4870 X2 pics

[Aberforth]

http://www.techpowerup.com/index.php?64318

This does not tell us much but we are now sure it is definitely coming and will probably be cheaper than GTX 280.

Update

Two R700's is faster than GTX 280 in TriSLI



I'm locking this because (1) it's a duplicate and (2) it's already taken a turn for the worse.

Video Mod BFG10K.

 

[Piuc2020]

And it'll likely perform better.

It's nice to see ATI back on top, the GTX 280 is so inefficient, even the 9800GX2 is a more elegant solution.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Piuc2020
And it'll likely perform better.

It's nice to see ATI back on top, the GTX 280 is so inefficient, even the 9800GX2 is a more elegant solution.

I don't see ATi "on top":

1. Undisputed fastest single GPU = GTX280

2. Undisputed fastest multiple GPU solution = GTX280 3 Way

When you have the overall fastest parts with the best image quality in the graphics card industry, you're "on top".

Same in CPUs, same in RAM. Price isn't a factor, only "best performance" is.

Short version: You can't be "on top" in second place.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Whatever you say Rollo. The thing is, if you buy Intel's fastest Quad core processor, it is faster across the board then AMD's fastest Phenom. Nvidia just priced the GTX280 like it was the fastest across the board, unfortunately for Nvidia the GTX280 is not always the fastest... sometimes losing to a GPU that cost less then half as much.

 

[Piuc2020]

I always thought you were on top when you sold more and with the great value ATI's offering I think NV will have a lot of trouble keeping customers off the HD 4850s and the 4870s.

NV sells A LOT more 8800GTs than it does 3-Way GTX 280s and now ATI will sell a lot more HD 4850s and 4870s than NV will ever sell 8800GTs and 9800GTXs.

And I understand ATI is still behind but they are competitive now and no longer on the bottom of the barrel like they were last gen.

NVIDIA can't keep up with such an ineficient architecture such as GTX 280, on the other hand, ATI's way of doing things has a lot of future.

 

[taltamir]

mmm... i am not too sure about this nrollo... sure the 4870x2 looks like it is going to be a much better band for the buck then a single GTX280, but I am not sure about your claim of 3x GTX280 being the fastest thing when money is not an issue. Sclaing beyond the 2nd GPU is VERY tough, while AMD's new direct GPU-GPU interconnect means that the 4870x2 will scale much better then any other dual GPU out there, but them or nvidia.

So 1.8 x the 4870 performance vs ... what? last I checked 3x nvidia card did not scale that well... I read a few reviews and it seems that on 2560x1600 it does scale well, but on 1920x1200 and below it scales much less. And in many cases less then 150% of a single card.
AMD also claims to have solved the micro-stutter issue with the 4870...

Even then... how would 2x4870x2 compare to 3xGTX280?

 

[Ariste]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Piuc2020
And it'll likely perform better.

It's nice to see ATI back on top, the GTX 280 is so inefficient, even the 9800GX2 is a more elegant solution.

I don't see ATi "on top":

1. Undisputed fastest single GPU = GTX280

2. Undisputed fastest multiple GPU solution = GTX280 3 Way

When you have the overall fastest parts with the best image quality in the graphics card industry, you're "on top".

Same in CPUs, same in RAM. Price isn't a factor, only "best performance" is.

Short version: You can't be "on top" in second place.

So I guess McDonald's is inferior compared to, say, every decent restaurant on the planet? Except that McDonald's is bringing in 4 billion a year. I'm pretty sure my local steak house isn't.

 

[lopri]

Well the fastest single video card is GTX 280, that's correct. Sure one could argue efficiency or price, but it's at the top nonetheless.

Then again, the GTX 280 does look somewhat less efficient and is a lot more money for what it is.

As for 4870 X2, I will believe it when I see it. I don't think there is any credible spec out there yet, other than some guess-works. I mean, 9800 GX2 or regular SLI/CF can achieve ~80% scaling. There is nothing miraculous there.

And I am a little skeptical to the rumors like 'shared memory-pool'. If that turns out to be true, that'll be a major break-through in multi-GPU technology. (Think of it like the birth of dual-core CPUs)

 

[BTRY B 529th FA BN]

Anyone read this thread n article???

 

[lavaheadache]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Piuc2020
And it'll likely perform better.

It's nice to see ATI back on top, the GTX 280 is so inefficient, even the 9800GX2 is a more elegant solution.

I don't see ATi "on top":

1. Undisputed fastest single GPU = GTX280

2. Undisputed fastest multiple GPU solution = GTX280 3 Way

When you have the overall fastest parts with the best image quality in the graphics card industry, you're "on top".

Same in CPUs, same in RAM. Price isn't a factor, only "best performance" is.

Short version: You can't be "on top" in second place.

Maybe he was referring to "on top" of their game. I would say a porsche is "on top". It may not be a lamborghi, but christ I wouldn't discredit the company. I think it's this kinda offensive defense that people have towards just about anything, especially graphic cards, that makes people look rediculous. nRollo I'm sure Nvidia wouldn't kick you out of the program for admitting that the hd48xx's are formidable cards in the market. Lets keep this thread back on topic and out of the hands of thread crappers.

 

[bunnyfubbles]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Piuc2020
And it'll likely perform better.

It's nice to see ATI back on top, the GTX 280 is so inefficient, even the 9800GX2 is a more elegant solution.

I don't see ATi "on top":

1. Undisputed fastest single GPU = GTX280

2. Undisputed fastest multiple GPU solution = GTX280 3 Way

When you have the overall fastest parts with the best image quality in the graphics card industry, you're "on top".

Same in CPUs, same in RAM. Price isn't a factor, only "best performance" is.

Short version: You can't be "on top" in second place.

you forgot #3 which trumps the first two, and that's best selling...the first two can certainly help with #3, but it isn't always the case if they're priced out of their own league with nothing in between...

 

[Cookie Monster]

This thread should be locked. It would've been nice talking about the new GPU interconnect for example.

For instance, somebody claims that GTX280 is inefficient and that the 9800GX2 is elegant. This is borderlining stupidity. Why? because the architectural side of a G200 is much more efficent than 2xG92s. Future games will probably show this especially when games start using more and more DX10 capabilities. The only inefficiency i can think of is production/cost related but its not as of a big problem that some make it out to be because those cards aren't volume products.

The word "on Top" could be defined differently between people. The GTX280 is the fastest i.e on top. 3xGTX280 (3 way actually scales pretty decently where as 4 scales very bad as performance increase are negligible in almost all titles, and this applies for both CFX and SLi) is definitely faster than anything i.e on top. However some people also factor in performance/price i.e ATI is on top because they have a very high performing part for less money. It all depends on how a person defines the term "on top". Most people here are correct but theres no need to "convince" others that their definition of the word "on top" is correct.

 

[DaveSimmons]

Right, nvidia offers the highest perfornance but at more than twice the cost. SLI GTX at $1,300 will beat CF 4870 at $620.

It's still a major win for ATI that 4850 beats 9800GTX and 4870 beats GTX 260. nvidia vendors have already had to panic-drop prices by $100 on the 9800GTX and GX2, and similar massive cuts will be needed on the GTX cards.

:thumbsup: for competition.

 

[Aberforth]

ATI definitely has the capacity to beat NV in performance, it took a huge chip with 1.4 billion transistors to beat AMD where as 55nm GPU performs very close to high end GTX, Geforce GT200 series is architecturally inefficient, ever since G80 there has been very little progress in Geforce architecture, the acquisition of Ageia proves their incapacity to think big.

 

[Sylvanas]

This thread has taken a turn for the worse as soon as Rollo turned up, just like how the 4xxx review thread went off track once the Nvidia brigade turned up- honestly, whats the point of having them here. It would be nice to discuss the R700, not stupid flamewars.

 

[seipheroth]

Can't wait to see the reviews on this. Certainly the 4850 and 4870 have fared well in reviews so far, and I think the X2 will deliver another card that performs well for its price. I'm just curious to see how AMD's X2 card will compare to Nvidia's X2 card.

 

[sourthings]

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Piuc2020
And it'll likely perform better.

It's nice to see ATI back on top, the GTX 280 is so inefficient, even the 9800GX2 is a more elegant solution.

I don't see ATi "on top":

1. Undisputed fastest single GPU = GTX280

2. Undisputed fastest multiple GPU solution = GTX280 3 Way

When you have the overall fastest parts with the best image quality in the graphics card industry, you're "on top".

Same in CPUs, same in RAM. Price isn't a factor, only "best performance" is.

Short version: You can't be "on top" in second place.

4870x2 is released, fastest single slot card goes to ATI. ATI is on top, 4870x2 crossfired in a setup of two to four 4870x2s, likely fastest multi-card setup goes to ATI, ATI is again on top.

As far as 'image quality', well that's just a big LOL, grasping at straws there. 4870x2 comes out, and it's fairly certain right now, ati has fastest single slot card, and quite likely fastest multi-card as well.

The NV cards this round are horrible.

NV can have CUDA, fastest single GPU, (by not much), I'm interested in what will give the highest frames when I am gaming, and that is going to be the 4870x2, either one, or several together.

 

[Piuc2020]

Originally posted by: Cookie Monster
For instance, somebody claims that GTX280 is inefficient and that the 9800GX2 is elegant. This is borderlining stupidity. Why? because the architectural side of a G200 is much more efficent than 2xG92s. Future games will probably show this especially when games start using more and more DX10 capabilities. The only inefficiency i can think of is production/cost related but its not as of a big problem that some make it out to be because those cards aren't volume products.

I agree the thread should be locked and people should be talking about R700 but I just need to say one thing regarding your post.

Stupidity? Maybe you should recheck the concept of efficiency. Efficiency is the amount of energy that is converted into useful work, in a videogame enviroment useful work would be seen as the frames rendered per second (FPS). Now if a GTX 280 consumes MORE energy than a 9800GX2 and renders less frames per second, how is that efficient?

 

[Aberforth]

Freedom of expression isn't against the law, however stealth marketing is. In every thread there is a fanboy trying to derail the primary subject of the topic.

 

[BadRobot]

"on top" mmmmmmmmm..... sorry what were we talking about? 4850x2...right...

anyone want to talk about the original post instead of making sexual references and taking jabs at each other?

 

[Cookie Monster]

Originally posted by: Piuc2020
Stupidity? Maybe you should recheck the concept of efficiency. Efficiency is the amount of energy that is converted into useful work, in a videogame enviroment useful work would be seen as the frames rendered per second (FPS). Now if a GTX 280 consumes MORE energy than a 9800GX2 and renders less frames per second, how is that efficient?

So according to your definition of "efficient", a 7900GTX SLi is more "efficent" because it was faster than the 8800GTX at the time of release since it produced more fps? Power draw was probably higher with the GTX as well.

When we compare a single G200 with a single G92 (which should be considered normal when comparing two GPU architectures), it pretty much outclasses the chip in everything. When we look at different aspects of the architecture and how it handles certain work loads, benchmarks (mostly synthetic) shows G200 being much more efficent than the comparable G92/G80 cores. How much of this efficiency is shown on real world applications is variable, since it all depends on how the game takes advantage of this. G200s strengths should be more visible as more and more games begin to take advantage of DX10 capabilities.

Ok lets talk about power draw. G200 draws the same idle power of an HD4850 (according to AT, and according to nVIDIA it consumes around 25Ws during normal desktop use). For a 1.4 billion transistor chip that is very impressive. Only during load would you ever see it consuming close to its max power draw. Compare that to the 9800GX2. It consumes roughly 60W more during idle and 10W less than the GTX. Which solution here actually consumes more power? which do you think is more efficient?

Depending on the context, "Efficency" can mean different things. Maybe i should have clearly stated that G200 is architecturally superior to the G92 core. Even 2xG92.

edit - didnt want to go OT. Im speculation that the HD4870X2 is based on RV770PRO cores. Why? thermal envelope may well be way to high for a stock X2 cooler for 2 RV770XT cores clocked higher than stock HD4870s. HD4870s, and RV770 in general are considered to be space heaters. (Due to inadequate cooling i guess most of the time).

 

[Bateluer]

The GT 200 chips are amazingly pieces of engineering technology, there's no argument there. But they are huge chips, which produce much more and draw a lot more power than their competitors, and they cost double. Tri-SLI GT 280 is beyond the scope of most people's budgets, and electrical wiring.

By contrast, the 4870 costs half as much as the GT 280 and delivers 90% of its performance, at a lower power cost and heat production. The 4850 delivers 90% of the performance of the GT 260, beating it some cases, and costs less than half.

About the only thing the GT 280s can say they have over the 4870s is that they are in stock. Of course, the argument could be made that few are foolish enough to buy them over the much better bang for you buck 4800s.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: SlowSpyder
Whatever you say Rollo. The thing is, if you buy Intel's fastest Quad core processor, it is faster across the board then AMD's fastest Phenom. Nvidia just priced the GTX280 like it was the fastest across the board, unfortunately for Nvidia the GTX280 is not always the fastest... sometimes losing to a GPU that cost less then half as much.

I didn't say "The GTX280 is the best bang per buck" option, I only pointed out it's inaccurate to say "ATi is on top again".

They used to be when the their cards were fastest and offered the highest image quality for the most part, now they offer no higher image quality, and are slower for the most part.

This is not "back on top", this is "offering good second tier alternatives" like they've been doing since R600 launched. They're just way better second tier alternatives than R600s.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Ariste

Originally posted by: nRollo

Originally posted by: Piuc2020
And it'll likely perform better.

It's nice to see ATI back on top, the GTX 280 is so inefficient, even the 9800GX2 is a more elegant solution.

I don't see ATi "on top":

1. Undisputed fastest single GPU = GTX280

2. Undisputed fastest multiple GPU solution = GTX280 3 Way

When you have the overall fastest parts with the best image quality in the graphics card industry, you're "on top".

Same in CPUs, same in RAM. Price isn't a factor, only "best performance" is.

Short version: You can't be "on top" in second place.

So I guess McDonald's is inferior compared to, say, every decent restaurant on the planet? Except that McDonald's is bringing in 4 billion a year. I'm pretty sure my local steak house isn't.

If you want to compare financials and sales, ATi is nowhere near the top. I wasn't even thinking of that though, performance is what I care about, and if ATi was at the top I wouldn't have posted.