$600 for a new computer

[asuh]

I have appx. $600 to buy a new computer. All I need is the following:

CPU - 2800+ (too much? should I try to get a 2500+ and OC?)
Motherboard - GA-7NNXP (I like the 8 IDE channels available)
RAM - 1GB Corsair XMS series (wouldn't mind kingston or mushkin but don't know which is good or bad; I would like to hit 200MHz FSB...would PC2700 be okay?)
CPU fan - Smart Fan II (stick with a reliable brand)
Thermal Grease- Arctic Silver 5?

I currently am running a 1600+, KX7-333R, 512MB PC2700, Smart Fan II, Arctic Silver II. I should add that the reason I'm getting a brand new computer is because my dad is getting the older system as his current one sucks.

I am into some multimedia web design, not too heavy with gaming, but like graphic intensive programs like Photoshop and such.

An article that I'm trying to consider is this one.. Using the above info, what should I get??

 

[Sheriff]

CPU - 2800+ (too much? should I try to get a 2500+ and OC?)

I would with the 2500

Motherboard - GA-7NNXP (I like the 4 IDE channels available)

most every new Rev Nforce chipset will hit 200FSB, even the Shuttle @ $70

FSB...would PC2700 be okay?)

Most yes, Samsungs CB0's 2100 DDR hits 200
and any reliable HS/Fan with any good Grease will/should work
Edited because no one answered

 

[Sid59]

- get the 2500+
- all mobos have 4 ide channels
- get PC3200

i would wouldn't upgrade yet .. save more and get a A64

 

[asuh]

Originally posted by: Sid59
- get the 2500+
- all mobos have 4 ide channels
- get PC3200

i would wouldn't upgrade yet .. save more and get a A64

Oops, I meant 8 IDE channels. I like to use the four ports that are on the board.
Why the 2500+ and not the 2800+?

 

[Bovinicus]

I suggest that you purchase the following; all prices are from NewEgg:

CPU: Athlon XP 2400+ 266FSB ($75)
Motherboard: Don't upgrade
Memory: Crucial 512MB PC2700 ($71)
Heatsink/Fan: Thermaltake Silent Boost ($27)
Thermal Paste: Arctic Silver 5 ($7)

Total: $180 + Shipping

The CPU is the fastest one that your motherboard can support and is widely available.

I don't think it is worth it to get a new motherboard. That additional $100 or so isn't worth the performance increase. If there was more life left in the Socket A platform, then I might think otherwise.

You still get your 1GB of memory, you just don't have to get rid of the existing memroy that you already investedin.

The heatsink/fan is quiet, but cools very well at the same time. I used the Opteron version in my friend's latest system. I was very impressed. Oh yeah, and the clip is the best design I have seen to date.

If you absolutely must upgrade, then I would suggest going with an Athlon64 3000+, Asus K8V or other K8T800 based motherboard, and any PC3200 memory from a respected manufacturer (Kingston, Crucial, Corsair, Mushkin, etc.)

 

[Duvie]

With what you suggested you should be looking at an intel p4c anways....This is the area it leads and has far more programs optimised for it....

P4 2.6c HT retail (oc maybe get 3.2ghz+ with stock fan) faster then a barton 2500+ or an xp 2800+ = 175.00
Abit IC7 = 120.00
2 x 512mb of pc3200 to pc3500 that can run cas 2.....It is likely you could oc to levels of 3.2ghz or 250fsb so unless you want to buy PC4000 stuff with only cas 2.5 rating you are likely going to be runnig 5:4 ratio anyways so you really only need some ram that will run 400ddr cas 2....Trust me 1:1 and banwidth but with worse cas timings will be trumped by a 5:4 system running cas 2 tigh timings....175-225 can accomplish this

You can use stock fans likely up to 3 - 3.2ghz.....

You could use the 100 left to put towards a nice raptor HDD


If you were a gamer I would say amd all the way.....

If you don't plan on ocing I still wouldn't suggest the athlon 3000+ cause I think a 3.0 p4c is faster then it in a majority of multimedia apps...You could oc it but if you were going to oc I think the p4 can go potentially higher then the best the 3000+ can do.....


Photoshop has optimizations for the p4 including I belive HT optimizations....Most adobe software is well optimized for p4's

 

[asuh]

Yeah, I understand that 64bit technology is here but no apps support it. And it's way too expensive to lay down just $600 especially if I want 1GB of RAM. But thanks for the suggestion, Bov.

I hadn't really thought about the Pentium. I have been with the dark side since 2001 when I upgraded to a 950 from a PII 400. Anywho, I don't even know the first thing about OCing a pentium chip, but I guess it couldn't be too difficult?

Does the P4 2.6GB really OC better than the 2500+ or even the 2800+?

Also, is it really worth the extra money to lay down for a SerialATA? Do they really make that much of a difference? I am running with 3 120GB HDs right now and wouldn't wanna get anything smaller than like 80 or so because of all the storage space I need from my digital pics and such.

Also, I found 1GB of Corsair XMS PC4000 for $300. Worth the buy?

 

[Duvie]

Trust me I had a barton 2500+ that oc'd to 3200+ but it did not equal up to my 2.6c@3.2 or my 2.4@3.2.....I could oc the barton up to about 2.3ghz but it was a locked chip as most are now and boards can get flaky not too far past 200fsb....

The 2800+ Barton likely clocks to same range but with the higher multiplier you likely will not hit 200fsb so bandwidth will less less....A xp 2800+ also likely will not clock to 200fsb and ofcourse there you have the smaller l2 cache....

I think a p4 wouln't likely need to be much better then 2.8-3.0ghz to beat a barton 3200+ in majority of multimedia apps...It is well known the barton line was a shame to its pr rating late in the game.....

Look around many have gotten their p4's to 3ghz plus upwards to 3.5ghz like mine....

I say go with the stock HSF for now...If the chip is a real champ you may want to lay down 30 more bucks and get a nice aftermarket cooler like the zalman 7000a Al-CU....


Serial ATA is not all the great if we are talking about 7200rpm drives....really just the same bloated marketing BS the ata100 andf ata133 were...just now they would call it ata150....On the other hand the raptor is SATA with a 10000rpm speed...that translate in faster seek times and I defintely feel it in loading up, window installs, defragg harddrives, transferring of files, etc.....Excellent main drive with a goo 40 to 120gb drive as a storage drive...

 

[Bovinicus]

Duvie is right about the P4 being better in your situation. For some reason I misread your statement about gaming to mean that you game frequently. I'm just used to helping people design gaming rigs. I apologize.

 

[daddyo]

I might get flamed for saying this, but have you looked at the Dell Poweredge 400SC servers?

For $500, you can get:

P4-2.8ghz, 800mhz FSB ($400 if you take a 2.6Ghz/800FSB chip)
40gb HD
128mb RAM
CD-ROM
KB/Mouse

This system comes with integrated video, but it has an AGP slot as well. You also get the advantage of a completely silent dell case. All you have to do is add RAM and install an OS, and you are all set.

 

[Bovinicus]

Originally posted by: daddy-o
I might get flamed for saying this, but have you looked at the Dell Poweredge 400SC servers?

For $500, you can get:

P4-2.8ghz, 800mhz FSB ($400 if you take a 2.6Ghz/800FSB chip)
40gb HD
128mb RAM
CD-ROM
KB/Mouse

This system comes with integrated video, but it has an AGP slot as well. You also get the advantage of a completely silent dell case. All you have to do is add RAM and install an OS, and you are all set.

I actually think that is a very reasonable idea. Just go onto the website of an online retailer and make sure you can't configure the same system, plus memory, for the same amount of money or less.

The only problem I see with that system is the low storage space. I have a feeling that asuh might want more storage space than 40GB. However, if that is sufficient for him, then I see that as a pretty good deal. Just don't use Dell's crappy install disk with a bunch of bloatware. Install the OS and applications yourself.

The other thing that I would be weary of is the included power supply. Make sure it isn't a puny generic turd. I can't stand OEMs that include cheapo power supplies in their systems. Dell is one of the better system builders, so the chance is lower relative to other OEMs.

 

[asuh]

The more I think about it, the more likely I will be to buy a 2500+ and will OC to get better timings and save money (AMD is a little cheaper than Intel and works pretty much the same in the long run; I might also game a little more...). However, I'm still trying to decide about buying the RAM.

I have been recommended PC3200 which is fine. However, i've seen some nice Corsair PC4000 for $300. Is that worth the buy? And, I'm trying to consider about the fact that it might be useful for my next upgrade to a 64bit CPU. Or should I not even bother? It seems the current DDR will be phased out for the new DDR-II. So that makes me think, hell, I should just buy a nice generic brand of Corsair, not XMS, which will still give me a good OC. Or I could go with Kingston or Mushkin.

Suggestions?

 

[Bovinicus]

Originally posted by: asuh
The more I think about it, the more likely I will be to buy a 2500+ and will OC to get better timings and save money (AMD is a little cheaper than Intel and works pretty much the same in the long run; I might also game a little more...). However, I'm still trying to decide about buying the RAM.

I have been recommended PC3200 which is fine. However, i've seen some nice Corsair PC4000 for $300. Is that worth the buy? And, I'm trying to consider about the fact that it might be useful for my next upgrade to a 64bit CPU. Or should I not even bother? It seems the current DDR will be phased out for the new DDR-II. So that makes me think, hell, I should just buy a nice generic brand of Corsair, not XMS, which will still give me a good OC. Or I could go with Kingston or Mushkin.

Suggestions?

If you plan on purchasing a 2500+ and overclocking it, then you really only need some decent PC3200 memory. Why? Because the stock FSB that the 2500+ Barton runs on is 333MHz. So, PC3200 memory will already get you to 2.2GHz (11x200MHz); this is the equivalent of an Athlon XP 3200+. If you upgrade again, then you can continue to use that PC3200 memory with an Athlon 64 or Prescott. If anything, just buy some PC3200 memory that can handle aggressive timings.

 

[Markfw]

OK, if I read this correctly, you have a budget, but are not set on any one thing. For $600, you can get an Athlon64 3000+, motherboard(ASUS K8V),1 gig of memory, and an aftermarket HSF. Why go with a 2500 when you can have one that will blow its doors off ?

 

[asuh]

bovinicus - yeah, that's what I was thinking about the PC3200. I assume any stick of the main brands of memory, Corsair, Kingston and Mushkin, will handle aggressive timings?

Markfw900 - That does sound very tempting. However, I think it would make more sense to wait to upgrade to the 64bit when the boards have changed over to the new standards for PCI slots and also wait for the BTX to settle in. Although most of this won't really matter until mid-2005, I'd be happy saving a little now to buy a more mature 64bit platform. What's your thoughts?

 

[Markfw]

Wel, its up to you. You never know what the future holds, but when I saw the 3000+ at just over $200, I knew after years of looking at this stuff, I wouldn;t be sorry, and I am not. The only thing that will get better in the near future is the OC options, and mine does good enough. The new slots will create a whole new bunch of problems, so decide now, or wait untill ?? There is never a perfect time, but now is one of the better times I have seen. (I may eat my words in a month, but ?????)

 

[asuh]

lol. thanks mark.

 

[Bovinicus]

Originally posted by: asuh
bovinicus - yeah, that's what I was thinking about the PC3200. I assume any stick of the main brands of memory, Corsair, Kingston and Mushkin, will handle aggressive timings?

Markfw900 - That does sound very tempting. However, I think it would make more sense to wait to upgrade to the 64bit when the boards have changed over to the new standards for PCI slots and also wait for the BTX to settle in. Although most of this won't really matter until mid-2005, I'd be happy saving a little now to buy a more mature 64bit platform. What's your thoughts?

No, not all name brand memory will handle agressive timings. However, name brand memory is more likely to handle aggressive timings when it is not specified to do so from the factory. I wouldn't worry about aggressive timings. Unless you can get a really good deal, the slight increases in performance are not worth the added cost.

It's not even the PCI Express and BTX standards that you want to wait for, it's the Socket 939 and 775 platforms. These two platforms should have a lot more upgrading headroom than Socket A, Socket 478, or Socket 754 processors. Granted, there is no way to know for sure that these sockets will support a wider range of clockspeeds. Although, in AMD's case, I have read interviews that signify the longer life of Socket 939.

Originally posted by: Markfw900Wel, its up to you. You never know what the future holds, but when I saw the 3000+ at just over $200, I knew after years of looking at this stuff, I wouldn;t be sorry, and I am not. The only thing that will get better in the near future is the OC options, and mine does good enough. The new slots will create a whole new bunch of problems, so decide now, or wait untill ?? There is never a perfect time, but now is one of the better times I have seen. (I may eat my words in a month, but ?????)

In addition to better OC options, there is also the more upgradeable Socket 939 platform that I already mentioned. There will also be other unknown features that chipset and motherboard manfuacturers will include with their system boards. For example, high speed hyper transport buses. I don't think now is one of th ebetter times to purchase a board at all. I think my EPoX 8KHA+ was purhcased at the right time. I have a 1GHz@1.13GHz CPU in it right now, and I can upgrade to a 2GHz Athlon XP 2400+ without changing any other hardware.

Also, what problems are you talking about the these slots are going to create? If anything, I think PCI Express is going to fix many problems associated with the current add-in bus system.'

 

[dnuggett]

Originally posted by: Bovinicus

Originally posted by: asuh
The more I think about it, the more likely I will be to buy a 2500+ and will OC to get better timings and save money (AMD is a little cheaper than Intel and works pretty much the same in the long run; I might also game a little more...). However, I'm still trying to decide about buying the RAM.

I have been recommended PC3200 which is fine. However, i've seen some nice Corsair PC4000 for $300. Is that worth the buy? And, I'm trying to consider about the fact that it might be useful for my next upgrade to a 64bit CPU. Or should I not even bother? It seems the current DDR will be phased out for the new DDR-II. So that makes me think, hell, I should just buy a nice generic brand of Corsair, not XMS, which will still give me a good OC. Or I could go with Kingston or Mushkin.

Suggestions?

If you plan on purchasing a 2500+ and overclocking it, then you really only need some decent PC3200 memory. Why? Because the stock FSB that the 2500+ Barton runs on is 333MHz. So, PC3200 memory will already get you to 2.2GHz (11x200MHz); this is the equivalent of an Athlon XP 3200+. If you upgrade again, then you can continue to use that PC3200 memory with an Athlon 64 or Prescott. If anything, just buy some PC3200 memory that can handle aggressive timings.

I like the suggestion up to a point. That point is PC3200 RAM. I would go 3500. You will have a little more headroom if you want to OC, and avoid the difficulties some users have had with the 64 and PC3200 RAM if you decide to upgrade.

 

[asuh]

Okay, so let's assume that I go with the PC3200 VS Corsair. Here's what I'm thinking.

I mainly use the computer to photoshop a lot and occassionally record/edit some music files with audio editors. This requires a lot of memory so I'm looking for a gig of memory. A question I should also ask is would OCing the FSB to 400MHz really affect and help my audio/photo editing? Truthfully, I'd be OCing the FSB to 400MHz just because that's what the memory and motherboard can handle. I would get a 3000+ and not really have to OC because everything would be compatible except I don't think that chip is worth the extra $120 if I can just OC a 2500+. I understand how 1GB would be much better than 512MB of RAM, but would a FSB of 400MHz be so much more beneficial than 333MHz for what I currently do?

 

[Markfw]

Originally posted by: asuh
Okay, so let's assume that I go with the PC3200 VS Corsair. Here's what I'm thinking.

I mainly use the computer to photoshop a lot and occassionally record/edit some music files with audio editors. This requires a lot of memory so I'm looking for a gig of memory. A question I should also ask is would OCing the FSB to 400MHz really affect and help my audio/photo editing? Truthfully, I'd be OCing the FSB to 400MHz just because that's what the memory and motherboard can handle. I would get a 3000+ and not really have to OC because everything would be compatible except I don't think that chip is worth the extra $120 if I can just OC a 2500+. I understand how 1GB would be much better than 512MB of RAM, but would a FSB of 400MHz be so much more beneficial than 333MHz for what I currently do?

Which way are you going ? 3000+ or Barton ? There is no FSB on the 3000+, and yes, 3200 would be fine for the Barton setup.

 

[asuh]

I thought I made it clear ... "I would get a 3000+ . . . except I don't think it's worth the extra $120..." So I'll probably just get 2500+ and OC it.

I'm just trying to figure out if the better memory is better suited for my needs or if the general corsair, mushkin, kingston would work just as well and help me save money.

 

[Bovinicus]

Originally posted by: asuh
Okay, so let's assume that I go with the PC3200 VS Corsair. Here's what I'm thinking.

I mainly use the computer to photoshop a lot and occassionally record/edit some music files with audio editors. This requires a lot of memory so I'm looking for a gig of memory. A question I should also ask is would OCing the FSB to 400MHz really affect and help my audio/photo editing? Truthfully, I'd be OCing the FSB to 400MHz just because that's what the memory and motherboard can handle. I would get a 3000+ and not really have to OC because everything would be compatible except I don't think that chip is worth the extra $120 if I can just OC a 2500+. I understand how 1GB would be much better than 512MB of RAM, but would a FSB of 400MHz be so much more beneficial than 333MHz for what I currently do?

You must remember that you are not guaranteed, in any way, to reach an overclock of 2.2GHz with the 2500+. Many people have had good success overclocking this chip, but the ability to overclock well always has something to do with luck.

Another item to consider is the fact that the Athlon 64 does perform much better than the Athlon XP when it comes to content creation. So, the 3000+ Athlon 64 will probably perform better than the 3200+ Athlon XP in audio/photo editing programs.

 

[Markfw]

yes I agree with the above. And BTW, I got a Barton 2600+ for one of my other boxes, and could only get 2.1 ghz OC on PC3200 CAS2 memory. 192x11

 

[FreshPrince]

This is what I'm looking to get myself...

P4, 2.4C $164
WD 36GB Raptor $119
Geil 1GB PC3200 $133.50 (refurb, same as new IMO)
Asus P4P800 $107.99
GeXcube Radeon 9600XT $159

without the vid card, it'll come out to be $524.49, which is way under your budget.

Good luck with the new PC.

-FP