64% of Americans believe Big Government is the biggest threat

[Jhhnn]

The actual poll question is incredibly vague, leaving the participants & the readers to use their imaginations to fill in the blanks as to what aspects of big govt are seen as threats.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/151490/fear-big-government-near-record-level.aspx

Given that Politico & Gallup teamed up to do it, the clear intent is to support the "smaller govt" faction of the Repub party. Notice how Repub raving has waxed & waned depending on whether they control the executive branch, and how htat affects opinion...

It's a form of projection as propaganda.

"Big Government" means a lot of different things to different people.

I suspect that some people as ill at ease over things like the Patriot Act & current efforts to allow for indefinite military detention of suspected terrorists apprehended in this country, for example. But those things are faves of the anti-gubmint ravers. Maybe they're upset about increasingly onerous requirements to vote, another fave. Maybe they're apprehensive about govt willingness to bail out the still out of control financial sector, and unwillingness to build them a suitable playpen. Maybe they're apprehensive that big military is gobbling up too much of our resources, but that's a fave of Righties everywhere...

 

[monovillage]

Because undoubtedly a majority of that 64% is firmly attached to the goverment tit and drawing SS and medicare while they bemoan big government.

It's no secret that the retired and elderly make up a substantial portion of the ultra conservative republican base and are the staunchest opponents of big government and the most active in polling and getting out the vote for the conservative agenda, while they pay their bills and buy their medicine with government checks.

You have the facts to back that up?
Oh yeah, it's no secret and everybody knows. The 2 biggest fact checks for liberal Democrats.

 

[monovillage]

The actual poll question is incredibly vague, leaving the participants & the readers to use their imaginations to fill in the blanks as to what aspects of big govt are seen as threats.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/151490/fear-big-government-near-record-level.aspx

............I suspect that some people as ill at ease over things like the Patriot Act & current efforts to allow for indefinite military detention of suspected terrorists apprehended in this country, for example. But those things are faves of the anti-gubmint ravers. Maybe they're upset about increasingly onerous requirements to vote, another fave. Maybe they're apprehensive about govt willingness to bail out the still out of control financial sector, and unwillingness to build them a suitable playpen. Maybe they're apprehensive that big military is gobbling up too much of our resources, but that's a fave of Righties everywhere...

The article states "The all-time high for percentage of people who said big government was the biggest threat to the country was in 1999 and 2000, when 65 percent named it the country’s biggest menace."

So I guess your Patriot Act theory gets tossed out. As for anti government ravers, it looks like 64% of the population is by your definition a "raver". Maybe you should change your definitions to match reality?

 

[monovillage]

You mean that fund they were ordered to pay into and could not opt out of? Yeah it's completely irrational for them to want that.

Not only ordered, but threatened with imprisonment if they didn't obey.

 

[zsdersw]

You have the facts to back that up?
Oh yeah, it's no secret and everybody knows. The 2 biggest fact checks for liberal Democrats.

How were the poll responders being hypocritical? I thought i'd just return the favor since you claimed they were the ones that were hypocrites.

There's a reason SS and Medicare reform are referred to as "third rails" in American politics, and part of it has to do with how popular those programs in their present form are.

The huge majorities required to make something a "third rail" in politics means that most if not all of those polled feel big government is the biggest threat and, simultaneously, demand big government: "don't you dare mess with my Medicare and Social Security!"

 

[woolfe9999]

The article states "The all-time high for percentage of people who said big government was the biggest threat to the country was in 1999 and 2000, when 65 percent named it the country’s biggest menace."

So I guess your Patriot Act theory gets tossed out. As for anti government ravers, it looks like 64% of the population is by your definition a "raver". Maybe you should change your definitions to match reality?

I think the Patriot Act is just an illustration. Historically, Americans fear the police state in general. Any poll that shows Americans being concerned about "big government" is going to contain some people who are chiefly concerned about that, as opposed to say, government regulation of business, or entitlements. This stands to reason since this number has historically always been high, even when budgets were balanced/lower and government was smaller in general. You'd need more specific poll wording to parse out the two concerns. I wouldn't be surprised if today the majority of the current 64% were concerned about the spiraling deficit and overall size of government, but "majority" is not all.

 

[actuarial]

You mean that fund they were ordered to pay into and could not opt out of? Yeah it's completely irrational for them to want that.

But they didn't pay enough to cover their own benefits, hence why there's a projected shortfall in those programs.

 

[monovillage]

I think the Patriot Act is just an illustration. Historically, Americans fear the police state in general. Any poll that shows Americans being concerned about "big government" is going to contain some people who are chiefly concerned about that, as opposed to say, government regulation of business, or entitlements. This stands to reason since this number has historically always been high, even when budgets were balanced/lower and government was smaller in general. You'd need more specific poll wording to parse out the two concerns. I wouldn't be surprised if today the majority of the current 64% were concerned about the spiraling deficit and overall size of government, but "majority" is not all.

I don't really see 1999 and 2000 as old time historical, wasn't that when Bill Clinton was President and Janet Reno was his Attorney General? I certainly don't disagree that the 48% of Democrats that think Big Government is the greatest threat to face the American people don't have a different view and priorities then the 64% of Independents that say it's the biggest threat.

 

[Atreus21]

The actual poll question is incredibly vague, leaving the participants & the readers to use their imaginations to fill in the blanks as to what aspects of big govt are seen as threats.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/151490/fear-big-government-near-record-level.aspx

Given that Politico & Gallup teamed up to do it, the clear intent is to support the "smaller govt" faction of the Repub party. Notice how Repub raving has waxed & waned depending on whether they control the executive branch, and how htat affects opinion...

It's a form of projection as propaganda.

"Big Government" means a lot of different things to different people.

I suspect that some people as ill at ease over things like the Patriot Act & current efforts to allow for indefinite military detention of suspected terrorists apprehended in this country, for example. But those things are faves of the anti-gubmint ravers. Maybe they're upset about increasingly onerous requirements to vote, another fave. Maybe they're apprehensive about govt willingness to bail out the still out of control financial sector, and unwillingness to build them a suitable playpen. Maybe they're apprehensive that big military is gobbling up too much of our resources, but that's a fave of Righties everywhere...

So the question was "Do you view big government, big business, or big labor as the bigger threat?"

And by your analysis, people view "big government" as meaning anything, but big business and big labor as quite specific?

 

[bfdd]

"big government" is about as definitive as "liberal" or "conservative". there's about 20 different definitions or combination of definitions that are used for those words and they mean something else to every single person.

 

[woolfe9999]

I don't really see 1999 and 2000 as old time historical, wasn't that when Bill Clinton was President and Janet Reno was his Attorney General? I certainly don't disagree that the 48% of Democrats that think Big Government is the greatest threat to face the American people don't have a different view and priorities then the 64% of Independents that say it's the biggest threat.

Right, the 48% of democrats probably do have a different view, and they comrpise a portion of the total 64%. Anyway, I was referring to all the way back to the 60's. At times we were at 40%, 50%. It's doubtful that in those times the concern was mainly about government spending and regulation. The political debate wasn't even focused on those issues much.

Americans have always had a love-hate relationship with their government. Look at the sharp dip the number took after 911, yet that has nothing to do with government spending. I also think people tend to conflate their dislike of elected officials with dislike of government in general.

More specific polling questions would parse all this out better. But you guys like the result of the generally worded question, so why look any further, right?

 

[monovillage]

Right, the 48% of democrats probably do have a different view, and they comrpise a portion of the total 64%. Anyway, I was referring to all the way back to the 60's. At times we were at 40%, 50%. It's doubtful that in those times the concern was mainly about government spending and regulation. The political debate wasn't even focused on those issues much.

Americans have always had a love-hate relationship with their government. Look at the sharp dip the number took after 911, yet that has nothing to do with government spending. I also think people tend to conflate their dislike of elected officials with dislike of government in general.

More specific polling questions would parse all this out better. But you guys like the result of the generally worded question, so why look any further, right?

If by "you guys" you mean honest, reasonable, mainstream, hardworking, practical Americans, then, yes.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

But they didn't pay enough to cover their own benefits, hence why there's a projected shortfall in those programs.

They did as they were ordered at the same time that many lost their retirements because they could not prevent their pensions from being raided some decades ago, a practice that was government approved. When you do as you are ordered you don't have any real choice do you? Conform or be cast out is the least of their concerns.

Have you wondered why the Bill of Rights targeted the government that the Constitution caused to come about? Don't you think that the writers of that document were very familiar with government, religion and commerce? We aren't experiencing anything new, we've merely circumvented our protections. What is missed is that this isn't about government vs corporations, it's about those who have power and those who do not. Those that do have long ago consolidated their positions. Does that sound unlikely or untrue? How about that the wealthiest are not in danger and have not been by any income tax increase? Most earn money by other vehicles which will remain untouched. Oh but there were hearings and all! And what's come of it? Nothing. How about the government taking property from private citizens merely for increased tax purposes? That happened and the cry was that the SCOTUS said it was permissible. Bad Conservatives. Well if you looked at the decisions it wasn't about liberal or conservative and further it was mentioned by them that Congress had the ability to stop the practice. Did it? I don't think so.

Government is a creation of humans and run by those who would use power. It is hoped that they would use the One Ring if you will for good, but that is a matter of faith, something the Founders had little of in regards to the long term effects of their child, the US government. That's the reason for the Bill of Rights. Political parties, the lobbying system, the electoral process, and other things have conspired to allow the situation you see. You have two masters if you see it or not and both of them are merely faces of the same coin. Until people realize their position and stop their almost religious belief in the institutions of power they will be happy puppets, but not free men and women. The answer is from the bottom up, not the top down. It isn't that a corporation will cut profits to give you a job or that government will give back a power given. That doesn't happen. It's people deciding to act in a constructive manner, a "no more" attitude that sticks that will do the job, and mark this- those who do will be excoriated by both political factions and their compatriots in industry too.

 

[FerrelGeek]

Well since a majority believe that, and we live in a democracy, it's not really much of a threat then is it?

It is to people like Craig.

 

[senseamp]

A poll paid for by Politico, done by Gallup.
This poll shows that 64% of all Americans consider Big Government to be the biggest threat that Americans face. Even 48% of Democrats and 64% of Independents thought that Big Government is the biggest threat. 82% of Republicans consider it the biggest threat.
How often do we see someone on these forums denigrated and called some kind of nut if they distrust government or consider Big Government as a threat, this poll shows that a good sized majority of Americans agree on their distrust of Big Government. It's no surprise to me, but I didn't know I held such mainstream views.

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1211/70318.html

"An overwhelming 64 percent of people surveyed said big government was the biggest threat to the country, compared to just 26 percent who said big business is their gravest concern and 8 percent who picked big labor."

How does that compare to the percent of Americans who thought Saddam had WMDs?

 

[monovillage]

How does that compare to the percent of Americans who thought Saddam had WMDs?

I don't know, look it up.

 

[Dman8777]

What a dumb poll question. It sounds like something Fox news would come up with. WTF is big government? That's nothing but a conservative talking point.

 

[Atreus21]

What a dumb poll question. It sounds like something Fox news would come up with. WTF is big government? That's nothing but a conservative talking point.

I asked earlier: How is "Big Government" marvelously vague, but "Big Business" and "Big Labor" not vague?

The respondent had the option of three vague choices. They chose big government.

 

[monovillage]

What a dumb poll question. It sounds like something Fox news would come up with. WTF is big government? That's nothing but a conservative talking point.

From wikipedia: Fox news not found

"Politico is owned by Allbritton Communications, which owns television stations in Washington, D.C., and elsewhere, all affiliated with the Disney-owned ABC network.

The newspaper has a circulation of approximately 32,000,[4] distributed for free on Capitol Hill and elsewhere in Washington, D.C.[1] The newspaper prints up to five issues a week while Congress is in session, and sometimes publishes one issue a week when Congress is in recess.[5] It carries advertising, including full-page ads from trade associations and a large help-wanted section listing Washington political jobs.

Politico is a partner with several news outlets that co-report and distribute its video, print, and audio content. Partners include CBS News,[6] Allbritton Communications's ABC station WJLA and cable channel NewsChannel 8,[7] radio station WTOP-FM,[8] and Yahoo! News election coverage.

 

[darkewaffle]

This news tempered by the fact that an exceedingly low % of Americans aren't actually idiots.

 

[woolfe9999]

If by "you guys" you mean honest, reasonable, mainstream, hardworking, practical Americans, then, yes.

Nice deflection. "Honest, reasonable" people prefer to rely on inconclusive information, eh? I don't think so. It's clearly partisans like yourself who want to take this result and not inquire any further.

 

[monovillage]

Nice deflection. "Honest, reasonable" people prefer to rely on inconclusive information, eh? I don't think so. It's clearly partisans like yourself who want to take this result and not inquire any further.

I'm crushed by the partisan label. Coming from a partisan like yourself it really hurts my feelings. You're the one trying to deflect that close to half of Democrats think that Big Government is a threat. That's not the impression we get on these forums that everyone loves big Government except a a few right wingers.

 

[woolfe9999]

I'm crushed by the partisan label. Coming from a partisan like yourself it really hurts my feelings. You're the one trying to deflect that close to half of Democrats think that Big Government is a threat. That's not the impression we get on these forums that everyone loves big Government except a a few right wingers.

You're still deflecting. The point is that the poll question is too general and doesn't tell us everything we need to know. You continue to deflect because you know the point is valid. That's what makes you especially partisan.

 

[monovillage]

You're still deflecting. The point is that the poll question is too general and doesn't tell us everything we need to know. You continue to deflect because you know the point is valid. That's what makes you especially partisan.

"especially partisan" ? Am I going to be put on Double secret partisan probation next?

It wasn't a specific poll, and it wasn't intended to be. Just because you don't like the results you shouldn't attack the one that posted them.

 

[xj0hnx]

Because undoubtedly a majority of that 64% is firmly attached to the goverment tit and drawing SS and medicare while they bemoan big government.

It's no secret that the retired and elderly make up a substantial portion of the ultra conservative republican base and are the staunchest opponents of big government and the most active in polling and getting out the vote for the conservative agenda, while they pay their bills and buy their medicine with government checks.

That is so ass backwards it isn't even funny, but since it seems most people that call themselves liberals nowadays are really progressives it's no wonder. It's almost surreal seeing "liberals" going on, and on about how good government is, while going on about how the right wing is the loony anti-government crowd. If you had explained this to a liberal from the 60-90's you'd probably get a deer in the head lights look.