A nice silly-charged rod.

[Demon-Xanth]

2 turbos+blower on a 350=WHEEEE!

 

[SSSnail]

Is it just me, or that seems kinda wasted energy? Either way, one of those system is wasted. If the turbos output are higher, the supercharger is a stupid waste, and vice versa.

Leave it up to the rednecks to engineer craps. You don't get combined boost in this application.

 

[Eli]

Is it just me, or that seems kinda wasted energy? Either way, one of those system is wasted. If the turbos output are higher, the supercharger is a stupid waste, and vice versa.

Leave it up to the rednecks to engineer craps. You don't get combined boost in this application.

Huh? That isn't how it works.

If you have a turbo putting out 15PSI and a blower putting out 15PSI, it combines to give you 30PSI.

 

[JJ650]

besides...turbos run on wasted energy anyway.

 

[SSSnail]

Huh? That isn't how it works.

If you have a turbo putting out 15PSI and a blower putting out 15PSI, it combines to give you 30PSI.

No. He's feeding it to one another.

 

[Hyperlite]

God said, let there be BOV's.

Actually, that's a really interesting argument. Wouldn't the blower have to be making 30 PSI to see 15+15? but then the blower would be sucking air through the turbos....yeah i have no idea if this actually works. >.<

how does a normal twin-charger setup work? are the intake tracks combined after the blower???

googly googly gooo!!

 

[SSSnail]

Pressure works differently than volume.

 

[Demon-Xanth]

God said, let there be BOV's.

Actually, that's a really interesting argument. Wouldn't the blower have to be making 30 PSI to see 15+15? but then the blower would be sucking air through the turbos....yeah i have no idea if this actually works. >.<

how does a normal twin-charger setup work? are the intake tracks combined after the blower???

googly googly gooo!!

They can vary, but in the case of Detroit Diesels, they actually are setup like they are in the picture.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRewg1IhIHI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bjnAFZoRT0

 

[Hyperlite]

They can vary, but in the case of Detroit Diesels, they actually are setup like they are in the picture.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRewg1IhIHI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bjnAFZoRT0

i see. which led me to this video...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0o1o5W_f6o O.O

 

[Pantlegz]

Is it just me, or that seems kinda wasted energy? Either way, one of those system is wasted. If the turbos output are higher, the supercharger is a stupid waste, and vice versa.

Leave it up to the rednecks to engineer craps. You don't get combined boost in this application.

I'm at work and didn't watch the video...

But you can put a huge turbo on a car with a SC to build boost faster. basically the SC is going to 'waste' but it's allowing the car to run on ~15psi while the turbo's spool up(quicker) eleminating some of the turbo lag. It may not be the best use of resources but it's not worthless.

 

[Demon-Xanth]

I'm at work and didn't watch the video...

But you can put a huge turbo on a car with a SC to build boost faster. basically the SC is going to 'waste' but it's allowing the car to run on ~15psi while the turbo's spool up(quicker) eleminating some of the turbo lag. It may not be the best use of resources but it's not worthless.

In the case of the videos I posted, they were two stroke diesels. No boost=no run. When you hear about "naturally aspirated" Detroit diesels, they still have blowers. Just not turbos.

 

[ElFenix]

so... 3 superchargers on one engine?

 

[SSSnail]

I'm at work and didn't watch the video...

But you can put a huge turbo on a car with a SC to build boost faster. basically the SC is going to 'waste' but it's allowing the car to run on ~15psi while the turbo's spool up(quicker) eleminating some of the turbo lag. It may not be the best use of resources but it's not worthless.

There are SOOOOO many other ways to get rid of turbo lags without resorting to inefficient redneck engineering, and they're available.

With this rig, you'll have to think about what it's actually helping in turbo lag time, versus weight and parasitic drag on the whole system (and at the higher end, if he ever gets there). Keep in mind that it does not add any boost whatsoever to the whole output.

 

[LordMorpheus]

turbo and supercharged engines aren't a waste and this guy isn't the first.

As was said earlier, if you've got the super making 15 psi, and the turbos making 15 psi, you'll get 30 going into the engine. Each device creates a pressure differential from it's input to output. The pipes between the turbo and supercharger will be 15 psi above atmosphere, and the intake manifold will be 15 psi above that, so 30 psi above atmosphere.

Of course, if you look at the car he's putting the engine in, this guy isn't terribly concerned about performance. It's an old school hotrod, the power is only a side effect of what he's going for - a unique and awesome piece of functional art.

I know I saw a turbo and supercharged engine going in a factory five GTM or an RCR car. I'm looking for the build thread, but so far no luck. It would be an example of a more performance oriented approach to this than the (awesome) engine in the OP.

 

[SSSnail]

lol

 

[Demon-Xanth]

lol

You laugh, yet still claim that a turbo leading into a supercharger doesn't work, while I have two videos of exactly that having been done by a major manufacturer.

Twincharging was also used on aircraft in WW2, the Lancia Delta S4 rally car, as well as the Nissan March Superturbo which made a run of production cars. It can be made to work. Though I'll be the first to admit that the car in the OP was far from an optimized state for performance. It looks badass though.

 

[SSSnail]

Of course it works, but one of it is next to useless, unless the intention is to reduce low RPM turbo lags, and ONLY then it would serves its purpose.

To explain it in terms some of you can understand, if you have a tank that's filled to 100 PSI, and you divide the tank in half. Each of the halves' pressure is still 100 PSI, not 50 PSI. Conversely, when you remove the divider, it's still 100 PSI, not 200 PSI. It is the volume that's changed, not the pressure.

Many manufacturers have instead of installing twin turbos are installing bi-turbos to take care of this lag problems.

 

[EightySix Four]

Of course it works, but one of it is next to useless, unless the intention is to reduce low RPM turbo lags, and ONLY then it would serves its purpose.

To explain it in terms some of you can understand, if you have a tank that's filled to 100 PSI, and you divide the tank in half. Each of the halves' pressure is still 100 PSI, not 50 PSI. Conversely, when you remove the divider, it's still 100 PSI, not 200 PSI. It is the volume that's changed, not the pressure.

Many manufacturers have instead of installing twin turbos are installing bi-turbos to take care of this lag problems.

First, "bi-turbo" means twin turbo, dumb ass, you're thinking about a twin-scroll turbo. Second, if you're running a big turbo, it doesn't matter what you do, there is going to be lag. The only choice is to run a compound set-up (throw on a supercharger) or live with the lag, twin-scroll or not.

 

[Demon-Xanth]

First, "bi-turbo" means twin turbo, dumb ass, you're thinking about a twin-scroll turbo. Second, if you're running a big turbo, it doesn't matter what you do, there is going to be lag. The only choice is to run a compound set-up, throw on a supercharger, or live with the lag, twin-scroll or not.

I believe he's trying to differentiate between sequential and parallel turbo arrangements. During the late 80's early 90's a few manufacturers paired up a small and a large turbo inline with each other. Whereas these days most put two medium sized ones beside if they're going to go with two.

 

[EightySix Four]

I believe he's trying to differentiate between sequential and parallel turbo arrangements. During the late 80's early 90's a few manufacturers paired up a small and a large turbo inline with each other. Whereas these days most put two medium sized ones beside if they're going to go with two.

It doesn't matter if they are sequential or parallel, it's still bi/twin turbo.

Definition of Bi:
joining two, combining or involving two

 

[exdeath]

No. He's feeding it to one another.

It's called compound boost.

 

[exdeath]

Of course it works, but one of it is next to useless, unless the intention is to reduce low RPM turbo lags, and ONLY then it would serves its purpose.

To explain it in terms some of you can understand, if you have a tank that's filled to 100 PSI, and you divide the tank in half. Each of the halves' pressure is still 100 PSI, not 50 PSI. Conversely, when you remove the divider, it's still 100 PSI, not 200 PSI. It is the volume that's changed, not the pressure.

Many manufacturers have instead of installing twin turbos are installing bi-turbos to take care of this lag problems.

But compressors aren't tanks, they work in relative pressure difference between inlet and outlet and work in stages. If the air going into a compressor is already 15 psi, and the second stage compressor is adding another 15 psi, you get 30 psi. If the turbos are 15 psi and the blower is 15 psi, the blower isn't just going to have zero effect because the incoming air is already 15 psi, it's going to double the pressure of the already compressed air.

If you don't think sequential compressors work in that way (increasing differential pressure between inlet and outlet of each stage), then the jet engine is impossible.

 

[Demon-Xanth]

It doesn't matter if they are sequential or parallel, it's still bi/twin turbo.

Definition of Bi:
joining two, combining or involving two

I understand that, wasn't saying he was right. Just taking a guess.

 

[halik]

Huh? That isn't how it works.

If you have a turbo putting out 15PSI and a blower putting out 15PSI, it combines to give you 30PSI.

Not quite, if the flow characteristics of the the devices aren't identical, one or the other will impede the efficiency:

Turbos flow more air than blower : pressure before the blower > pressure after blower
Blower flows more air than turbos : pressure before blower lower than atmospheric.

Incidentally this is why electric sump pump ebay "supercharges" don't do anything - they simply can't move enough air under load to build positive pressure.

 

[halik]

turbo and supercharged engines aren't a waste and this guy isn't the first.

As was said earlier, if you've got the super making 15 psi, and the turbos making 15 psi, you'll get 30 going into the engine. Each device creates a pressure differential from it's input to output. The pipes between the turbo and supercharger will be 15 psi above atmosphere, and the intake manifold will be 15 psi above that, so 30 psi above atmosphere.

Of course, if you look at the car he's putting the engine in, this guy isn't terribly concerned about performance. It's an old school hotrod, the power is only a side effect of what he's going for - a unique and awesome piece of functional art.

I know I saw a turbo and supercharged engine going in a factory five GTM or an RCR car. I'm looking for the build thread, but so far no luck. It would be an example of a more performance oriented approach to this than the (awesome) engine in the OP.

Pressure differential is a function of airflow...