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4day work week: 100% pay if workers promise to maintain 100% of their productivity

JEDI

JEDI

Lifer

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Thousands of UK workers are starting a four-day work week from Monday with no cut to their pay in the largest trial of its kind.
The pilot, which will last for six months, involves 3,300 workers spanning 70 companies, ranging from providers of financial services to a fish-and-chip restaurant.
During the program, workers receive 100% of their pay for working only 80% of their usual week, in exchange for promising to maintain 100% of their productivity.

Until now, Iceland had conducted the biggest pilot of a shorter working week between 2015 and 2019, with 2,500 public sector workers involved in two large trials.
Those trials found no corresponding drop in productivity among participants, and a dramatic increase in employee well-being.


So doing 5 days work in 4 days?!
That's not maintaining 100% productivity. You're doing 125% productivity. 😱
 
JEDI said:

CNN - Breaking News, Latest News and Videos

View the latest news and breaking news today for U.S., world, weather, entertainment, politics and health at CNN.com.
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Thousands of UK workers are starting a four-day work week from Monday with no cut to their pay in the largest trial of its kind.
The pilot, which will last for six months, involves 3,300 workers spanning 70 companies, ranging from providers of financial services to a fish-and-chip restaurant.
During the program, workers receive 100% of their pay for working only 80% of their usual week, in exchange for promising to maintain 100% of their productivity.

Until now, Iceland had conducted the biggest pilot of a shorter working week between 2015 and 2019, with 2,500 public sector workers involved in two large trials.
Those trials found no corresponding drop in productivity among participants, and a dramatic increase in employee well-being.


So doing 5 days work in 4 days?!
That's not maintaining 100% productivity. You're doing 125% productivity. 😱
Click to expand...
Or more likely, they were only every doing 80% productivity before.
 
So, I'm a fan of this concept. I read Tim Ferriss' book of the same name a few years ago:


The original concept of "8 hours" is flawed because it's just a historical catchphrase, not a reflection of actual productivity metrics:

  • "The 8-hour workday is a remnant of the industrial age, and it came about in part because it made for a snappy labor-rights slogan: “Eight hours labor, eight hours recreation, eight hours rest.”

The average worker is only actually productive about 3 hours a day:


Research says that we're really only good up to about 5 hours a day:

There are certain jobs that will always require shift availability, like an emergency room, McDonald's drive-thru, machine tools like CNC machines & 3D printers that need to be run 24/7, etc. But for a lot of people, working a reduced amount of time with more efficiency would be better. I really like the concept of the 4/10 workweek because you're already at work, so the extra time really isn't that much extra once you factor in lunch, commute there & back, etc., and you could have more time to spend at home recharging, with your family, your pets, your hobbies, etc. It's not for everyone, but we definitely need a better approach to workplace productivity imo!
 
I had a 4-day work week (4x 10-hour shifts) for years and it was great. (off Sun/Mon/Tues)

I'd like a 3-day work week (3x 12-hours) even better ... for me the most annoying part of working is getting there and getting motivated once I get cranking it's fine.

Staying at work for a few more hours is no big deal BUT more "me-time" doing what I enjoy is a real game-changer!
 
Kaido said:
So, I'm a fan of this concept. I read Tim Ferriss' book of the same name a few years ago:


The original concept of "8 hours" is flawed because it's just a historical catchphrase, not a reflection of actual productivity metrics:

  • "The 8-hour workday is a remnant of the industrial age, and it came about in part because it made for a snappy labor-rights slogan: “Eight hours labor, eight hours recreation, eight hours rest.”

The average worker is only actually productive about 3 hours a day:


Research says that we're really only good up to about 5 hours a day:

There are certain jobs that will always require shift availability, like an emergency room, McDonald's drive-thru, machine tools like CNC machines & 3D printers that need to be run 24/7, etc. But for a lot of people, working a reduced amount of time with more efficiency would be better. I really like the concept of the 4/10 workweek because you're already at work, so the extra time really isn't that much extra once you factor in lunch, commute there & back, etc., and you could have more time to spend at home recharging, with your family, your pets, your hobbies, etc. It's not for everyone, but we definitely need a better approach to workplace productivity imo!
Click to expand...

Agreed 100% for “brainpower” jobs like engineering (the only area besides the usual high school grocery store type job that I have any experience in)

I’m a robotics / controls engineer and mostly write software in C++ these days .. it’s a rare day when I’m actively productive for more than three or four hours. At the same time those three or four hours is enough to get a ton of work done, get excellent performance reviews and keep up with the rest of my coworkers. My coworkers are far from dumb or slow so I can only assume that pretty much every one of them is only getting real work done for a similar amount of time. Thinking about hard problems takes a lot of energy and there’s only so much of it the brain can do in a day, dumb eight hour productivity expectations be damned.

That said I just switched to four ten hour days, Monday through Thursday. Four decently productive days per week is enough time to get a whole lot of work done.
 
So, I don't understand something here. There is not a set number of hours that must be worked, just a set number of days? I'd have to put myself on a fixed schedule like 4x10 - would be worth it for 3 consecutive days off. hell, I've worked plenty of jobs putting 50-60 hours in 5 days, and even ~70 hours over 6 days (though the later truly does suck).
 
Ajay said:
So, I don't understand something here. There is not a set number of hours that must be worked, just a set number of days? I'd have to put myself on a fixed schedule like 4x10 - would be worth it for 3 consecutive days off. hell, I've worked plenty of jobs putting 50-60 hours in 5 days, and even ~70 hours over 6 days (though the later truly does suck).
Click to expand...
I've only ever rarely done over 40 hours in a week over the past 20+ years, I will only do it in unusual circumstances. Any place that it occurs regularly doesn't value their employees, is poorly managed, and can fuck off.
 
I did 4 10s for years and that was 10 years ago. Not a new concept.

Driving in four days instead of five was one thing, staying 2 hours more each day wasn't even noticeable.

Having three consecutive days off was the best part.


Friday through Monday as I recall. Or maybe it was Thursday through Sunday. Days off were all weekdays when I could get things done while everybody else was at work.
 
I've worked 5-8s, 4-10s, 3-13s, 5-10s, 6-10s, 6-12s, 7-12s, 7-however fucking many hours we can to get the job done...
I liked the rare 4-10s shift...but being hourly with good overtime, 6-10s was the easiest (on my mental and physical health) way to make mo money. 7-12s is doable (for me) for about 6 months...then I needed at least a week off then a few weeks of 5-8s or 4-10s, then back to heavy overtime.
For me, with CA laws and union rules, the first 8 hours M-F were at 1x wages, after 8, 1.5x, after 10, 2x. Saturday, the first 8 were at 1.5x, after 8 was 2x. All hours on Sunday were at 2x.
Working 7-12's was:
40 hours @ 1x
18 hours @ 1.5x
26 hours @ 2x
for the equivalent of 119 regular time hours of pay every week.
 
I work shifts so this applies less to me but I absolutely do think 4 day weeks should be standard. Even if it means working 10h shifts instead of 8h shifts but ideally keep it 8h shifts and just pay people more so the monthly pay is the same. But good luck convincing companies to do this. Either way as long as it does not involve making less money per month I'd be for it.

My current setup is ideal too though, I work a mix of 8h shifts and 12h shifts. The more 12h shifts I work the more days off I get. Schedules are somewhat random and depend a lot on stats, vacation etc. I prefer working more 12h shifts myself as I find 3 extra hours is honestly not that big a deal, either way, it's a full work day. I prefer working longer work days so I can get more days off later. I've had it where I get a full week off without even needing to use vacation time.
 
4-day work week with the same working hours per day, whether that's 8 or 9, would be a step in the right direction. None of this, "I'll still work 40+ hours in 4 days" nonsense.

For non-production workers where you can't really measure x produced per minute/hour, it should be work as you need. Doesn't matter if you get your work done in 2 hours or 40 hours as long as your projects are done on time. My work is done in 2 hours and I can screw off the rest of the week? My manager isn't giving me enough work.

The dedicated employees will hang around and help out, probably working the full 40 hours even if they don't need to, while the slackers will either barely scrape by or be noticed (if their manager is competent) and fired.
 
nakedfrog said:
I've only ever rarely done over 40 hours in a week over the past 20+ years, I will only do it in unusual circumstances. Any place that it occurs regularly doesn't value their employees, is poorly managed, and can fuck off.
Click to expand...
I refuse to work anywhere that doesn't pay engineers OT or at least comp time. It's the only thing that keeps a lot of managers in check.
 
My company mostly did 9/80, but I've stayed on 5x8. I like the off Fridays because I can actually work without people bothering me. I tried the 9/80 for awhile after going remote, but found it less flexible and harder to make myself workout after work.
 
Zorba said:
My company mostly did 9/80, but I've stayed on 5x8. I like the off Fridays because I can actually work without people bothering me. I tried the 9/80 for awhile after going remote, but found it less flexible and harder to make myself workout after work.
Click to expand...
Just looked up 9/80, is 8 9-hour days accurate? I'm able to get in the weeds pretty deep and I feel like I'd be hard pressed to actually commit to 9-hours straight of work in a sensory deprivation chamber, much less a normal work environment (or wfh). That sounds like a terrible waste of time.
 
[DHT]Osiris said:
Just looked up 9/80, is 8 9-hour days accurate? I'm able to get in the weeds pretty deep and I feel like I'd be hard pressed to actually commit to 9-hours straight of work in a sensory deprivation chamber, much less a normal work environment (or wfh). That sounds like a terrible waste of time.
Click to expand...
if it's fed govt, 1/2 the people on 9/80 take the 1st fri, the other half take the 2nd fri.
so there's at least some people every fri
 
As a consultant I bill hourly so if you cut my work week by a day, the revenue I generate for the company would be reduced by 20%.
 
Early in the pandemic our shop changed to 4 day work week... but still had to do 45-50hrs. That was horrible. Anymore i can't even stand working 10hr days. 9 tops & if needed i'll do 5 on Saturday.
 
Everyone should be for a four day work week. That's still working the majority of the week but just at least gives balance vs a five day workweek with only two days off. I mean if you own a house you may have to spend one day just taking care of things and now you have one day off. It's just not right.
 
JEDI said:

CNN - Breaking News, Latest News and Videos

View the latest news and breaking news today for U.S., world, weather, entertainment, politics and health at CNN.com.
lite.cnn.com

Thousands of UK workers are starting a four-day work week from Monday with no cut to their pay in the largest trial of its kind.
The pilot, which will last for six months, involves 3,300 workers spanning 70 companies, ranging from providers of financial services to a fish-and-chip restaurant.
During the program, workers receive 100% of their pay for working only 80% of their usual week, in exchange for promising to maintain 100% of their productivity.

Until now, Iceland had conducted the biggest pilot of a shorter working week between 2015 and 2019, with 2,500 public sector workers involved in two large trials.
Those trials found no corresponding drop in productivity among participants, and a dramatic increase in employee well-being.


So doing 5 days work in 4 days?!
That's not maintaining 100% productivity. You're doing 125% productivity. 😱
Click to expand...
How does that work in a restaurant? Or any field that requires the manipulation of mass?
 
[DHT]Osiris said:
Just looked up 9/80, is 8 9-hour days accurate? I'm able to get in the weeds pretty deep and I feel like I'd be hard pressed to actually commit to 9-hours straight of work in a sensory deprivation chamber, much less a normal work environment (or wfh). That sounds like a terrible waste of time.
Click to expand...
In a 2 week period you work 8 9 hour days, and 1 8 hour day, then you get 1 "extra" day off. I used to really want to work 4x10s, but then I started working out after work and had a kid, just don't think they'd work with my lifestyle any more.
 
MrSquished said:
Everyone should be for a four day work week. That's still working the majority of the week but just at least gives balance vs a five day workweek with only two days off. I mean if you own a house you may have to spend one day just taking care of things and now you have one day off. It's just not right.
Click to expand...
Hell, half the time I spend one day mentally recovering while doing housework, and the other day mentally prepping while doing housework. Tend to not really feel like I have days off, lol.

It is better now with WFH, since I can take care of a lot more shit while home, and I don't lose an hour a day to driving.
 
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