9800 gtx+ needs more power?

[Washoe]

The quick version - is a fsp-group 600w gln enough to run a 9800 gtx+?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817104014

mine must be an older model because my psu actually says 15a on the 12v rails.

Will that cut it to run a 9800 gtx+?


The detailed version of what I'm going through... I am in process of upgrading pc components.

Old system - asrock 939, amd 3700 san diego cpu, 1900xtx, decent ddr2 mem, a couple of ide hdds, with a fsp-group 600w gln psu.

Recently I've upgraded to:

Phenom ii black ed. 955, asus m4a785rd-v evo motherboard, 4GB ddr3 corsair dominator, 1TB sata drive.

the 1900xtx is decent for older games but I'd like to try some of the newer ones. Bestbuy has a pny 9800 gtx+ for sale at $109 here. I thought that would make a decent upgrade from the 1900xtx and allow me to try out some of the newer dx10 games.

I got it today, popped it in to the rig and powered up but no display. I took it out, made sure things were plugged in right, and it finally powered on. Win7 made me restart, but when it did, I got no display again. I hit restart button a few times, and it finally booted with display. Back into windows, but the whole pc shut down suddenly. It wouldn't start up again at all until I unplugged power, reset the switch, plugged back in, powered on, but then it again took a few tries to get a display on the monitor.

I guess it could be a bad card. It seems like this is likely to have been a re-shelved product. I noticed the hdmi audio cable is missing from the package - even though it's listed on the box as part of the package contents.

So I'll probably take it back, but I do wonder if the psu is an issue.

Again, here's the link to the psu on newegg
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817104014

Even though this one on newegg says 18a on the 12v rails, mine must have been an older model because my psu says 15a for all the 12v.

So do I really need to upgrade my power supply? I would have thought with my old system, that would be the one item - besides the case - that I didn't need to upgrade!

 

[cmdrdredd]

You have 15a across 4 "rails" (I doubt it really has 4 rails) which would put you at 60a total. It probably isn't that much power in reality. Having said that it should be enough, but it is possible that they are overestimating their 15a rating with 4 rails and really only get 12a and you're straining one rail already(the one your video card also needs).

I'd upghrade it to a better unit so this cannot happen again. A Corsair TX750 is $87.99 after rebate ($107 on newegg). It's a very solid and quality unit. I've run a GTX 295 and 9600GT (physx card) off of it and had no trouble whatsoever.

 

[v8envy]

15 amps * 12 volts = 180 watts. The big question is: can your PSU operate at 100% after capacitor aging, and at temperatures higher than 25C?

I'm guessing the answer is "no." A single core socket 939 is going to use a lot less of that juice than a quad. I'm a little surprised the X1900XT was able to function though -- the 9800GTX+ should draw even less current at idle.

It could be a fried and returned video card, but you're definitely not doing your CPU, hard drive and GPU (plus fans) any favors by trying to feed them all from a max of 180 watts.

 

[Washoe]

well I'm getting a bunch of restarts and sometimes no power-on at all. Gotta be the psu, right? I put back the 1900xtx and it boots fine.

 

[Schmide]

I would call bad card. That PSU should run any single card, regardless of it's age.

Have you switched up the 12v leads? Maybe a situation where all the 12v is coming from one rail?

 

[happy medium]

You need more than a 15 amp psu for a 9800gtx+. A quality psu with a 30amp rail should do it. Especially with a Quad core cpu.

Sorry read it wrong .

+1 for a bad card.

My 9800gtx+ has one pci-e connector. Does yours need 2?

 

[Schmide]

A 9800gtx+ (65nm) is going to use around 120w (10a) (55nm versions much less 80-100w)

 

[Washoe]

@happy medium - The card only requires 1 pci-e connector.

@Schmide - I have no idea how to switch the 12v leads...


I don't think the card is fried, as I was able to get it to boot into Windows a couple of times, at 1920x1200 res. Problem is, the whole system shut down within less than a minute of being logged in.

I've had the system with the 1900xtx in it running fine for about 4 days now.

I believe I do have enough justification to return the card... being that part of the contents were missing, which indicates a reshelved product.

Perhaps I should have done what I really wanted all along - get that nice Corsair 650TX and an Asus 5770!

 

[Washoe]

You know what, looking at the specs on the panel of the power supply
(here: http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/17-104-014-S05?$S640W$ )
(my power supply actually reads 15a, not 18a like the picture above)

It says 12V4 is for PCI-E, which would be just 15a going to the PCI-E component. Am I not reading that correctly?

 

[cmdrdredd]

No you have it right, 15a is probably not enough. You'd need a new PSU for a more power hungry card.

The recommended amperage for the card is 26a but this is considering a basic system with a single rail. You are already sharing part of your 12v rail with the CPU while running your video card.

 

[Washoe]

thx cmdrdredd. you happy with your hx1000?

 

[Schmide]

You know what, looking at the specs on the panel of the power supply
(here: http://images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/17-104-014-S05?$S640W$ )
(my power supply actually reads 15a, not 18a like the picture above)

It says 12V4 is for PCI-E, which would be just 15a going to the PCI-E component. Am I not reading that correctly?

It should show two of the 12V leads for each PCI-E leads. From the picture you showed one lead is shared with the CPU. This is what I was hinting at, try using the other pci-e lead. (PCI-E1?)

BTW 15a = 180w. If your phenom II 955 x4 (90-100w) shares the the rail with a 9800gtx+ (120w) you could see how it blows the budget. Moving that to another lead will alleviate that.

 

[Schmide]

No you have it right, 15a is probably not enough. You'd need a new PSU for a more power hungry card.

The recommended amperage for the card is 26a but this is considering a basic system with a single rail. You are already sharing part of your 12v rail with the CPU while running your video card.

Dude it's a 60a (~500w on the 12v) PSU? I think he's just using a rail shared with a hungry CPU.

 

[Washoe]

@Schmide thx a ton for the input. Actually I have tried it with both PCI-E connectors. Neither makes a difference.

 

[happy medium]

Believe it or not this Antec Earthwatts Green 380Watt for 45$ shipped and 15$ rebate($30) will run your system just fine, if your looking to save some money.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817371033

 

[cmdrdredd]

Dude it's a 60a (~500w on the 12v) PSU? I think he's just using a rail shared with a hungry CPU.

No, look at the rail diagram. 12v1 is for CPU1, 12v2 is for PCIe2 and CPU2, 12v3 is for M/B accessory basically everything else, and 12v4 is for PCIe1. So you're sharing the rail with the CPU which only has 15a to supply on that line. Remember he said his model is older and only has 15a on each rail.

I'm not sure what CPU1 and CPU2 means though.

 

[happy medium]

His psu has a total of 50 amps on the 12v rail.

http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=177211

Even 15 amps to 1 rail should run his 9800gtx+. Thats a 180 watt rail.

 

[Washoe]

here's a link to the video card at newegg
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814133246

but I did get it at best buy. Strange, the newegg product says it requires 2 PCIE connectors. But the one I got from bb only has 1. It also says on the back of the box:

"A minimum 450W or greater system power supply (with a minimum 12V current rating of 24A)"

Could this card I got from best buy really require a single 12V connector with 24A?

Perhaps I need to look into a single-rail psu solution?

 

[Schmide]

@cmdrdredd It a good PSU and should have plenty of juice/rails to run a 100-120w GPU with a 90-100w CPU regardless of the remaining components. He's not even getting into bios so it's no where near that draw. You should be able to boot his system on a 300w PSU.

Fsp Group is a darn good PSU producer.

Edit: Adding. His motherboard only accepts a single 4-pin CPU power (190w) and a 6-pin pci-e is limited to 75w as well. Edit: If they are shared this could over burden a single rail.

Have you tried switching to the other CPU 4-pin?

At this point I'm thinking bad card regardless.

Adding on the 12v

20-pin ATX = 75w(6a)
24-pin ATX = 150w(12a)
4-pin cpu = 190w(16a) <- Edit: oops this is much higher.
8-pin cpu = 330w(28a) <- Edit: oops this is much higher.
6-pin pci-e = 75w(6a)
8-pin pci-e = 150w(12a)

 

[happy medium]

With that psu,if the 1900xtx boots and runs fine and the 9800gtx+ dosen't , your card is bad.

Does the cards fan spin at startup?
Try booting into safe mode.

 

[Washoe]

@happy medium - the card fans do spin at startup (when it does decide to start)

and good point on the fact that it boots fine with the xtx in it.

I'm going to take it back to bestbuy and get another one to try. This one seems to me to have been re-shelved due to the lack of all the product contents.

ty to everyone for their input!

 

[happy medium]

@happy medium - the card fans do spin at startup (when it does decide to start)

and good point on the fact that it boots fine with the xtx in it.

I'm going to take it back to bestbuy and get another one to try. This one seems to me to have been re-shelved due to the lack of all the product contents.

ty to everyone for their input!

Plaese let us know how it turns out.

 

[Washoe]

new card, fresh out of the box - same problems.

It boots but I get no display.

I got it running for a couple of minutes, but the power shut off again.

Seems I need to do some psu shopping.

 

[Washoe]

hmm I've taken out the fsp-group power supply and I have to say.. .it's really dusty in there. Possible clean-up would help?

 

[happy medium]

hmm I've taken out the fsp-group power supply and I have to say.. .it's really dusty in there. Possible clean-up would help?

I find it real hard to believe that psu can't handle that card but runs the x1900xt fine.
Mabe the psu is going bad?

Give it a good cleaning.

Are you gonna buy a psu from best buy?