A foolproof PSU for nextgen graphics cards

[axemanrio]

Alright, I'm planning to upgrade my PSU but want to make sure I don't have to change it when I get a dx10 compatible graphics card (whenever G80 or R600 releases).

The 2 PSU's I have in mind: Enermax ELT620AWT & Fortron FX700-GLN

The major differences between them: Enermax has two +12v@22A rails and 80% efficiency AND Fortron has four +12v@15A rails with >85% efficiency.

Question: Should I get a PSU with higher amperage on the rails (enermax) or one with more than 2 rails (Fortron)? I also plan to get a water cooling system for my rig in future.

Thanks!

 

[PurdueRy]

There's no guarantee that the next gen GPUs will take more power. If anything they will probably take about the same.

The electronics world cannot keep using more and more power. Efficiency is becoming a huge concern, as you can see in the latest processors.

I would get a quality 500 watt or so and be done with it.

 

[axemanrio]

Thanks purdue... so will an Enermax Liberty 500AWT or Antec NeoHE 500 be able to run a card like the x1900xtx and a swiftech water cooling system?

 

[PurdueRy]

Originally posted by: axemanrio
Thanks purdue... so will an Enermax Liberty 500AWT or Antec NeoHE 500 be able to run a card like the x1900xtx and a swiftech water cooling system?

I don't imagine either would have a problem. If you want a little more go for a 550.

 

[n7]

I disagree with the recommendation to just get a good 500W.

SLI/Crossfire isn't going to happen on that even now, nevermind in the future.

That FSP you are looking at is a superb PSU.

Quad rails; each one has a task.

12V1 - CPU
12V2 - CPU2 & PCI-e2
12V3 - mobo & other accessories
12V4 - PCI-e1

 

[Howard]

Under 35 degrees Celsius, the FX700-GLN can supply more current on the +12V rails.

Heck, even the FX600-GN will supply more +12V current than the Liberty 620 (at 35C or under).

 

[axemanrio]

Thanks n7/howard... however, wouldn't the lower amperage (15A) on the FX700's +12v rails be a bottleneck eventually? Assuming I get an X2 4800 + 3*250GB drives + 2 optical drives + x1900xtx + swiftech h20-220 kit, are you saying the FX700 will handle these components better than the Liberty 620AWT or Seasonic 600W because of the 4 independent rails?

 

[Howard]

Originally posted by: axemanrio
Thanks n7/howard... however, wouldn't the lower amperage (15A) on the FX700's +12v rails be a bottleneck eventually? Assuming I get an X2 4800 + 3*250GB drives + 2 optical drives + x1900xtx + swiftech h20-220 kit, are you saying the FX700 will handle these components better than the Liberty 620AWT or Seasonic 600W because of the 4 independent rails?

15A isn't really the max on each rail. I hear it's 18A.

 

[Luckyboy1]

The Enermax is easily the best choice between the two.

Big time edit:

I missed the part where you said you were going to water cool. You start getting beyond the power supplies you are talking about and things start getting expensive in a hurry. So, I have a few questions before advising you further...

1) Are you planning to run all the water cooling gear on the power supply?

2) Would this include a 12 volt pump or are you going to go with a 120 volt pump?

3) Any plans to get nuts with Peltiers?

 

[axemanrio]

Originally posted by: Howard

15A isn't really the max on each rail. I hear it's 18A.

Howard, it's 15A according to newegg and manufacturer. How does it stack up against the Liberty @ 15A per +12v rail?

 

[axemanrio]

Answers to big time edit

1. Yes

2. I will be running this swiftech cooling kit, which has a 12v pump

3. No

Thanks for your help, luckyboy!

 

[jonnyGURU]

12V rails are not additive, so look at the Combined Maximum Wattage for the 12V rails to determine which really has more power.

Also, if you get the FSP, DO NOT use the 8-pin EPS motherboard connector is using SLI. If your motherboard has an 8-pin, but not a 4-pin, use the 4-pin connector in the 8-pin header.

 

[n7]

Originally posted by: axemanrio

Originally posted by: Howard

15A isn't really the max on each rail. I hear it's 18A.

Howard, it's 15A according to newegg and manufacturer. How does it stack up against the Liberty @ 15A per +12v rail?

Actually Howard is right.

Originally posted by:[FSP]Grace on Hexus

What I mentioned applies to the present Epsilon 600/ 700.

Yes, the present ones have been reclassified. Even though it says 15A, it's actually 18A (with Over Current Protection of 20A).

Grace

A lot more great info here: http://forums.hexus.net/forumdisplay.php?f=87

 

[n7]

Seriously though, these two PSUs aren't really even comparable IMO.

Liberty = total 36A max on the 12V rail
Epsilon = total 50A max on the 12V rail

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Showimage...0AWT+ATX12V+620W+Power+Supply+-+Retail

&

http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/1268/fsplabel6cy.jpg

And yes, you can see i have the FSP myself.
I actually was considering both those models too; you'll see that in a similar thread i made earlier.
After quite a bit of research, the Liberty wasn't even in my contender's list.
At the same price, there is simply no comparispon between these two, to hear someone saying the Liberty is the better choice easily is just laughable :laugh:

Do some research ffs...

 

[Luckyboy1]

With your 12 volt needs being right at the limit before considering a 12 volt pump, I'm not found of either choice anymore. They will be pushing their respective limits at best on the 12 volt side of life and that's no way to end up...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817711001#DetailSpecs

My thanks to Galvanized for finding this great rebate price from a good vendor! :beer:

 

[axemanrio]

LOL I'm even more confused now... I'm clear that the FSP rails are 18A even though it says 15A. What I'm not sure about is whether 20A would be sufficient for running a nextgen graphics card. $175 is a lot of money for me so I want to make sure my investment is worth it and I don't have to buy another PSU when a new GPU is out later this year. This was the primary reason behind considering the Liberty 620, since it has higher amperage (22A) on the +12v rails.

Btw, appreciate the help people...

 

[Bobthelost]

Originally posted by: Luckyboy1
With your 12 volt needs being right at the limit before considering a 12 volt pump, I'm not found of either choice anymore. They will be pushing their respective limits at best on the 12 volt side of life and that's no way to end up...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817711001#DetailSpecs

My thanks to Galvanized for finding this great rebate price from a good vendor! :beer:

What the ****** are you on about? No gaming system i've ever heard of draws 50A from the 12V rails, the very idea is ridiculous. And then you stick up your bloody OCZ again. Which is an overrated 600W model with 40A (or more likely less) on the 12V rails.

 

[jonnyGURU]

Originally posted by: n7
Seriously though, these two PSUs aren't really even comparable IMO.

You're right. They're not. It's an apples and oranges comparison, really.

Do you want modular or not? The Liberty is modualar. The FSP is not.

You don't get features for free. Every light, every shiny surface, sleeved and/or modular cable costs money.

If the Liberty is enough power and you want a modular power supply, it's a good choice.

If modular isn't a concern, then the FSP is a better choice.

This isn't brain surgery.

 

[jonnyGURU]

Originally posted by: Bobthelost

Originally posted by: Luckyboy1
With your 12 volt needs being right at the limit before considering a 12 volt pump, I'm not found of either choice anymore. They will be pushing their respective limits at best on the 12 volt side of life and that's no way to end up...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817711001#DetailSpecs

My thanks to Galvanized for finding this great rebate price from a good vendor! :beer:

What the ****** are you on about? No gaming system i've ever heard of draws 50A from the 12V rails, the very idea is ridiculous. And then you stick up your bloody OCZ again. Which is an overrated 600W model with 40A (or more likely less) on the 12V rails.

You're right. It's not 40A. It's 420W on the combined 12's. That's only 35A. There are 500W and 550W power supplies out there with as much that cost half as much.

I don't agree in investing extra money in "wattage" I'm not going to need as much of (3.3V, 5V, -12V)

 

[Bobthelost]

Originally posted by: jonnyGURU

You're right. It's not 40A. It's 420W on the combined 12's. That's only 35A. There are 500W and 550W power supplies out there with as much that cost half as much.

I don't agree in investing extra money in "wattage" I'm not going to need as much of (3.3V, 5V, -12V)

Thanks, i know that the rails added together are almost always less, but not by how much. It's nice how OCZ makes a 600W PSU and sells it based upon it's sustained rating, but newegg messes us around by advertising it as a 700W PSU.

If i were one of you yanks i'd drop them an email to complain.

 

[Luckyboy1]

The confusion here comes from how they rate these power supplies. OCZ tests the power supplies at the top of their rated case temperature operating range and only list constant duty specs and they add a little fudge factor to it. That's why you see at newegg, the newegg people are saying it is easily a 700 watt unit when compared to the other offerings.

Why the "stick" for OCZ?

1) Very conservative specs listed. You will get what you've paid for.

2) Quiet and I mean very quiet even under full load. There are cheaper knockoffs of the same power supply out there. They have cheaper capacitors that folks here and elsewhere report make noise at best and problems sometimes. They also have cheaper cooling fans that are noisier and whatnot. Who knows what else is cheated on as well. A UL spec has alot of wiggle room in it.

3) Superior fault detection circuits that may or may not be there with the cheap, knockoffs of same. I once accidentally dropped a screw that got behind the mommaboard and was jammed between the backing plate and a solder joint on the AGP connector. When I tried to start the PC, the OCZ 520 watt Powerstream I have (and no, the Modstreams are not nearly as good) would have none of it and never put out any power. It checks before it starts up and most check while they are starting up.

4) Superior RF insulating and high quality wiring and connectors.

5) A 5 year warranty and OCZ's superior rMA process.


With all this, I can take that "stick" and beat you with it compared to the other offerings.

 

[Operandi]

Originally posted by: Bobthelost

Originally posted by: Luckyboy1
With your 12 volt needs being right at the limit before considering a 12 volt pump, I'm not found of either choice anymore. They will be pushing their respective limits at best on the 12 volt side of life and that's no way to end up...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817711001#DetailSpecs

My thanks to Galvanized for finding this great rebate price from a good vendor! :beer:

What the ****** are you on about? No gaming system i've ever heard of draws 50A from the 12V rails, the very idea is ridiculous. And then you stick up your bloody OCZ again. Which is an overrated 600W model with 40A (or more likely less) on the 12V rails.

Agreed, everyone here stating that he "needs" a 600-700 watt PSU is crazy. It's practically impossible to build a PC that can draw that much power and the OP is nowhere near there.

If I was going to be building a ultra high-end machine in the near future I would go the 500 watt Seasonic S12. I can't imagine power requirements going up significantly from where they are now so the only way I can see the S12 becoming obsolete is if Intel changes the ATX spec again.

 

[PurdueRy]

Originally posted by: Operandi

Originally posted by: Bobthelost

Originally posted by: Luckyboy1
With your 12 volt needs being right at the limit before considering a 12 volt pump, I'm not found of either choice anymore. They will be pushing their respective limits at best on the 12 volt side of life and that's no way to end up...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817711001#DetailSpecs

My thanks to Galvanized for finding this great rebate price from a good vendor! :beer:

What the ****** are you on about? No gaming system i've ever heard of draws 50A from the 12V rails, the very idea is ridiculous. And then you stick up your bloody OCZ again. Which is an overrated 600W model with 40A (or more likely less) on the 12V rails.

Agreed, everyone here stating that he "needs" a 600-700 watt PSU is crazy. It's practically impossible to build a PC that can draw that much power and the OP is nowhere near there.

If I was going to be building a ultra high-end machine in the near future I would go the 500 watt Seasonic S12. I can't imagine power requirements going up significantly from where they are now so the only way I can see the S12 becoming obsolete is if Intel changes the ATX spec again.

That's what I said...but I guess I was crazy :disgust: