7800GTX fails shader model 3.0 tests

[Keysplayr]

Link

Hmmm. Seems neither company has SM3.0 "Done Right!".

 

[DRavisher]

Indeed. I would be interested to know why nvidia fails the test though. We all know ATI are saying Vertex Texturing is unimportant on the R520 while it is teh 1337 on the xenos, but what is it nvidia is 'cheating' on?

 

[ZobarStyl]

Repost, as well as it's just the Inq reporting on those old FUD slides. I really wouldn't put much faith in it.

 

[Lonyo]

Originally posted by: ZobarStyl
Repost, as well as it's just the Inq reporting on those old FUD slides. I really wouldn't put much faith in it.

Faith in the MS test for compliance with SM3?
Or faith in the Inq's ability to run a simple test which I would assume it's quite hard to get wrong?

 

[ZobarStyl]

I'm sorry, that was unclear; I simply wouldn't put much stock into either company not having full compliance to the exact standard, as any developer will have to work around the limitations of a card as they find them. The only point in this is to show flaws in either side's marketing strategy/claims, and that's basically just FUD, hence I don't find it that interesting.

 

[forumposter32]

If this is a repost, has Nvidia answered these claims?

 

[Ronin]

They don't need to, anymore than ATi does.

 

[Ackmed]

Until a game comes out that uses Vertex Texturing, its pointless to try and say ATi screwed up. Unified is going to be used, from what I have read.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: Ackmed
Until a game comes out that uses Vertex Texturing, its pointless to try and say ATi screwed up. Unified is going to be used, from what I have read.

That's not really the point. It will fail the MS test just as nvidia did for whatever reasons.

 

[crazydingo]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Ackmed
Until a game comes out that uses Vertex Texturing, its pointless to try and say ATi screwed up. Unified is going to be used, from what I have read.

That's not really the point. It will fail the MS test just as nvidia did for whatever reasons.

Does it ? Why not wait for Fuad's tests on the X1800 XL .. :clock:

 

[M0RPH]

What's important is real-world SM3.0 performance, and from what I've seen in reviews, ATI has done a significantly better job with their implementation. Therefore, IMO, their little tag line "SM3 done right" has some merit.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: crazydingo

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Ackmed
Until a game comes out that uses Vertex Texturing, its pointless to try and say ATi screwed up. Unified is going to be used, from what I have read.

That's not really the point. It will fail the MS test just as nvidia did for whatever reasons.

Does it ? Why not wait for Fuad's tests on the X1800 XL .. :clock:

You mean, you expect it to pass everything in that test? Even the vertex texturing test even though it does not exist. You still think it might have a chance? I mean, if it tries really really hard, it can convince the MS test that it really really does have the vertex texturing feature? Please Dingo. Give it a rest.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: M0RPH
What's important is real-world SM3.0 performance, and from what I've seen in reviews, ATI has done a significantly better job with their implementation. Therefore, IMO, their little tag line "SM3 done right" has some merit.

"Some" merit? You mean it's questionable that it is perfect? No way!!! Who are you and what have you done with MORPH!!! MORPH would never admit to any shortcomings of the company ATI. EVER.

 

[M0RPH]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

"Some" merit? You mean it's questionable that it is perfect? No way!!! Who are you and what have you done with MORPH!!! MORPH would never admit to any shortcomings of the company ATI. EVER.

I don't worry much about "SM3 done right" because I realize that it's just a marketing line. All they're saying is that their SM3 works better than the comepetition in the real-world, and the reviews have shown this to be correct so far. You are trying to interpret this marketing tag line to mean 'SM3 done exactly to the specifications', so that you can ridicule it. Well have at it if that makes you feel better.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: M0RPH

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

"Some" merit? You mean it's questionable that it is perfect? No way!!! Who are you and what have you done with MORPH!!! MORPH would never admit to any shortcomings of the company ATI. EVER.

I don't worry much about "SM3 done right" because I realize that it's just a marketing line. All they're saying is that their SM3 works better than the comepetition in the real-world, and the reviews have shown this to be correct so far. You are trying to interpret this marketing tag line to mean 'SM3 done exactly to the specifications', so that you can ridicule it. Well have at it if that makes you feel better.

So, it's SM3 Done wrong then. If its not done to the exact specifications, what would you call it? A white lie? I'm still laughing morph. keep em coming.

 

[jiffylube1024]

Originally posted by: M0RPH
What's important is real-world SM3.0 performance, and from what I've seen in reviews, ATI has done a significantly better job with their implementation. Therefore, IMO, their little tag line "SM3 done right" has some merit.

What have you seen? Personally, I've seen nothing to show that either company's implementation is better; just a pull and tug between the X1800XT and the 7800GTX.

 

[biostud]

Even though the cards might lack a few features they just need to take it into consideration when programming games. I don't think it will matter that much.

 

[Kyanzes]

The question is, how these drivers got the WHQL status if they fail...

 

[Gstanfor]

Text

See this post by demirug

The reason for failing some of the PS 3.0 tests is not the shader itself. The reason is that nVidia use a different mipmap selection than refrast. Because of this the card take the samples sometime from a different mipmap than refrast. As every mipmap have a different content (colors or rotated) they can not reach 85% identity with the refrast image. As there is no Direct3D specification about how mipmap selection have to work MS can not blame nVidia. Because of this the driver still get WHQL even if it don?t pass all tests.

 

[crazydingo]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: crazydingo

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Ackmed
Until a game comes out that uses Vertex Texturing, its pointless to try and say ATi screwed up. Unified is going to be used, from what I have read.

That's not really the point. It will fail the MS test just as nvidia did for whatever reasons.

Does it ? Why not wait for Fuad's tests on the X1800 XL .. :clock:

You mean, you expect it to pass everything in that test? Even the vertex texturing test even though it does not exist. You still think it might have a chance? I mean, if it tries really really hard, it can convince the MS test that it really really does have the vertex texturing feature? Please Dingo. Give it a rest.

Vertex texture fetch is optional. I think you should look up the word optional at dictionary.com

If that feature is present in the DCT then fair and square, it fails. Until that is proven (by Fuad or some one else) why dont YOU give it a rest. (and stop jumping on me?)

 

[OneOfTheseDays]

this is going to sound dumb, but what exactly is SM3? And who created it? Thanks.

 

[BFG10K]

SM3 is Shader Model 3, the latest version of programming GPUs. It is part of the Microsoft DirectX 9.0c spec but I'm sure GPU vendors has some input into it as well.

 

[Gamingphreek]

Originally posted by: Sudheer Anne
this is going to sound dumb, but what exactly is SM3? And who created it? Thanks.

IIRC it is a MS standard. It basically gives manf a minimum requirement that they must meet in order to run games. It sets a standard in features. COmpanies are free to go above and beyond that standard, but they are not certified if they do not meet the standard.

What have you seen? Personally, I've seen nothing to show that either company's implementation is better; just a pull and tug between the X1800XT and the 7800GTX.

That is what i have seen, it just seems like M0RPH is being his usual trolling self :roll:

-Kevin

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: crazydingo

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: crazydingo

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Ackmed
Until a game comes out that uses Vertex Texturing, its pointless to try and say ATi screwed up. Unified is going to be used, from what I have read.

That's not really the point. It will fail the MS test just as nvidia did for whatever reasons.

Does it ? Why not wait for Fuad's tests on the X1800 XL .. :clock:

You mean, you expect it to pass everything in that test? Even the vertex texturing test even though it does not exist. You still think it might have a chance? I mean, if it tries really really hard, it can convince the MS test that it really really does have the vertex texturing feature? Please Dingo. Give it a rest.

Vertex texture fetch is optional. I think you should look up the word optional at dictionary.com

If that feature is present in the DCT then fair and square, it fails. Until that is proven (by Fuad or some one else) why dont YOU give it a rest. (and stop jumping on me?)

Ya see, the thing is I started this thread stating both camps fail the test. But that is not good enough for you. And I don't think it will ever be good enough. You are totally one sided and really do not display a willingness to actually discuss this stuff. Am I wrong? If so, please tell me why. Thanks.

 

[M0RPH]

Originally posted by: jiffylube1024

What have you seen? Personally, I've seen nothing to show that either company's implementation is better; just a pull and tug between the X1800XT and the 7800GTX.

Without any doubts, from the architectural point of view, ATI RADEON X1000 is the most advanced graphics architecture for the PC to date. The RADEON X1800 ? ATI?s newest top-of-the-range offering ? not only sports Shader Model 3.0, High Dynamic Range and image quality enhancement capabilities ? such as quality area anisotropic filtering and adaptive antialiasing ? but also provides future proof by featuring H.264 video decoding hardware acceleration, really speedy pixel shader 3.0 branch execution as well as efficient and reprogrammable Ring Bus memory controller.

When working on the RADEON X1000 product line in general and the top-of-the-range X1800 XT solution in particular, ATI paid special attention to the practical value of each of the above mentioned features. According to the company representatives, the graphics card makers try to take advantage of all the features offered by the new architecture, making sure that nothing will be wasted. Today we saw that the Shader Model 3.0 support was really done for good: just look how the RADEON X1600 XT manages to leave behind a far more expensive and enhanced GeForce 7800 GTX during dynamic branching and pixel shaders 3.0 processing. In addition, ATI?s new RADEON X1000 family copes perfectly well with multi-pass rendering, and full-screen anti-aliasing, according to our preliminary observations.

Link

See this review to start with. I'll give you more later, I just don't have time at the moment.