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90% of guns in Mexican drug war from U.S. is inaccurate.

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May 16, 2000
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Originally posted by: NeoV
I have to comment again - I love how the gun nuts take this article as gospel, without considering the source of some of this 'data'.

An NRA spokesman says most of the guns in Mexico come from S.America - reliable source?
A gun instructor in Arizona - suddenly an expert on guns in Mexico?

There is even a question in the article - why would Mexican drug cartels buy guns in America when they can buy them from China, Israel, or S.Africa - - hello? Does anyone else see how ridiculous that question is? I'm going to take a small guess and say - because there are 6,600 gun shops within 10 miles of the border on the US side? Because cash payments are a lot harder to track than electronic payments? Because tying a straw buyer back to a cartel is more difficult than tracking an electronic payment? Are you kidding me?

Also - look at the numbers - 29,000 guns were recovered - 11.000 were sent back to the US for tracing - and 90% of those were in fact successfully traced to the US - that doesn't mean the other 18,000 guns all are from sources outisde the US - yes, you can still trace guns with filed serial numbers - but I'm going to go out on a limb and say neither Mexico nor the US wanted to pay for the additional testing needed to do that - so I would venture to say that a rather large portion of the 'other 18,000 guns also came from the US but had their serial #'s removed. There aren't enough facts in this piece of 'fair and balanced' reporting, period.

Obviously there are guns in Mexico from sources other than the US, but if you take as gospel this 17% speculation, it's at least as erroneous as those saying the number is 90%.
Because most of it is common knowledge, with readily available sources through even a rudimentary google search. Most weapons aren't made in the US, they're made in those other locations. I'm amazed that Brazil didn't make the list as their production is enormous. Many of those other countries have FAR fewer controls on gun sales than does the US. It's not rocket science to draw a logical conclusion from that.

Where does it say those gun stores are 10 miles from the border, cause I'm having trouble locating that part.

Moreover, you fail utterly at math, you fail utterly at reading, you're an utter liar, or a combination those three.

In 2007-2008, according to ATF Special Agent William Newell, Mexico submitted 11,000 guns to the ATF for tracing. Close to 6,000 were successfully traced -- and of those, 90 percent -- 5,114 to be exact, according to testimony in Congress by William Hoover -- were found to have come from the U.S. But in those same two years, according to the Mexican government, 29,000 guns were recovered at crime scenes. In other words, 68 percent of the guns that were recovered were never submitted for tracing. And when you weed out the roughly 6,000 guns that could not be traced from the remaining 32 percent, it means 83 percent of the guns found at crime scenes in Mexico could not be traced to the U.S.
11,000 out of 29,000 sent back, 6000 were able to be traced at all, 5100 of those were US. That's less than half of only about 1/3. I agree, the final number is likely more than the 17% suggested...but so much closer to that than the 90% that quite frankly the AG and SoS should face criminal charges for conspiring to defraud the citizens of the US.

I also agree that there should be a COMPLETE investigation into this report. I would love to see Congressional hearings about it. Let's get all the facts before we make a final judgment. But you know what, it's been more than a day, and so far hardly any mainstream news sources are even mentioning this blatant lie to the American people involving high ranking government officials from at least two nations. Lemme tell you, I hate faux news more than anyone else on these forums (or at least as much), but if no one else has the balls or moral fiber to even mention such an obvious error, well then I'm not sure that saving this nation is in anyone's best interests anyway.
 

NeoV

Diamond Member
Apr 18, 2000
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the issue of where the guns are manufactured has NOTHING to do with anything - it's where they are sold.

Genx - who said anything about buying guns one at a time? What do you think is more likely for a Mexican drug 'cartel' - to have some shady Texas guy be a straw buyer or to order guns from Russia/China/Israel? You can't be serious that this isn't happening.

It's not a gun control issue for crying out loud - you have your panties all in a wad because there is a strong possibility our lax gun laws allow high powered guns, not readily available in Mexico, to be moved across the border. No one is coming for you guns, relax.

As for the guy being aquitted - that's what happens when you have have powered NRA-funded attorneys against joe small town DA's - this guy sold guns to federal agents WHO TOLD HIM THEY WERE GOING TO TAKE THE GUNS TO MEXICO AND SELL THEM - and he didn't even get a slap on the wrist for it.

Look Prince - I agree that there is a huge difference between 6000 of the successfully traced guns being sold in America - and quoting that as the "90 % of all guns used in crimes" - it's wrong, shame on Clinton's people for giving her bad numbers to run with, as well as the other people in the media & Washington quoting this number.

You can't honestly tell me, though, that the high density of gun dealers along the border has nothing to do with guns going to Mexico.
 

nobodyknows

Diamond Member
Sep 28, 2008
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Originally posted by: NeoV
the issue of where the guns are manufactured has NOTHING to do with anything - it's where they are sold.

Genx - who said anything about buying guns one at a time? What do you think is more likely for a Mexican drug 'cartel' - to have some shady Texas guy be a straw buyer or to order guns from Russia/China/Israel? You can't be serious that this isn't happening.

It's not a gun control issue for crying out loud - you have your panties all in a wad because there is a strong possibility our lax gun laws allow high powered guns, not readily available in Mexico, to be moved across the border. No one is coming for you guns, relax.

As for the guy being aquitted - that's what happens when you have have powered NRA-funded attorneys against joe small town DA's - this guy sold guns to federal agents WHO TOLD HIM THEY WERE GOING TO TAKE THE GUNS TO MEXICO AND SELL THEM - and he didn't even get a slap on the wrist for it.

Look Prince - I agree that there is a huge difference between 6000 of the successfully traced guns being sold in America - and quoting that as the "90 % of all guns used in crimes" - it's wrong, shame on Clinton's people for giving her bad numbers to run with, as well as the other people in the media & Washington quoting this number.

You can't honestly tell me, though, that the high density of gun dealers along the border has nothing to do with guns going to Mexico.
Make up your mind? Is this about gun control or not?

Of course it's asbout gun control and they are trying to use Mexico as an excuse to crack down harder on gun ownership in this country. I say piss off Mexico, guard your own f'in border for a change.
 

BoomerD

No Lifer
Feb 26, 2006
57,067
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May-hee-ko better be careful of what they ask...if the US Gubmint cracks down TOO hard on the border in an attempt to stop the smuggling of weapons...then it MIGHT interfere with the trafficking of illegal immigrants...May-hee-ko's number 2 source of income. (the money immigrants send back, not the actual trafficking)

But hey...I'm all in favor of totally locking down our southern border...let nothing across without it being examined by 50 or more people...including a proctologist.
THEN, heavily tax everything to cover the costs of said inspections.
WTF, Why not? May-hee-ko already increased tariffs on many US goods over the May-hee-kan truck incident...
 

Pigiron

Junior Member
Sep 15, 2008
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Originally posted by: NeoV
the issue of where the guns are manufactured has NOTHING to do with anything - it's where they are sold.

Genx - who said anything about buying guns one at a time? What do you think is more likely for a Mexican drug 'cartel' - to have some shady Texas guy be a straw buyer or to order guns from Russia/China/Israel? You can't be serious that this isn't happening.

It's not a gun control issue for crying out loud - you have your panties all in a wad because there is a strong possibility our lax gun laws allow high powered guns, not readily available in Mexico, to be moved across the border. No one is coming for you guns, relax.

As for the guy being aquitted - that's what happens when you have have powered NRA-funded attorneys against joe small town DA's - this guy sold guns to federal agents WHO TOLD HIM THEY WERE GOING TO TAKE THE GUNS TO MEXICO AND SELL THEM - and he didn't even get a slap on the wrist for it.

Look Prince - I agree that there is a huge difference between 6000 of the successfully traced guns being sold in America - and quoting that as the "90 % of all guns used in crimes" - it's wrong, shame on Clinton's people for giving her bad numbers to run with, as well as the other people in the media & Washington quoting this number.

You can't honestly tell me, though, that the high density of gun dealers along the border has nothing to do with guns going to Mexico.
The charges against Iknadosian were filed by the Arizona State Attorney General in the Arizona Superior Court located in Phoenix, AZ, not by a joe small town DA. Iknadosian was defended by an Phoenix attorney who specializes in Wildlife and Hunting law, not by a gaggle of high powered NRA attorneys.
 

TheSlamma

Diamond Member
Sep 6, 2005
7,625
4
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Originally posted by: Budmantom
The liberals have no room for truth or facts while they are trying to accomplish their agenda.
Like the conservative hard on to wipe the first amendment from existence?
 

feralkid

Lifer
Jan 28, 2002
15,445
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Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski


Our current leadership doesn't give two squirts of piss about the violence in Mexico. They just want a way to disarm the populace of America so there is less resistance to "Change"
Oh, Jeffrey, how can you repeat such nonsense?

:(
 
May 16, 2000
13,526
0
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Originally posted by: NeoV
the issue of where the guns are manufactured has NOTHING to do with anything - it's where they are sold.

Genx - who said anything about buying guns one at a time? What do you think is more likely for a Mexican drug 'cartel' - to have some shady Texas guy be a straw buyer or to order guns from Russia/China/Israel? You can't be serious that this isn't happening.

It's not a gun control issue for crying out loud - you have your panties all in a wad because there is a strong possibility our lax gun laws allow high powered guns, not readily available in Mexico, to be moved across the border. No one is coming for you guns, relax.

As for the guy being aquitted - that's what happens when you have have powered NRA-funded attorneys against joe small town DA's - this guy sold guns to federal agents WHO TOLD HIM THEY WERE GOING TO TAKE THE GUNS TO MEXICO AND SELL THEM - and he didn't even get a slap on the wrist for it.

Look Prince - I agree that there is a huge difference between 6000 of the successfully traced guns being sold in America - and quoting that as the "90 % of all guns used in crimes" - it's wrong, shame on Clinton's people for giving her bad numbers to run with, as well as the other people in the media & Washington quoting this number.

You can't honestly tell me, though, that the high density of gun dealers along the border has nothing to do with guns going to Mexico.
I already did, and showed you why very clearly. There's no difference in the concentration of gun dealers in border states, and those in other pro-gun states. That's how many gun dealers there are throughout America.
 

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