A letter to John

vanln

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Aug 1, 2002
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Bring it on, John
Oliver North

August 27, 2004

"Of course, the president keeps telling people he would never question my service to our country. Instead, he watches as a Republican-funded attack group does just that. Well, if he wants to have a debate about our service in Vietnam, here is my answer: 'Bring it on.'" -- Sen. John Kerry

Dear John,

As usual, you have it wrong. You don't have a beef with President George Bush about your war record. He's been exceedingly generous about your military service. Your complaint is with the 2.5 million of us who served honorably in a war that ended 29 years ago and which you, not the president, made the centerpiece of this campaign.

I talk to a lot of vets, John, and this really isn't about your medals or how you got them. Like you, I have a Silver Star and a Bronze Star. I only have two Purple Hearts, though. I turned down the others so that I could stay with the Marines in my rifle platoon. But I think you might agree with me, though I've never heard you say it, that the officers always got more medals than they earned and the youngsters we led never got as many medals as they deserved.

This really isn't about how early you came home from that war, either, John. There have always been guys in every war who want to go home. There are also lots of guys, like those in my rifle platoon in Vietnam, who did a full 13 months in the field. And there are, thankfully, lots of young Americans today in Iraq and Afghanistan who volunteered to return to war because, as one of them told me in Ramadi a few weeks ago, "the job isn't finished."

Nor is this about whether you were in Cambodia on Christmas Eve, 1968. Heck John, people get lost going on vacation. If you got lost, just say so. Your campaign has admitted that you now know that you really weren't in Cambodia that night and that Richard Nixon wasn't really president when you thought he was. Now would be a good time to explain to us how you could have all that bogus stuff "seared" into your memory -- especially since you want to have your finger on our nation's nuclear trigger.

But that's not really the problem, either. The trouble you're having, John, isn't about your medals or coming home early or getting lost -- or even Richard Nixon. The issue is what you did to us when you came home, John.

When you got home, you co-founded Vietnam Veterans Against the War and wrote "The New Soldier," which denounced those of us who served -- and were still serving -- on the battlefields of a thankless war. Worst of all, John, you then accused me -- and all of us who served in Vietnam -- of committing terrible crimes and atrocities.

On April 22, 1971, under oath, you told the Senate Foreign Relations Committee that you had knowledge that American troops "had personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies, randomly shot at civilians, razed villages in fashion reminiscent of Genghis Khan, shot cattle and dogs for fun, poisoned food stocks, and generally ravaged the country side of South Vietnam." And you admitted on television that "yes, yes, I committed the same kind of atrocities as thousands of other soldiers have committed."

And for good measure you stated, "(America is) more guilty than any other body, of violations of (the) Geneva Conventions ... the torture of prisoners, the killing of prisoners."

Your "antiwar" statements and activities were painful for those of us carrying the scars of Vietnam and trying to move on with our lives. And for those who were still there, it was even more hurtful. But those who suffered the most from what you said and did were the hundreds of American prisoners of war being held by Hanoi. Here's what some of them endured because of you, John:

Capt. James Warner had already spent four years in Vietnamese custody when he was handed a copy of your testimony by his captors. Warner says that for his captors, your statements "were proof I deserved to be punished." He wasn't released until March 14, 1973.

Maj. Kenneth Cordier, an Air Force pilot who was in Vietnamese custody for 2,284 days, says his captors "repeated incessantly" your one-liner about being "the last man to die" for a lost cause. Cordier was released March 4, 1973.

Navy Lt. Paul Galanti says your accusations "were as demoralizing as solitary (confinement) ... and a prime reason the war dragged on." He remained in North Vietnamese hands until February 12, 1973.

John, did you think they would forget? When Tim Russert asked about your claim that you and others in Vietnam committed "atrocities," instead of standing by your sworn testimony, you confessed that your words "were a bit over the top." Does that mean you lied under oath? Or does it mean you are a war criminal? You can't have this one both ways, John. Either way, you're not fit to be a prison guard at Abu Ghraib, much less commander in chief.

One last thing, John. In 1988, Jane Fonda said: "I would like to say something ... to men who were in Vietnam, who I hurt, or whose pain I caused to deepen because of things that I said or did. I was trying to help end the killing and the war, but there were times when I was thoughtless and careless about it and I'm ... very sorry that I hurt them. And I want to apologize to them and their families."

Even Jane Fonda apologized. Will you, John?

Oliver North is a nationally syndicated columnist, host of the Fox News Channel's War Stories and founder and honorary chairman of Freedom Alliance


http://www.vnsfvetakerry.com/bring_it_on-ok_we_will.htm
 

sMiLeYz

Platinum Member
Feb 3, 2003
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Has Oliver North apologized for the Iran-Contra affair yet? Being convicted of selling arms to terrorist and covering it up is pretty serious especially in the context of post-9/11 world.
 

LunarRay

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2003
9,993
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Oliver North is a disgrace to the Nation. He has no status to comment on Kerry or Bush, IMO. He violated the law in more ways than I can count.. The shredding of documents... 'obstruction of justice' being the last.

I have more respect for Liddy (G. Gordon) than I do North.

I should say that the pension he draws as a retired 05 bothers me because he was in the Marines at the time of his misdeeds... but, he did serve so maybe I shouldn't be all that bothered..
 

PowerEngineer

Diamond Member
Oct 22, 2001
3,606
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So, now we're saying that John Kerry is responsible for lengthening the Vietnam war and the imprisonment of US soldiers? And I guess anyone else who found fault with the war is also responsible? Gosh, I guess we all ought to apologize for exercising our freedom to dissent. Especially that we now see in retrospect how absolutley critical the outcome of the war was to the defeat of communism.

What a crock!

Of course, this kind of thinking isn't really new to Oliver North. Any kind of dissent -- even from Congress -- is something he doesn't put any value on. That anyone puts any stock in his opinions is quite amazing.
 

Rainsford

Lifer
Apr 25, 2001
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I would being worrying about my opinion if I found Oliver North agreeing with me and supporting my side of things. That article is gibberish, but the part about Kerry being responsible for our POWs and the length of the war was simply astonishing.
 

smashp

Platinum Member
Aug 30, 2003
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I wonder if Oliver North's view could be tainted because John Kerry Broke open the entire Iran/contra affair.


maybe just a grudge.
 

chess9

Elite member
Apr 15, 2000
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"But I think you might agree with me, though I've never heard you say it, that the officers always got more medals than they earned and the youngsters we led never got as many medals as they deserved."

This is absolutely true and very, very sad. It is exactly what is wrong with the medal system and one of the reasons why I don't put HEAVY value on Kerry's decorations. But, this is not a problem he created and he DID serve.

Ollie North is an ex-Marine-and I tip my hat to him for his service-but he is bitter and confused and has made so many mistakes himself I'm surprised he has the cujones to "go" where this piece leads. I guess he's counting on the large number of people who don't remember and/or haven't read what happened under Reagan's watch. Instead of being in a federal prison he now has his own talk show?

-Robert
 

PatboyX

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2001
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Originally posted by: chess9
"But I think you might agree with me, though I've never heard you say it, that the officers always got more medals than they earned and the youngsters we led never got as many medals as they deserved."

This is absolutely true and very, very sad. It is exactly what is wrong with the medal system and one of the reasons why I don't put HEAVY value on Kerry's decorations. But, this is not a problem he created and he DID serve.

Ollie North is an ex-Marine-and I tip my hat to him for his service-but he is bitter and confused and has made so many mistakes himself I'm surprised he has the cujones to "go" where this piece leads. I guess he's counting on the large number of people who don't remember and/or haven't read what happened under Reagan's watch. Instead of being in a federal prison he now has his own talk show?

-Robert

i actually believe you are correct on that last point. i wasnt really paying attention to politics when i was younger and north hit that point, but i still remember seeing him on tv. i think a lot of college-aged folks wont remember or know much about him.

i didnt know he had his own tv show but i saw him once on hannity and colmes. a reporter from rolling stone was on to do a bit on the soldiers in Iraq and North basically just had to keep trying to make the reporter feel like a pansy for not being a part of the military and for just riding along and north kept saying "im going back tomorrow. you coming?" anytime the reporter would suggest that some (but he stressed not a lot) of the troops were getting depressed about the situation back home.
 

Ldir

Platinum Member
Jul 23, 2003
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Oliver North is right about one thing. The Not-so-swift Liars issue is not about Kerry's medals or when he was in Cambodia. It is about Vietnam veterans who still carry a grudge against people like Kerry who protested the war. They are bitter old man so consumed by hate they will lie to hurt Kerry. They dishonor themselves.
 
Jan 12, 2003
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Originally posted by: LunarRay


Oliver North is a disgrace to the Nation.

Yea, okay...no more so than John Kerry. We had Americans being held hostage overseas; if one was your father/son/brother, so would be signing a different tune.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
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Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
Originally posted by: LunarRay


Oliver North is a disgrace to the Nation.

Yea, okay...no more so than John Kerry. We had Americans being held hostage overseas; if one was your father/son/brother, so would be signing a different tune.
Why it was Kerry and those like him that helped bring the POWs home earlier than they would have if it were left up to the cocksckers running the war
 

Infohawk

Lifer
Jan 12, 2002
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Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
Originally posted by: LunarRay


Oliver North is a disgrace to the Nation.

Yea, okay...no more so than John Kerry. We had Americans being held hostage overseas; if one was your father/son/brother, so would be signing a different tune.


So you aren't bothere by liars and cheaters and terrorist appeasers if the results suit you?
 

Todd33

Diamond Member
Oct 16, 2003
7,842
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A letter from a lying criminal, lovely. Kerry should whipe his a$$ with it.

When Oliver North was compelled to give testimony in the Iran-Contral scandal and then convicted by the Courts on the basis of his own testimony, he was defended by the ACLU, claiming a violation of his constitutional right not to incriminate himself, and his conviction was overturned (Smithsonian magazine, January 1998).
 

viivo

Diamond Member
May 4, 2002
3,345
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Originally posted by: Infohawk
Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
Originally posted by: LunarRay


Oliver North is a disgrace to the Nation.

Yea, okay...no more so than John Kerry. We had Americans being held hostage overseas; if one was your father/son/brother, so would be signing a different tune.


So you aren't bothere by liars and cheaters and terrorist appeasers if the results suit you?

Isn't that the extreme right's mantra?

"We supported Bin Laden and Saddam before we didn't," to use a tired phrase structure oft parroted by Galt.
 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,833
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The "Honorable" Ollie North. The one who takes it on himself to funnel money to terrorists. LOL, that's quite an endorsement. Bring on more of those.
 

LunarRay

Diamond Member
Mar 2, 2003
9,993
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Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
Originally posted by: LunarRay


Oliver North is a disgrace to the Nation.

Yea, okay...no more so than John Kerry. We had Americans being held hostage overseas; if one was your father/son/brother, so would be signing a different tune.

I'm not sure exactly how may hundreds of thousands American servicemen and women were 'held hostage' in the military while Nixon and company continued to prosecute that insidious war when Kerry testified and protested against it. But, I supported anything that could have help end it, if even by a day. I didn't actually protest overtly but, I did internally. I wish I had but, at the time I felt I owed something to the folks who served or were serving who didn't like what Kerry was doing.... A dilemma for me.. that time has not yet healed... I wish I was at that table when Kerry testified... right along side him!
 

raildogg

Lifer
Aug 24, 2004
12,892
572
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Originally posted by: LunarRay
Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
Originally posted by: LunarRay


Oliver North is a disgrace to the Nation.

Yea, okay...no more so than John Kerry. We had Americans being held hostage overseas; if one was your father/son/brother, so would be signing a different tune.

I'm not sure exactly how may hundreds of thousands American servicemen and women were 'held hostage' in the military while Nixon and company continued to prosecute that insidious war when Kerry testified and protested against it. But, I supported anything that could have help end it, if even by a day. I didn't actually protest overtly but, I did internally. I wish I had but, at the time I felt I owed something to the folks who served or were serving who didn't like what Kerry was doing.... A dilemma for me.. that time has not yet healed... I wish I was at that table when Kerry testified... right along side him!


dont blame Nixon for vietnam ... blame LBJ ...
 

PatboyX

Diamond Member
Aug 10, 2001
7,024
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Originally posted by: arsbanned
Hahah...Oliver North...decided to crawl back out from under that rock I see.

:thumbsup:

apparently, he fills in for hannity quite a bit.

youd think colmes would bring that up.
oh wait...
 

slyedog

Senior member
Jan 12, 2001
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But Oliver North is not running for pres. Kerry is and he is history. kerry is unraveling like a
spool of thread.