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97% of all shootings in NYC are done by blacks or hispanics

Jul 10, 2007
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96% of victims are also black or hispanic.

The latest NYPD statistics show that crime is centered overwhelmingly in minority-group neighborhoods — buttressing a key argument Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly makes to justify his controversial stop-and-frisk policy.

Citing an NYPD analysis of stats for the first six months of the year, Kelly said Wednesday that 96% of shooting victims are black or Hispanic — and in 97% of all shootings, the trigger was pulled by other blacks and Hispanics.

Kelly in recent months has repeatedly said minority-group leaders and civil liberties advocates complain about stop-and-frisk tactics but do nothing to help combat crime in minority neighborhoods.

A review of the statistics, contained in a report, “Crime Enforcement Activity in New York City,” shows that minority-group members also represent 89% of murder victims — and 86% of murder suspects. There are similar numbers for felony assaults — 81% of victims are minorities, as are 88% of the suspects.

But there is a sharp disparity for robberies, with blacks described as suspects in 70% of the cases, while they are victims in 33% of the crimes.

In response to the statistics, state Sen. Eric Adams (D-Brooklyn) said with too many minority men “career unemployed,” it’s inevitable some will turn to a life of crime.

“Where are the after-school programs and all these other programs that are supposed to help the police?” he asked.

“That’s why if only the Police Department looks at these numbers, we’re not going to come up with proactive crimefighting tools. The Police Department too often becomes the safety net when other agencies drop the ball.”

Eugene O’Donnell, a professor of police science at John Jay College of Criminal Justice, suggested the report has been compiled to blunt criticism that police routinely stop young minority-group men for no reason.

Kelly has worked to improve the NYPD’s relationship with minorities, in part by working with a task force of Brooklyn clergy.

Bishop Gerald Seabrooks of Rehoboth Cathedral said the partnership has paid off and will continue to do so if parents work harder at raising their kids.

“I think it’s more of a spiritual problem than a jobs problem,” he said. “In the 1930s, we didn’t have jobs, but we weren’t killing each other.”

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nypd-statistics-show-96-percent-shooting-victims-black-hispanic-minority-groups-represent-89-percent-murder-victims-article-1.1152838#ixzz25eXgLQTV
and yet I continued to get stopped and my bags searched.
it's about time we stop being PC and start profiling. statistics aren't racist.
 
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Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
66,613
3,406
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Wall street bankers steal in a minute what these criminals steal in a lifetime. We need to stop being brain dead and start profiling. White, work in a bank, have a Harvard business degree, put an FBI agent in their pocket.
 
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Lithium381

Lifer
May 12, 2001
12,464
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Yep, moonbeam hit it on the nose. lets go after the big problems first. so instead of going after our 2nd amendment rights and restricting gun ownership to "prevent needless deaths" when a criminal who wasn't going to follow the law anyway kills 10 people. . . . we should look at doing something about heart disease and cancer and respiratory diseases . . .
 

OCGuy

Lifer
Jul 12, 2000
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Of course. Unfortunately this country is too PC to have a real discussion over the violence problem.
 
Jul 10, 2007
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Exactly. Wake me up when white folks or suburbanites start getting killed -so long as it's ghetto dwellers killing each other, people won't really give a shit.
I have no problems with gang members shooting and killing each other but the bolded sentence about robberies is proof that I'm more likely to be a statistic. Obviously thieves know which targets are more profitable and it's definitely not the gangbanger in the doorag with his pants around his ankles.
 
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Svnla

Lifer
Nov 10, 2003
17,216
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And this is new news? Go to the FBI data page and look up the demographic groups of violent crimes.

/thread
 

Rainsford

Lifer
Apr 25, 2001
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The problem isn't "political correctness" (whatever that even means), it's that racial profiling means the cops will stop a law abiding black software developer while ignoring an equally law abiding white software developer just because the former has the wrong skin color. You can cite as many statistics as you want, but it's hard to understand how that sounds like an OK way to run things. And if the end goal is to have less minority crime, sending the message that it doesn't matter how successful or law abiding you are, you're still viewed as a criminal if you've got dark skin, doesn't really seem like a great message.
 

Geosurface

Diamond Member
Mar 22, 2012
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How is this black law abiding software developer dressed?

If he's dressed like the white one, I doubt he's stopped. It's possible, but far far less likely than if he's dressed like a hoodlum.
 

bradley

Diamond Member
Jan 9, 2000
3,664
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The worst part: being stopped in order for NYC police to reach some PC white male quota, then apologetically being detained and ticketed for having a stationary bicycle on the sidewalk. Obviously, the case is immediately dismissed due to a lack of proper police jurisdiction.

And let’s not forget the actual unconstitutionality of such a policy itself. We have already abandoned constitutional principles in order to save the US Constitution.
 

monovillage

Diamond Member
Jul 3, 2008
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_correctness

Political correctness (adjectivally, politically correct; both forms commonly abbreviated to PC) is a term which denotes language, ideas, policies, and behavior seen as seeking to minimize social and institutional offense in occupational, gender, racial, cultural, sexual orientation, certain other religions, beliefs or ideologies, disability, and age-related contexts, and, as purported by the term, doing so to an excessive extent. In current usage, the term is primarily pejorative,[1][2] while the term politically incorrect has been used as an implicitly positive self-description. Examples of the latter include the conservative The Politically Incorrect Guide published by Regnery Publishing and the television talk show Politically Incorrect. In these cases, the term politically incorrect connotes language, ideas, and behavior unconstrained by a perceived orthodoxy or by concerns about offending or expressing bias regarding various groups of people.
Current usage

Widespread use of the term politically correct and its derivatives began when it was adopted as a pejorative term by the political right in the 1990s, in the context of the Culture Wars. Writing in the New York Times in 1990,[9] Richard Bernstein noted "The term 'politically correct,' with its suggestion of Stalinist orthodoxy, is spoken more with irony and disapproval than with reverence. But across the country the term p.c., as it is commonly abbreviated, is being heard more and more in debates over what should be taught at the universities." Bernstein referred to a meeting of the Western Humanities Conference in Berkeley, California, on "'Political Correctness' and Cultural Studies," which examined "what effect the pressure to conform to currently fashionable ideas is having on scholarship". Bernstein also referred to "p.c.p" for "politically correct people," a term which did not take root in popular discussion.

Within a few years, this previously obscure term featured regularly in the lexicon of the conservative social and political challenges against curriculum expansion and progressive teaching methods in US high schools and universities.[10] In 1991, addressing a graduating class of the University of Michigan, U.S. President George H. W. Bush spoke against "a movement [that would] declare certain topics 'off-limits,' certain expressions 'off-limits', even certain gestures 'off-limits'" in allusion to liberal Political Correctness.[11] The most common usage here is as a pejorative term to refer to excessive deference to particular sensibilities at the expense of other considerations. The converse term "politically incorrect" came into use as an implicit term of self-praise, indicating that the user was not afraid to ignore constraints associated with political correctness.
Duh.
 

Doppel

Lifer
Feb 5, 2011
13,313
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The thing is everyone knows this, it's just most won't talk about it. The disparity in committing of violent crimes by race is undeniable and vast. Black on white crime are also far more serious a problem in numbers than white on black. Those with the money simply avoid black neighborhoods (including blacks who have the money) and more or less don't have to worry about this kind of thing impacting them directly.

How many people tune into the nightly news and read about "shootings in the city"? And almost to a one it's a black victim, very likely a black perpetrator as well. And sitting out in the suburbs it seems a world away even if it's only 10 miles.
 

ichy

Diamond Member
Oct 5, 2006
6,940
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How is this black law abiding software developer dressed?

If he's dressed like the white one, I doubt he's stopped. It's possible, but far far less likely than if he's dressed like a hoodlum.
This shows why profiling based on race can be rather silly. A thuggish looking loser with neck tattoos and pants halfway to his knees deserves greater police scrutiny regardless of his race.
 

Rainsford

Lifer
Apr 25, 2001
17,520
0
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How is this black law abiding software developer dressed?

If he's dressed like the white one, I doubt he's stopped. It's possible, but far far less likely than if he's dressed like a hoodlum.
Well that wouldn't be racial profiling then...which is kind of my point in using that example. Not only is it wrong to stop someone just because of their skin color (the infamous "driving while black" issue), but it's not very productive either.

The police trying to look for people who look like criminals seems reasonable to me, but race seems like a dumb way to do that and likely to cause issues. It seems better all around for the police to keep an eye on some white thug looking dude and ignore the random black guy minding his own business. The point of this thread, on the other hand, seems to be that the OP thinks cops should focus mainly on race.
 

peonyu

Platinum Member
Mar 12, 2003
2,038
23
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96% of victims are also black or hispanic.



But there is a sharp disparity for robberies, with blacks described as suspects in 70% of the cases, while they are victims in 33% of the crimes.

For the Police Chief to pull out that evidence shows how much he is being hammered for stop and frisk...But its true. Asians and especially Jews are prime targets for being robbed in NYC due to the black perception of every one of them being rich. Its not uncommon for a gang to "scout" out a Jewish or Asian neighborhood in NYC to pick out future robbery targets. Its mostly all hush hush in the media though. Yet when a Asian neighborhood flairs up and chases out some black folks people act as though its odd...There is a reason for everything, in that case [in NYC] its due to being sick and tired of being scouted to be robbed.

And speaking of minorities...Why are Asians doing so damn well in this country while Hispanics flounder ? Blacks atleast can blame slavery and Jim Crow [even though that excuse is mostly invalid today], Hispanics can blame little else for their failure. Infact, a large portion of Hispanic youth emulate urban Black youth since they think its "cool" to be ghetto, maybe the problem lies there.
 

Rainsford

Lifer
Apr 25, 2001
17,520
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Yeah, the problem is that the phrase has been so overused by some people on the right that it doesn't really have much meaning any more. Your wikipedia link, and common sense, suggest the modern use of "political correctness" refers to EXCESSIVE deference to racial and other sensitivities. But some people seem to use it as a magic phrase to deflect criticism for ANY viewpoint biased against race, sex, religion, etc.

In this context, it would be "PC" to refuse to point out that minority crime rates are high or suggest something could be done about it. But it doesn't seem "PC" to me to suggest we shouldn't treat law abiding people differently just because the have the wrong skin color.
 

Rainsford

Lifer
Apr 25, 2001
17,520
0
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For the Police Chief to pull out that evidence shows how much he is being hammered for stop and frisk...But its true. Asians and especially Jews are prime targets for being robbed in NYC due to the black perception of every one of them being rich. Its not uncommon for a gang to "scout" out a Jewish or Asian neighborhood in NYC to pick out future robbery targets. Its mostly all hush hush in the media though.

And speaking of minorities...Why are Asians doing so damn well in this country while Hispanics flounder ? Blacks atleast can blame slavery and Jim Crow [even though that excuse is mostly invalid today], Hispanics can blame little else for their failure. Infact, a large portion of Hispanic youth emulate urban Black youth since they think its "cool" to be ghetto, maybe the problem lies there.
I like how you used "black" and "gang" as interchangeable in your post there...

I do think the fact that crime is disproportionately done by certain minorities is a problem, I'm just not sure the best solution is to treat EVERYONE of certain races as if they were criminals. And the problem with your example is that it's not at all obvious to me how focusing on race helps the police or anyone else do their job better. You don't think the police will be able to tell when a gang is casing a well-to-do neighborhood unless they can pick them out by their race?
 

QuantumPion

Diamond Member
Jun 27, 2005
6,017
1
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And speaking of minorities...Why are Asians doing so damn well in this country while Hispanics flounder ? Blacks atleast can blame slavery and Jim Crow [even though that excuse is mostly invalid today], Hispanics can blame little else for their failure. Infact, a large portion of Hispanic youth emulate urban Black youth since they think its "cool" to be ghetto, maybe the problem lies there.
Children of Asian parents are much less likely to grow up in a broken home. When you normalize crime and poverty statistics by people who were raised by single mothers, the race biases drop out.

So why do black and Hispanic cultural values promote absent fathers more so than Asian or Jewish? That's the real question.
 

peonyu

Platinum Member
Mar 12, 2003
2,038
23
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I like how you used "black" and "gang" as interchangeable in your post there...

I do think the fact that crime is disproportionately done by certain minorities is a problem, I'm just not sure the best solution is to treat EVERYONE of certain races as if they were criminals. And the problem with your example is that it's not at all obvious to me how focusing on race helps the police or anyone else do their job better. You don't think the police will be able to tell when a gang is casing a well-to-do neighborhood unless they can pick them out by their race?

You can sub in Hispanic if it makes you feel better.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gangs_in_the_United_States#Gang_demographics

""There were at least 30,000 gangs and 800,000 gang members active across the USA in 2007, up from 731,500 in 2002 and 750,000 in 2004. By 1999, Hispanics accounted for 47% of all gang members, Blacks 34%, Whites 13%, and Asians 6%.""


And I dont believe all minorities are criminals, but on average there are far more for their population than other groups have. Its just calling a fact a fact. I am far more certain that a "gang" member shooting someone up in NYC will be Black or Hispanic and not Amish...
 

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