9/11 Remembering the Jumpers

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Nocturnal

Lifer
Jan 8, 2002
18,927
0
76
Sickening to say the least. I don't blame it all on the Muslims. I still believe 9/11 was an inside job.
 

thecrecarc

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2004
3,364
3
0
Honestly, it would of cost more lives, American and Japanese, to invade Japan rather than nuke it. Not to mention, after all the shit they did as well as being the aggressor, why the fuck should we allow them to have a conditional surrender that keeps their old form of government in place? The same one that committed all those atrocities.


But, this is a totally different topic. If you really want to discuss this, start a new thread.
 

Lurknomore

Golden Member
Jul 3, 2005
1,310
0
0
Originally posted by: Nocturnal
Sickening to say the least. I don't blame it all on the Muslims. I still believe 9/11 was an inside job.

I once thought the same bout Kennedy and Flight 800.
But guess what?
Those damn mundane, boring, scientific facts kept getting in the way- DAMN them!!!
And yes, you come to accept the plausibility of the mundane rather than the shocking.
 

Number1

Diamond Member
Feb 24, 2006
7,881
549
126
Originally posted by: Lurknomore
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Burning to death is probably one of the more painful ways to die, especially if you are slowly roasted and not quickly consumed in an explosive blast. The people who survived the initial crash could only be slowly burned, so jumping is simply the lesser of two evils in this case...10 seconds of fresh air then BAM, you're roadkill -instant death, no pain.

For some perspective, the US military dropped incendiary bombs on Japan during WWII - burning most of their major cities to the ground. The incendiary bombs killed many civilians, and unlike the tower jumpers, their only option was to experience Iron Chef from the food's perspective. The number of people killed by the atomic bombs pale in comparison to the numbers the US killed with incendiary bombs. So yeah, we lost the WTC but compared to the things we as a nation have done...if you can't take it, don't dish it out.

You do realize that by dropping the atom bombs we saved hundreds of thousands, if not millions of lives....right?

You do realize you ignored the part about the US Fire-bombing and killing many thousands of japanese civilians for the greater duration of the US involvement in WWII, which effectively negate any lives we "saved" by nuking them. Furthermore, your statement is based on heresay - it is highly unlikely that the Japanese could have mounted a substantial assault on the US at the time we decided to nuke them. At that point, their navy was in shambles, they were out of raw materials and most of their major cities were smoldering piles of ash. We killed more jap civilians than hitler killed jews...What I am saying is that the WTC was bad but the US has been responsible for far worse in the past and people need to understand that we as a country are far from innocent.

QFT
That we would "need" to "save" Japan from itself by possibly sacrificing millions just to implement our unconditional surrender clause is a reflection of our patronizing worldview that still exists today.

Revisionist stupidity or just plain ignorance?

The only reason the US nuked japan was to eliminate the need for an invasion saving countless US soldiers lives. It was to save soldiers lives, US soldiers.
 

nick1985

Lifer
Dec 29, 2002
27,158
6
81
Originally posted by: Number1
Originally posted by: Lurknomore
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Burning to death is probably one of the more painful ways to die, especially if you are slowly roasted and not quickly consumed in an explosive blast. The people who survived the initial crash could only be slowly burned, so jumping is simply the lesser of two evils in this case...10 seconds of fresh air then BAM, you're roadkill -instant death, no pain.

For some perspective, the US military dropped incendiary bombs on Japan during WWII - burning most of their major cities to the ground. The incendiary bombs killed many civilians, and unlike the tower jumpers, their only option was to experience Iron Chef from the food's perspective. The number of people killed by the atomic bombs pale in comparison to the numbers the US killed with incendiary bombs. So yeah, we lost the WTC but compared to the things we as a nation have done...if you can't take it, don't dish it out.

You do realize that by dropping the atom bombs we saved hundreds of thousands, if not millions of lives....right?

You do realize you ignored the part about the US Fire-bombing and killing many thousands of japanese civilians for the greater duration of the US involvement in WWII, which effectively negate any lives we "saved" by nuking them. Furthermore, your statement is based on heresay - it is highly unlikely that the Japanese could have mounted a substantial assault on the US at the time we decided to nuke them. At that point, their navy was in shambles, they were out of raw materials and most of their major cities were smoldering piles of ash. We killed more jap civilians than hitler killed jews...What I am saying is that the WTC was bad but the US has been responsible for far worse in the past and people need to understand that we as a country are far from innocent.

QFT
That we would "need" to "save" Japan from itself by possibly sacrificing millions just to implement our unconditional surrender clause is a reflection of our patronizing worldview that still exists today.

Revisionist stupidity or just plain ignorance?

The only reason the US nuked japan was to eliminate the need for an invasion saving countless US soldiers lives. It was to save soldiers lives, US soldiers.

Yep. In fact, wounded soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan are STILL TO THIS DAY recieving the purple hearts they made for the anticipation of a massive number of american casualties for the invasion of Japan.
 

CKent

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
9,020
0
0
Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124
Originally posted by: CKent
Originally posted by: zoiks
Originally posted by: CKent
Originally posted by: Ocguy31
Fuck Terrorists. Fuck Wahabbi Islam.
In essence, fuck Muslims. You can't blame a religion, it's an inanimate concept. It's the people who fanatically follow it and use it to justify such horrors who are at fault. Further, it's hardly "only the radicals". By the standards of other religions, most Muslims are radical.
Really. You're a radical just for saying that too. So go fuck yourself as well.
Really? I don't remember praying 5 times today and then strapping a bomb to my chest or flying a plane into any buildings. Whoops! Looks like I'm a member of the civilized world.
I've prayed 3/5 times today so far, and...I haven't strapped a bomb to my chest, and I couldn't fly a plane if my life depended on it. So I guess my point is, fuck you!
Keep working on that raisin :laugh:
 

nick1985

Lifer
Dec 29, 2002
27,158
6
81
Originally posted by: CKent
Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124
Originally posted by: CKent
Originally posted by: zoiks
Originally posted by: CKent
Originally posted by: Ocguy31
Fuck Terrorists. Fuck Wahabbi Islam.
In essence, fuck Muslims. You can't blame a religion, it's an inanimate concept. It's the people who fanatically follow it and use it to justify such horrors who are at fault. Further, it's hardly "only the radicals". By the standards of other religions, most Muslims are radical.
Really. You're a radical just for saying that too. So go fuck yourself as well.
Really? I don't remember praying 5 times today and then strapping a bomb to my chest or flying a plane into any buildings. Whoops! Looks like I'm a member of the civilized world.
I've prayed 3/5 times today so far, and...I haven't strapped a bomb to my chest, and I couldn't fly a plane if my life depended on it. So I guess my point is, fuck you!
Keep working on that raisin :laugh:

This is some fucked up back-and-forth...
 

skyofavalon

Senior member
Jul 11, 2007
328
0
71
not one jumper went out in style,just the generic crazy legs/crazy arms, random tumble. I would of done something elegant like a swan dive or technically sound such as the triple lindy.
 

Lurknomore

Golden Member
Jul 3, 2005
1,310
0
0
Originally posted by: Number1
Originally posted by: Lurknomore
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Burning to death is probably one of the more painful ways to die, especially if you are slowly roasted and not quickly consumed in an explosive blast. The people who survived the initial crash could only be slowly burned, so jumping is simply the lesser of two evils in this case...10 seconds of fresh air then BAM, you're roadkill -instant death, no pain.

For some perspective, the US military dropped incendiary bombs on Japan during WWII - burning most of their major cities to the ground. The incendiary bombs killed many civilians, and unlike the tower jumpers, their only option was to experience Iron Chef from the food's perspective. The number of people killed by the atomic bombs pale in comparison to the numbers the US killed with incendiary bombs. So yeah, we lost the WTC but compared to the things we as a nation have done...if you can't take it, don't dish it out.

You do realize that by dropping the atom bombs we saved hundreds of thousands, if not millions of lives....right?

You do realize you ignored the part about the US Fire-bombing and killing many thousands of japanese civilians for the greater duration of the US involvement in WWII, which effectively negate any lives we "saved" by nuking them. Furthermore, your statement is based on heresay - it is highly unlikely that the Japanese could have mounted a substantial assault on the US at the time we decided to nuke them. At that point, their navy was in shambles, they were out of raw materials and most of their major cities were smoldering piles of ash. We killed more jap civilians than hitler killed jews...What I am saying is that the WTC was bad but the US has been responsible for far worse in the past and people need to understand that we as a country are far from innocent.

QFT
That we would "need" to "save" Japan from itself by possibly sacrificing millions just to implement our unconditional surrender clause is a reflection of our patronizing worldview that still exists today.

Revisionist stupidity or just plain ignorance?

The only reason the US nuked japan was to eliminate the need for an invasion saving countless US soldiers lives. It was to save soldiers lives, US soldiers.

We had unfettered access to limitless cheap fuel.
We had eager poor soldiers crawling out of the depression era.
We had tons of .30 cal stockpiled.

Do you really think we cared all that about American lives?:laugh:

Tell that to almost 100,000+ of ours dead and done in Korea and Nam- just 5 and 20yrs. past the end of WW2. We don't care about our soldiers lives- GET IT?
 

nick1985

Lifer
Dec 29, 2002
27,158
6
81
Originally posted by: Lurknomore
Originally posted by: Number1
Originally posted by: Lurknomore
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Burning to death is probably one of the more painful ways to die, especially if you are slowly roasted and not quickly consumed in an explosive blast. The people who survived the initial crash could only be slowly burned, so jumping is simply the lesser of two evils in this case...10 seconds of fresh air then BAM, you're roadkill -instant death, no pain.

For some perspective, the US military dropped incendiary bombs on Japan during WWII - burning most of their major cities to the ground. The incendiary bombs killed many civilians, and unlike the tower jumpers, their only option was to experience Iron Chef from the food's perspective. The number of people killed by the atomic bombs pale in comparison to the numbers the US killed with incendiary bombs. So yeah, we lost the WTC but compared to the things we as a nation have done...if you can't take it, don't dish it out.

You do realize that by dropping the atom bombs we saved hundreds of thousands, if not millions of lives....right?

You do realize you ignored the part about the US Fire-bombing and killing many thousands of japanese civilians for the greater duration of the US involvement in WWII, which effectively negate any lives we "saved" by nuking them. Furthermore, your statement is based on heresay - it is highly unlikely that the Japanese could have mounted a substantial assault on the US at the time we decided to nuke them. At that point, their navy was in shambles, they were out of raw materials and most of their major cities were smoldering piles of ash. We killed more jap civilians than hitler killed jews...What I am saying is that the WTC was bad but the US has been responsible for far worse in the past and people need to understand that we as a country are far from innocent.

QFT
That we would "need" to "save" Japan from itself by possibly sacrificing millions just to implement our unconditional surrender clause is a reflection of our patronizing worldview that still exists today.

Revisionist stupidity or just plain ignorance?

The only reason the US nuked japan was to eliminate the need for an invasion saving countless US soldiers lives. It was to save soldiers lives, US soldiers.

We had unfettered access to limitless cheap fuel.
We had eager poor soldiers crawling out of the depression era.
We had tons of .30 cal stockpiled.

Do you really think we cared all that about American lives?:laugh:

Tell that to almost 100,000+ of ours dead and done in Korea and Nam- just 5 and 20yrs. past the end of WW2. We don't care about our soldiers lives- GET IT?

You are retarded
 

Number1

Diamond Member
Feb 24, 2006
7,881
549
126
Originally posted by: Lurknomore
Originally posted by: Number1
Originally posted by: Lurknomore
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Burning to death is probably one of the more painful ways to die, especially if you are slowly roasted and not quickly consumed in an explosive blast. The people who survived the initial crash could only be slowly burned, so jumping is simply the lesser of two evils in this case...10 seconds of fresh air then BAM, you're roadkill -instant death, no pain.

For some perspective, the US military dropped incendiary bombs on Japan during WWII - burning most of their major cities to the ground. The incendiary bombs killed many civilians, and unlike the tower jumpers, their only option was to experience Iron Chef from the food's perspective. The number of people killed by the atomic bombs pale in comparison to the numbers the US killed with incendiary bombs. So yeah, we lost the WTC but compared to the things we as a nation have done...if you can't take it, don't dish it out.

You do realize that by dropping the atom bombs we saved hundreds of thousands, if not millions of lives....right?

You do realize you ignored the part about the US Fire-bombing and killing many thousands of japanese civilians for the greater duration of the US involvement in WWII, which effectively negate any lives we "saved" by nuking them. Furthermore, your statement is based on heresay - it is highly unlikely that the Japanese could have mounted a substantial assault on the US at the time we decided to nuke them. At that point, their navy was in shambles, they were out of raw materials and most of their major cities were smoldering piles of ash. We killed more jap civilians than hitler killed jews...What I am saying is that the WTC was bad but the US has been responsible for far worse in the past and people need to understand that we as a country are far from innocent.

QFT
That we would "need" to "save" Japan from itself by possibly sacrificing millions just to implement our unconditional surrender clause is a reflection of our patronizing worldview that still exists today.

Revisionist stupidity or just plain ignorance?

The only reason the US nuked japan was to eliminate the need for an invasion saving countless US soldiers lives. It was to save soldiers lives, US soldiers.

We had unfettered access to limitless cheap fuel.
We had eager poor soldiers crawling out of the depression era.
We had tons of .30 cal stockpiled.

Do you really think we cared all that about American lives?:laugh:

Tell that to almost 100,000+ of ours dead and done in Korea and Nam- just 5 and 20yrs. past the end of WW2. We don't care about our soldiers lives- GET IT?

Trolling or just plain stupid?
 

mrSHEiK124

Lifer
Mar 6, 2004
11,491
2
0
Originally posted by: CKent
Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124
Originally posted by: CKent
Originally posted by: zoiks
Originally posted by: CKent
Originally posted by: Ocguy31
Fuck Terrorists. Fuck Wahabbi Islam.
In essence, fuck Muslims. You can't blame a religion, it's an inanimate concept. It's the people who fanatically follow it and use it to justify such horrors who are at fault. Further, it's hardly "only the radicals". By the standards of other religions, most Muslims are radical.
Really. You're a radical just for saying that too. So go fuck yourself as well.
Really? I don't remember praying 5 times today and then strapping a bomb to my chest or flying a plane into any buildings. Whoops! Looks like I'm a member of the civilized world.
I've prayed 3/5 times today so far, and...I haven't strapped a bomb to my chest, and I couldn't fly a plane if my life depended on it. So I guess my point is, fuck you!
Keep working on that raisin :laugh:
What raisin? Whatever the hell you're talking about is flying over my head.
And what do you know, done with all 5 prayers of the day and I didn't strap a bomb to my chest or fly a plane into any buildings. Quite the opposite actually, trying to find a nice deal on a C2D laptop with some decent discrete graphics. Get a life, bigot. It's assholes like you that give Americans like me a bad reputation around the world for being a loudmouthed, close-minded, racist, bigoted dumbass.
 

CKent

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
9,020
0
0
Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124
What raisin? Whatever the hell you're talking about is flying over my head.
And what do you know, done with all 5 prayers of the day and I didn't strap a bomb to my chest or fly a plane into any buildings. Quite the opposite actually, trying to find a nice deal on a C2D laptop with some decent discrete graphics. Get a life, bigot. It's assholes like you that give Americans like me a bad reputation around the world for being a loudmouthed, close-minded, racist, bigoted dumbass.
I'm not racist ;)

You're the exception.

And a raisin is the mark you get on your forehead after a lifetime of bashing it against the floor 5 times a day. Most young muslims these days are intentionally mashing their foreheads during prayer to prove to others how pious they are by getting one earlier in life.
 

ELopes580

Diamond Member
Jun 21, 2003
3,891
15
81
I feel sick to my stomach watching/listening to that. :( I was in NYC this past thursday, as i go every 9/11, it still feels just as real there. I'm not even gonna bother reading most of the comments posted in the thread. P&N is one level down for you freaks.
 

Polish3d

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2005
5,501
0
0
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Burning to death is probably one of the more painful ways to die, especially if you are slowly roasted and not quickly consumed in an explosive blast. The people who survived the initial crash could only be slowly burned, so jumping is simply the lesser of two evils in this case...10 seconds of fresh air then BAM, you're roadkill -instant death, no pain.

For some perspective, the US military dropped incendiary bombs on Japan during WWII - burning most of their major cities to the ground. The incendiary bombs killed many civilians, and unlike the tower jumpers, their only option was to experience Iron Chef from the food's perspective. The number of people killed by the atomic bombs pale in comparison to the numbers the US killed with incendiary bombs. So yeah, we lost the WTC but compared to the things we as a nation have done...if you can't take it, don't dish it out.


This is one of the absolute shittiest posts I have ever read on the internet, between the sick "fun" you're having with wordplay about human suffering, to the totally inept analogy
 

mrSHEiK124

Lifer
Mar 6, 2004
11,491
2
0
Originally posted by: CKent
Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124
What raisin? Whatever the hell you're talking about is flying over my head.
And what do you know, done with all 5 prayers of the day and I didn't strap a bomb to my chest or fly a plane into any buildings. Quite the opposite actually, trying to find a nice deal on a C2D laptop with some decent discrete graphics. Get a life, bigot. It's assholes like you that give Americans like me a bad reputation around the world for being a loudmouthed, close-minded, racist, bigoted dumbass.
I'm not racist ;)

You're the exception.

And a raisin is the mark you get on your forehead after a lifetime of bashing it against the floor 5 times a day. Most young muslims these days are intentionally mashing their foreheads during prayer to prove to others how pious they are by getting one earlier in life.

I'm not going to turn this into a shit-slinging contest, so this'll be the last reply. Am I the exception in a religion made up entirely of plane flying, suicide bombing maniacs that I happen to be a part of, or the exception to your "non-racist" (hey, if 'Jew' can be a race and religion, and hating either makes you anti-Semitic, it's gotta carry over) hate? Just yesterday I was at a USF football game (go Bulls!) with 10, maybe 15 more Muslims, and it's been two days now and to my knowledge, none of them have a. blown themselves up, b. pilot licenses. As a matter of fact, the only way you could distinguish us from the rest of the crowd would be the fact that we weren't drunk, which might I add, didn't stop any of us from losing our voices.

I really don't see what you're trying to get at, there are over 5 million Muslims in America. If what you were saying were true, we'd be pretty fucked as there wouldn't be a single building left in any metro skyline anywhere and there'd be a worldwide aircraft shortage.

And I pray on a soft rug, and don't bash my head into anything either. They must be doing something wrong :p
 

skyking

Lifer
Nov 21, 2001
21,959
4,683
146
This thread is in poor taste and should be locked. All the threads wtih these vid links were locked back then.
 

Darwin333

Lifer
Dec 11, 2006
19,946
2,328
126
Originally posted by: jpeyton
Originally posted by: lykaon78
Originally posted by: ppdes
>one brave final decision to take control of how they would perish

There's no chance of surviving the jump and falling bodies can hurt others at the base of the building. What if you hit a doctor or a fireman who would have saved multiple people later had you not taken them out? Jumping is cowardly and despicable in this case.

Idiot
You do realize an NYC firefighter was killed when he was struck by a jumper, right?

A good number of the jumpers probably didn't consciously make the decision to jump. As I stated earlier, when conditions deteriorate to a certain point (such as being burned alive) the lower brain can and will take action before you consciously consider them. Its a primitive brain response meant to keep us alive in extremely stressful situations (like the threat of being burned alive).

To the other poster who made the ignorant comment that jumping was cowardly and despicable, I am willing to bet that you have never been severely burned before. Well I have and I can promise you that, even if in full control, jumping to your death to avoid burning to death is not cowardice. I guarantee that if I put your ass in a room surrounded by insanely hot fire with no other way out you would have done the same exact thing. It doesn't matter how big of a man you think you are. You simply can not endure that kind of pain without taking drastic measures to get away from it.

I suffered 3rd degree burns over 1/3 of my body so I have a bit of perspective.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
55,825
13,865
146
Originally posted by: Darwin333
Originally posted by: jpeyton
Originally posted by: lykaon78
Originally posted by: ppdes
>one brave final decision to take control of how they would perish

There's no chance of surviving the jump and falling bodies can hurt others at the base of the building. What if you hit a doctor or a fireman who would have saved multiple people later had you not taken them out? Jumping is cowardly and despicable in this case.

Idiot
You do realize an NYC firefighter was killed when he was struck by a jumper, right?

A good number of the jumpers probably didn't consciously make the decision to jump. As I stated earlier, when conditions deteriorate to a certain point (such as being burned alive) the lower brain can and will take action before you consciously consider them. Its a primitive brain response meant to keep us alive in extremely stressful situations (like the threat of being burned alive).

To the other poster who made the ignorant comment that jumping was cowardly and despicable, I am willing to bet that you have never been severely burned before. Well I have and I can promise you that, even if in full control, jumping to your death to avoid burning to death is not cowardice. I guarantee that if I put your ass in a room surrounded by insanely hot fire with no other way out you would have done the same exact thing. It doesn't matter how big of a man you think you are. You simply can not endure that kind of pain without taking drastic measures to get away from it.

I suffered 3rd degree burns over 1/3 of my body so I have a bit of perspective.

I also wonder how many were pushed intentionally and unintentionally because of the very same desperation? The windows were only one person wide and many people in small areas were probably desperate for fresh air with limited window space.
 

Gothgar

Lifer
Sep 1, 2004
13,463
1
0
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: Darwin333
Originally posted by: jpeyton
Originally posted by: lykaon78
Originally posted by: ppdes
>one brave final decision to take control of how they would perish

There's no chance of surviving the jump and falling bodies can hurt others at the base of the building. What if you hit a doctor or a fireman who would have saved multiple people later had you not taken them out? Jumping is cowardly and despicable in this case.

Idiot
You do realize an NYC firefighter was killed when he was struck by a jumper, right?

A good number of the jumpers probably didn't consciously make the decision to jump. As I stated earlier, when conditions deteriorate to a certain point (such as being burned alive) the lower brain can and will take action before you consciously consider them. Its a primitive brain response meant to keep us alive in extremely stressful situations (like the threat of being burned alive).

To the other poster who made the ignorant comment that jumping was cowardly and despicable, I am willing to bet that you have never been severely burned before. Well I have and I can promise you that, even if in full control, jumping to your death to avoid burning to death is not cowardice. I guarantee that if I put your ass in a room surrounded by insanely hot fire with no other way out you would have done the same exact thing. It doesn't matter how big of a man you think you are. You simply can not endure that kind of pain without taking drastic measures to get away from it.

I suffered 3rd degree burns over 1/3 of my body so I have a bit of perspective.

I also wonder how many were pushed intentionally and unintentionally because of the very same desperation? The windows were only one person wide and many people in small areas were probably desperate for fresh air with limited window space.

eehhhh, never really thought of that, that just seems terrible, your fellow office workers pushing you to your death for a chance at some fresh air...
 

EricMartello

Senior member
Apr 17, 2003
910
0
0
Originally posted by: mugs
Woah woah woah there slugger...
1. We did not kill more Japanese civilians than Hilter killed Jews.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties
580k Japanese civilian deaths; 6 million Jews died in the holocaust.
2. China suffered 16 million civilian deaths. Who were they fighting against?
3. Soviet Union had 11 million civilian deaths. Fighting against Germany.
4. Germany had 1.6 million civilian deaths during the American Reign of Terror.
5. It's great that we saved a lot of Japanese lives by nuking instead of invading, but I think we were more interested in saving American lives.
6. Japan was the aggressor. They could have surrendered when it became obvious that they were going to lose, but they kept fighting. They forced our hand. Japan's civilian death's are Japan's fault.

Once you cite a credible, irrefutable source like Wikipedia, any chance debate is quashed. :eek: There is no way those numbers are inaccurate.

The point that you seem to be missing, unsubstantiated figures aside, is that the US has in its past killed many civilians and has committed what could be considered "horrendous crimes against humanity". Guantanamo bay is a lovely resort, isn't it? The guy saying we "saved soldiers lives" by killing Japanese civilians with a nuke rather than invading...sure sounds noble, but members of the military have agreed to fight; civilians have not. Killing civilians to prevent further military deaths sounds a lot like an Al Quaeda tactic to me. In fact, I bet these muslim terrorists are using the same logic - blow up a few schools to prevent kids from adding to the US military. Blow up some buildings - that's one less logistical advantage for the US. Just think how many lives are saved each time a car bomb goes off.

 

m1ldslide1

Platinum Member
Feb 20, 2006
2,321
0
0
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Burning to death is probably one of the more painful ways to die, especially if you are slowly roasted and not quickly consumed in an explosive blast. The people who survived the initial crash could only be slowly burned, so jumping is simply the lesser of two evils in this case...10 seconds of fresh air then BAM, you're roadkill -instant death, no pain.

For some perspective, the US military dropped incendiary bombs on Japan during WWII - burning most of their major cities to the ground. The incendiary bombs killed many civilians, and unlike the tower jumpers, their only option was to experience Iron Chef from the food's perspective. The number of people killed by the atomic bombs pale in comparison to the numbers the US killed with incendiary bombs. So yeah, we lost the WTC but compared to the things we as a nation have done...if you can't take it, don't dish it out.

You do realize that by dropping the atom bombs we saved hundreds of thousands, if not millions of lives....right?

Oh no...another thread about to be derailed by Nick's completely irresponsible lack of history education. :thumbsdown:
 

m1ldslide1

Platinum Member
Feb 20, 2006
2,321
0
0
Originally posted by: mugs
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Originally posted by: nick1985
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Burning to death is probably one of the more painful ways to die, especially if you are slowly roasted and not quickly consumed in an explosive blast. The people who survived the initial crash could only be slowly burned, so jumping is simply the lesser of two evils in this case...10 seconds of fresh air then BAM, you're roadkill -instant death, no pain.

For some perspective, the US military dropped incendiary bombs on Japan during WWII - burning most of their major cities to the ground. The incendiary bombs killed many civilians, and unlike the tower jumpers, their only option was to experience Iron Chef from the food's perspective. The number of people killed by the atomic bombs pale in comparison to the numbers the US killed with incendiary bombs. So yeah, we lost the WTC but compared to the things we as a nation have done...if you can't take it, don't dish it out.

You do realize that by dropping the atom bombs we saved hundreds of thousands, if not millions of lives....right?

You do realize you ignored the part about the US Fire-bombing and killing many thousands of japanese civilians for the greater duration of the US involvement in WWII, which effectively negate any lives we "saved" by nuking them. Furthermore, your statement is based on heresay - it is highly unlikely that the Japanese could have mounted a substantial assault on the US at the time we decided to nuke them. At that point, their navy was in shambles, they were out of raw materials and most of their major cities were smoldering piles of ash. We killed more jap civilians than hitler killed jews...What I am saying is that the WTC was bad but the US has been responsible for far worse in the past and people need to understand that we as a country are far from innocent.

Woah woah woah there slugger...
1. We did not kill more Japanese civilians than Hilter killed Jews.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties
580k Japanese civilian deaths; 6 million Jews died in the holocaust.
2. China suffered 16 million civilian deaths. Who were they fighting against?
3. Soviet Union had 11 million civilian deaths. Fighting against Germany.
4. Germany had 1.6 million civilian deaths during the American Reign of Terror.
5. It's great that we saved a lot of Japanese lives by nuking instead of invading, but I think we were more interested in saving American lives.
6. Japan was the aggressor. They could have surrendered when it became obvious that they were going to lose, but they kept fighting. They forced our hand. Japan's civilian death's are Japan's fault.


Wow, you too? Its generally accepted now that Japan was trying to surrender and we essentially ignored them so that we could try out the bomb. They wanted to keep their emperor in place after surrender, which we refused - the US wanted unconditional surrender at the time. Two nukes later, they agreed to unconditional surrender. Guess what we did with that emperor? Left him in power anyway. You figure it out. Well, no I take that back - try not to figure anything out - you may hurt yourself.