92 Nissan stanza

caboob

Platinum Member
Mar 31, 2000
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2.4L 4cyl, 155K

runs great on the hwy but in city driving get lots of throttle hesitation and the occasional engine stall.
I just had a new catalytic converter installed (to pass emissions inspection) and plugs look black last time I changed the spark plugs. I presume that oil is leaking past the rings and is burning up in the cylinders.
A recent look by a mechanic recommended that piston rings should be replaced and wanted $1500.
Would it be better to replace engine now that its at 155K or have those rings replaced?
 

Eli

Super Moderator | Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
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Originally posted by: caboob
2.4L 4cyl, 155K

runs great on the hwy but in city driving get lots of throttle hesitation and the occasional engine stall.
I just had a new catalytic converter installed (to pass emissions inspection) and plugs look black last time I changed the spark plugs. I presume that oil is leaking past the rings and is burning up in the cylinders.
A recent look by a mechanic recommended that piston rings should be replaced and wanted $1500.
Would it be better to replace engine now that its at 155K or have those rings replaced?
Uhm, your symptoms and basic description of the plugs do not seem to warrant an engine overhaul.

Were the deposits on the plug thick and nasty, or were they relatively clean.. just black in color?

Does the engine smoke out the tail pipe? When was the last time basic routine maintenance was done? Fuel filter, etc?
 

caboob

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Mar 31, 2000
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deposits were thick but not gunky. the plugs were changed 6 months ago. Fuel filter was changed last year. changed oil every 3K for the last 3 years now that its getting on in age. new O2 sensor as well last year. engine smokes out of tail pipe only on startup.
 
Aug 23, 2000
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probably valve seals going out. Could probably use a valve job. IMO it's not worth fixing. Sell it for whatever you can and get something else.
 

lavaheadache

Diamond Member
Jan 28, 2005
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I got a 91 Stanza that less than a week ago needed a fuel pump and a slave cylinder. It was cheaper and easier for me to get an entire complete fuel tank from the bone yard than a pump at nappa. Quick and easy fix minus the rusted tank bolts. Slave cylinder was a snap... hardest part was bleeding the line. Good luck on fixing that engine.. Too bad you dont live in MA cause I know of a good strong running 92 in nice condition that the engine could be had for around 300 bones
 

Eli

Super Moderator | Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
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Originally posted by: caboob
deposits were thick but not gunky. the plugs were changed 6 months ago. Fuel filter was changed last year. changed oil every 3K for the last 3 years now that its getting on in age. new O2 sensor as well last year. engine smokes out of tail pipe only on startup.
Hmm.

How much oil does it use between changes?

As someone said, if anything.. it is probably the valve stem seals, not the rings.

Does it puff some smoke after an extended idle when you first accelerate?

Regardless, these problems have nothing to do with the drivability problems in the city. Does it stumble and die when you first hit the gas, or while idling? Or at a certain RPM?
 

caboob

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Mar 31, 2000
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Between oil changes, I have to add a quart.

I get a puff of blue smoke only when I start it up.

It stumbles and dies when I first hit the gas from idle like while sitting at a traffic light.
 

Zenmervolt

Elite member
Oct 22, 2000
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Originally posted by: caboob
Between oil changes, I have to add a quart.

I get a puff of blue smoke only when I start it up.

It stumbles and dies when I first hit the gas from idle like while sitting at a traffic light.

Yup, valve stem seals. Definitely sounds like that. I'll bet that the stumbling is from fouled plugs. A thick, black residue (oil) on the plugs can definitely cause issues.

ZV
 

deadken

Diamond Member
Aug 8, 2004
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It's kinda hard to make an accurate diagnosis with the information given, but let me tell you this:

1) A compression test would be a guaranteed way to determine if your engine needs rings or not. If the compression is low, you should squirt some lightwieght oil into the cylinder (which will temporarily coat the pistons and rings), then you perform another compression test and if the numbers go up, your rings are worn. A compression gauge is pretty cheap (certainly one could be bought new for less then $50) and pretty easy to use. You simply remove all the spark plugs and disable the cars fuel system (no sense in having fuel spraying around, just pull the fuse for the fuel pump). You screw the compression gauge into one cylinder and crank for a few seconds. The guage will record the pressure achieve by that one cylinder it is screwed into. Repeat for all cylinders involved and if any are low then use oil as described above to determine if the problem is on the 'top end' or in the 'bottom end' (Valves/Guides/Head Gasket or Pistons/Cylinders/Rings).

2) A quick and easy way to determine if your Valve stem seals are leaking is this: place the shift selector in first gear, drive up to a decent rate of speed (no need to go really fast) and let off the throttle while letting the engine slow the car down (you will need to be in first gear in an Automatic trans.), then accelerate again while looking in your rearview mirror. Look for a puff of smoke. What that test does is starve the engine for air (the throttle is closed) forcing a high vacuum situation. The engine will suck air in from wherever possible and if your valve stems/seals are bad it will carry in oil with the air. When you accelerate again the oil gets burned off and gives a tell-tale puff of smoke from the exhaust.

3) It would be easier for you to get a book with pictures from the library (or perhaps Google) then for me to try and describe what a oil fouled spark plug looks like. If your plugs are black (like you said) your problem could be too much fuel which could be caused by a clogged throttle body. That would also give a hesitation and perhaps smoke when accelerating from a stop. To put it simply, when your engine is idling the throttle 'butterfly' is closed. Air needs to come in from somewhere and if the passage is clogged up with carbon (as tends to happen, even more so with older cars) then the air fuel ratio gets upset and the car runs rich (too much fuel). The plugs get 'wet' or 'fuel soaked' and when you accelerate the engine hesitates as the excess fuel is burned off. Some cars have a hole in the butterfly, some keep the butterfly open a little bit, and others use a 'idle motor' which opens and closes an orafice to allow more or less air in depending on the target idle.

4) I should mention that you really should check to be sure that your plugs are the right numbers and are gapped properly. Different spark plugs have different 'heat' ratings. If your plugs are too 'cold' then you could they could be discolored like you described. Also, if someone dropped the box of plugs and the air gap got closed in a bit, the spark might not be big enough to burn off all the fuel/oil which could give the conditions you described. I doubt it, but I prefer to start with the basics when guessing at a car I can't check myself.

I realize that this reply is rather long, but I tried to give a relatively easy way to diagnose your problem. I haven't seen anyone else post a way to diagnose your condition. I try not to guess, I prefer to diagnose. Post back with some results of what you find or PM me for more information or things to check.

Personnaly, I have a 1983 Volve 240 with over 265k on the odometer. I should mention that sometimes the odometer sticks, so the car most certainly has more mileage on it. Also I should say that the speedometer and odometer stopped working recently, it's probably just a speedometer cable and I will get to it sooner or later. My 83 runs like a champ and I will only get rid of it if it needs a large infusion of cash or if I find a great price on a better car. I drive into NYC everyday and NY roads are pretty rough. No sense in replacing this car if I don't need to. It doesn't burn any oil and has E.F.I. (no carb), 4 wheel disc brakes (4 piston calipers in front, 2 pistons in the rear), Overdrive Auto trans, etc...). Perhaps ABS brakes would be nice, but I don't miss them much.