8 year old ''beast'' gaming pc, advice needed after a long hiatus

[escrow4]

Contrary to alot of members here I don't overclock so I'd throw out an alternative core build:

- 4790 non K
- Asrock H97 Fatality

I looked into X99 myself but its currently a mess - BIOS's are all over the place and DDR4 isn't mature. For a set it and forget box if you don't want to OC I'd get a locked i7 as the threads will help in the long term and a decent H97 board - that Asrock is cheap and has shielded ALC 1150, which is excellent for onboard audio as well as an Intel NIC. It also supports K overclocking if you ever do want to drop in a K processor.

In game that chip will hit 3.8GHz or 3.7Ghz which isn't far off a 4790K OC'd up to 4.4Ghz (if you get a decent chip) and you won't have to worry about excess heat or fiddling with voltages. The money saved you can chuck at a 290X or 970/980.

 

[Essence_of_War]

Cerb has answered all of your questions nicely, OP.

I'm with AnitaPeterson and 2nd all of this:

As a long-time AT user, I am ashamed to see this kind of uncalled-for attitude. It does not represent me, or the vast majority of the users in this forum. I will notify the mods, and leave it up to them to intervene.

PullTheTricker, you have my apologies for the way in which this person talks to you. I see you've been here for quite some time, even if you don't post a lot. Hang in there, don't let a rotten apple spoil the whole basket for you.

I usually pay extra for a high end cpu, and upgrading graphics card trough mid-generation 1x if necessary. SSD is definitely on my books for purchase, seems optimal for commonly used applciations/videogames.
My knowledge is limited about super high res (4k?) modern monitors. This may seem silly perspective, but 1680x1050 or 1920x1080 seems srsly sufficient high enough to me, but that may just me not being familiar with that kind of resolution.

SSDs are IMHO mandatory. Multiplier unlocked i5s are usually the best choice for mostly gaming. Not many games scale with hyperthreading, but almost every game scales with higher clock speeds. The hex/octa core models on the Haswell-E (LGA2011 socket) only make sense for those with excess cash to burn, or who are planning on 3-4 way SLI/Crossfire.

I usually buy custom zalman cooler for the cpu, for better silence and possible overclocking if my heart so desires. Power supply, my old Corsair 520 watt still doing duty.

For a basic tower cooler for OC'ing, you'll often see the Cooler Master 212 Plus/Evo, or the ACFZ i30, recommended. Zalman has a CNPS10X Optima, that is in the same price and perf range also.

I would certainly get a new PSU with a new build. The most recent Intel CPUs/MoBos have additional low-power states that older PSUs are not compatible with.

 

[Cerb]

Contrary to alot of members here I don't overclock so I'd throw out an alternative core build:

- 4790 non K

The non-K v. K price is very small, though. Here in the U.S, it's about $310 v. $330. I'd spend that $20 for the extra speed every day of the week, especially if not overclocking, just as much as I'd save money off the i7 non-K if the speed and IGP aren't issues . 6% more money for 10-11% more speed.

 

[greybaby]

1) It's obvious the OP's first language is not English - we don't know how easy it is for him to read and understand things some of us take for granted.

2) riahc3's replies were not only brutal to the OP; he used unnecessary harsh language in replies directed at other members.

3) Any salient point can be made without having to resort to profanities and aggressive behavior.

4) No matter what the OP's intentions - whether he wanted to be spoonfed or was merely asking questions about stuff he's missed in the past years - the purpose of this forums is to exchange information.

5) There's no need to assume we all have the same amount of time to dedicate to computers. There's more to life than IT. Imagine someone (who's otherwise quite good at computers) asking a very simple question about photography in the dedicated AT subforum, and being treated like garbage for not knowing what a "prime lens" is. Acting like jerks will make people stop coming here, and the quality of the place will deteriorate.

Thank you, I was baffled at everyone's ire! I'm actually new to this specific forum.

You'll be fine building a computer, and if you feel like you need help you can always go to anantech and look at suggested builds. If you've been out of computer buidling as long as you say you have, one of the major changes has been that people now talk often in terms of architecture, which is why you're probably confused.

Yes, google is your friend but don't be to shy to post on forums if the googling isn't helping you understand the new language that has changed since you've been gone. Just pretend you are starting from scratch and you'll get it.

 

[riahc3]

I'm on these forums every day, reading and learning as much as I can. While my knowledge is vast, there's always new tech coming out, and new things to learn.

While I know what Haswell, Broadwell, and Skylake are, because I've read about them here, I, for example, would have a hard time telling you the difference between Mooresfield and Merrifield. (Other than, I think, they are some sort of Mobile SoC, some sort of Atom derivative for phones or tablets.)

If I really cared enough to know the difference, that's just a websearch away. I think that was riahc3's point. If you ignore the aggressive nature of his posts, he's simply saying that someone that can't be bothered to spend time researching technology terms for themselves, may lack the wherewithall to built their own PCs, especially if they run into something that they don't know or understand.

And with that said, I do agree with that. You need to be self-motivated, and ever-learning in this field. If you're not like that, you just want to be spoon-fed, and not have to think and learn for yourself, then ... pay someone else, that knows more than you for their services.

This sums up everything I have said in my posts. I did not know that the internet had a "aggressive nature" but hey.

 

[Zorander]

All that condescending was uncalled for. The OP has simply been out of the game for so long there is a litany of tech names out there to digest (and wiki). Guiding him/her to a good build guide (like this one) is more constructive. OP can ask any following questions after reading the guide (and we will be able to tell if s/he is genuinely looking for help or wanting to be spoon-fed).

Also, I myself have been around since Coppermine to today's Devil Canyon. I took a hiatus in 2006-2010 and have absolutely no knowledge on CPUs of those days (yea, those Q and E processors are a mystery to me). Why should I be shot down and told to read some random wikis when a guiding hand to some articles would have been more useful?

 

[Charlie98]

I would certainly get a new PSU with a new build.

You beat me to it...

OP, I don't think there is anything from your current build I would reuse.

 

[mfenn]

If you ignore the aggressive nature of his posts

At Anandtech we expect a respectful discourse to be maintained at all times, especially when somebody comes and asks for information in a polite manner. There is absolutely no excuse for heaping verbal abuse onto someone who asked an honest question, and riahc3 has been sanctioned appropriately.

I don't normally point out where infractions have been issued (though you can usually guess), but I want to make it absolutely crystal clear to everyone that cursing at someone and insulting their intelligence is not acceptable behavior in this forum and will be punished.

mfenn
General Hardware Moderator

 

[riahc3]

At Anandtech we expect a respectful discourse to be maintained at all times, especially when somebody comes and asks for information in a polite manner. There is absolutely no excuse for heaping verbal abuse onto someone who asked an honest question, and riahc3 has been sanctioned appropriately.

I don't normally point out where infractions have been issued (though you can usually guess), but I want to make it absolutely crystal clear to everyone that cursing at someone and insulting their intelligence is not acceptable behavior in this forum and will be punished.

mfenn
General Hardware Moderator

Offensive material redacted.

Life isnt that like. I told him what he needed to read to push him in the direction of opening up a browser and searching for those terms.

I made it very clear that it would have taken him less to google those codenames than to write the post.

Why should I waste my time helping him when he cant even waste his time on Google searching a couple of harmless terms? Just seraching and THEN posting his post, he could have gotten a way better answer.

Members: Grow a pair, come on. I think all of us are adults and adults sometimes need to speak to each other to point out flaws. We all make mistakes.

And you're making another one mistake right now. In case it wasn't clear, you do not get to make the rules about what is and is not acceptable speech in this forum.

Furthermore, when I'm writing in bold text, I'm writing as a moderator and those rulings are not up for debate in the thread. If you have issue with the moderation, your recourse is to make a thread in Moderator Discussions. Any further discussion of this topic in this thread will result in infractions.

mfenn
General Hardware Moderator
http://forums.anandtech.com/forumdisplay.php?f=56

 

[VirtualLarry]

We all make mistakes.

Yes, and yours was making some extremely disrespectful and expletive-laden posts towards the OP, which is unacceptable on this forum.

I tried to make your point in a much more subtle way for you. I know those types of people too, I have two friends that could easily learn more about hardware and installing software and upgrading their PCs, in fact one of them brags that they "went to school for computers". Yet, he asks for help with upgrades.

Some people are simply not concerned enough or possibly even capable enough to build or fix or upgrade or install PCs. Then there are the people that are capable, but make a conscious effort not to learn. Then there are the techies, like us, that relish learning about new tech and playing with it.

I think that the OP is capable, but perhaps just needs some internal motivation to start learning about new tech.

 

[Charlie98]

I think all of us are adults and adults sometimes need to speak to each other to point out flaws. We all make mistakes.

I think mfenn did that...

 

[Essence_of_War]

I think mfenn did that...

Beat me to it.

And you're still being unnecessarily rude.

As the saying goes:

If you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.

 

[riahc3]

I think that the OP is capable, but perhaps just needs some internal motivation to start learning about new tech.

As the saying goes:

Saying doesnt apply here because Im digging a hole to show him the light. The means justify the end.

 

[PullTheTricker]

Hello all, so I'm back with a preview. nothing is set in stone yet.
I still need to know if PSU is sufficient or if I can downgrade.
8 vs 16gb? and does 1800/2400/2600 mhz RAM affect overcloking?
Is the mobo overkill, considering I dont have plans (yet) to go SLI, and probably may not since I'm not sure.
I allready have a not so old Western Digital 1TB (I'm still checking what the rpm is on this one, can't see on system information, but my guess is 7200rpm) wich I plan to use from my old system.
I have a spare Corsair HX520hw, has been used, but not as much as my old one, useless or?
Also I've usually been a loyal customer of ASUS, is their variant of 970gtx more reliable, or is the MSI ok? I've usually also always used Asus mobo's.


MOBO: MSI Z87-G45 Gaming € 112,90
CPU: Intel® Core™ i7-4790K, 4,0 GHz (4,4 GHz Turbo Boost) € 324,-
GFX Card: MSI GTX 970 Gaming 4G € 359,-
CPU Cooling: Cooler Master Hyper212 Evo € 29,99,-
RAM: Corsair 16 GB DDR3-2400 Kit € 172,90,-
PSU: Corsair RM650, 650 Watt € 109,90,-
SSD: Samsung 840 EVO MZ-7TE250BW, 250 GB SSD € 117,90,-
Case: Sharkoon T28 red edition € 57,90,-

Not sure if I am allowed to post links, but I'l remove it if not... purchases will be made from https://www.alternate.nl/html/index.html

€1284,- total price, with the qeustions I asked, hopefully if I may reduce the price to like €1000-€1150, I could add a ASUS 24" VG248QE for smooth refresh rates for games, or go on past experience with Samsung monitor, since they've always served me well with fantastic picture quality. But yeh I still haven't made up my mind on a monitor.

 

[Charlie98]

The sweet spot on RAM is 1600MHz, past that you are into diminishing returns. Having said that, sometimes the cost differential isn't much, so you would have to make that decision. 8GB RAM is usually sufficient unless you are doing something like video or photo editing. In my experience I have very rarely tapped 6GB RAM usage, even while gaming or using Photoshop, etc. Reducing those two things might get you closer to your budget.

Chances are you can drop that PSU down into the 500w range, but I'd let someone verify that... I'm not up on GPU power demand. How old is your Corsair HX?

I would spend the money on a Samsung... I have one and love it, the picture is far better than the equivalent Acer I have upstairs.

 

[Yuriman]

I'd hold onto the 650w PSU if you may do SLI at a later date. Otherwise, 500w will be sufficient.

Also, I second what Charlie98 said about the RAM. Past 1600 is diminishing returns, but sometimes 1866 is negligibly more expensive. Also, you can always drop more in down the road if you're trying to hit a specific budget today.

 

[Cerb]

Just to be sure of CPU support out of the box, make it a Z97 motherboard.

 

[Essence_of_War]

Saying doesnt apply here because Im digging a hole to show him the light. The means justify the end.

It does. You don't understand your place in the metaphor.

 

[VirtualLarry]

The sweet spot on RAM is 1600MHz, past that you are into diminishing returns. Having said that, sometimes the cost differential isn't much, so you would have to make that decision. 8GB RAM is usually sufficient unless you are doing something like video or photo editing

I agree with this. See if you can't get an 8GB kit of DDR3-1600 for much cheaper. If it's almost the same price for 2400, then it probably wouldn't hurt too much to get the faster RAM, but if it's more expensive, you don't need it. (Except possibly for bragging rights.)

There's also some evidence that Haswell quads are harder to overclock, when you are using faster RAM.

Edit: Although, if you're getting the 4790K, then there's not much higher to go. Haswells don't really do 5.0Ghz, 4.6-4.7 is probably the highest you'll be able to go, if you even want to go there. 4.4Ghz (with MCT - multi-core Turbo enabled in the BIOS, sometimes this gets enabled automagically when you enable XMP) is pretty fast.

 

[AnitaPeterson]

[...]
Why should I waste my time helping him when he cant even waste his time on Google searching a couple of harmless terms? Just seraching and THEN posting his post, he could have gotten a way better answer.

Members: Grow a pair, come on.

My god, you really have a chip on your shoulder. Is someone forcing you to waste your precious time with the OP, if he's so much beneath your level of expertise?

If your time's so important, why waste it writing offensive stuff about a stroller and a breast pump? Just like - in a now-deleted post - you derided the OP's family? Then YOU tell US to grow a pair?

I took a couple of minutes to look at other posts of yours around here. You seem to be lacking the capacity to be civilized and show empathy to your fellow humans. I'm not going to speculate, but I sense a lot of anger behind your words. Maybe you should seek help.

All *I* can do is put you on my "ignore" list from now on. I have no doubts other people will do the same, after this brilliant demonstration of ruthlessness.

 

[monkeydelmagico]

I think all of us are adults and adults sometimes need to speak to each other to point out flaws.

Most of us here are adults. Pretty clear we do have one rogue agent in the mix though....

Also I've usually been a loyal customer of ASUS, is their variant of 970gtx more reliable, or is the MSI ok? I've usually also always used Asus mobo's.


€1284,- total price, with the qeustions I asked, hopefully if I may reduce the price to like €1000-€1150, I could add a ASUS 24" VG248QE for smooth refresh rates for games, or go on past experience with Samsung monitor, since they've always served me well with fantastic picture quality. But yeh I still haven't made up my mind on a monitor.

I would say that MSI is at least the equal to Asus. Asus has, in some folks opinions, gotten too big for it's own good. Some of that legendary quality and customer support has gone away. That being said, they still offer a very compelling product..... I own both an asus mobo and gpu currently.

As for cutting costs: Go to an i5 4690k and 8gb ram will put you right on target. Chances are very good you will never notice the difference.

 

[Yuriman]

I'd be tempted to save some money with an H97 board if paring it with a 4790K, since, as VirtualLarry said, there isn't much to gain with that chip.

 

[PullTheTricker]

The spare Corsair HX520W is around 3 max 4 years old, in comparison to the other one that is at least 8 years old. But I don't know, I've always thought it was good quality psu. Perhaps with age. its not providing the same wattage anymore, could be.
One reason I'm a bit skeptical about SLI, is due to price/perfomance is worse then just getting one badass graphics card. But tbh I don't know...

Just to be sure of CPU support out of the box, make it a Z97 motherboard.

Do you mean this?
https://www.alternate.nl/ASRock/Z97...-moederbord/html/product/1139174?tk=7&lk=9450
The Z87 is alot cheaper though, what do you mean with cpu support. It says under specifications, it both supports Haswell 4xxx.

@VirtualLarry
Well, I hope the Cooler Master Hyper212 Evo is sufficient for the overclocking. In the past I always used zalman coolers, but I notice coolers aren't the same anymore.
I want to overclock, but do it safely. I also do not want too high voltage risking frequent hardware faillure. I don't know what realistic, but 4.6 I'l be happy about, overclocked. Also I have yet to understand what the turbo feature works like, gonna check that soon.

 

[PullTheTricker]

I'd be tempted to save some money with an H97 board if paring it with a 4790K, since, as VirtualLarry said, there isn't much to gain with that chip.

If someone could clarify what you mean with this. You mean the Z87 bottlenecks it?

 

[Cerb]

The 8-series boards that support the refreshes may or may not come with a BIOS version new enough to work out of the box. Many board makers do not ship with their latest firmwares, so you might need a non-refresh chip on hand to get it working.

Meanwhile, every 9-series board will work with the refresh CPUs, out of the box, guaranteed.