A question of mental health

[Bateluer]

Does anyone have experience with mental health providers, psychologists, psychiatrists, counselors, that sort?

The past few months, this has been getting progressively worse. I've been attributing it to the rotating schedule at work, my decreasing mileage, and the aching jaw/headaches brought on by my braces. If I'm lucky, I'll get 5 hours of sleep on a week day, usually closer to 3. Doesn't matter what time I go to bed, I'll end up staring at the ceiling for hours. I don't doubt that this is having an effect.

For most of the summer, I was working nights, which meant I had to do my runs either at nearly the hottest part of the day or after the end of a shift. Either way, the run wasn't the best it could be. In early September, I went with some friends to Disneyland for the Half Marathon and flipped back to a 'day' schedule. While there, I don't think I slept more than an hour or two at a time. Towards the end of the day, I'd become testy and short tempered, several times wandering off in the park myself without telling my friends where I was heading. Wasn't really heading anywhere, just wandered off. The group was debating which thrill rides they wanted to go on at the parks, rides I don't enjoy, so I wandered off.

The week after we got back, there was a Happy Hour type outing that I went to with the same group of people. It was originally to take place at my favorite restaurant, but after arriving and getting our group on the list and learning it would be an 45mn-1hr wait, they decided to go to be least favorite restaurant. However, they wanted to keep our names on the list as they wanted to return there to drink later. So we went to my least favorite restaurant, everyone orders large meals and food. I thought thought that was odd, given that they'd stated they wanted to return to the first restaurant for drinking, and it'd take nearly an hour for the second restaurant to bring out the food. Buzzer for the first restaurant goes off right as they bring out the food. I ask if they want me to head back to the first place to hold the table so it doesn't get given away. They say sure. I had back, and end up sitting by myself at a table for 10 for 45 minutes. I say 'fvck it' and leave. Unfortunately, since I didn't drive, I walked the 6 miles home. There's more details to this story, but that's the basics.

A few days later, I get an email from one of my closest friends, who was there, telling me that she's noticed a negative trend in my behavior, that I need to learn how to act in social situations, and that I need to stop being so inflexible with life. She suggests I seek professional help, notes that our mutual employer provides excellent medical benefits, including mental health. I have my doubts on this, as I'm on the entry level plan and she's on the top end/cadillac plan. I responded some time later explaining my stance on that night, and went into a little detail with whats been happening with me and how I really didn't want to see a counselor because of my extreme distrust of the medical profession, 6 years of government medical care in the USAF will do that.

For a few days, I hear nothing. Since I consider her one of my best friends, I write up an extremely detailed email, bout 4 pages, explaining everything thats been irritating me and why I believe it so. I covered the braces, aching jaw, headaches, rotating schedules, and my dropping mileage. I should also add here that we're coming into the racing season, now is not the type for my mileage to be dropping. And this is something that is every present in my mind. If I were to stop running, I don't think I'd make it a month. I also went into detail why I dislike doctors and why I refuse to take any medications unless its an absolute necessity.

Her response was, shall we say, brutally honest. There are definitely times when I really feel 'blah' and have no motivation to much more than get out of bed. I'm positive my work performance is suffering for it. But, on days where I get a good nights sleep, I'm awake and motivated. On days where I get a good night's sleep and a good run, I feel fantastic. But it fades by the end of the day. My friend really wants me to see a professional for my 'problems' and get medication. I will not budge on the medication thing, I will not take any medications. The side effects are not worth the temporary benefits. They only cover up the problem and not solve it. I'm agreeable to seeing a counselor or therapist if I could find the right one. I pulled some of the providers covered by my employer's insurance, but the information listed on the insurance site profile doesn't really give much to go on to evaluate them. A few got ruled out easily by having their office hours posted, being too far away, etc.

Thing is, I really don't believe a therapist is going to solve the problems, and in fact, may make things worse by taking vital training time. But if something doesn't happen, its a good bet that a few of my closet friends will be lost.

Rock and a hard place.

 

[kamper]

Out of curiosity, why are you so dependent on running? I can certainly understand that running makes you happy, but not being able to see a doctor because it might cost you some training time seems a little extreme to me. What would really happen if you missed one day of training?

Other than that, I really hope you find something that works for you. I know I'm much less pleasant in the office on less than 5 hours of sleep (he said while on the internet at 3:30am) and regularly getting as little as you're getting must be horrible. Do what you can to keep your friends. That one sounds like she'd really like to help you if she can.

 

[hellotyler]

Sleep deprivation is terrible, speaking as a fellow insomniac, I know your pain. It effects so many aspects of your life and people just look at you like you should 'get with the program'. Sedatives have been the only half-assed answer I could find, temazepam or valium, I'm sure your doctor would know what is best. What I was prescribed doesn't even work that well, but it's better then staring at the ceiling for 4 hours. Another side note is that you can't take them daily, unless you're looking to be addicted to pills that is. I'm not so I get prescribed 10 or so at a time for use 'as needed'. I really hate having to choke down a stupid pill just to get some sleep, but still, I guess it's better then not sleeping at all.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

There are other early options to consider before you should feel the need to consult someone in the psychology field. Firstly, if you can, you should start setting an exact time where you go to bed and wake up each and every day. The regularity of the schedule will aid with your sleep hygiene and circadian rhythms. If you can't sleep when you lie down, you can look into full spectrum lighting that you can utilize throughout the day to really regulate your circadian rhythms. What they do it tell you (while you're inside) that day is day. And when you get home and have to go to sleep, you can black the room out and your body will recognize that as night more clearly. Perhaps that will aid your problem.

Secondly, you can go to a regular doctor (people view MDs as less quacky) and get a prescription for something like Ambien. It's a pill that aids the process of falling asleep and improves the quality of sleep, even if brief. I've had severe bouts of insomnia (just had one for about 3 weeks) and I was feeling the same way - lethargic, unmotivated, cranky, and just moody all around. I took one of the Ambien (I only take it when the insomnia is driving me mad) and boom, I got an 8h night of sleep. After that, I cleaned up my sleep schedule, and I'm sleeping fine again. Medication doesn't have to be a regular thing - it can just help you get back on track, especially with insomnia. I hope you consider the other two options. You shouldn't feel you don't have options. You really do.

 

[imagoon]

Question, would you include quality of sleep in this?

I basically feel as the OP said (minus the running) a lot of the time. Even when I managed to get a 8 hours, I still feel exhausted and don't want to get out of bed.

I have been putting this all on stress at the moment, but maybe it is sleep issues or some combination of.

 

[Kipper]

Well, you have to do something about this, don't you? It is clearly affecting your quality of life. Since you don't want to take meds, that leaves only one angle of mental health professional: counseling/talk therapy. Working with a therapist is a complete issue of FIT. You need a professional who is competent (obviously), but more important, one that you can develop rapport with. If you are going to be uptight and closed, the sessions are a waste of time. "Shop around" if it's necessary, but give the relationship a chance to develop. Consider gender of the therapist, as well as credentials. See if you can get a referral covered under your insurance by going through either your primary MD or a local mental health organization.

Also consider that your inability to sleep and/or mental state is affecting your running, and possibly vice versa. The mind and body are not two separate entities. As the Latin motto goes, mens sana in corpore sano - a sound mind (spirit) in a sound body.

 

[mizzou]

What a depressing fucking thread.

You, no offense, sound like you acted like an ass when you went out with your friends and also at the disneyland thing. Your actions to your friends probably came off as whiny pouting you didnt get your way.

I know im not getting the full story so im not faulting you, but obviously thise around you bear the brunt of your dissatisfications. Maybe hang out with people who do stuff you like, but imo, you are probably just irritable and craby due to no sleep.

It routinely takes me hours to fall asleep and i can bever sleep in , but i mabage by incorporating.a strict night rouine that guarantees decent rest.

And go do something fun and happy, even if its by yourself!

 

[RagingBITCH]

You're a runner. Running is your outlet to relieve stress and feel good about yourself. Your schedule interfered with your running, caused your one outlet to no longer be that outlet, and you have no idea where to turn to or what to do. You find balance in running, and since it's not up to par/snuff, you're off-balance, hence your lack of sleep, behavior, etc.

I was told I fell into similar patterns/anti-social behavior during some of my injuries earlier this year. I had one friend (who is always blunt) tell me I need to find some other outlet to balance my life out - what if I permanently get hurt and can no longer run? Same situation as yourself. You need to creatively find some other outlet in which you can channel your energy and stress through, or find some way to balance everything you have going on in life. I equate running to an addiction - take away heroin from a heroin addict - they go nuts. Same thing is happening to you.

It's obviously not easy to do, but you need to find another outlet to channel/balance yourself out.

 

[Carmen813]

Ygpm.

 

[Whisper]

Disturbed sleep can definitely be a significant cause of irritability, disrupted concentration, lethargy, and a whole host of other issues. It's possible that there might be an underlying cause of the sleep disturbance that is mental health-related, or vice-versa--that the sleep deprivation is a primary cause of the mental health issues. Or both.

There are actually psychologists who specialize in sleep disorders, and who've developed many common sleep hygiene tips and strategies (some of which SociallyChallenged mentioned). You could always give one of them a try, and if the underlying issue is one of mental health rather than solely sleep disturbance, they may be able to pick up on it.

 

[Bateluer]

You, no offense, sound like you acted like an ass when you went out with your friends and also at the disneyland thing. Your actions to your friends probably came off as whiny pouting you didnt get your way.

What my friend said, in a nut shell. I don't want to quote it here, but the above is pretty much dead on. I'm not normally like that, its honestly been in the past 2 months or so that little things have been irritating me.

You're a runner. Running is your outlet to relieve stress and feel good about yourself. Your schedule interfered with your running, caused your one outlet to no longer be that outlet, and you have no idea where to turn to or what to do. You find balance in running, and since it's not up to par/snuff, you're off-balance, hence your lack of sleep, behavior, etc.

I was told I fell into similar patterns/anti-social behavior during some of my injuries earlier this year. I had one friend (who is always blunt) tell me I need to find some other outlet to balance my life out - what if I permanently get hurt and can no longer run? Same situation as yourself. You need to creatively find some other outlet in which you can channel your energy and stress through, or find some way to balance everything you have going on in life. I equate running to an addiction - take away heroin from a heroin addict - they go nuts. Same thing is happening to you.

It's obviously not easy to do, but you need to find another outlet to channel/balance yourself out.

This sounds very accurate to me. I have no idea what I'd replace it with though. Don't the budget for much these days.

Ygpm.

Responded.

I'm hesitant to read up on personality disorders and do self diagnosing, thats a road I really don't want to go down. But, if you wiki Borderline Personality Disorder, its symptoms seem like a pretty accurate description of me. Right now, I feel decent and alert. This morning, not so much. Odds are, tonight will be 'not so much' as well.

I could probably go running on night, did that while working on nights because it was necessary. But, I'm on the day shift schedule for the time being, I don't want to be up all night and sleep all day. If I'm up to 2-4 in the morning, after I get off work, that's going to be devastating on a race weekend.

With regard to medications, I really do not want to take any. Googling for 'MedicationName side effects' makes me never want to take any medication ever. I only take multivitamins a few times a week.

 

[Whisper]

What my friend said, in a nut shell. I don't want to quote it here, but the above is pretty much dead on. I'm not normally like that, its honestly been in the past 2 months or so that little things have been irritating me.



This sounds very accurate to me. I have no idea what I'd replace it with though. Don't the budget for much these days.



Responded.

I'm hesitant to read up on personality disorders and do self diagnosing, thats a road I really don't want to go down. But, if you wiki Borderline Personality Disorder, its symptoms seem like a pretty accurate description of me. Right now, I feel decent and alert. This morning, not so much. Odds are, tonight will be 'not so much' as well.

I could probably go running on night, did that while working on nights because it was necessary. But, I'm on the day shift schedule for the time being, I don't want to be up all night and sleep all day. If I'm up to 2-4 in the morning, after I get off work, that's going to be devastating on a race weekend.

With regard to medications, I really do not want to take any. Googling for 'MedicationName side effects' makes me never want to take any medication ever. I only take multivitamins a few times a week.

Self-diagnosis of any mental health condition, especially a personality disorder, is generally never accurate. It's exceedingly hard to objectively observe yourself. Also, keep in mind that the personality disorders are comprised of various characteristics that all of us have to some degree. These characteristics only venture into the realm of pathology when they co-exist in certain clusters and are beyond a certain level of severity.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

With regard to medications, I really do not want to take any. Googling for 'MedicationName side effects' makes me never want to take any medication ever. I only take multivitamins a few times a week.

Are you a recovering addict of some sort? What is the underlying reason that you don't want to take medication? As an athlete, you are less likely to have complications or any interactions with other drugs (since you don't take anything else). Personally, I very rarely get ANY side effects. To be perfectly honest, there's not much to lose if you try something. If you take it and it works, then you can use it as a tool to recover from insomnia. If you take it and you have side effects, then you have a bad night and you're all done. Really, side effects are typically rather superficial (nausea, headache, dry mouth). The cost to gain ratio is low. Trust me, I'm not exactly the pill-popper. I take ibuprofen only when I have to (typically for inflammation over anything else) and I am very, very wary about stuff like sleeping pills. I tried Ambien once, it worked great. I used it again a year later, it worked great again. If you can use them in moderation (or even only as necessity dictates), then you will be alright.

 

[Bateluer]

Are you a recovering addict of some sort? What is the underlying reason that you don't want to take medication?

I am wary of long term issues, and issues that arise after the medication has been on the market for a while. I took Accutane when I was younger, get rid of the acne, but years later it was found to cause a whole slew of very bad long term effects. Had some people I knew if USAF technical training that took were taking Ephedra back in 2002/2003. Only one of them had a serious issue due to it, but it underlines my point. These are unnatural chemicals we're putting into our bodies, often because the drug company tells us we need them.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

I am wary of long term issues, and issues that arise after the medication has been on the market for a while. I took Accutane when I was younger, get rid of the acne, but years later it was found to cause a whole slew of very bad long term effects. Had some people I knew if USAF technical training that took were taking Ephedra back in 2002/2003. Only one of them had a serious issue due to it, but it underlines my point. These are unnatural chemicals we're putting into our bodies, often because the drug company tells us we need them.

Right, but I specifically addressed the point of long-term use. If you had prolonged depression, then this would be a problem since the solution is frequently long-term medication. However, you can try to alleviate your insomnia with temporary short-lived medication while you clean up your sleep habits and lifestyle. Short-lived medication produces short-lived side effects (if the side effects show up at all). You don't have much to lose and you have a lot to gain by temporarily utilizing medication. Due to the news and hype about medications going awry, the perceived prevalence of medication troubles is much, much greater than the actual prevalence. Everyone thinks CA gets riddled with earthquakes and that all of FL gets smashed with hurricanes yearly; but there are Californians who have never felt an earthquake and Floridians who have never been hit with heavy rain, let alone a hurricane. Think about it. Use your logic to think this through.

 

[Bateluer]

Right, but I specifically addressed the point of long-term use. If you had prolonged depression, then this would be a problem since the solution is frequently long-term medication. However, you can try to alleviate your insomnia with temporary short-lived medication while you clean up your sleep habits and lifestyle. Short-lived medication produces short-lived side effects (if the side effects show up at all). . . . Think about it. Use your logic to think this through.

I just don't like medications and would prefer to avoid them if at all possible. The human body has a natural balance. When there's a problem, such as depression or insomnia, the body is out of balance. Drugs and medications don't restore the balance. Best analogy I can up up with right now is a pathetic glass of salt water outside on a hot day. Not my best work.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

I just don't like medications and would prefer to avoid them if at all possible. The human body has a natural balance. When there's a problem, such as depression or insomnia, the body is out of balance. Drugs and medications don't restore the balance. Best analogy I can up up with right now is a pathetic glass of salt water outside on a hot day. Not my best work.

Right, but you need to keep in mind that nature is not perfect. The natural balance of some is severe depression and suicidal thoughts... The problem cannot be alleviated by other means when it's that far. The same thing goes with inoculations, antibiotics, etc. Saying nature is perfect or even best is not correct in many situations. Drugs like SSRI's actually do restore the balance via proper neurotransmitter secretion. Like I said, I'm not telling you to treat your depression. I'm telling you to treat your insomnia short term, of which depression and hopelessness are symptoms. I've been there from sleep deprivation - it can be fixed through primarily natural methods (sleep hygiene, lifestyle modifications as I stated before), but it may require brief medication.

 

[Bateluer]

Right, but you need to keep in mind that nature is not perfect. The natural balance of some is severe depression and suicidal thoughts... The problem cannot be alleviated by other means when it's that far. The same thing goes with inoculations, antibiotics, etc. Saying nature is perfect or even best is not correct in many situations. Drugs like SSRI's actually do restore the balance via proper neurotransmitter secretion. Like I said, I'm not telling you to treat your depression. I'm telling you to treat your insomnia short term, of which depression and hopelessness are symptoms. I've been there from sleep deprivation - it can be fixed through primarily natural methods (sleep hygiene, lifestyle modifications as I stated before), but it may require brief medication.

I have some contacts to call Monday morning, see what comes from it. Last few days, I've taken melatonin tablets. Seems to keep my asleep for considerably longer. Other issues still need to be addressed though.

 

[Bateluer]

Made the call, insurance information/etc given, waiting for a callback for scheduling.

Feel good when I get a decent night's sleep, 0030 to ~0630 pretty solidly.

 

[MrColin]

Thing is, I really don't believe a therapist is going to solve the problems, and in fact, may make things worse by taking vital training time. But if something doesn't happen, its a good bet that a few of my closet friends will be lost.

No therapist is going to solve anything. A good one may be able to help you identify your issues better and offer you ways to deal with them. The responsibility for handling your problems will always be on you. A therapist, as an independent observer being well versed in things like this can help you a lot. If there is a downward trend in your quality of life, you owe it to yourself to do something, and you don't seem to have figured it out on your own.

 

[Bateluer]

If there is a downward trend in your quality of life, you owe it to yourself to do something, and you don't seem to have figured it out on your own.

Probably could resolve it myself, but parts of it can't. If that makes sense. Destroying one's own friendships while they try to fix their own problems when loneliness is one of their problems doesn't sound like a recipe for success.

 

[Whisper]

No therapist is going to solve anything. A good one may be able to help you identify your issues better and offer you ways to deal with them. The responsibility for handling your problems will always be on you. A therapist, as an independent observer being well versed in things like this can help you a lot. If there is a downward trend in your quality of life, you owe it to yourself to do something, and you don't seem to have figured it out on your own.

This is exactly true. No therapist should tell you that he or she will solve any of your problems, and most shouldn't even be offering advice at all, as that's also not the typical role of a therapist. Rather, a therapist is there--as MrColin said--to serve as an objective outsider and to teach you strategies and tools to use so that you can more effectively solve your own problems.

 

[Bateluer]

I have an appointment scheduled for early next week. See if I'm a lost cause or not. Seems like things that are 'normal' for me are not supposed to be normal.

 

[moshquerade]

I would bet the cause of all of this is your sleep deprivation. Your mind has become groggy. Your mood has become negatively affected, and you're feeling depressed.

Seriously, look up the consequences of lack of sleep.

The more you try to sleep the more you can't fall asleep. Your mind won't stop keeping you awake as you rehash the day and try to plan the next day.

I think you should start there. Go to your doc and ask how you can remedy your sleep issues.

 

[SociallyChallenged]

I would bet the cause of all of this is your sleep deprivation. Your mind has become groggy. Your mood has become negatively affected, and you're feeling depressed.

Seriously, look up the consequences of lack of sleep.

The more you try to sleep the more you can't fall asleep. Your mind won't stop keeping you awake as you rehash the day and try to plan the next day.

I think you should start there. Go to your doc and ask how you can remedy your sleep issues.

He has already been improving sleep duration and quality, but is still feeling symptomatic. I initially thought the same thing, but it seems it's a bit different than just sleep deprivation.