$50 billion of bailout going to employee bonuses

Ozoned

Diamond Member
Mar 22, 2004
5,578
0
0
WTF????? Who voted for this?????

Link

$50 billion of bailout going to employee bonuses
Posted Oct 31 2008, 07:30 AM by Andrew Horowitz Rating: Filed under: Merrill Lynch, Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs, banking, Andrew Horowitz
As if the economic bailout by U.S. taxpayers isn't enough to make you sick to your stomach, new information has come to light that several banks are planning to pay billions of dollars in year-end bonuses from the bailout funds they received. Investigations are beginning into the nine banks that took in the first $125 billion -- the same $125 billion that was supposed to be used to unclog the credit system which was preventing banks from providing much needed funds for individuals and businesses.

There are many feathers in a ruffle over this and New York Attorney General Andrew Cuomo and several congressmen are furious that over $20 billion has already been earmarked as bonus funds for management and employees. Unbelievably, that is just the estimates from Goldman Sachs, Morgan Stanley and Merrill Lynch. There are six more banks that are also working on similar heists.

Here is their rationale for using that money: It is reported that the financial industry pays base salaries in the range of $80,000 to $600,000 and apparently that is simply not enough to keep some of the best and brightest working to keep their companies profitable. It seems that if they were paid only this meager amount, the company would risk mass defections. That would be a real problem...or would it?

Maybe it is time to peg annual bonuses to something meaningful like profitability. As I recall, not only are these the firms that have been losing money (as is evident by the need for a massive multi-billion dollar bailout) but they have also been shown to be the creators of securitization, derivatives, sub-prime mortgages and other toxic credit that is the root cause of this historic global economic catastrophe!

Maybe I am being too harsh? Perhaps management is entitled to hundreds of millions in bonuses for the hard work they do, day in and day out. You have to feel sorry for them as most have had to give up their private jets and instead fly in a cramped seat in first class. Surely most will now have to wonder how they will deal with the excess workload as they have had to fire thousands of employees. Also, they will need to use a good chunk of that money to rebuild their retirement plans as much of their wealth was tied up in their company's stock which, under their leadership, could be down more than 60% just this year alone.

 

nageov3t

Lifer
Feb 18, 2004
42,808
83
91
what's the average size of the bonus and are the bonuses contractually obligated or anything?
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,705
6,261
126
Like I said in another thread(one discussing using the Funds to purchase competitors): It must be more awesome than usual to be a Banker/Financier right now! Just imagine it, you can royally fuck up, nearly destroying everything around you, and someone comes along to shower Money down upon you!!

It's kinda like the story of Dubyah's Life.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,705
6,261
126
Originally posted by: loki8481
what's the average size of the bonus and are the bonuses contractually obligated or anything?

I heard that it's over $100k.
 

mugs

Lifer
Apr 29, 2003
48,920
46
91
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: loki8481
what's the average size of the bonus and are the bonuses contractually obligated or anything?

I heard that it's over $100k.

$50 billion / $100k = 500,000 employees earning an average bonus of $100k. That $50 billion number smells fishy.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,705
6,261
126
Originally posted by: mugs
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: loki8481
what's the average size of the bonus and are the bonuses contractually obligated or anything?

I heard that it's over $100k.

$50 billion / $100k = 500,000 employees earning an average bonus of $100k. That $50 billion number smells fishy.

Only part of the $50billion would go towards the Bonusses.
 

jackace

Golden Member
Oct 6, 2004
1,307
0
0
This is why I think their are some fundamental problems in the banking and financial industries. Every industry I have worked in bonuses are contingent on your personal performance AND the company performance. If the company does not meet expectations, sorry no bonus for you. These guys are getting bonuses even when the companies they are running are bankrupt and bringing down the entire economy without government bail-outs.

The source I saw did an average and found that Goldman Sachs' bonus was ~$415,000 per employee. That includes EVEY employee they have including secretaries, mail guys, entry level guys, etc. These guys just live and work in a totally different "capitalism" than the rest of us.
 

frostedflakes

Diamond Member
Mar 1, 2005
7,925
1
81
I don't buy it. Mass defections to where? The whole financial industry is hurting, are these employees really going to find a better job than what they already have?
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: frostedflakes
I don't buy it. Mass defections to where? The whole financial industry is hurting, are these employees really going to find a better job than what they already have?

It's a scam

How do I sign up? I haven't gotten a bonus or vacation since July 1992.
 

Thump553

Lifer
Jun 2, 2000
12,837
2,622
136
Take a look at the headline article in today's Wall Street Journal on this subject. I couldn't read it-my eyes kept clouding over with anger. It talked about possibly using the bailout money to meet the banks' legal obligations to executives, that in some cases the money owed the big wigs exceeded the amount of the bank's enitre pension system, etc.

Mr. Paulson better make darn sure that this program isn't looted during his last few months in office. I pray GWB takes some time off from his accumulated vacation time to ride close herd over Paulson and make it clear this money is not to be frittered away in this manner.
 

chess9

Elite member
Apr 15, 2000
7,748
0
0
Originally posted by: Ozoned
WTF????? Who voted for this?????

Link

$50 billion of bailout going to employee bonuses
Posted Oct 31 2008, 07:30 AM by Andrew Horowitz Rating: Filed under: Merrill Lynch, Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs, banking, Andrew Horowitz
As if the economic bailout by U.S. taxpayers isn't enough to make you sick to your stomach, new information has come to light that several banks are planning to pay billions of dollars in year-end bonuses from the bailout funds they received. Investigations are beginning into the nine banks that took in the first $125 billion -- the same $125 billion that was supposed to be used to unclog the credit system which was preventing banks from providing much needed funds for individuals and businesses.

There are many feathers in a ruffle over this and New York Attorney General Andrew Cuomo and several congressmen are furious that over $20 billion has already been earmarked as bonus funds for management and employees. Unbelievably, that is just the estimates from Goldman Sachs, Morgan Stanley and Merrill Lynch. There are six more banks that are also working on similar heists.

Here is their rationale for using that money: It is reported that the financial industry pays base salaries in the range of $80,000 to $600,000 and apparently that is simply not enough to keep some of the best and brightest working to keep their companies profitable. It seems that if they were paid only this meager amount, the company would risk mass defections. That would be a real problem...or would it?

Maybe it is time to peg annual bonuses to something meaningful like profitability. As I recall, not only are these the firms that have been losing money (as is evident by the need for a massive multi-billion dollar bailout) but they have also been shown to be the creators of securitization, derivatives, sub-prime mortgages and other toxic credit that is the root cause of this historic global economic catastrophe!

Maybe I am being too harsh? Perhaps management is entitled to hundreds of millions in bonuses for the hard work they do, day in and day out. You have to feel sorry for them as most have had to give up their private jets and instead fly in a cramped seat in first class. Surely most will now have to wonder how they will deal with the excess workload as they have had to fire thousands of employees. Also, they will need to use a good chunk of that money to rebuild their retirement plans as much of their wealth was tied up in their company's stock which, under their leadership, could be down more than 60% just this year alone.

I've mentioned this in several other threads as a real possibility (along with the high administrative costs of the bailout) but few people thought it was a serious issue, and several dismissed this with a "So what? attitude.

If you read the bailout bill there is nothing in there to prevent these bonuses being paid, and Paulson would be the last person in the world to complain about sky high bonuses, as he's earned millions in bonuses when at Goldman Sachs. This is yet another reason why this bailout was a truly stupid idea.

Write your congressman and complain, but your complaints will fall on deaf ears as our Congress is full of stupid people who have been bought by Wall Street. Barney Frank is a major embarrassment. He shouldn't be in charge of his own checking account.....(On most other issues I like Frank, but this ain't one of them.)

-Robert
 

Ozoned

Diamond Member
Mar 22, 2004
5,578
0
0
Originally posted by: chess9
Originally posted by: Ozoned
WTF????? Who voted for this?????

Link

$50 billion of bailout going to employee bonuses
Posted Oct 31 2008, 07:30 AM by Andrew Horowitz Rating: Filed under: Merrill Lynch, Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs, banking, Andrew Horowitz
As if the economic bailout by U.S. taxpayers isn't enough to make you sick to your stomach, new information has come to light that several banks are planning to pay billions of dollars in year-end bonuses from the bailout funds they received. Investigations are beginning into the nine banks that took in the first $125 billion -- the same $125 billion that was supposed to be used to unclog the credit system which was preventing banks from providing much needed funds for individuals and businesses.

There are many feathers in a ruffle over this and New York Attorney General Andrew Cuomo and several congressmen are furious that over $20 billion has already been earmarked as bonus funds for management and employees. Unbelievably, that is just the estimates from Goldman Sachs, Morgan Stanley and Merrill Lynch. There are six more banks that are also working on similar heists.

Here is their rationale for using that money: It is reported that the financial industry pays base salaries in the range of $80,000 to $600,000 and apparently that is simply not enough to keep some of the best and brightest working to keep their companies profitable. It seems that if they were paid only this meager amount, the company would risk mass defections. That would be a real problem...or would it?

Maybe it is time to peg annual bonuses to something meaningful like profitability. As I recall, not only are these the firms that have been losing money (as is evident by the need for a massive multi-billion dollar bailout) but they have also been shown to be the creators of securitization, derivatives, sub-prime mortgages and other toxic credit that is the root cause of this historic global economic catastrophe!

Maybe I am being too harsh? Perhaps management is entitled to hundreds of millions in bonuses for the hard work they do, day in and day out. You have to feel sorry for them as most have had to give up their private jets and instead fly in a cramped seat in first class. Surely most will now have to wonder how they will deal with the excess workload as they have had to fire thousands of employees. Also, they will need to use a good chunk of that money to rebuild their retirement plans as much of their wealth was tied up in their company's stock which, under their leadership, could be down more than 60% just this year alone.

I've mentioned this in several other threads as a real possibility (along with the high administrative costs of the bailout) but few people thought it was a serious issue, and several dismissed this with a "So what? attitude.

If you read the bailout bill there is nothing in there to prevent these bonuses being paid, and Paulson would be the last person in the world to complain about sky high bonuses, as he's earned millions in bonuses when at Goldman Sachs. This is yet another reason why this bailout was a truly stupid idea.

Write your congressman and complain, but your complaints will fall on deaf ears as our Congress is full of stupid people who have been bought by Wall Street. Barney Frank is a major embarrassment. He shouldn't be in charge of his own checking account.....(On most other issues I like Frank, but this ain't one of them.)

-Robert
I favor a progressive tax system. ;)
 

chess9

Elite member
Apr 15, 2000
7,748
0
0
Originally posted by: Ozoned
Originally posted by: chess9
Originally posted by: Ozoned
WTF????? Who voted for this?????

Link

$50 billion of bailout going to employee bonuses
Posted Oct 31 2008, 07:30 AM by Andrew Horowitz Rating: Filed under: Merrill Lynch, Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs, banking, Andrew Horowitz
As if the economic bailout by U.S. taxpayers isn't enough to make you sick to your stomach, new information has come to light that several banks are planning to pay billions of dollars in year-end bonuses from the bailout funds they received. Investigations are beginning into the nine banks that took in the first $125 billion -- the same $125 billion that was supposed to be used to unclog the credit system which was preventing banks from providing much needed funds for individuals and businesses.

There are many feathers in a ruffle over this and New York Attorney General Andrew Cuomo and several congressmen are furious that over $20 billion has already been earmarked as bonus funds for management and employees. Unbelievably, that is just the estimates from Goldman Sachs, Morgan Stanley and Merrill Lynch. There are six more banks that are also working on similar heists.

Here is their rationale for using that money: It is reported that the financial industry pays base salaries in the range of $80,000 to $600,000 and apparently that is simply not enough to keep some of the best and brightest working to keep their companies profitable. It seems that if they were paid only this meager amount, the company would risk mass defections. That would be a real problem...or would it?

Maybe it is time to peg annual bonuses to something meaningful like profitability. As I recall, not only are these the firms that have been losing money (as is evident by the need for a massive multi-billion dollar bailout) but they have also been shown to be the creators of securitization, derivatives, sub-prime mortgages and other toxic credit that is the root cause of this historic global economic catastrophe!

Maybe I am being too harsh? Perhaps management is entitled to hundreds of millions in bonuses for the hard work they do, day in and day out. You have to feel sorry for them as most have had to give up their private jets and instead fly in a cramped seat in first class. Surely most will now have to wonder how they will deal with the excess workload as they have had to fire thousands of employees. Also, they will need to use a good chunk of that money to rebuild their retirement plans as much of their wealth was tied up in their company's stock which, under their leadership, could be down more than 60% just this year alone.

I've mentioned this in several other threads as a real possibility (along with the high administrative costs of the bailout) but few people thought it was a serious issue, and several dismissed this with a "So what? attitude.

If you read the bailout bill there is nothing in there to prevent these bonuses being paid, and Paulson would be the last person in the world to complain about sky high bonuses, as he's earned millions in bonuses when at Goldman Sachs. This is yet another reason why this bailout was a truly stupid idea.

Write your congressman and complain, but your complaints will fall on deaf ears as our Congress is full of stupid people who have been bought by Wall Street. Barney Frank is a major embarrassment. He shouldn't be in charge of his own checking account.....(On most other issues I like Frank, but this ain't one of them.)

-Robert
I favor a progressive tax system. ;)

Don't we all? ;) But, the question is do you favor progressive socialism? ;) You know, better and more expensive socialism for those in power.

-Robert
 

trenchfoot

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
15,684
8,229
136
Greed at this level knows no bounds. These guys are so used to swimming in cash that even when the economy tanks, they, in their recession-proof insulated magical world still expect a year-end treat no matter how or where the treat comes from.
 

Ozoned

Diamond Member
Mar 22, 2004
5,578
0
0
Originally posted by: chess9
Originally posted by: Ozoned
Originally posted by: chess9
Originally posted by: Ozoned
WTF????? Who voted for this?????

Link

$50 billion of bailout going to employee bonuses
Posted Oct 31 2008, 07:30 AM by Andrew Horowitz Rating: Filed under: Merrill Lynch, Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs, banking, Andrew Horowitz
As if the economic bailout by U.S. taxpayers isn't enough to make you sick to your stomach, new information has come to light that several banks are planning to pay billions of dollars in year-end bonuses from the bailout funds they received. Investigations are beginning into the nine banks that took in the first $125 billion -- the same $125 billion that was supposed to be used to unclog the credit system which was preventing banks from providing much needed funds for individuals and businesses.

There are many feathers in a ruffle over this and New York Attorney General Andrew Cuomo and several congressmen are furious that over $20 billion has already been earmarked as bonus funds for management and employees. Unbelievably, that is just the estimates from Goldman Sachs, Morgan Stanley and Merrill Lynch. There are six more banks that are also working on similar heists.

Here is their rationale for using that money: It is reported that the financial industry pays base salaries in the range of $80,000 to $600,000 and apparently that is simply not enough to keep some of the best and brightest working to keep their companies profitable. It seems that if they were paid only this meager amount, the company would risk mass defections. That would be a real problem...or would it?

Maybe it is time to peg annual bonuses to something meaningful like profitability. As I recall, not only are these the firms that have been losing money (as is evident by the need for a massive multi-billion dollar bailout) but they have also been shown to be the creators of securitization, derivatives, sub-prime mortgages and other toxic credit that is the root cause of this historic global economic catastrophe!

Maybe I am being too harsh? Perhaps management is entitled to hundreds of millions in bonuses for the hard work they do, day in and day out. You have to feel sorry for them as most have had to give up their private jets and instead fly in a cramped seat in first class. Surely most will now have to wonder how they will deal with the excess workload as they have had to fire thousands of employees. Also, they will need to use a good chunk of that money to rebuild their retirement plans as much of their wealth was tied up in their company's stock which, under their leadership, could be down more than 60% just this year alone.

I've mentioned this in several other threads as a real possibility (along with the high administrative costs of the bailout) but few people thought it was a serious issue, and several dismissed this with a "So what? attitude.

If you read the bailout bill there is nothing in there to prevent these bonuses being paid, and Paulson would be the last person in the world to complain about sky high bonuses, as he's earned millions in bonuses when at Goldman Sachs. This is yet another reason why this bailout was a truly stupid idea.

Write your congressman and complain, but your complaints will fall on deaf ears as our Congress is full of stupid people who have been bought by Wall Street. Barney Frank is a major embarrassment. He shouldn't be in charge of his own checking account.....(On most other issues I like Frank, but this ain't one of them.)

-Robert
I favor a progressive tax system. ;)

Don't we all? ;) But, the question is do you favor progressive socialism? ;) You know, better and more expensive socialism for those in power.

-Robert
Well, if by that you mean the type of socialism that gives me 750 billion dollars and then raises my tax rate 5%, Certainly.