7-Year-Old Migrant Girl Dies Of Dehydration In Border Patrol Custody

[brandonbull]

Within an hour you went from "we don't know all the facts" to "the facts don't work for you because I know all the facts."

basically: you don't give a fuck about facts. We always knew that. You just want GOP "wins," at whatever cost, and more dead brown people is a major bonus. This is the summary of your entire posting history.

I hope you and others like you don't sleep well at night. Your continued support of illegal aliens coming to America is a major factor in this child's death. I guess you don't care as long as the Democrats get more future voters and indentured servants. Cost of doing business? You are truly a disgusting piece of crap along with your gang of Progressheviks.

 

[brandonbull]

My name is Heinrich Luitpold Himmler , and I approved this message.

View attachment 1561

I guess supporting sick grandmas and children that survive inhospitable conditions is a way of only selecting the best voters and indentured servants for the glorious Democratic Party.

 

[brandonbull]

What should or could they have done differently? Answered numerous times by others and myself. Safety of Mexico? Because the economy in Mexico is so much better than where they were. /s
Hindsight is 20/20. However, when children are involved, all institutions and government offices should and must be held to a higher standard.

Are you saying that the Border Patrol Agents let her flop around with seizures and after 8 hours finally got around to taking her to the hospital?

 

[SMOGZINN]

I hope you and others like you don't sleep well at night. Your continued support of illegal aliens coming to America is a major factor in this child's death. I guess you don't care as long as the Democrats get more future voters and indentured servants. Cost of doing business? You are truly a disgusting piece of crap along with your gang of Progressheviks.

Do you really believe that people coming from places so bad that they would walk with a 8 year old across the desert would care if we were a little harder on immigration or not? Do you really believe that she would not have died if we had simply put a big wall up across that desert? What do you think was going to happen when they came to that wall? The answer is you would not care, because then you would not have to hear about the girl that died on the other side of the wall. That is all you actually care about, that you don't have to see the dead girl, not whether or not the girl lives.

 

[Lanyap]

Do you really believe that people coming from places so bad that they would walk with a 8 year old across the desert would care if we were a little harder on immigration or not? Do you really believe that she would not have died if we had simply put a big wall up across that desert? What do you think was going to happen when they came to that wall? The answer is you would not care, because then you would not have to hear about the girl that died on the other side of the wall. That is all you actually care about, that you don't have to see the dead girl, not whether or not the girl lives.

There has to be some way we can help these people in their own country. Most of these people are the poorest of the poor that get crapped on in their country. I know we have messed with their governments in the past and maybe even now but it doesn’t make sense that we don’t provide some type of assistance (while avoiding the corruption) so these people don’t feel like they have to make these dangerous journeys to other countries to start an unknown new life in a new country. I realize this is a simplistic answer but it could go a long way to resolving a lot of the illegal immigration issues we have been facing while giving these people a better life.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

There has to be some way we can help these people in their own country. Most of these people are the poorest of the poor that get crapped on in their country. I know we have messed with their governments in the past and maybe even now but it doesn’t make sense that we don’t provide some type of assistance (while avoiding the corruption) so these people don’t feel like they have to make these dangerous journeys to other countries to start an unknown new life in a new country. I realize this is a simplistic answer but it could go a long way to resolving a lot of the illegal immigration issues we have been facing while giving these people a better life.

That's a very tall order, unfortunately. We've spent the better part of the last century generally fucking about with central/south america, and for the most part this is the fallout of that (along with the rampant drug usage/availability in the US). As individuals, most of these people are useless to their host governments. They aren't really regarded at all, and people are left to their own devices, which eventually means a long life of destitution, or a short life of illegality. Hence, they try to forge a better life by getting to the US, where they know if they put in an ounce of effort they can reap enormous rewards for themselves and their family.

Assisting their host countries would be very difficult, because you are dealing with corruption in most cases. You can't just give people free money, you can't tell the governments to not be corrupt. Can't exactly annex the host country. Much of the conflict we've got on the world stage right now was probably precipitated by one nation or another trying to bring democracy to some nation they regarded as a third world hellhole, and that's a longstanding tradition going back to the Christian's version of manifest destiny. Generally speaking, screwing around with host nations only makes things worse, not better.

If it were me, I'd probably abolish the war on drugs, and legalize all drugs (all of them), and pour massive resources into combating human trafficking, like 10x current levels. That'd probably go the furthest to help pull the host countries out of the quagmire they're in.

 

[Viper1j]

I'm still waiting to hear how tall this "big beyoootifull wall" is going to be.. I wonder if planes will be ably to fly over it? Or will they have to cut holes in at 26,000 feet for the planes to fly through?

And will the holes have border people stationed at them?

 

[interchange]

Do you really believe that people coming from places so bad that they would walk with a 8 year old across the desert would care if we were a little harder on immigration or not? Do you really believe that she would not have died if we had simply put a big wall up across that desert? What do you think was going to happen when they came to that wall? The answer is you would not care, because then you would not have to hear about the girl that died on the other side of the wall. That is all you actually care about, that you don't have to see the dead girl, not whether or not the girl lives.

I think it is foolish not to imagine that a system which reliably, transparently, and expediently denies access to asylum seekers based on criteria that are as explicit and objective as possible would not significantly reduce attempts to cross the border seeking asylum. I also think a structural barrier is potentially significantly effective at reducing crossings.

I also recognize that our current administration denies access in a way that is none of reliable, transparent, expedient, or based on objective and explicit criteria. And that we have fervor over structural barriers with little certainty in application. The current situation is opposed to what would be effective for the stated goal.

And I think what we do now is inhumane and should not be accepted regardless of efficacy.

And I think the real aim is xenophobia and scapegoating for which a highly punitive and marginally efficacious approach supports continuation of division.

 

[Lanyap]

I'm still waiting to hear how tall this "big beyoootifull wall" is going to be.. I wonder if planes will be ably to fly over it? Or will they have to cut holes in at 26,000 feet for the planes to fly through?

And will the holes have border people stationed at them?

Heh, walls will never work. Automated drones with cameras, infrared and other new surveillance tech, satellites and flight capable robocops are part of the answer. All with no weapons, of course.

 

[Lanyap]

Additional details on migrant children and families overwhelming remote CBP stations recently.


https://news.yahoo.com/officials-baffled-large-migrant-groups-remote-crossing-224914311.html
Officials baffled by large migrant groups at remote crossing
Associated Press
ELLIOT SPAGAT and COLLEEN LONG,Associated Press•December 18, 2018

WASHINGTON (AP) — Large numbers of Guatemalan families and unaccompanied children are surrendering to U.S. immigration agents in an extremely remote and dangerous stretch of New Mexico desert, a new smuggling route that has baffled authorities.

It is where 7-year-old Jakelin Caal and her father were found Dec. 6 with 161 others near a border crossing in Antelope Wells. Caal started vomiting on the bus ride to the nearest Border Patrol station 94 miles (150 kilometers) away and had stopped breathing by the time she arrived. She died at a hospital in El Paso, Texas.

U.S. authorities this week encountered groups of 257 and 239 people consisting of families and unaccompanied children, Customs and Border Protection Commissioner Kevin McAleenan said Tuesday. The Border Patrol found groups of more than 100 people along the entire U.S. border with Mexico about eight times during the budget year that ended Sept. 30 and encountered nearly four times that amount since Oct. 1.

"This is a brand new phenomenon," McAleenan told reporters in a conference call. "It's really challenging our resources."

Antelope Wells is the site of one of about three dozen Border Patrol "forward operating bases" in Arizona, New Mexico and Texas — bare-bones facilities designed to increase enforcement in remote areas. About four agents are assigned to Antelope Wells and they sleep at the base on eight-day shifts to avoid having to drive home every day.

Migrants have told agents that they took commercial buses from Guatemala to New Mexico in four or five days straight, a sharp contrast to the traditional route that can take 25 to 30 days to reach the U.S. border and includes rest stops at "stash houses" along the way, McAleenan said.

It's unclear why Guatemalans are choosing such a remote spot, but McAleenan said it may be less expensive for smugglers to pay other criminal organizations fees to pass through. The U.S. is working with Mexico to determine the reasons behind it, hoping to redirect traffic to the nearest cities, El Paso and Nogales, Arizona.

Families began arriving in large groups about once or twice a week since mid-October and the trend has accelerated in recent weeks, McAleenan said.

The families are generally seeking out U.S. agents to turn themselves in, raising questions about why they would go to such lengths when they could do so in large cities. All along the border, migrants are increasingly turning themselves in to U.S. authorities to seek asylum or other form of humanitarian protection.

The U.S. has shifted additional medical personnel and more vehicles to Lordsburg and Antelope Wells to help manage.

"In a group as large as 250 you're going to have medical issues," McAleenan said. "You're going to have people that have the flu, and people that have scabies or lice or other skin conditions, and so we are making hospital runs with pretty much every group that arrives at this time."

Only about 30 vehicles a day enter the U.S. at the Antelope Wells, compared to tens of thousands at San Diego's San Ysidro crossing, the nation's busiest. McAleenan said buses typically drop off Guatemalans near Antelope Wells and they cross a barbed-wire fence to reach the U.S.

McAleenan gave a tour of the area to members of the Democratic Congressional Hispanic Caucus. Rep. Joaquin Castro, D-Texas, said the group had seen many young children and their parents in the facility, and called for a congressional investigation into the conditions at the facility and the girl's death.

Caal's body was expected to be returned to Guatemala Thursday, and then taken to her hometown of San Antonio Secortez. Her death touched off a firestorm. Border Patrol agents said they did all they could do to help the girl who seemed healthy when she first reached encountered them. But it's not clear if there was a translation issue. Border Patrol agents were speaking to her father in Spanish, as they are required to do, but his first language is the Mayan tongue known as Q'eqchi'.

Attorneys in Texas representing the girl's father criticized U.S. officials for asking him to sign a form that asks questions with check boxes of "yes" or "no." ''Claims good health" was handwritten in the "additional comments" section.

Her cause of death has not been released.

The family also disputed the accounts by U.S. officials that the girl walked for days in the desert without food or water before crossing. The father's lawyers said Caal took care of his daughter, giving her sufficient water and food, and she appeared to be in good health.

 

[Zaap]

So what about when a child dies six weeks after being in ICE custody, after her mother took her on a flight from Texas to NJ instead of directly to medical care?

Let's do this one game show style. The correct answer is:

A. Yup it's ICE's fault again. It's always ICE's fault. ICE. Their fault. Them.

Oh, and Give that mom $60,000,000.

B. If you've got custody of a child, you're responsible for that child. So hours on an airplane instead of straight to hospital... not only NOT 60 million smakers but charged with 'negligent homicide'.

Helpful hint: ICE weren't the ones who had custody of the child while on an airplane instead of in a hospital.

Or C...

Aww screw it. ICE's fault. $60 million clams and stellar world citizen of the decade award.


^ anyone care to be consistent and pick their answer above?

 

[Viper1j]

Heh, walls will never work. Automated drones with cameras, infrared and other new surveillance tech, satellites and flight capable robocops are part of the answer. All with no weapons, of course.

All they have to do, is swim 100ft.

TJ on the left, San Diego on the right.



If Donny wants to stretch that, he can only go 12 miles before hitting international waters. How much will THAT cost?

 

[Lanyap]

All they have to do, is swim 100ft.

TJ on the left, San Diego on the right.

View attachment 1663

If Donny wants to stretch that, he can only go 12 miles before hitting international waters. How much will THAT cost?

Well, I was referring to the other end of that wall that would span 4 states.

 

[Lanyap]

So what about when a child dies six weeks after being in ICE custody, after her mother took her on a flight from Texas to NJ instead of directly to medical care?

Let's do this one game show style. The correct answer is:

A. Yup it's ICE's fault again. It's always ICE's fault. ICE. Their fault. Them.

Oh, and Give that mom $60,000,000.

B. If you've got custody of a child, you're responsible for that child. So hours on an airplane instead of straight to hospital... not only NOT 60 million smakers but charged with 'negligent homicide'.

Helpful hint: ICE weren't the ones who had custody of the child while on an airplane instead of in a hospital.

Or C...

Aww screw it. ICE's fault. $60 million clams and stellar world citizen of the decade award.


^ anyone care to be consistent and pick their answer above?

It does sound like she may have a valid claim based on the articles I read about this incident. IMO the mother did make the mistake of taking the daughter on a long flight instead of bringing her to the closest hospital as soon as she was released from detention but it may have been too late even in that case.

 

[Viper1j]

Well, I was referring to the other end of that wall that would span 4 states.

It would be kind of interesting, to see them try to stretch that out 12 miles, strictly from a "America's Funniest Home Videos" perspective.

 

[Lanyap]

It would be kind of interesting, to see them try to stretch that out 12 miles, strictly from a "America's Funniest Home Videos" perspective.

That part of the existing wall does look kind of half-ass.

 

[Zaap]

It does sound like she may have a valid claim based on the articles I read about this incident. IMO the mother did make the mistake of taking the daughter on a long flight instead of bringing her to the closest hospital as soon as she was released from detention but it may have been too late even in that case.

That's a pretty gargantuan mistake to make, if you knew your child was critically ill, and are blaming someone else for it, to the tune of suing them for $60 million dollars.

I know lawyers chase where the money is, but come on.

In this case, we're told that if you have custody of a child and fail to provide medical care for them, and they die- heck, one person insists that should even be a homicide charge. Okay- if that's what's established, and you can point to a specific person you'd charge, fine.

Meanwhile in the other case, you have a mother suing ICE for $60 million dollars for the death of her daughter- when right after being released she traveled across the country rather than seek immediate medical care. The child unfortunately died- but 6 weeks past being in ICE custody.

How do you blame someone else for the death of your child after you first subject them to a hazardous illegal border crossing- which is going to get you detained in any country- and then when released, don't feel there's a need to seek immediate medical care, vs. travel from Texas to NJ, and even once there wait several more hours before going to a hospital?

I just notice the only thing that's consistent: always blame ICE, always blame the US for actually having (and how DARE us enforce!) our immigration laws.

And of course ALWAYS excuse the actions of the illegal immigrants themselves- like they are all children or something and can't be held to any sort of standard that anyone else as a parent subjecting their children to dangerously terrible decision making is held to.

 

[Lanyap]

The official autopsy reports still have not been released for the two children that died. I doubt that they will be at this point.

Meanwhile, the number of 100+ caravans of migrant families with a large percentage of children bused in from Central America are increasing dramatically. Apparently smugglers are dropping them off in remote areas to overwhelm the CBP and keep them busy while they can smuggle drugs across the border.

Instead of building a huge physical wall that will not work we need to continue to expand the existing virtual wall we have been working on for a long time using latest technology.


Border Patrol overwhelmed by large groups of migrant families
https://news.yahoo.com/border-patrol-overwhelmed-large-groups-migrant-families-201344689.html

(Reuters) - U.S. Border Patrol said on Friday its resources were being stretched thin by larger and larger groups of Central American families left by smugglers in remote locations along the U.S. Mexico border.

So far in fiscal year 2019, which began last October, the Border Patrol has apprehended 60 groups of 100 or more migrants, compared with 13 during the entire 2018 fiscal year and just two large groups caught in the 2017 fiscal year, a U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) official said on a call with reporters.

Until recently, most people caught crossing the border illegally were men from Mexico, but now Central American families and unaccompanied minors make up some 60 percent of those apprehended, data from the agency show.

Facilities built decades ago are struggling to cope with the influx of migrant families, many with young children, who are often in need of medical care.

"Large bus loads of individuals are being bussed up to the border and we don't have any infrastructure in that area," the official said on the call with reporters.

Many of the migrants who may seek passage with smugglers in their journey through Mexico cross the border and turn themselves into U.S. authorities to seek asylum in the United States, a drawn-out court process that can take months or years to resolve.

The border patrol official said smugglers drop off large groups as a diversion tactic to tie up law enforcement resources in order to move drugs across other parts of the border.

The Trump administration has tried to curb access to asylum, including by starting a program that would require applicants to wait out their legal proceedings in Mexico.

Human rights advocates say increased border security and daily quotas put on asylum requests at ports of entry are among factors pushing large groups of migrants to cross the border in risky, remote areas.

Just how dangerous these crossings can be was highlighted in December when a 7-year-old girl from Guatemala died in U.S. custody after she and her father crossed in a large group in a remote area of New Mexico. Weeks later, an 8-year-old Guatemalan boy died after crossing the border with his father near El Paso, Texas.

Overall, illegal crossings at the southern border have dropped dramatically compared to previous decades but in recent years the number of families and unaccompanied children heading to the United States has increased.

 

[cytg111]

If anyone was wondering how to create terrorists. This is how you create terrorists.
If that was me on that border and that was my child. Holy crap batman, the lid would come off and I dont think i'd ever come back...

 

[MagnusTheBrewer]

Are you saying that the Border Patrol Agents let her flop around with seizures and after 8 hours finally got around to taking her to the hospital?

I'm saying ignorance of her true condition in no way mitigates responsibility. If you have custody, you have responsibility period.

 

[Jaskalas]

I'm saying ignorance of her true condition in no way mitigates responsibility. If you have custody, you have responsibility period.

Define custody.
4 Agents were in the process of rescuing 163 people from the desert. With a bus and a 3 hour round trip.
They did everything possible.

Their responsibly to know every single person's condition starts AFTER they've been processed. After they've taken custody. After the people are brought in / rescued from the desert. Until then, the migrant's fate has been 100% of their own creation.

This is NOT 8 hours into custody. This is 8 hours into a rescue operation in a remote desert.

Stop framing this as if they were processed and left in cages to die for 8 hours. That is FAR removed from the reality of the situation. Such outrage belies the circumstances, the resources and the information available to the BP. It belies the sheer stupidity of taking small children to a REMOTE desert for days. Emotional appeals to ignorance do not serve you in this case. It was not yet custody, it was a RESCUE operation.

Do you also attack first responders in say, the flooding after a storm, if they fail to rescue every single person? The position of people in this topic is not logical, ignores the facts, and is horribly wrong.

 

[BUTCH1]

I'm saying ignorance of her true condition in no way mitigates responsibility. If you have custody, you have responsibility period.

As much as I hate Trump and everything he stands for, blaming boarder patrol here is wrong IMO. Are they supposed to do a triage/medical evaluation on every single person/child in the field?. The really bad idea of taking a 7yr old on this type of journey has to fall upon the father.

 

[realibrad]

I'm saying ignorance of her true condition in no way mitigates responsibility. If you have custody, you have responsibility period.

If she had cancer, would they be responsible period?

 

[MagnusTheBrewer]

If she had cancer, would they be responsible period?

Can cancer be aided at a crossing point? Can dehydration? Perhaps the lesson is, taking children into custody shouldn't be your first response.

 

[MagnusTheBrewer]

As much as I hate Trump and everything he stands for, blaming boarder patrol here is wrong IMO. Are they supposed to do a triage/medical evaluation on every single person/child in the field?. The really bad idea of taking a 7yr old on this type of journey has to fall upon the father.

Perhaps, taking children into custody shouldn't be your first response.