60HZ CRT rez

[Wardog2121]

I have had my monitor at 1024x768 rez and at 60HZ for a while now and is it really bad for your eyes? i also have another monitor i use thats 1280x1024 and its at 60HZ also, is one better then the other?

 

[Zebo]

bad as in what? it causes eye fatique and gives headaches. Not going to give you cataracts or anything.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

You might get dizzy or something from the flickering but the chance of 60Hz causing blindness is pretty low.

 

[Wardog2121]

ya see people say that when its at 60Hz its flickers but i dont see any flickering going on, and ya i was talking about if it will make your vision worse

 

[firerock]

Why don't you just set those fresh rate higher and see/feel the difference yourself?

 

[Wardog2121]

because my monitors dont support any higher than 60HZ at those rezs

 

[fierydemise]

The sensitivity of peoples eyes is different, you eyes aren't as sensitive so you can work at 60Hz without eyestrain, unlike someone with very sensitive eyes.

 

[Zebo]

Wow.. I notice anything less than 100. 85hz is bad enough but 60 is like a strobe light.

 

[nealh]

If we are talking CRT 60hz is in almost all people going to cause more fatigue and eyestrain

LCD this has no meaning of course

75hz ...is fine for most, 85hz should cause very little issue..with one caveat the amount of time in front of a monitor

the longer you are using any monitor without breaks the more fatigue(there is literally ligaments/muscles in the eye that allows are our eyes to accomodate to near/intermediate work..the younger a person has more accommodative power and longer you can do this)

also longer duration leads to drying(lack of blink) which casue discomfort and blurring..so artifical tears will help you if you have to spend all day on a monitor

I would recommend max. the refresh rate for anyone regardless of whether they "feel or see the monitor refresh"

Zebo is correct no physical damage occurs to the eye

FYI: I am a Ophthalmologist

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Wardog2121
because my monitors dont support any higher than 60HZ at those rezs

drop the resolution of your current 1280x1024 @ 60hz down to 10x7 and raise your refresh rate . . . you should be able to get at least 70-75hz.

see for yourself

but you won't go blind . . . i can't change my Win98 display to more than 60 hz

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: nealh
If we are talking CRT 60hz is in almost all people going to cause more fatigue and eyestrain

LCD this has no meaning of course

75hz ...is fine for most, 85hz should cause very little issue..with one caveat the amount of time in front of a monitor

the longer you are using any monitor without breaks the more fatigue(there is literally ligaments/muscles in the eye that allows are our eyes to accomodate to near/intermediate work..the younger a person has more accommodative power and longer you can do this)

also longer duration leads to drying(lack of blink) which casue discomfort and blurring..so artifical tears will help you if you have to spend all day on a monitor

I would recommend max. the refresh rate for anyone regardless of whether they "feel or see the monitor refresh"

Zebo is correct no physical damage occurs to the eye

FYI: I am a Ophthalmologist

Cool.. I gotta a couple questions that's been nagging me perhaps you can answer

a) I notice anything below 100Hz. And I mean 85Hz is bad. Most say, like you just did 75Hz is fine, nope strobe here.

b) Guys often say LCD's are fine for gaming. So I bought the supposedly good ones Dell 2005FP and a Dell 2001FP and it's just horrid Motion Blue (aka "ghosting") so much so I get motion sickness while playing and was forced back onto my MITSU 2070 CRT. I get in constant arguements with LCD fans about how crappy they are with motion blur.. often to the point of not beliveing them. They *must * see it and are just lying!!

c) Often I hear 60FPS is fine -- I notice anything dropping below 75.

Are these 3 related? And what's the deal? Why am I so sensitive and can't enjoy the dell 2005 in all it's "glory"? TIA

 

[Deinonych]

Originally posted by: Zebo
Cool.. I gotta a couple questions that's been nagging me perhaps you can answer

a) I notice anything below 100Hz. And I mean 85Hz is bad. Most say, like you just did 75Hz is fine, nope strobe here.

b) Guys often say LCD's are fine for gaming. So I bought the supposedly good ones Dell 2005FP and a Dell 2001FP and it's just horrid Motion Blue (aka "ghosting") so much so I get motion sickness while playing and was forced back onto my MITSU 2070 CRT. I get in constant arguements with LCD fans about how crappy they are with motion blur.. often to the point of not beliveing them. They *must * see it and are just lying!!

c) Often I hear 60FPS is fine -- I notice anything dropping below 75.

Are these 3 related? And what's the deal? Why am I so sensitive and can't enjoy the dell 2005 in all it's "glory"? TIA

I'm interested in hearing the answers to these questions as well. My experiences with CRT refresh rates and LCD motion blur are exactly like yours.

[edit] I wonder if it has to do with visual acuity? I have 20/20 vision.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Zebo
Wow.. I notice anything less than 100. 85hz is bad enough but 60 is like a strobe light.

Hmmm. I can do 75Hz and up, but 60Hz the screen almost seems to "vibrating".

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: Deinonych

Originally posted by: Zebo
Cool.. I gotta a couple questions that's been nagging me perhaps you can answer

a) I notice anything below 100Hz. And I mean 85Hz is bad. Most say, like you just did 75Hz is fine, nope strobe here.

b) Guys often say LCD's are fine for gaming. So I bought the supposedly good ones Dell 2005FP and a Dell 2001FP and it's just horrid Motion Blue (aka "ghosting") so much so I get motion sickness while playing and was forced back onto my MITSU 2070 CRT. I get in constant arguements with LCD fans about how crappy they are with motion blur.. often to the point of not beliveing them. They *must * see it and are just lying!!

c) Often I hear 60FPS is fine -- I notice anything dropping below 75.

Are these 3 related? And what's the deal? Why am I so sensitive and can't enjoy the dell 2005 in all it's "glory"? TIA

I'm interested in hearing the answers to these questions as well. My experiences with CRT refresh rates and LCD motion blur are exactly like yours.

[edit] I wonder if it has to do with visual acuity? I have 20/20 vision.

I'm about 20/15 here.. could be.

 

[ssvegeta1010]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: Deinonych

Originally posted by: Zebo
-snip-

I'm interested in hearing the answers to these questions as well. My experiences with CRT refresh rates and LCD motion blur are exactly like yours.

[edit] I wonder if it has to do with visual acuity? I have 20/20 vision.

I'm about 20/15 here.. could be.

Very strange... Im ok with 75 Hz, notice almost no ghosting, and can deal with ~25 FPS. i guess its just all what youre used to.

 

[MDE]

60Hz gives me a headache, 75Hz makes me feel kinda funny looking at it, but 85Hz+ is perfect for me.

 

[AznAnarchy99]

75hz is good, still hurts my eyes after a while. LCDs are a godsend

 

[Pete]

Zebo,

Oh, I'm not a doctor. That won't stop me from answering, though.

a) Lotta variables here: signal quality of your video card and monitor cable, room lighting, monitor brightness, screen's phosphor decay. I'm sure your eyes figure in prominently, too, but I'll let Neal field that.

b) Not everyone is as sensitive as you are, so they either don't consciously notice or aren't bothered by the slow pixel response. Again, Neal would likely be better able to answer this than me. I wonder if moving the LCD farther away and increasing ambient light would lessen your nauseau, though.

c) Well, this is typically a separate issue, not directly related to your eyes. You *feel* slower framerates because your inputs (keyboard/mouse) aren't rendered as immediately at lower framerates. Yeah, you can *see* slower framerates, too (Google "fpscmp02" or just look at a fast pan in any movie), but I'm guessing you're referring to *feeling* the game respond more sluggishly.

 

[Insomniak]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: Deinonych

Originally posted by: Zebo
Cool.. I gotta a couple questions that's been nagging me perhaps you can answer

a) I notice anything below 100Hz. And I mean 85Hz is bad. Most say, like you just did 75Hz is fine, nope strobe here.

b) Guys often say LCD's are fine for gaming. So I bought the supposedly good ones Dell 2005FP and a Dell 2001FP and it's just horrid Motion Blue (aka "ghosting") so much so I get motion sickness while playing and was forced back onto my MITSU 2070 CRT. I get in constant arguements with LCD fans about how crappy they are with motion blur.. often to the point of not beliveing them. They *must * see it and are just lying!!

c) Often I hear 60FPS is fine -- I notice anything dropping below 75.

Are these 3 related? And what's the deal? Why am I so sensitive and can't enjoy the dell 2005 in all it's "glory"? TIA

I'm interested in hearing the answers to these questions as well. My experiences with CRT refresh rates and LCD motion blur are exactly like yours.

[edit] I wonder if it has to do with visual acuity? I have 20/20 vision.

I'm about 20/15 here.. could be.

Zebo - I'm the same way. Actually, I can't use CRTs at all for more than 15 minutes or my head starts to throb, no matter the refresh rate. My old CRT did 110Hz and that was still no good. Moving to LCD was absolutely neccesary for me. However, I don't have any trouble with motion blur on LCDs...but then, I am using a smaller panel (Dell 1505FP on one machine, 1704FPT on another.). Maybe that has to do with it. Also, what's the response time on the big widescreen panels? Anything above 16ms will still ghost.

Anyway, my vision is 20/12, so it may very well have to do with visual acuity.

 

[IEC]

Zebo, you're not alone on the refresh rate issue: I couldn't stand anything less than 85Hz, so I ended up buying an LCD (still going strong!) - unlike you however, the slight "tearing" or motion blur you noticed doesn't bother me as long as the FPS > 45. My vision is 20/20 with contacts and I can tell the difference between 75FPS and 60FPS as well... I say, the more FPS, the merrier. FYI, my monitor has a 25ms response time, but unlike some manufacturers, I think Samsung is being conservative on this one...

 

[Chaoticknight16]

i have a 60 hz crt monitor (1150*864), but after reading this thread i decided to try and make it 75 hz. Now i feel like i'm blinking more and something is weird. Is it all in my head? What happens if you push a 60hz monitor to 75 hz?

 

[Pete]

What video card are you using? Could be it doesn't have very good signal quality, so the picture is slightly blurrier at the higher refresh rate. What happens is the video card has to update the picture more often, so if it's using cheaper parts, the updates it sends may not be as sharp.

Could be your monitor, too. Make and model and size? The cheaper ones won't look as good at higher resolutions and refresh rates, though 11x8@75Hz doesn't sound too stressfull for anything 17"+.

 

[VIAN]

Cool.. I gotta a couple questions that's been nagging me perhaps you can answer

a) I notice anything below 100Hz. And I mean 85Hz is bad. Most say, like you just did 75Hz is fine, nope strobe here.

b) Guys often say LCD's are fine for gaming. So I bought the supposedly good ones Dell 2005FP and a Dell 2001FP and it's just horrid Motion Blue (aka "ghosting") so much so I get motion sickness while playing and was forced back onto my MITSU 2070 CRT. I get in constant arguements with LCD fans about how crappy they are with motion blur.. often to the point of not beliveing them. They *must * see it and are just lying!!

c) Often I hear 60FPS is fine -- I notice anything dropping below 75.

Are these 3 related? And what's the deal? Why am I so sensitive and can't enjoy the dell 2005 in all it's "glory"? TIA

a) Sounds like you have fast eyes if 85Hz is bad. Some people say 75Hz, but I can't stand it at all. I need at least 85Hz and then it's diminshing returns after that.

b) Most LCDs *are ok for gaming... at 30fps. Most LCDs claim such and such a response time, but in truth, the fastest LCDs can only show at least 66fps. 66fps is far from the response time they claim to operate at. So with most LCDs, if you are playing at about 30fps, ghosting should be small enough to not be seeable, because it would be too difficult to differeniate it from the blurring caused by low framerates. At higher framerates, say 60 and above, ghosting is more noticeable. Since most LCDs only do 60Hz anyway, 60fps is the maximum you are ever gonna get on an LCD. Ghosting is much more noticeable with 60fps, because now you can actually see the ghosting instead of the frame blur. With the Dell 1704FPT, the ghosting isn't amazingly terrible at high framerates, but I can deal with it for the games I play. Most of the time, I play at about 30fps anyway (due to my turning up the Image quality high enough), so I won't notice.

c)I think the thing is that you are trying to get a perfect image quality. But this just doesn't happend. You have to make trade-offs. I can certainly notice a difference between 85 and 60fps, but I would rather play at 30fps with high resolution and most of the bells and whistles. You have to choose what's right for you.

 

[Chaoticknight16]

i'm using a msi 6600gt, but using an analog connection. the monitor is a NEC multisync FE 700...it's probably a million years old...

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: Pete
Zebo,

Oh, I'm not a doctor. That won't stop me from answering, though.

a) Lotta variables here: signal quality of your video card and monitor cable, room lighting, monitor brightness, screen's phosphor decay. I'm sure your eyes figure in prominently, too, but I'll let Neal field that.

b) Not everyone is as sensitive as you are, so they either don't consciously notice or aren't bothered by the slow pixel response. Again, Neal would likely be better able to answer this than me. I wonder if moving the LCD farther away and increasing ambient light would lessen your nauseau, though.

c) Well, this is typically a separate issue, not directly related to your eyes. You *feel* slower framerates because your inputs (keyboard/mouse) aren't rendered as immediately at lower framerates. Yeah, you can *see* slower framerates, too (Google "fpscmp02" or just look at a fast pan in any movie), but I'm guessing you're referring to *feeling* the game respond more sluggishly.

You're absolutly right on "c" now that I think about it.. a combination of course, where movement is'nt instantanous with input combined with choppiness which is assume both can be felt and seen ~60-70 FPS


Thanks for you input pete

Not everyone is as sensitive as you are

Awww