a study is funded by a partisan organisation, does not mean it's findings are able to be simply dismissed with a wave of the hand. If there are specific faults with the study that lead CycloWizard to believe the results are worthless, then he should identify and describe those faults for us all. Simply dismissing results you don't like, on the grounds they were obtained by an organisation you don't like, is not good science.

Originally posted by: tss4
And you did not adress or refute the other elements of my post. The point is their is evidence to suggest that using birth control works better than abstinance only. So why dismiss it without further studies. That's not respoonsible to our children.

The reason people like PsychoWizard would like to dismiss such results, is that they are not consistent with his own ideological agenda.

I however agree with you, these findings are important, and more research along the lines of the study you referenced is defintely warranted.