450W enough for Sandy Bridge + GTS450?

[ganymede]

I'm planning a new build with these parts:

• CPU:
  Intel Core i3 2100 @3.00 GHz
• Motherboard:
  Asus P8H61 Pro
• RAM:
  Kingston KHX1333C9D3B1/2G, DDR3 1333 MHz, 2x2 GB
• GPU:
  GIGABYTE GV-N450D3-1GI, GeForce GTS450, 1GB, PCIe
• HDD:
  Samsung HD753LJ, 750 GB, 7200 rpm, 32 MB SATA
• Optical:
  Samsung SH-S203D
• Soundcard:
  Creative X-Fi Surround 5.1 Pro, SB1095, external USB 2.0

(I know some of these might not factor in at all, but better safe than sorry)

I'm not planning on overclocking or SLI.

Currently I have a CoolerMaster RealPower 450W, with the following ratings:

nVidia says the GTS450 has a maximum power consumption of 106 W and recommends a mimimum system power of 400 W. The RealPower 450W's 12V1 rail has 12V*12A = 144 W.

(To me this seems like a no-brainer, but Google searches seem to be affected by the Heisenberg effect: if I search for "will a 450 W PSU handle a GTS450" the answers are "no, you need 500/600/750 W"; if I search for "what PSU is good for a GTS 450" the answers seem to be "450W to be safe, but 400W should be enough" 😀 )

So, would the CM RealPower 450W handle this setup? The previous rig was an Athlon64 3000+ with a Leadtek A6600GT 128MB, it ran that without problems for the past 7-8 years.

edit: I don't know if this goes without saying, but if the current PSU is inadequate then I'm looking for suggestions on what PSU to upgrade to next.

 

[lehtv]

In terms of capacity it should handle it, but I would upgrade a 7-8 year old cooler master PSU. They're not particularly good quality to begin with.

Where are you located / what store do you buy from?

I would also not buy an Asus P8H61 Pro. Rather get a cheaper H61 motherboard, or a H67 motherboard with native SATA 6gb/s ports (which are better than the add-on ports of P8H61 Pro).

Make sure the memory you get is 1.5 volt

 

[ganymede]

I was not aware that the P8H61 did not have "true" SATA 6 GB/s support, thanks. How about a P8H67-V?

I'm in Hungary, from what I've seen most major brands seem to be available, I can check if you have any suggestions.

The memory is 1.5V, thanks for the tip!

 

[lehtv]

Asus P8H67-V is a decent board but at least in the US (newegg) it is $10-25 more expensive than many other decent boards, e.g. Gigabyte offerings, Asrock H67M, and Intel's own H67 boards. Asus P8H67-M LE is also decent if you want to stick with Asus.

If you need a replacement PSU look for Corsair CX430 / CX500 / CX600. They're pretty affordable in Europe as well. Other options: Seasonic S12II, XFX Core, Antec Earthwatts / High Current Gamer / Neo Eco. If you find other units that you're interested in but can't tell if they're good, post here.

 

[ganymede]

Well over here the H67-V is actually only $8 more expensive than the H61 Pro, and it's even cheaper than some of the Asrock offerings. Plus, it's a full ATX card. (I don't think a mATX would fit properly in my case).

After a bit of Googling, the consensus on the CX600 seems to be that it's basically a 500W unit (a shame, because it's actually cheaper here than the CX500 😀 ). The Neo ECO 620C seems pretty good though, only $15 more expensive ($68) and from what I gather it's actually a rebranded Seasonic S12II 620 Bronze? Anyway, it's 80+ certified and outputs 48A on the single 12V rail.

Except, isn't $68 suspiciously cheap? Prices of the other PSUs you mentioned are:

• $120 for the Earthwatts 650-EC
• $109 for the Seasonic S12II
• $97 for the High Current Gamer HCG-620
• $96 for the XFX PRO650W

Does that seem reasonable? Does that $30 price difference represent the corners cut?

 

[lsv]

Seasonic all the way. This is why.

 

[max347]

+1 for the CX430 thought

 

[lehtv]

Well over here the H67-V is actually only $8 more expensive than the H61 Pro, and it's even cheaper than some of the Asrock offerings. Plus, it's a full ATX card. (I don't think a mATX would fit properly in my case).

What case is that? Did you take a look at any Gigabyte boards?

After a bit of Googling, the consensus on the CX600 seems to be that it's basically a 500W unit (a shame, because it's actually cheaper here than the CX500 😀 ). The Neo ECO 620C seems pretty good though, only $15 more expensive ($68) and from what I gather it's actually a rebranded Seasonic S12II 620 Bronze? Anyway, it's 80+ certified and outputs 48A on the single 12V rail.

Except, isn't $68 suspiciously cheap? Prices of the other PSUs you mentioned are:

• $120 for the Earthwatts 650-EC
• $109 for the Seasonic S12II
• $97 for the High Current Gamer HCG-620
• $96 for the XFX PRO650W

Excellent price for the 620C. It's a Seasonic made unit, very stable and reasonably quiet. Only con is it doesn't come with a power cord (and only 80 plus efficient but that hardly matters). Would buy - unless CX series is significantly cheaper (even a CX430 would power your system fine). Also what about Neo Eco 400C, 450C, 520C?

The other PSUs mentioned aren't worth the extra $, they seem overpriced in comparison. Especially the price on the Earthwatts is ridiculous, it should be priced similarly to Neo Eco 620C, maybe $5-10 more.

 

[ganymede]

What case is that? Did you take a look at any Gigabyte boards?

Okay, I'm moving this discussion into Motherboards 🙂

edit: Moved!

Also what about Neo Eco 400C, 450C, 520C?

They are $38, $43 and $53, respectively.

I would prefer the PSU I'm buying now to be able to power the next system, as long as I don't underload it with my current rig. Would a 520C be any good a few years down the road for a mid-range build with no overclocking? (and likely no CrossFire/SLI)

 

[coffeejunkee]

450W is plenty for that setup. And it will be plenty for a future build, considering cpu's and gpu's will only become more power efficient. But you might want to go for 550W in case you decide to use a bit more powerful gpu in the future.

I would recommend XFX Pro 450W or 550W Core Edition or Antec HCG 400W or 520W (both Seasonic made).

 

[lehtv]

I would prefer the PSU I'm buying now to be able to power the next system, as long as I don't underload it with my current rig. Would a 520C be any good a few years down the road for a mid-range build with no overclocking? (and likely no CrossFire/SLI)

Yes, 520C would be powerful enough for almost any single-GPU setup without overclocking. It has 6-pin and 6+2-pin PCIe, so you'll be fine as long as your GPU upgrade is in the ~200W or lesser range (up to GTX570 / HD7970).

The most power hungry single GPUs (NVIDIA 580 or next-gen equivalent) require 2x 6+2 pin PCIe connectors. XFX 650W would be fine for that (Neo Eco 620C has 6-pin and 6+2pin). In theory, 520C/620C should power it without OC but you'd need to use a molex->PCIe 8-pin adapter.

$53 for 520C is a pretty good price as well, it costs $60 on newegg.com.

 

[coffeejunkee]

650W is really overkill for your current system. Again, 450W will be plenty. But I would upgrade the psu, the Coolermaster doesn't have too much power on the 12V rails and considering output goes down over the years I think you're cutting it too close for comfort.

 

[ganymede]

As I said earlier, as long as I don't underload it, I'd rather have an overkill PSU for the current system if it means not having to upgrade again for the next system.

Actually, since I've been recommended a cheaper motherboard and not to buy an aftermarket CPU HSF, it looks like I can afford an XFX PRO 650W.

 

[BoomerD]

Your Coolermaster PSU is an AcBel build. Definitely not one of the best OEM's in the business, but unless it blows up, it SHOULD have enough power for your proposed build.

According to the Anandtech review of the GTS450, the system power requirement under Furmark is about 300 watts.

Personally, if the budget allows, I'd replace it with a quality Seasonic build, but that's me...I don't trust many PSU OEM's...most are just unreliable.

 

[classy]

Actually those particular Cooler Masters tested very well. While it is an older ps, it will easily power that setup. Those were some good ps back when they were released.

 

[ganymede]

Actually those particular Cooler Masters tested very well. While it is an older ps, it will easily power that setup. Those were some good ps back when they were released.

It's 8 years old, to be precise 🙂 That, and it being dual rail are my two concerns. The GTS450 supposedly pulls 106W (nVidia specs), so the 12V1 rated at 12A should be more than enough... if it still has the same punch as three-quarters of a decade ago 😀

Don't get me wrong, I'd like nothing more than to not have to buy a new PSU, but it is the one component I really don't want to skimp on. I'm tempted to try the new build with the RealPower 450W, except I'm concerned it might go belly-up and wreck the brand-new components.

 

[coffeejunkee]

As I said earlier, as long as I don't underload it, I'd rather have an overkill PSU for the current system if it means not having to upgrade again for the next system.

Actually, since I've been recommended a cheaper motherboard and not to buy an aftermarket CPU HSF, it looks like I can afford an XFX PRO 650W.

Well personally I don't see the need to spend more than necessary on a psu, even if you got some room in your budget. What do you have in mind for this next system? Will it have a top-of-the-line graphics card? Heavily overclocked 6-core cpu? If the answer is no, a 550W psu will be more than enough. If you stay with similar hardware as the current system, 450W will be more than enough. In fact a modern 450W psu will fex. easily power an overclocked 2500K + HD6950.

 

[ganymede]

Okay, final vote 🙂 Is there any reason why I shouldn't give the current CoolerMaster RealPower 450W a shot at powering an i3-2100 + GTS450 (both non-overclocked)?

edit: other than the fact that it has no PCIe connector 😀

 

[Crap Daddy]

I have a no-name 430W PSU in my second machine that works no problems with a GTS450 and an E8400 both stock so I vote you will be fine.

 

[Blastman]

Yup -- easy. Even with that graphics card you will be under 200w while gaming.

When I built my i3-530 (sig), I used an Enemrax 350w psu from my old build in 2002.

The only downside to these old psu's, even though they have enough power to run an i3 system easy, is …

- noisy 80mm fan
- not very efficient compared to modern 80+ rated psu's
- no SATA or PCI-E connectors -- have to buy adapter cables.

By using my old psu I could just wait for a good deal on a new psu. Picked up a Enermax 500W modular psu on a Boxing Day door crasher sale for $30.:thumbsup:

 

[ganymede]

The only downside to these old psu's, even though they have enough power to run an i3 system easy, is …

- noisy 80mm fan

I'm actually fine with the current noise level.

- not very efficient compared to modern 80+ rated psu's

Noted.

- no SATA or PCI-E connectors -- have to buy adapter cables.

If it means not buying a $50 PSU, I think I can afford $1.60 for an adapter cable 😉

While we're on the topic of adapter cables:
It's a 2 molex -> 6-pin PCIe cable. Should I connect it to two different cables or two molexes (molices? 😀) on the same physical cable? I have nothing else that runs off of a molex. (HDD and DVD run off of the SATA power cable, fans and the Aerogate run off of the small connectors)

 

[Blastman]

While we're on the topic of adapter cables:
It's a 2 molex -> 6-pin PCIe cable. Should I connect it to two different cables or two molexes (molices? 😀) on the same physical cable? I have nothing else that runs off of a molex. (HDD and DVD run off of the SATA power cable, fans and the Aerogate run off of the small connectors)

Doesn't really matter. 6-pin PCI-E connection is limited to 75watts and the wires can handle much more than what the individual molex connectors are rated for.

In the case of 12v rails, your 12v1/12v2 are connected internally to the same single 12v rail with cutout limiters (usually) put on each rail. With a 12A rated rail, the cutout is usually much higher -- probably 20A (or even higher). So even if you ran that entire system on only 1 of the 12v rails it should have no problem.

 

[ElFenix]

Seasonic all the way. This is why.

impressive performance. i take slight issue with 1 statement here:

The load level here is so low, you aren't too likely to encounter it in normal operation.

i'm sure there are a lot of computers that are idling in the 60s these days with how good SB is at idle. even my athlon ii box idles in the 60s.

so i'd like to see this test in every review. 🙂

maybe there's a guy around here who could help make that happen :hmm:


edit: looking at anandtech's long idle for the 7970 that's drawing 100 watts from the wall on a 1200 watt supply with an overclocked SB-E, so even that's probably down in the 60s

 

[ganymede]

Okay, so due to availability issues the Neo Eco 520C (and, in fact, all Neo Eco models) are out. I'm thinking XFX Core Edition 550W?

 

[swinger222]

550W should work just fine, if you're not planning upgrades in the future. I'm selling an 850W OCZ, if it's in your price range, you might want to check it out.