5900Ultra HL2 and CS:S Goodness

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N

Netopia

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
4,793
4
81
Hey Gang,

I apologize for this being a 50% video card 50% software post.

As some might or might not know, HL2, nVidia 5x00 series cards and DirectX 9 do NOT get along. In fact, the 5x00 series perform SO badly that Valve makes the software automatically switch to DX8 mode if you have a 5x00 series card. I once manual enabled DX9 from the command line and it was much prettier, but so slow it was totally unplayable. I have a FX5900Ultra, so this has always bummed me out a little.

Last night I was playing some CS:S and noticed some things that I'd not seen before, like the fact that it's raining on Aztec! The game seemed the normal speed, but there were definitely a LOT of added details and smoothness. Just out of curiosity, I checked the display settings in the game, and both hardware and software were set to DX9! I contacted a friend who has a FX5700 and he too saw much more detail with no slowdown in the game.

Does anyone know if Valve has somehow fixed the problem and perhaps patched through a Steam update? I've done some googling, but so far have found nothing.

Anyone else with nVidia 5x00 series cards want to check this out and find what their results are?

Joe
 
Ika

Ika

Lifer
Mar 22, 2006
14,264
3
81
sounds interesting. did you check Steam's update news for the game?

aw, this means i gotta download another update...
 
N

Netopia

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
4,793
4
81
I've done more googling and come up with nothing.

Wish I could find a complete change log for every steam update!

Joe
 
nitromullet

nitromullet

Diamond Member
Jan 7, 2004
9,031
36
91
I wonder if maybe Valve did some work for NVIDIA to make the Source Engine run DX9 better on the FX series (and probably all NVIDIA cards). When HL2 was first launched ATI was the launch partner, but when HL2 EP1 launched it was getting pimped on NVIDIA's web site. Maybe some cash exchanged hands and performance improved.

Another theory is that EP1 was really only meant to run DX9, and Valve realized that their game ran poorly on cards in use by many of their customers. Maybe they did some optimization so they could sell their episodic content.

http://www.steampowered.com/status/survey.html

If you look at the survey you will see that a lot of Steam users are running FX and 6-series NVIDIA gpu's.

Cool for you either way. Source looks better on DX9 than DX8
 
N

Netopia

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
4,793
4
81
Since it says both hardware and software DX9, how would one go about finding out if it were actually OpenGL?

Joe
 
sandorski

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,720
6,278
126
Originally posted by: Netopia
Since it says both hardware and software DX9, how would one go about finding out if it were actually OpenGL?

Joe
Click to expand...

I'd think they just optomized it for those cards using the special coding paths Nvidia tried to get everyone to use back then.
 
X

xtreme26

Member
Jan 28, 2006
140
0
0
this sucks, i just checked and it says software level directx9, hardware level directx 8. although i do have a fx5200
 
T

TheRyuu

Diamond Member
Dec 3, 2005
5,479
14
81
Ok???

Hurray for you!? Get the Xtreme-G 91.31's (if you don't already have them). Easily the best drivers out there right now.
 
ElFenix

ElFenix

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
102,398
8,566
126
Originally posted by: nitromullet
I wonder if maybe Valve did some work for NVIDIA to make the Source Engine run DX9 better on the FX series (and probably all NVIDIA cards). When HL2 was first launched ATI was the launch partner, but when HL2 EP1 launched it was getting pimped on NVIDIA's web site. Maybe some cash exchanged hands and performance improved.

Another theory is that EP1 was really only meant to run DX9, and Valve realized that their game ran poorly on cards in use by many of their customers. Maybe they did some optimization so they could sell their episodic content.

http://www.steampowered.com/status/survey.html

If you look at the survey you will see that a lot of Steam users are running FX and 6-series NVIDIA gpu's.

Cool for you either way. Source looks better on DX9 than DX8
Click to expand...

less than 1% of people have a multi gpu solution... interesting
 
G

Gstanfor

Banned
Oct 19, 1999
3,307
0
0
Originally posted by: Netopia
Hey Gang,

I apologize for this being a 50% video card 50% software post.

As some might or might not know, HL2, nVidia 5x00 series cards and DirectX 9 do NOT get along. In fact, the 5x00 series perform SO badly that Valve makes the software automatically switch to DX8 mode if you have a 5x00 series card. I once manual enabled DX9 from the command line and it was much prettier, but so slow it was totally unplayable. I have a FX5900Ultra, so this has always bummed me out a little.

Last night I was playing some CS:S and noticed some things that I'd not seen before, like the fact that it's raining on Aztec! The game seemed the normal speed, but there were definitely a LOT of added details and smoothness. Just out of curiosity, I checked the display settings in the game, and both hardware and software were set to DX9! I contacted a friend who has a FX5700 and he too saw much more detail with no slowdown in the game.

Does anyone know if Valve has somehow fixed the problem and perhaps patched through a Steam update? I've done some googling, but so far have found nothing.

Anyone else with nVidia 5x00 series cards want to check this out and find what their results are?

Joe
Click to expand...

The FX5900 series have always performed well in HL2 DX9 mode, ever since the game was first released, despite lard-arse Newell's and the fanatics protests to the contrary. Of course Newell had 5 million ATi provided "reasons" to make it appear as though the FX series had a DX9 problem...

There is absolutely nothing preventing the FX series from running DX9 mode other than changing two lines in dxsupport.cfg (a HL2 game file). For instance in the case of your card you would change this bit from

"name" "NVidia GeForce FX 5900 Ultra"
"VendorID" "0x10DE"
"MinDeviceID" "0x0330"
"MaxDeviceID" "0x0330"
"m_nDriverVersion_Build" "6177"
"DefaultRes" "1024"
"MaxDxLevel" "81"
"DxLevel" "81"
"NoUserClipPlanes" "1"
"ConVar.r_fastzreject" "1"
Click to expand...

to

"name" "NVidia GeForce FX 5900 Ultra"
"VendorID" "0x10DE"
"MinDeviceID" "0x0330"
"MaxDeviceID" "0x0330"
"m_nDriverVersion_Build" "6177"
"DefaultRes" "1024"
"MaxDxLevel" "90"
"DxLevel" "90"
"NoUserClipPlanes" "1"
"ConVar.r_fastzreject" "1"
Click to expand...

And enjoy the Dx9 mode that your FX card supposedly cannot handle...
 
I

Ichigo

Platinum Member
Sep 1, 2005
2,158
0
0
Originally posted by: xtreme26
this sucks, i just checked and it says software level directx9, hardware level directx 8. although i do have a fx5200
Click to expand...

The Fx5200 sucks. Simple as that. You can not expect it to compare performance-wise with a 5700 or 5900.

Also, gstanfor, you have reading comprehension issues. The OP commented that he DID at one point run DX9 but that the performance was terrible. Nothing prevented DX9 in the past but performance. Simple as that.
 
G

Gstanfor

Banned
Oct 19, 1999
3,307
0
0
You could not get the FX series to run in dx9 mode unless you did what I described above or used a little fan made patch that did the same thing for you.

I don't think it's possible to enable the needed changes through the console (though I may possibly be wrong).

As to playability I played the game all the way through in DX9 mode on a 5900XT (a fair bit less power than his 5900 U) and performance was quite acceptable at 1152x864.
 
N

Netopia

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
4,793
4
81
Originally posted by: Gstanfor

The FX5900 series have always performed well in HL2 DX9 mode, ever since the game was first released, despite lard-arse Newell's and the fanatics protests to the contrary. Of course Newell had 5 million ATi provided "reasons" to make it appear as though the FX series had a DX9 problem...

There is absolutely nothing preventing the FX series from running DX9 mode other than changing two lines in dxsupport.cfg (a HL2 game file). For instance in the case of your card you would change this bit from

"name" "NVidia GeForce FX 5900 Ultra"
"VendorID" "0x10DE"
"MinDeviceID" "0x0330"
"MaxDeviceID" "0x0330"
"m_nDriverVersion_Build" "6177"
"DefaultRes" "1024"
"MaxDxLevel" "81"
"DxLevel" "81"
"NoUserClipPlanes" "1"
"ConVar.r_fastzreject" "1"
Click to expand...

to

"name" "NVidia GeForce FX 5900 Ultra"
"VendorID" "0x10DE"
"MinDeviceID" "0x0330"
"MaxDeviceID" "0x0330"
"m_nDriverVersion_Build" "6177"
"DefaultRes" "1024"
"MaxDxLevel" "90"
"DxLevel" "90"
"NoUserClipPlanes" "1"
"ConVar.r_fastzreject" "1"
Click to expand...

And enjoy the Dx9 mode that your FX card supposedly cannot handle...
Click to expand...

I've previously forced DX9 mode (using what you posted PLUS "-dxlevel 90" in the launch options) and the performance SUCKED... BADLY. That's why I'm so surprized about this. I can attest that my 5900Ultra DID NOT do well with CS:S and DX9, so it's not just a rumor. I too have it at 1152 X ... but I pretty much max everything else out except for AA with I have at 2x

Joe
 
G

Gstanfor

Banned
Oct 19, 1999
3,307
0
0
Define unplayable. When I played HL2 on my old 5900XT I had an XP2400+, 1gig memory & the FX as the core of my system. I completed the game easily with that, at 1152x864, 2 x AA, 4 x AF. Drivers would have been late 60 series, early 61 series IIRC. I had a brief muck around on the 6800GT, but never played the game through again (boring game, didn't bother reinstalling it this time around). I don't play CS:S.
 
S

Shadowmage

Golden Member
Aug 26, 2004
1,162
0
76
You do realize that I could do exactly the same thing (except at 1280x800 res) on a Radeon 9600 Mobility 128MB, right?

As in, even if it could play with DX9 (as in even if what you said was true), performance was about equal to a mid-low-range ATI graphics card.
 
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