A really excellent jobs report!

[alcoholbob]

Maybe Moonbeam is a neurosurgeon in the Deep South? 90% of his posts on P&N are about conservative brain defects.

 

[nickqt]

Let's take a look at the past couple of "recoveries" as compared to the other recoveries where big ol' gub'mint increased spending to get people working again.

Neoliberalism. Not even once.

 

[OverVolt]

We need 400k jobs/month to actually recover. 200k jobs/month is simply the replacement rate. And there are alot of pent up displaced workers. Underemployment never even used to be a thing.

I've stopped caring about employment data for a long time. Most interesting statistic I've heard is actually from HR where I was recently hired. They used to get 107 applicants per job but that number is down to 43. I hypothesize that job boards circa 2009 like monster and such put the idea in peoples heads that you can apply to some six figure job posting across the country and actually have a shot in hell of landing it. For example at my moms work they interviewed someone from Louisiana just looking for a job and is all like oh yea and also I want to move here. In the days of paper applications (not long ago, FYI, I got a job in 2008 via paper application, which is now impossible) you had to actually you know, at least be close enough to drive there.

I understand people with skills in their peak earnings years might get poached to another state or switch to a different company just for the name on the resume, or whatever, but its kinda different when you have people applying to work at the Proctor&Gamble night shift manufacturing plant from 1,500 miles away for ten dolla an hour.

 

[nickqt]

We need 400k jobs/month to actually recover. 200k jobs/month is simply the replacement rate. And there are alot of pent up displaced workers. Underemployment never even used to be a thing.

90,000 jobs need to be created a month in order to keep up with population growth. ~257,000 a month is a pretty good number.

 

[OverVolt]

90,000 jobs need to be created a month in order to keep up with population growth. ~257,000 a month is a pretty good number.

The number is skewed because of how many are dropping out of the labor force THEN you look at population growth.

http://www.economicpopulist.org/content/how-many-jobs-are-needed-keep-population-growth

Luckily I was already looking at it in another tab, that says 126,000 or so using 68% participation, like before.

This is probably the most important dataset:

http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/NILFWJN

 

[nickqt]

The number is skewed because of how many are dropping out of the labor force THEN you look at population growth.

http://www.economicpopulist.org/content/how-many-jobs-are-needed-keep-population-growth

Luckily I was already looking at it in another tab, that says 126,000 or so using 68% participation, like before.

This is probably the most important dataset:

http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/NILFWJN

Well, first we should probably agree to a set benchmark, otherwise we'll just be crosstalking the whole time.

I just gave the 90k number because usually you go by current stats, whereas when an economy start improving, that number will go up as more people start looking for work again.

All I know is that ultimately, if the public employment numbers were anywhere near what they were pre-2008, unemployment would be a hell of a lot lower. Public employment has been dropping while private employment has been skyrocketing, at least compared to 2002-2008.

 

[Moonbeam]

What are you talking about? Boehner said "It’s always good news that more Americans are finding work," and added "That said, we know millions are still struggling and searching for a good job." Others clearly said that it was good news but there's still more work to do to improve. This is a brain defect in your world?

Please tell me more about who actually has a brain defect here.

Of course it's a brain defect. First it's Obama is terrible, the job market is a disaster, and then when the evidence to the contrary becomes undeniable, it becomes, this is good news BUT..... We never have plane old good news about the economy under a Democratic President, we always have bad news or better, when the evidence is overwhelming but lets keep the attention on the negative. Conservatives have a brain defect. They deny reality.

Now remember, there is no such thing as perfection. The best news could always be better. So let's not play that silly game. Republicans have done nothing but try to stop Obama from fixing the economy. They would destroy the country before they let his succeed and have done the best along that line that they can. When your team is more important than the nation, you have a brain defect. That conservatives have this problem more than liberals is a scientifically verified fact. Those scientists that know this are desperately seeking a way to keep conservatives from destroying the nation. You should try to help. And don't forget also, that no matter how badly defective you are, it could always be worse.

 

[fskimospy]

Why is it click bait or dumb? I read the article, and while I didn't verify all the information presented, it didn't seem deceptive on the surface. Could you please address the actual information presented and explain why it's flawed, I'd like to know.

He's acting like the U6 rate doesn't exist despite it being a routinely publicly reported number.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Of course it's a brain defect. First it's Obama is terrible, the job market is a disaster, and then when the evidence to the contrary becomes undeniable, it becomes, this is good news BUT..... We never have plane old good news about the economy under a Democratic President, we always have bad news or better, when the evidence is overwhelming but lets keep the attention on the negative. Conservatives have a brain defect. They deny reality.

Now remember, there is no such thing as perfection. The best news could always be better. So let's not play that silly game. Republicans have done nothing but try to stop Obama from fixing the economy. They would destroy the country before they let his succeed and have done the best along that line that they can. When your team is more important than the nation, you have a brain defect. That conservatives have this problem more than liberals is a scientifically verified fact. Those scientists that know this are desperately seeking a way to keep conservatives from destroying the nation. You should try to help. And don't forget also, that no matter how badly defective you are, it could always be worse.

There are a lot of ways to look at this...but I see that you're convinced and are unable to see what I see. The LBD is strong with you it seems.

 

[Moonbeam]

There are a lot of ways to look at this...but I see that you're convinced and are unable to see what I see. The LBD is strong with you it seems.

Yes, there are many ways to look at it, when you have ulterior needs, but the essential fact is that the report is good news. Republicans can't any longer deny it, but they won't flat out admit it either. I see exactly what you see and I also see it's a deflection. Remember which of us the scientists say is likely to do that.

 

[senseamp]

Let's take a look at the past couple of "recoveries" as compared to the other recoveries where big ol' gub'mint increased spending to get people working again.

Neoliberalism. Not even once.

Prolonged recessions after Reaganomics went into effect, not surprised, since it's all about spending cuts and financial bubbles.

 

[nickqt]

Prolonged recessions after Reaganomics went into effect, not surprised, since it's all about spending cuts and financial bubbles.

Take a look at private job creation and public job creation since 2009.

If the public sphere had expanded, or even remained the same instead of shrinking, unemployment would be even lower. And while I know it's reverse voodoo economics to think that people having jobs and spending creates demand for stuff, had employment jumped up like it used to before we decided that the rabble should suffer for being the rabble, the economy would have been much better, sooner.

Of course, I'm a MMT person, so I look at debt as simply an accounting of private assets, but that's another thread.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Yes, there are many ways to look at it, when you have ulterior needs, but the essential fact is that the report is good news. Republicans can't any longer deny it, but they won't flat out admit it either. I see exactly what you see and I also see it's a deflection. Remember which of us the scientists say is likely to do that.

They flat out said it was good news...wtf moonie?

 

[Moonbeam]

They flat out said it was good news...wtf moonie?

They qualified everything. Good news but but but isn't flat out.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

They qualified everything. Good news but but but isn't flat out.

Of course they qualified because it's true...we still need improvement. Or are you so LBD that you actually think it's not true and that we don't still need further improvement?

 

[piasabird]

How many people who are illegals are part of these job numbers? The government could easily provide number since they all have those foreign ID tax numbers on ssn cards.

Just like in California where they layed 0ff 500 people in IT and replaced them all with h1b foreign visa holders from India. I wonder how many of these are in the USA now?

 

[senseamp]

It really hurts you right wingers so much that the American economy is on the mend that you have to go through the five stages of grief?

 

[nickqt]

It really hurts you right wingers so much that the American economy is on the mend that you have to go through the five stages of grief?

They still have another year of hoping and praying that it goes bad so they even have a chance at the WH. Because Freedom.

 

[Moonbeam]

Of course they qualified because it's true...we still need improvement. Or are you so LBD that you actually think it's not true and that we don't still need further improvement?

What did I say before. There is nothing that can't be improved on, ever. Every post you've ever made could be improved on. Imagine if I told you that every time you posted. You would quickly conclude that I am insane and I would be. The reasons those folk gave in the link I gave are all there to detract and reduce the impact of the fact the figures were very good news. It's the nature of the but but but you are in denial about. You hide behind the trivial fact that the news could be better. Any good news can be better. But when you have a bunch of donkeys pointing that out you look for the motivation. "We came here to bury Caesar not to salute him."

Furthermore, you are defending the fucks that have done everything in their power to destroy the economy so Obama can get no credit for what little the Democrats could pass to make it better. You are on the side of folk who are against working people. How did you become so blind? If I weren't aware of the hopelessness of the CBD I could even get pissed off.

 

[Moonbeam]

It really hurts you right wingers so much that the American economy is on the mend that you have to go through the five stages of grief?

Hehehehehe When you have an ego as big as a conservative, even a nick can be huge.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

What did I say before. There is nothing that can't be improved on, ever. Every post you've ever made could be improved on. Imagine if I told you that every time you posted. You would quickly conclude that I am insane and I would be. The reasons those folk gave in the link I gave are all there to detract and reduce the impact of the fact the figures were very good news. It's the nature of the but but but you are in denial about. You hide behind the trivial fact that the news could be better. Any good news can be better. But when you have a bunch of donkeys pointing that out you look for the motivation. "We came here to bury Caesar not to salute him."

Furthermore, you are defending the fucks that have done everything in their power to destroy the economy so Obama can get no credit for what little the Democrats could pass to make it better. You are on the side of folk who are against working people. How did you become so blind? If I weren't aware of the hopelessness of the CBD I could even get pissed off.

They said the jobs reports was great; but the mere mention by some that further improvement is still needed gets your panties in a bunch. Even though it's fucking true! You're insane.

 

[glenn1]

It really hurts you right wingers so much that the American economy is on the mend that you have to go through the five stages of grief?

Why would it when it was the repudiation of Obama's economic policy and loss of the Congressional (D) majority in last 3 elections that's responsible for it?

They still have another year of hoping and praying that it goes bad so they even have a chance at the WH. Because Freedom.

You might want to reconsider that. When times are good is exactly when people tend to vote Republican because economic issues like taxes and social policy can become more of a focus. Poor economic times are ideal for Democrats to get elected to WH since that's when people are most afraid and willing to try their stupid economic ideas again until they wise up at the next election cycle.

 

[dank69]

They said the jobs reports was great; but the mere mention by some that further improvement is still needed gets your panties in a bunch. Even though it's fucking true! You're insane.

It goes without saying that things can be better, but the GOP has to say it anyway. They are implying that things would be better now if it weren't for Obama and the Democrats.

 

[dank69]

Why would it when it was the repudiation of Obama's economic policy and loss of the Congressional (D) majority in last 3 elections that's responsible for it?



You might want to reconsider that. When times are good is exactly when people tend to vote Republican because economic issues like taxes and social policy can become more of a focus. Poor economic times are ideal for Democrats to get elected to WH since that's when people are most afraid and willing to try their stupid economic ideas again until they wise up at the next election cycle.

What specific economic policies of the Democrats do you feel are stupid?

 

[fskimospy]

What specific economic policies of the Democrats do you feel are stupid?

He is just really really angry that liberal economic policies turned out to be right. The more evidence he sees, the angrier he gets.