Question 4080 Reviews

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Ranulf

Platinum Member
Jul 18, 2001
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One theory for NE selling out is scalpers buying them up and putting them on ebay etc.. $1200 up to $1800 right now over there with buy it now prices starting around $1500.
 

Stuka87

Diamond Member
Dec 10, 2010
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Just a reminder that the GTX 580 was the full size Fermi die. All of the subsequent x80 GPUs after the 580 were cut down dies to some degree.

Not all. Only half were to my recollection.

580: GF110 (full)
680: GK104 (full)
780: GK110 (really cut down)
980: GM104 (full)
1080: GP104 (full)
2080: TU104 (cut down)
3080: GA102 (really cut down)
 

Carfax83

Diamond Member
Nov 1, 2010
6,841
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That newegg in the USA is sold out now, doesn't mean they aren't selling much slower than past releases, especially around the world. Go watch HWUB video I linked on previous page. He acknowledged they were selling a bit better in the USA(but still slow), but they really weren't moving in the rest of the world.

The rest of the World has to deal with import taxes and VAT, so that definitely inflates the price significantly and makes it much more difficult to justify buying; especially with the RTX 4090 being an option. I think the average VAT for the E.U is around 20%, which must hurt a lot.

But it has poor perf/$. The normal situation is that the top card like the 4090 would have the worse perf/$, and the next step down would have much better perf/$, but that isn't the case here. At best the 4080 only ties the 4090 for perf/$ and in may even be worse, which is a sign it's a ripoff.

I don't disagree with you here at all. But my mind is wondering whether this is intentional by Nvidia due to greed, or the result of legitimate market forces at play. As I said earlier, GPUs are much more expensive to make than ever, and also much more in demand than ever. I paid $2300 (including taxes) for my RTX 4090, which is much more than what you can get the RTX 4080 for at a brick and mortar retailer in the U.S.
 
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Carfax83

Diamond Member
Nov 1, 2010
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I suspect NVIDIA and scalpers are partially to blame for this. Scalpers hoping to make some quick money on Christmas sales probably scooped up the 4090. NVIDIA probably did not produce enough 4090 chips to meet demand. They misjudged the number of people that are willing to pay a premium. They likely created far more 4080s because they figured that is where the market would be. People claim they made the 4080 in order to upsell the 4090, but I don't think so.

From what I understand, the inventory for the RTX 4090 was much higher than Ampere at launch, but the demand was just ruthless. Up until the day I bought my RTX 4090 from an Amazon sub retailer, Newegg and every other major e-tailer along with every brick and mortar retailer were completely out of stock with no date for restocking.

That's why I just bit the bullet and paid well above MSRP to get mine. Couldn't be bothered to wait anymore, especially after the RDNA 3 presentation.

After that, sales of top end cards won't be so rosy, and we may even see cheaper pricing as a result.

Perhaps. But many of us thought that Ampere prices would also crater but they've been surprisingly firm. I honestly think that the days of relatively inexpensive GPUs may be over, mostly due to how expensive they've become to manufacturer and the massive increase in PC gaming over the years.

I think the PS4 and Xbox One era disillusioned a lot of console gamers and made them realize just how subpar consoles are to gaming PCs.
 

amenx

Diamond Member
Dec 17, 2004
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This screen was especially telling of nVidia's greed.
View attachment 71624
Ada is the first radical departure for Nvidia buyers in that price range to not find something suitable vs the competition. And is exactly is why many of them may make the break with Nv and go AMD this time around.

Jensen so dumb if he thought this will move 30 series cards. Only radical price cuts (3080 @ $500) can do that.
 
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Aapje

Golden Member
Mar 21, 2022
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The rest of the World has to deal with import taxes and VAT, so that definitely inflates the price significantly and makes it much more difficult to justify buying; especially with the RTX 4090 being an option. I think the average VAT for the E.U is around 20%, which must hurt a lot.

It does hurt a lot, but a key factor is that the euro dropped in value compared to the dollar. The euro used to be about 20% stronger, so about the VAT. So it seemed like you paid the same price as the US, because the exchange rate compensated for the VAT. That is no longer the case.

And energy prices have always been higher in the EU, in no small part due to heavy taxation, which means that the rising energy costs hurts Europeans more than Americans as well.
 

Carfax83

Diamond Member
Nov 1, 2010
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It does hurt a lot, but a key factor is that the euro dropped in value compared to the dollar. The euro used to be about 20% stronger, so about the VAT. So it seemed like you paid the same price as the US, because the exchange rate compensated for the VAT. That is no longer the case.

I should hope that I paid the same price as what Americans pay, as I'm American and I live in America :D

But my point was that it was demand that was driving the inflated price here in the U.S. The only place you could find RTX 4090s were on eBay and on Amazon (from resellers). All the stock was completely wiped out.

In the end I considered myself fortunate, because the Ampere prices at their height were much worse due to the Crypto nonsense and the chip shortage. I remember looking at RTX 3090 Tis and many were selling for $2500 and up......before taxes.

If GPU mining was still a thing then its conceivable that the RTX 4090 would be close to $3000.

And energy prices have always been higher in the EU, in no small part due to heavy taxation, which means that the rising energy costs hurts Europeans more than Americans as well.

I agree.
 

Alxender

Junior Member
Nov 24, 2022
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Timmah!

Golden Member
Jul 24, 2010
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I doubt it. I just checked Newegg's RTX 4080 inventory and they are completely out of stock so it is definitely selling. Amazon still have stock but it's dwindling rapidly.

The best place to get an RTX 480 would be a local brick and mortar store rather than any of the large online e-tailers that hardware enthusiasts and gamers frequent.

But anyone thinking or hoping the RTX 4080 isn't going to sell well is in for a rude awakening. The RTX 4080 is a solid high end card with exceptional performance per watt and great overall performance and feature set. It's more suited to 2K than 4K though.

Price and value are subject to market forces, and currently, they are not in favor of the consumer. Lack of strong competition, high demand and product scarcity are going to drive up prices. When RDNA3 becomes available and if it performs well enough, Nvidia may have to lower the prices.

If 4080 had 14k cores instead of slightly under 10k and say 20GB ram instead of 16, it would surely sell better.
People are just not stupid, they can run numbers and see that 4080 is worse deal than either 4090 or 3000 series cards. Nobody is crazy about product offering 2/3 performance (based on the specs) for 3/4 of price.
 
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jpiniero

Lifer
Oct 1, 2010
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If 4080 had 14k cores instead of slightly under 10k and say 20GB ram instead of 16, it would surely sell better.
People are just not stupid, they can run numbers and see that 4080 is worse deal than either 4090 or 3000 series cards. Nobody is crazy about product offering 2/3 performance (based on the specs) for 3/4 of price.

Maybe nVidia doesn't care and was willing to hang the 4080 out for the time being to try to push the 4090. The problem is they aren't fully supplying the 4090 either.
 

Timmah!

Golden Member
Jul 24, 2010
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Maybe nVidia doesn't care and was willing to hang the 4080 out for the time being to try to push the 4090. The problem is they aren't fully supplying the 4090 either.

i shall know, i ordered one and its still no show. This launch was supposed to be unlike Ampere and Turing, rumors of plenty of stock, but obligatory lies, its exactly the same, if not worse. Bunch of cards available at launch, sold out in first 5 minutes and then 2 months nothing.
 
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Carfax83

Diamond Member
Nov 1, 2010
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If 4080 had 14k cores instead of slightly under 10k and say 20GB ram instead of 16, it would surely sell better.
People are just not stupid, they can run numbers and see that 4080 is worse deal than either 4090 or 3000 series cards. Nobody is crazy about product offering 2/3 performance (based on the specs) for 3/4 of price.

Nvidia has pulled stunts like this before though. The RTX 3090 Ti had a launch price of $1999 for only being about 8% faster than the RTX 3090 ($1499) and 10% faster than the RTX 3080 Ti ($1119).

Yet the cards still sell, so that says something about the consumer's motivations and it doesn't appear to be completely practical and price conscious.
 
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PJVol

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May 25, 2020
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Yet the cards still sell, so that says something about the consumer's motivations and it doesn't appear to be completely practical and price conscious.
This is fair only for the top dog, that the 3090ti has become.
Anything below was imho always the subject of a detailed price/perf study before buying.
In this regard 4080 looks more like 3080ti to me.
 
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Aapje

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Mar 21, 2022
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The top card always has the benefit that those who care little to nothing about the price will buy it. The 3090/4090 Ti is also cheap to make since it is just a better binned version of the 3090/4090.

With the big price premium, they don't have to sell in huge numbers to be worth the effort.
 
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eek2121

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Aug 2, 2005
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If 4080 had 14k cores instead of slightly under 10k and say 20GB ram instead of 16, it would surely sell better.
People are just not stupid, they can run numbers and see that 4080 is worse deal than either 4090 or 3000 series cards. Nobody is crazy about product offering 2/3 performance (based on the specs) for 3/4 of price.
You grossly overestimate the intelligence of humanity.
 
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You grossly overestimate the intelligence of humanity.
Yeah a lot of people don't bother. They see how much money they have and buy whatever they can afford. Or if their friends have a 4080, they will also get a 4080. Why waste time researching? I asked a guy in office about his gaming PC specs. He was like, "I don't know. I just told the shopkeeper that I want to play games, he built me a PC and I paid. It plays whatever I want". How can one argue with people like that?
 
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Aapje

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Mar 21, 2022
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Still, there is a level of greediness where even the dumb people start to notice.

Lots of companies know to 'boil the frog,' for example by reducing the contents of the packaging while keeping the price the same and then later, offering a 'volume discount' for a larger package. Then after some time they reduce the contents again, etc. By doing this they can prevent customers from noticing that they pay more for less.

Nvidia is giving us horrible tiers, yet greatly increasing the pricing at the same time. For all the talk about how genius their marketing is and how horrible AMD is at it, Nvidia seem to be making a really dumb marketing mistake that was always going to cause enormous backlash, that even the dumb people are going to notice.

I think that Nvidia is very good at engineering, simply providing excellent products with a lot of innovation, but their marketing is actually quite poor. That AMD is not great at it and can't lean on superior exclusive features, doesn't suddenly make Nvidia's marketing genius.
 

eek2121

Diamond Member
Aug 2, 2005
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Still, there is a level of greediness where even the dumb people start to notice.

Lots of companies know to 'boil the frog,' for example by reducing the contents of the packaging while keeping the price the same and then later, offering a 'volume discount' for a larger package. Then after some time they reduce the contents again, etc. By doing this they can prevent customers from noticing that they pay more for less.

Nvidia is giving us horrible tiers, yet greatly increasing the pricing at the same time. For all the talk about how genius their marketing is and how horrible AMD is at it, Nvidia seem to be making a really dumb marketing mistake that was always going to cause enormous backlash, that even the dumb people are going to notice.

I think that Nvidia is very good at engineering, simply providing excellent products with a lot of innovation, but their marketing is actually quite poor. That AMD is not great at it and can't lean on superior exclusive features, doesn't suddenly make Nvidia's marketing genius.

Well, to be fair, Inflation has been BRUTAL. My total grocery bill would have gone up 261% between 2019 and today had I not changed what I buy. Example (compared to 2019):

Milk - 33% higher
Eggs - 300% higher
Soda - 100% higher
Fruit and Vegetables - 40% higher
Ground Beef - 200% higher.

NVIDIA is likely hoping consumers will blame price increases on inflation and pull the trigger anyway.

Also, TSMC charges far more for N5 than Samsung did for 8N or whatever their node is.

That being said, it is still a garbage price.

The funny thing is, only AMD wins in the end. NVIDIA sets the price ceiling for AMD every generation. AMD can charge just a bit less, and they make out like bandits. AMD's margins on the 7900xtx are going to be completely insane. Also, if a few former NVIDIA users buy AMD because of the pricing, AMD wins again. The only way AMD loses is if their GPUs sell poorly enough to hurt revenue.

If the 4080 sells poorly, perhaps NVIDIA will do what they've done in the past: release a faster model for less than the cost of the original. (The 8800gt vs 8800gts/gtx comes to mind)
 

Aapje

Golden Member
Mar 21, 2022
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I don't think that there are a lot of eggs in GPUs.

AMD also chose to use relatively cheap N6 chiplets for a large part of their GPU. Nvidia could have chosen the same, or at least they said so.

And if AMD manages to keep prices (almost) the same, then Nvidia's story falls apart.
 

Dribble

Platinum Member
Aug 9, 2005
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Yeah a lot of people don't bother. They see how much money they have and buy whatever they can afford. Or if their friends have a 4080, they will also get a 4080. Why waste time researching? I asked a guy in office about his gaming PC specs. He was like, "I don't know. I just told the shopkeeper that I want to play games, he built me a PC and I paid. It plays whatever I want". How can one argue with people like that?
It's how people buy most things - we can't all be experts in everything so we trust an expert to sell them something and if we see someone else with something that works we buy it too. Truth is all those 4080 buyers will be quite happy - it will play all their games just fine.

They will buy Nvidia in the same way I buy Bosch kitchen appliances. It costs more but at least I know it will work reliably for years, and I learned not to cut corners and go cheap because in the end it's more hassle and more cost because the cheap thing will probably break. Is there a cheap dishwasher that will work as well as the Bosch one I bought and last as long - probably but I am not going to become a dishwasher expert to find out. I just buy Bosch, it does what it says it will do and I am happy.