Most people who simply want to play games do not want to spend $1500+ just for 2 graphics cards, which is what a 7800GTX 512 setup would cost you, plus the rest of the high end components. While we're enthusiasts, majority of the gaming population isn't. Majority of the gaming pop also isn't techincal enough to even know the first thing about Sli. Consoles are more successful because they have more games, much less hassle to deal with, nothing to upgrade, no software to update, worry about viruses/spam/driver issues/compatibility, etc.
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7800GTX 512 in SLI > XBox 360?
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shortylickens
No Lifer
Its been a while since I messed with consoles, but I recall the same issue with NES.
Remember the first games like Lode Runner and Donkey Kong? Look at them and then think of the later stuff like Final Fantasy and Castlevainia 3.
Its not about learning to take advantage of the console, its weither they need to. The developers of MGS4 said that current games dont need all that processing power as there not complex enough. Its only torward the end of a console usefuly life that people have to try and squeeze performance out of it.
Although logically I recon it swings both ways.
Although logically I recon it swings both ways.
BenSkywalker
Diamond Member
Could you point me to a PC that has over 20GB/sec system level memory bandwidth or over 200GB/sec framebuffer bandwidth for the GPU? I must have missed that setup.
DoA3 came out several years ago and still looks better then a good deal of the PC games being released today(obviously it is not comparable to the best titles today)- that is why it still used. Its' character model complexity and animation still best most PC titles shipping now. That is very sad given that that was a launch title for a last generation console.
Ultra mode does not require 512MB SLId boards to play- never has either.
So you are saying you have never seen PGR3- OK. You should check it out.
You are fooling yourself thinking the G71 is going to make any real difference. The G90 could hit tomorrow and it isn't going to change the fact that PC games are still using outdated tech and targetting R9200SEs.
CoD2 looks poor by XB360 standards- we know that as we are talking about experience. Why don't you show us some footage of PC games whipping this?
compgeek89
Golden Member
Ben, you are walking WAY to far up in the sky. You can't see facts.
BenSkywalker. The ultra mode on the doom 3 engine has ALWAYS needed 512mb cards(not necessarly sli but you have to have 512mb on the card) . It evens tells you that when you set it to ultra. I would tell you to try and and see for yourself but you appear to have no intention of gaming on a pc. And as i have stated numerous times in this thread i had a 360 hooked to my 34" xbr hdtv(argubably the best hdtv ever) playing that lamea-- pgr3 in 1080i and 720p and thought it looked no better than nfsmw on my pc. I am not impressed at all with your beloved pgr3 or your 360, and to continue to mis inform people that the 360 has better graphics than a high end pc with sli is just plain misleading, wrong, and untruthful.
Have you ever played the game? This is the second time you've posted this crap, granted I can't totally destroy my car, but if you play in cockpit mode (like any real pgr3 gamer should), when you break your sideview mirror off and its hanging, your windshield is dirty and cracked, it definitely makes a difference in your driving. If you've never played pgr on a 50" or greater TV in high-def, then you can't speak about the xbox's graphics. A 34" TV doesn't count when it's on the other side of the room over 10 feet from you, when I play mine on my 60" Sony 955XS, I'm sitting at a max of 15' from the TV.
That being said, I have COD2 for the PC, not for 360, because it just plays better on a pc. I want my keyboard and mouse and I game on it at 1680x1050, beautiful.
BenSkywalker
Diamond Member
If that were true you would have a good point- you can easily run the Ultra settings with a 256MB board- all it does is remove compression from the normal maps anyway(which if you don't vomit at the "quality" of AF on your board then you certainly won't notice).
Intentions no, although I do it regularly on a nearly daily basis when there is anything worth playing out. You can tell you don't frequent these forums very much- I game on every viable platform- own them all including my PCs. I am a big fan of the RTS genre and it isn't like the consoles can offer the type of gaming experience I can get with RoN(AoE3 svcked to me and Civ IV still suffers from the 'single spearman can wipe out a column of tanks' issue which makes it a true POS IMO). Shooters I'm also a fan of, but outside of control issues consoles are certainly competitive in that area(not to be mistaken as equal- but they have a decent selection). Unfortunately PC FPSs have been stagnant for some time; sure Monolith shakes things up a bit every now and then- but Epic and id are simply rehashing the SOS over and over with Crytek seemingly following in their footsteps. Croteam is doing a bit better then them in terms of approach- at least they are in your face old school and try to dial it up a few notches. RPGs- the last truly great RPG that hit the PC was KoTOR- a port from a console. Elder Scrolls IV is going to be launching on both at the same time(likely meaning that the console version will have an edge given the psuedo DX10 feature set of the R600 based XB360 not to mention Bethesda's horrible optimizing skills for the PC). If there were more killer titles coming out for the PC then I would likely play it more, but currently the NDS and PS2 have been taking up most of my time(DQ8 and MK).
I know what you have stated- what I'm telling you is break the elements down for us if you expect us to believe that that is remotely true. NFSMW is a poor port of a last gen console game to the PC and the 360- it has p!ss poor visuals by any current metric.
You want to debate graphics technology please start. I have heard nothing but vague statements about something you have supposedly seen- you have given us no insight whatsoever as to why you feel this is true. I was presented with HL2 shots and I gave a quick rundown of why they looked pathetic on a comparitive basis- if you have seen what you claimed to have seen and you want to discuss honesty then let's you start displaying your expertise in graphics technology and break it down for us.
compgeek89
Golden Member
And yet the 360 can barely manage 30 fps @ 1280x720 4xAA when the single 7800 GTX 512mb can do 1920x1200 4xAA 8xAF
You're hardly helping yourself out there. You are full of contradictions.
And DONT give us optimization bunk, the PC version received a whole lot less optimization than your 360. If the 360 actually were more powerful this wouldn't be an issue.
BenSkywalker
Diamond Member
Just wow.....
An EA port is now being used as an example of proper coding and a good display of ports. The same EA who not that long ago released a NFS that ran at a constant 60FPS on the PS2 but couldn't manage 30FPS on the PC(NFS:HP2)- I failed to hear the PC zealots trying to use that as an example. The funny thing is- neither would the PS2 fans as they all have the sense to know that EA has what is likely the poorest code writing teams in the gaming industry. Of course, the Sony loyalists are very pragmatic people compared to the inane drivel I'm hearing here.
compgeek89
Golden Member
Doesn't take much to impress you, I know the brain activcity in my area is impressive... but wow?
And what you said doesn't address what I said, actually affirms what I said.
I SAID, the PC received less optimizations than the 360 version by far, yet still performs better. AND, even if they received teh exact same optimization, if the 360 IS more powerful, than the 360 SHOULDNT HAVE PROBLEMS.
compgeek89
Golden Member
The inquirer says so.
compgeek89
Golden Member
I just searched google, and I cant find any NFSMW benchies.
BenSkywalker
Diamond Member
Try and follow along, it gets a bit tricky-
PCs have been around for many years.
Final XB360 dev kits were around for a few months before the system launched.
DX9 and x86 CPUs have been working together for years.
Xenon and Xenos have been working together for months.
Properly optimizing for hardware that doesn't exist yet isn't something you are going to find your port developers at EA handling in an ideal fashion.
NFS:MW doesn't look that much better then Forza all else equal- run at the same resolution and AA/AF settings I would say it looks overall quite inferior to that last generation title.
My PC has issues running PS2 games- why is that? Using your non thinking standard my PC is less powerful then a PS2.
Yreka
Diamond Member
I think its really subjective. For instance I can't stand aliasing. It sticks out like a sore thumb to me. On the PC, I will play a game at below 30fps at times if it means I can crank up the AA. Because of that, I think the graphics on my PC are better than on my XBOX360 *and properly calibrated 57" HDTV*.
For my friends, the 360 is better. They never notice the jaggies, and think I am just nitpicking. C'est La Vie
For my friends, the 360 is better. They never notice the jaggies, and think I am just nitpicking. C'est La Vie
compgeek89
Golden Member
Same here.
And also, 360 didnt give devs what they wanted like the xbox1 did.
THEY WANT x86architecture on asingle core, its what they know and can really use well.
MS gave them what they wanted last gen, they really messed that up this gen.
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