A first step to Dialogue: We need eloquent conservative thought.

[Dr. Zaus]

We need eloquent conservative thought.

Not for the sale of conservatives, but for the sake of engagement.

Let us remind ourselves that there is a language just as illiterate and worthless on the Left - postmodern gibberish.

We need somone to eloquently explain the meanings views of both sides in a common language.


Do we agree this would be a useful and good first step to dialogue?

 

[theeedude]

Conservative thought - oxymoron of the day.

 

[Fern]

It seems to me that those who are considered "eloquent conservatives" are in the 'establishment'. They mostly oppose Trump so I don't expect them to step forward etc.

In any case, at this point everything is drowned by the daily hysteria. Even if they were to step up (and maybe someone has) they wouldn't be heard. Also seems the topics change so fast no one has time to write/formulate anything eloquent. By the time it can be written and published the news cycle has moved on to something else and no one cares anymore.

Fern

 

[Jaskalas]

Do we agree this would be a useful and good first step to dialogue?

I wholeheartedly agree.
A topical and thoughtful discussion on issues, featuring a back and forth dialog is an effort that would elevate everyone involved.
Were you referring to P&N, or the national dialog? Past 2016 I'm not sure which is worse anymore.

 

[agent00f]

It seems to me that those who are considered "eloquent conservatives" are in the 'establishment'. They mostly oppose Trump so I don't expect them to step forward etc.

In any case, at this point everything is drowned by the daily hysteria. Even if they were to step up (and maybe someone has) they wouldn't be heard. Also seems the topics change so fast no one has time to write/formulate anything eloquent. By the time it can be written and published the news cycle has moved on to something else and no one cares anymore.

Fern

So really the reason why they can't think well is everyone else's fault but their own (probably mostly the leftards). Party of personal responsibility.

 

[nickqt]

We need eloquent conservative thought.

Not for the sale of conservatives, but for the sake of engagement.

Let us remind ourselves that there is a language just as illiterate and worthless on the Left - postmodern gibberish.

We need somone to eloquently explain the meanings views of both sides in a common language.


Do we agree this would be a useful and good first step to dialogue?

There are plenty of conservatives who are rational and reasonable.

And they've been declared RINOs and enemies of the modern Republican party. It's been moving faster and faster since 1994. There aren't many left who haven't either dropped the conservative moniker and gone with "libertarian", or "independent". At least the ones with any integrity .

 

[imported_tajmahal]

We need eloquent conservative thought.

Not for the sale of conservatives, but for the sake of engagement.

Let us remind ourselves that there is a language just as illiterate and worthless on the Left - postmodern gibberish.

We need somone to eloquently explain the meanings views of both sides in a common language.


Do we agree this would be a useful and good first step to dialogue?

Sure, i'll pick Newt Gingrich, one time Speaker of the House to represent modern conservative thought. I sure don't agree with him on many points, but he'll do the job. Who will stand for the left?

 

[agent00f]

There are plenty of conservatives who are rational and reasonable.

And they've been declared RINOs and enemies of the modern Republican party. It's been moving faster and faster since 1994. There aren't many left who haven't either dropped the conservative moniker and gone with "libertarian", or "independent". At least the ones with any integrity .

They still seem pretty content protecting their own, with little ambiguity of their flock.

Sure, i'll pick Newt Gingrich, one time Speaker of the House to represent modern conservative thought. I sure don't agree with him on many points, but he'll do the job. Who will stand for the left?

"Newt Gingrich is a dumb person's idea of a smart person." -- Smart leftard

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

Sure, i'll pick Newt Gingrich, one time Speaker of the House to represent modern conservative thought. I sure don't agree with him on many points, but he'll do the job. Who will stand for the left?

BWAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAA


Newt... no, just no.

 

[Fern]

So really the reason why they can't think well is everyone else's fault but their own (probably mostly the leftards). Party of personal responsibility.

You continue to demonstrate a serious deficiency in reading comprehension.

You confuse the inability to have your voice heard with the inability to think? Those aren't remotely the same.

Fern

 

[ivwshane]

Fern kind of hit it. There really aren't that many conservatives any more. The closest thing we have would be people like McCain and Lindsay Graham, huntsman or even mitt Romney.

the larger issue, for me, is that those on the right no longer accept facts. If we can't even agree on the basics then what hope do have of any meaningful discussion?

If we look at this forum and I think it actually does look very similar to the current political climate, you can see that one side more than the other is constantly trying to insert facts into the discussion while the other side ignores it, dismisses it, or proclaims that it's a conspiracy.

That being said, it does appear that those on the left are starting to go down the same path as the right.

 

[agent00f]

You continue to demonstrate a serious deficiency in reading comprehension.

You confuse the inability to have your voice heard with the inability to think? Those aren't remotely the same.

Fern

Take note there's literally stopping them except these excuses. Personally I take the lack of demonstrable thought to be indicative of the lack of thought since excuses tend to be post hoc, though some of it likely has to do with protecting their own where their silence speaks volumes.

 

[imported_tajmahal]

Fern kind of hit it. There really aren't that many conservatives any more. The closest thing we have would be people like McCain and Lindsay Graham, huntsman or even mitt Romney.

the larger issue, for me, is that those on the right no longer accept facts. If we can't even agree on the basics then what hope do have of any meaningful discussion?

If we look at this forum and I think it actually does look very similar to the current political climate, you can see that one side more than the other is constantly trying to insert facts into the discussion while the other side ignores it, dismisses it, or proclaims that it's a conspiracy.

That being said, it does appear that those on the left are starting to go down the same path as the right.

I don't consider Graham or McCain or Huntsman to be particularly conservative.Since they'd be the ones representing "my side" in a debate, i wouldn't choose them. As for your side, which Democrat/liberal/progressive would you pick to represent your side ?

 

[kage69]

Yeah sounds good Dixy. I just don't see it happening while education and science are mocked and vilified by Joe Six Pack, while ignorance and stubborn factionalism are often celebrated.

This goes a lot deeper than vocabulary and oratory skills, but I wish you luck all the same.

 

[ivwshane]

I don't consider Graham or McCain or Huntsman to be particularly conservative.Since they'd be the ones representing "my side" in a debate, i wouldn't choose them. As for your side, which Democrat/liberal/progressive would you pick to represent your side ?

Thanks for making my point. I don't side with anyone group or person, I pick sides based on facts and whose using them.

 

[imported_tajmahal]

Thanks for making my point. I don't side with anyone group or person, I pick sides based on facts and whose using them.

So you'd like to pick who debates on each side of an issue?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Yeah sounds good Dixy. I just don't see it happening while education and science are mocked and vilified by Joe Six Pack, while ignorance and stubborn factionalism are celebrated.

This goes a lot deeper than vocabulary, but I wish you luck all the same.

People don't want dialogue they want validation, too many, and if you aren't one of "us" you are one of "them". You kind of did that yourself. People yell I'm a Conservative because.. whatever, because I don't conform.

At this point I think Humpty Dumpty has hit the ground.

 

[Commodus]

What about David Frum? He's a neoconservative, but he's long been considered an intellectual conservative who's willing to point out problems with right-wing policy, compliment the left when he sees it doing things well, and change his ideas when logic and evidence suggest he's wrong. He welcomes social progress these days (he's fine with same-sex marriage) and believes the Republican party's recent fondness for obstructionism is destructive.

 

[dank69]

Pretty sure eloquence isn't the problem. Alternative facts, now we might have something.

 

[agent00f]

People don't want dialogue they want validation, too many, and if you aren't one of "us" you are one of "them". You kind of did that yourself. People yell I'm a Conservative because.. whatever, because I don't conform.

At this point I think Humpty Dumpty has hit the ground.

Your sort are conservative because they check all the boxes, BothSides, blame everything on them leftards, deny any conservatism despite all that, etc. But you are right that they're desperate looking to validate the perception of independent thought.

 

[agent00f]

The entire premise behind this thread is wrong, and that's an important enough point for its own thread: https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/conservatism-as-an-ideology-is-dumb-by-definition.2498346/

 

[zinfamous]

I think some still think that Newt Gingrich is one of those eloquent conservatives...but then you have to remind yourself that he is the guy that created what we have today with the conservative party of grown babies and terrified bed-wetters.

I don't know who is left...Collin Powell? lol, like he wants to be associated with the Pubs.

 

[zinfamous]

What about David Frum? He's a neoconservative, but he's long been considered an intellectual conservative who's willing to point out problems with right-wing policy, compliment the left when he sees it doing things well, and change his ideas when logic and evidence suggest he's wrong. He welcomes social progress these days (he's fine with same-sex marriage) and believes the Republican party's recent fondness for obstructionism is destructive.

David Brooks. But he's a RINO and quite possibly a traitor to America.

 

[HTFOff]

Do we agree this would be a useful and good first step to dialogue?

Good luck with that.

A third of house dems - a *third* - couldn't be bothered to get their crusty asses to the swearing in ceremony of a new president.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inauguration_of_Donald_Trump#Protests_and_demonstrations

Let me say it again - a THIRD of house democratic law makers skipped the swearing in of a new US president.

Not only do a sizeable portion of the left NOT want a dialogue, they simply do not respect the office of the presidency. Party before country, congrats team blue!

At least Obama didn't try to defend these schlubs.

 

[imported_tajmahal]

I think some still think that Newt Gingrich is one of those eloquent conservatives...but then you have to remind yourself that he is the guy that created what we have today with the conservative party of grown babies and terrified bed-wetters.

I don't know who is left...Collin Powell? lol, like he wants to be associated with the Pubs.

Why don't conservatives pick their choice for a conservative spokesperson and liberals pick their choice for a liberal spokesperson? Why would people from a opposing viewpoint think they should pick an opponent that the don't and never will agree with?