A tale of two reviews

[Narmer]

I just read Anand's review of the iPod Touch. It's far more honest than what I read at Engadget. While Joshua Topolsky likes to wave off the Touch's major shortcomings, Anand was clear about what they meant.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3903/apples-ipod-touch-2010-review-not-a-poor-mans-iphone-4/1

http://www.engadget.com/2010/09/07/ipod-touch-review-2010/

Regarding the Microphone
From Anand:

For what could ultimately be a great FaceTime platform, I am very disappointed that Apple dropped the ball with some obvious shortcomings. Not shipping earbuds with a mic is very unfortunate, and the external speaker is too quiet for a comfortable FaceTime conversation. The rear facing mic worked in my experience but it seems like an odd place to put it.

From Topolsky:

As with the new nano, the touch did seem to sound a little better than previous versions, but it's not such an astounding difference that you should toss your last gen model in the garbage. Overall, playback seemed solid to us -- at least it didn't leave us wanting for quality. If you're planning on using the external speaker for listening, however, you might want to reconsider. We can't remember the last time we heard something so tinny. Of course, it's not surprising considering the size of this housing. Even though it's located in a similar spot as the iPhone 4's speaker, the volume and quality of audio it produces is not even in the same vicinity. Still, how often will you use this?

Uh, everytime you use Facetime, which is a major selling point of iOS4?

And, finally, our conclusion:

Anand:

The pricing guarantees Apple is going to continue to have incredible quarters going forward. Apple found sneaky ways to reduce the total BOM (bill of materials) cost on the new iPod Touch. A cheaper chassis compared to the iPhone 4, no GPS, less DRAM on package (256MB vs. 512MB), a cheaper screen and a worse imaging sensor. Granted the iPod Touch is significantly less expensive than the iPhone 4, particularly if you take into account the AT&T contract you need for the latter. At least the new iPod Touch was on par with the iPhone 4 as an MP3 player, which is important given this is an iPod.
The bottom line is that the new iPod Touch is not an iPhone 4 without the phone, it’s more like an updated iPod Touch - maybe even an iPod Touch 3.5. It’s not bad but it's not great either. You have to set your expectations accordingly.

Joshua Topolsky:

Reading through this review, it should be clear that there isn't actually a whole lot to say about this device that hasn't already been said. The new touch isn't magical or revolutionary, or even unfamiliar. What it is, however, is a product without a peer; a media player that does far more than media playing. Besides the smaller screen real estate, the touch might be better compared to a tablet or netbook -- it has many of the same functions (more, in some cases). So you're not just dropping $229 (8GB), $299 (32GB), or $399 (64GB, also, ouch) on a music and video player -- you're buying into a mini-computer, a video camera, and a game system all with a massive ecosystem.

If you're already carrying around a smartphone with the above functions, maybe the iPod touch doesn't make sense, but for the legions of buyers out there who have yet to make the jump (or are stuck with an outdated handset), this device's appeal is hard to deny. Don't get us wrong, the touch isn't without faults -- the lack of GPS and a fairly low-quality still camera come to mind -- but there's nothing major here that gives us pause (and frankly, nothing else like it on the market). With the addition of HD video shooting, the new Retina Display, and a faster A4 processor, the touch has just gone from "nice to have" to nearly irresistible.

Maybe it's the geek in me that has a thing for specs but, to me, Anand succinctly describes the new Touch whereas Topolsky, after he removed himself from Jobs' ass cheeks, commenced with the platitudes and just brushed aside the weaknesses of this latest Touch. If I didn't know better I'd say Topolsky was in on the take but that's just me.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Josh isn't on the take, they just went have opinions, it's not a iPhone 4 without the radio, it's a mini tablet. I don't know if Anand's getting tired of iOS devices or what's up with his review, it's a better device than the previous generation at nearly the same price point, if you pay attention, Josh uses a Droid Incredible as his personal phone.

If one reviewer's opionon was all that counted, wouldn't this be a boring world?

I find the iPod Touch a compelling device, and it'll make Apple a ton of $.

Anand is comparing a $600+ device to a $250 device. Obviously there's more missing from the iPod Touch than a radio when compared to an iPhone 4

From Josh's review:

If you're already carrying around a smartphone with the above functions, maybe the iPod touch doesn't make sense, but for the legions of buyers out there who have yet to make the jump (or are stuck with an outdated handset), this device's appeal is hard to deny. Don't get us wrong, the touch isn't without faults -- the lack of GPS and a fairly low-quality still camera come to mind -- but there's nothing major here that gives us pause (and frankly, nothing else like it on the market). With the addition of HD video shooting, the new Retina Display, and a faster A4 processor, the touch has just gone from "nice to have" to nearly irresistible.

The field is wide open for someone else to build a better device, a more fair comparison would be to the PMP's on the market now, not the iPhone 4.

And honestly, I suspect Anand is more of an Apple fan then Josh.

 

[Narmer]

Josh isn't on the take, they just went have opinions, it's not a iPhone 4 without the radio, it's a mini tablet. I don't know if Anand's getting tired of iOS devices or what's up with his review, it's a better device than the previous generation at nearly the same price point, if you pay attention, Josh uses a Droid Incredible as his personal phone.

If one reviewer's opionon was all that counted, wouldn't this be a boring world?

I find the iPod Touch a compelling device, and it'll make Apple a ton of $.

Anand is comparing a $600+ device to a $250 device. Obviously there's more missing from the iPod Touch than a radio when compared to an iPhone 4

Was the gap always this big between the Touch and iPhones?

 

[Pliablemoose]

Was the gap always this big between the Touch and iPhones?

Who cares? It's not an iPhone, they're not priced the same, they're not intended for the same consumer...

Does Apple need to have a press conference to explain that the iPod Touch isn't an iPhone? That the economy of scale comes into play with retail items?

 

[Narmer]

Who cares? It's not an iPhone, they're not priced the same, they're not intended for the same consumer...

Does Apple need to have a press conference to explain that the iPod Touch isn't an iPhone? That the economy of scale comes into play with retail items?

You're the one that mentioned the (retail) price gap.

 

[Pliablemoose]

You're the one that mentioned the (retail) price gap.

Do you expect a Corolla to be equal to an Avalon?

CNET:

The iPod Touch is the best iPod yet, offering all the fun of the iPhone experience without a carrier contract or monthly bill.
​

PC Mag:

The already superb iPod touch gets its most significant update in years, adding photo and video capture, along with FaceTime video chat and an ultra-high-res display.

Slashgear:

Finally, the iPod touch, and if ever there was a device to overshadow the iPhone 4, this is it. It’s tough to imagine Apple being able to shave anything more from the touch, and a brief hands-on with the PMP is enough to convince most that the Apple premium is worth it. $229 for the 8GB model is a step up from the iPod nano, true, but you’re getting a whole lot more potential for your money. Apple’s new $0.99 TV shows come into their own on the 3.5-inch Retina Display, which is perfectly proportioned for making the most of commutes, lunch hours or time in-between lectures, or of course there’s the A4 processor to drive high-resolution games from the App Store.

Laptop Mag:

Let's answer one question at a time. Is the new iPod touch a good alternative to the iPhone 4 for those who don't want to be stuck in a contract? It depends, but for most people we'd say no. The iPhone 4 has a much sharper still camera and a better screen. And despite the fact that AT&T's network can be unreliable, it's nice to be able to check e-mail, surf the web, and download apps without having to be connected to a Wi-Fi hotspot (or toting your own mobile hotspot). Is the iPod touch upgrade worthy? Again, it depends, but we think the sharper Retina Display, FaceTime functionality, and 720p video recording make this device a worthy successor to the third-generation iPod touch. It's also a great choice for anyone looking to buy the best app phone sans phone. These days $229 is nothing to sneeze at, but no other portable media player delivers this much fun in such a strikingly svelte package.

T3:

Top-notch audio quality, an HD camcorder and a great screen, combine with some welcome additions via IOS4.1 to create the best PMP you can buy

The list goes on. Anand isn't always right, and he certainly has the right to his opinion.


​

 

[dguy6789]

Engadget has never been a good gadget site for reviews or articles, they are one of the worst. Popular /= good.

 

[MrX8503]

I think Engadget is a pretty good site. The only review that I really disagreed with was their review of the new nano.

Aside from that, I don't understand why people wanted a true iphone4-without-the-phone. The iPhone is more expensive, you're not gonna get a free ride on the ipod touch.

I've always thought Anand's reviews are top notch. He isn't always the first to the gate of releasing a review, but from the reviews of the droid incredible, HTC EVO, Samsung EPIC, and the iphone4 he was the first or at least the one to go in depth about...

Droid Incredible Android 2.1 UI Lag
HTC EVO performance issues 30 fps cap
iPhone Attenuation
Samsung Epic Hummingbird GPU performance

There isn't another review site that goes into depth about these topics.

 

[MJinZ]

I just read Anand's review of the iPod Touch. It's far more honest than what I read at Engadget. While Joshua Topolsky likes to wave off the Touch's major shortcomings, Anand was clear about what they meant.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3903/apples-ipod-touch-2010-review-not-a-poor-mans-iphone-4/1

http://www.engadget.com/2010/09/07/ipod-touch-review-2010/

Regarding the Microphone
From Anand:


From Topolsky:


Uh, everytime you use Facetime, which is a major selling point of iOS4?

And, finally, our conclusion:

Anand:


Joshua Topolsky:


Maybe it's the geek in me that has a thing for specs but, to me, Anand succinctly describes the new Touch whereas Topolsky, after he removed himself from Jobs' ass cheeks, commenced with the platitudes and just brushed aside the weaknesses of this latest Touch. If I didn't know better I'd say Topolsky was in on the take but that's just me.

The iPod Touch - as extraneous and unnecessary as the iPad.

Unless you like to spend more money and carry more redundant and superfluous devices around with you.

 

[Tom]

Both reviews say the same things, Anand just seems surprised a $229 device doesn't have the same features as a $600 device, which is not surprising. Comparing the ATT contract price is nonsensical..why would anyone sign up for 2 years with ATT and get a Touch instead of an iphone ? The ATT iphone is subsidized by the contract, the true cost isn't just what you pay upfront for the phone.

Look at it objectively and it's got a lot of capability for $229.

In fact, it might be my first Apple product in about 25 years..

 

[MJinZ]

Both reviews say the same things, Anand just seems surprised a $229 device doesn't have the same features as a $600 device, which is not surprising. Comparing the ATT contract price is nonsensical..why would anyone sign up for 2 years with ATT and get a Touch instead of an iphone ? The ATT iphone is subsidized by the contract, the true cost isn't just what you pay upfront for the phone.

Look at it objectively and it's got a lot of capability for $229.

In fact, it might be my first Apple product in about 25 years..

Stupidity.

The cost of the iPhone is $200 for the consumer.

The cost of the iAmUselessAndTouchMyself is $229 for the consumer.

No one gives a shit about what it really costs to make.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Stupidity.

The cost of the iPhone is $200 for the consumer with a 2 year contract that costs a minimum of $1,440 over those 2 years to a whopping $3240 with "unlimited" service + tax, fees, etc.

The cost of the iAmUselessAndTouchMyself (damn, every so often the pitcher just floats one over the plate and I can't swing because the mods/admins are my friends here) is $229 for the consumer.

No one gives a shit about what it really costs to make.

I underlined my edits, dude, and bolded the ironic comment .

Somehow I suspect MJinZ doesn't hold an advanced degree in math, econ, accounting, or finance...

Here's the deal, think of the intended consumer for the iPod Touch, kids, fanbois (and I don't mean fanboys as a pejorative label here, let's call them enthusiasts), and folks who don't want a smart phone, or a smartphone contract.

The iPod Touch is, I'm gonna say it... Magical to these folks.

 

[Tom]

Stupidity.

The cost of the iPhone is $200 for the consumer.

The cost of the iAmUselessAndTouchMyself is $229 for the consumer.

No one gives a shit about what it really costs to make.

iphone costs $200 plus $2000 in monthly fees. Or hundreds in ETF fee. And without service I doubt it can be used for anything.

It's far less expensive and more useful for me to have an Evo or TP2 on Sprint and an ipod Touch than it is to have an iphone on ATT.

That's one thing the Touch is good for, access to iphone software without ATT.

Compare the Touch to a Nintendo DS, Sony PSP, a netbook or tablet, and it's quite an interesting device.

 

[MJinZ]

Somehow I suspect MJinZ doesn't hold an advanced degree in math, econ, accounting, or finance...

Apparently, it costs $3240 over two years as an added tax and does nothing else.

You NEED cell service. Most people also NEED data service.

The IamUselessTouch falls in the category of "extraneous device" or "I am a loser device" or "I am extremely poor but can afford this $229 device on my Welfare".

/Thread.

 

[MJinZ]

iphone costs $200 plus $2000 in monthly fees. Or hundreds in ETF fee. And without service I doubt it can be used for anything.

It's far less expensive and more useful for me to have an Evo or TP2 on Sprint and an ipod Touch than it is to have an iphone on ATT.

That's one thing the Touch is good for, access to iphone software without ATT.

Compare the Touch to a Nintendo DS, Sony PSP, a netbook or tablet, and it's quite an interesting device.

OMG I had no idea that iPhone software was Jesus in the second coming! HOly shit, whatever are we going to do without the useless Apps on the iPhone!!! How did I ever SURVIVE?!!?!

No, it's a useless device compared to any handheld gaming because it can't play any serious games with any substantial production value (unless you just like to waste your time, which I think you can do with Solitaire or Minesweeper). It also lacks buttons. Buttons are hot. Even Apple admitted it when it brought buttons back with the new Shuffle.

A netbook or a tablet? If an iPad can't even get within a 20 mile chasm of even the slowest POS Netbook, what do you think your ITouch is going to do? Write a paper? Load a USB device? Do any real work?

 

[Tom]

OMG I had no idea that iPhone software was Jesus in the second coming! HOly shit, whatever are we going to do without the useless Apps on the iPhone!!! How did I ever SURVIVE?!!?!

As I said, I don't use Apple apps and haven't since about 1991. Being able to access them for $229 is an interesting proposition though.

 

[MJinZ]

As I said, I don't use Apple apps and haven't since about 1991. Being able to access them for $229 is an interesting proposition though.

What exactly are "Apple Apps"? Are they magical?

Why don't you get an actually useful apple product like a Macbook Pro instead?

 

[Pliablemoose]

Apparently, it costs $3240 over two years as an added tax and does nothing else.

You NEED cell service. Most people also NEED data service.

The IamUselessTouch falls in the category of "extraneous device" or "I am a loser device" or "I am extremely poor but can afford this $229 device on my Welfare".

/Thread.

And once again, you forget the target audience, does a tween need a cell phone? Probably not. Does my 70 year old aunt want a smart phone? Probably not.

Where does Apple generate the majority of it's profits?

Waiting for it.....


In markets other than the US market. Think of the overseas target market, particularly in developing countries, do you think they need or can afford an iPhone or any smartphone and the data plan?

 

[MJinZ]

And once again, you forget the target audience, does a tween need a cell phone? Probably not. Does my 70 year old aunt want a smart phone? Probably not.

Where does Apple generate the majority of it's profits?

Waiting for it.....


In markets other than the US market. Think of the overseas target market, particularly in developing countries, do you think they need or can afford an iPhone or any smartphone and the data plan?

A Tween does need a cellphone. In this day and age.

A 70 year old wouldn't want an Ipod Touch if she wouldn't want a Smart Phone.

Overseas, phones like the iPhone are not subsidized (it's an American concept), yet people pay big bucks for them.

 

[Tom]

No, it's a useless device compared to any handheld gaming because it can't play any serious games with any substantial production value (unless you just like to waste your time, which I think you can do with Solitaire or Minesweeper). It also lacks buttons. Buttons are hot. Even Apple admitted it when it brought buttons back with the new Shuffle.

A netbook or a tablet? If an iPad can't even get within a 20 mile chasm of even the slowest POS Netbook, what do you think your ITouch is going to do? Write a paper? Load a USB device? Do any real work?

It fits easily in a pocket. Big advantage over a netbook or tablet. It's true my TP2 will do most things the Touch will do, but it's size means it can easily accompany my TP2 and having 2 devices could have some usefullness. And the TP2 being able to be a wifi hub means the Touch always could be connected.

I think it could be a very complimentary device, the primary things it can't do, gps and phone calls, the TP2, or most any phone can do.

Can the Touch do txt ? I assume it can using Google phone, but can it do it natively over wifi ?

 

[Tom]

What exactly are "Apple Apps"? Are they magical?

Why don't you get an actually useful apple product like a Macbook Pro instead?

I would if it cost $200. Apple apps are apps than run on Apple OS's. They aren't magical I don't think, but a person who likes tech and apps and games likes to be ale to use whatever there is, if it's not too costly and suits a purpose.

 

[Pliablemoose]

A Tween does need a cellphone. In this day and age.

A 70 year old wouldn't want an Ipod Touch if she wouldn't want a Smart Phone.

Overseas, phones like the iPhone are not subsidized (it's an American concept), yet people pay big bucks for them.

Apple is a corporation that's supposed to make money, and they do make money, hand over fist, quarter after quarter, by making educated guesses about what will make them tons of cash...

And you feel they should sell iPhones with data plans to Hungarian/Chinese/Latvian/Costa Rican tweens... Ok then, moving right along....

 

[MJinZ]

Apple is a corporation that's supposed to make money, and they do make money, hand over fist, quarter after quarter, by making educated guesses about what will make them tons of cash...

And you feel they should sell iPhones with data plans to Hungarian/Chinese/Latvian/Costa Rican tweens... Ok then, moving right along....

I'm not talking about International markets as they are not relevant in a discussion unrelated to Apple's Finances. Apple makes money as they are lead by the world's foremost interior designer, and he does a damn good job making sure everything is sparkly, white and minimalistically elegant. Even if they can't hold a signal without interference from human hands.

 

[Tom]

A Tween does need a cellphone. In this day and age.

A 70 year old wouldn't want an Ipod Touch if she wouldn't want a Smart Phone.

Overseas, phones like the iPhone are not subsidized (it's an American concept), yet people pay big bucks for them.

actually a 70 year old would want them if it means they can watch videos and communicate with their family visually. People that age see devices more as single purpose, a smartphone doing too many things is more confusing than a device they perceive as having a different purpose than a phone.

 

[MJinZ]

actually a 70 year old would want them if it means they can watch videos and communicate with their family visually. People that age see devices more as single purpose, a smartphone doing too many things is more confusing than a device they perceive as having a different purpose than a phone.

I suppose you do have those bumbling idiotic 70 year olds with a million different things inside their lady bags.