• We’re currently investigating an issue related to the forum theme and styling that is impacting page layout and visual formatting. The problem has been identified, and we are actively working on a resolution. There is no impact to user data or functionality, this is strictly a front-end display issue. We’ll post an update once the fix has been deployed. Thanks for your patience while we get this sorted.

3500 Winchester Running at 57C idle, 60+C (and crashing) in 3D applications

T

Tenstorey

Junior Member
Hi,

I recently purchased an Athlon Winchester 3500+ (Not OCed) and an Abit AV8-Third Eye motherboard (latest BIOS) and I'm having real problems with the CPU temperture. Reading up on other forums I should be running with the temp in the 50s max, if not less for a Winchester. The system has been crashing within minutes of 3D applications running, ok..games 😉 with the CPU temp swinging into the 60s almost instantly. With the case cover off it still soars into the 60s when rendering 3D. I am using the stock CPU cooler, and applyed a thin even layer of Thermaltake compound (It was all I could find in the shops) before sitting the cooler on the CPU. Using the supplied Guru Clock my current readings are 25C Room Temp, Sys Temp 30C and PWM 38C and CPU 57C while typing this post.

Any ideas on a possible cause? Would some new cpu paste or a better heatsink help, or is it possible that the heatsink is not sitting square on the CPU? Just wanted to see if anyone has had similar problems as I don't want to fry my Athlon while still in its first days of operation!

Thanks for any advice 🙁

Craig

System:
Athlon64 Winchester 3500+
Abit AV8-3rd Eye
1 Gig Twinmos 3200 RAM
Geforce 6800GT
Soundblaster Audigy
Antec Truepower 430W
 
doesn't the stock heatsink come with thermal putty on the bottom of it anyway? hope the hs fan is plugged in.

maybe you put too much thermal grease.
 
Yeah, did you remove the stock heatsink putty before putting on the thermal greese? What is your voltage to the CPU? Also, Abit's motherboards report temperatures, on average, 7-10 degrees C. higher than other manufactureres. According to the FAQ on their website, this is due to the fact that the temperature is actually calculated from the diode voltage. Abit claims to use the chipmaker's numbers. I've always noticed that Asus temperatures seem pretty low. Maybe they play with the numbers?
 
I did not remove the putty before adding the grease. Never read anywhere that you had too! Should I remove the putty from the heatsink and re-apply the grease? (or remove the grease and just leave the putty) If so, what is the best method of removing the grease prior to re-applying?

The fan is plugged in with RPM 2520.
 
Originally posted by: Tenstorey
I did not remove the putty before adding the grease. Never read anywhere that you had too! Should I remove the putty from the heatsink and re-apply the grease? (or remove the grease and just leave the putty) If so, what is the best method of removing the grease prior to re-applying?

The fan is plugged in with RPM 2520.
Click to expand...

Are you serious??????? No wonder it's running so damned HOT...

Look at Arctic Silver's site for instructions on their compound. Look at the heatsink they apply it to and the instructions for applying it. Do you SEE any thermal pad on that heatsink?? Didn't think so... Just adding thermal compound to a thermal pad is akin to adding a quart of oil to your engine and calling it an oil change. :disgust:
 
It sounds stuped, I know but hell, thats what I did. BUT, if you read the instructions that come boxed with the CPU it has the part that says 'READ THIS FIRST' and point 6 says 'Thermal interface material is required for all AMD processors...blah blah' does NOT say 'This heatsink ALREADY has or DOES NOT REQUIRE thermal material' Thats what threw me. 😱 Have I said enough to dig myself out of a very embarrasing situation!
 
Originally posted by: Tenstorey
Have I said enough to dig myself out of a very embarrasing situation!
Click to expand...

Nope... That grey square item on the heatsink should have raised alarms that could have woken the dead with you. Especially when you compare it to what is shown on the Arctic Silver site when they show the heatsink. PLUS the instructions on their site specifically state...

ONLY Arctic Silver thermal compound should be between the processor core and the heatsink. Remove any thermal pads or other interface material from the heatsink before applying the Arctic Silver.  Thermal pads can be scraped off with a plastic tool that will not scratch the bottom then the remnants can be removed with a xylene based cleaner, (Goof Off and some carburetor cleaners) acetone, mineral spirits, or high-purity isopropyl alcohol.
Click to expand...

See the instructions for AS5 here. Instructions for the rest of their compounds can be found here...
 
Nope... That grey square item on the heatsink should have raised alarms that could have woken the dead with you. Especially when you compare it to what is shown on the Arctic Silver site when they show the heatsink. PLUS the instructions on their site specifically state...
Click to expand...

Wow, what a dick you are. Everyone has to learn somewhere. We're not all born with giant after-market heatsinks and phat overclocking processors, you know...

Anyhow, I doubt Tenstorey posted here wanting to be called stupid, and he seems to have made a very reasonable and understandable mistake.

Just scrape that square of thermal material off as best you can without scratching up the heatsink. Clean it off as best you can with alcohol or something afterwards. Apply the thermal paste to the CPU core, then attach the heatsink.

Let us know your temps after you get it back up 🙂
 
Claiming to have not seen the clear instructions to REMOVE whatever compound is on the heatsink is not being smart. It's posted in clear English on the AS site as to what to do.

IF he had followed the instructions originally, there wouldn't be any issue with the temps being so bloody high.

Oh, and I've been working with different heatsinks in persuit of getting my system SILENT. I'm NOT overcocking my processor, nor will I. When it's time that I need more speed, I'll upgrade to the new, faster, better, processor.

Follow the instructions for your processor and the compound you are using TO THE LETTER... Use those instructions long before what someone else posts up trying to come off as some 'nice guy' and such. As usual a simple act of RTFM would have saved the person a lot of grief in his system.
 
I'd say be glad it was such a simple, easy-to-fix mistake. There are a lot of worse things than forgetting to remove the thermal pad before applying thermal grease.
 
Well, I hate to have to break this down, but akira, you are the biggest dick I've seen in a while and hate to have you attempt to further ruin our nice and happy community.

First of all, he bought thermaltake compound from a shop. He did not buy AS and had no reason to read AS's web site. And when was the last time you bought some thermaltake compound and examined the instructions that came with it?

And please stop preaching RTFM. That's exactly what he did and he was trying to explain it to you nicely before some roach crawled up your ass and you decided to take it out on him.

If you want to be an ass, please don't post and keep it to yourself next time 🙂
 
I've cleaned the heatsink and CPU and reapplied the paste as per the 'Arctic Silver' guidelines (Themaltake say's to see their own website for installation instructions but I sure can't find them!). Temps now sitting 53C idle and still touching 60C in 3D games. A big improvement but is it still not a little high?😕
 
Hmm...Still crashing but now I'm reading about older Antec 430s (Which I have) being problematic with this motherboard...Reboots and such like. Guess it might not of been the heat issue that was the original cause afterall, as I've been reading of people running much higher tempretures on the MB. It is running cooler now which is good but PSU issue is not what I wanted to hear. I bought the Antec for a previous upgrade as it was a recommend PSU. *sigh* Now more money to spash out! :disgust:
 
25C Room Temp, Sys Temp 30C and PWM 38C and CPU 57C
Click to expand...
Hmmm...

The delta between ambient and system temp is 5ºC, and the delta between the system and CPU is 27ºC. Ding! Ding! Ding! It's a CPU cooling problem.

Edit: Use some 90% isoprobyl alcohol to clean the old paste off.
 
Originally posted by: MrControversial
25C Room Temp, Sys Temp 30C and PWM 38C and CPU 57C
Click to expand...
Hmmm...

The delta between ambient and system temp is 5ºC, and the delta between the system and CPU is 27ºC. Ding! Ding! Ding! It's a CPU cooling problem.

Edit: Use some 90% isoprobyl alcohol to clean the old paste off.
Click to expand...

Ding! Ding! Ding! Great job figuring out what the rest of us, including the original poster, all-ready knew!

I personally use only goof-off to clean my CPU, GPU, and HSF's as it seems to work wonders. I highly suggest using a lint-proof cloth as well (glasses cleaning cloth works well and costs like $3 at a drug store).

As for your current problem, I would wait a few days and bear with the crashes. Arctic Silver, and I assume most other thermal greases, takes a few days to "settle". The exact number from AS is 200 hours. My personal experience puts it at 3-4 days of normal use with at least 12 hours of cool-down and as much 100% CPU utilization as I can in order to do a full thermal cycle. I usually drop around 4 c in idle temps after this.

If the crashes are still happening then it very well could be the PSU. Besides reading up on these problems you were hearing about I would watch the voltages for the PSU and see how much fluctuation you have during normal and heavy use. If there is a large change then perhaps that PSU just does not have the balls to power a system such as yours. I would start thinking about saving for a new one and contacting Antec to see if there is anything they can do. Decent powersupplies can run as low as $50 so you should not have to save a ton up. Hope that helps!

-spike
 
Thanks.

I've contacted Antec and they have advised me to RMA the PSU back to them to get a replacement so there must be something there.

Back to the tempertures...I' notice today that as soon as the machine cold boots (In a room of 19C) the CPU temp shows 45C within 4 seconds after being switched off for 8 hours. I can get the CPU temp quick because the motherboard comes suppled with a screen that shows the system details almost as soon as you press the power switch. If this is the case I don't think the readout can be accurate. a leap of 26C in 4 seconds is hard to believe so perhaps the temp probe is faulty?
 
Originally posted by: Tenstorey
Thanks.

I've contacted Antec and they have advised me to RMA the PSU back to them to get a replacement so there must be something there.

Back to the tempertures...I' notice today that as soon as the machine cold boots (In a room of 19C) the CPU temp shows 45C within 4 seconds after being switched off for 8 hours. I can get the CPU temp quick because the motherboard comes suppled with a screen that shows the system details almost as soon as you press the power switch. If this is the case I don't think the readout can be accurate. a leap of 26C in 4 seconds is hard to believe so perhaps the temp probe is faulty?
Click to expand...

No that's right, the CPU heats up very quickly once voltage is applied. Without the heatsink it would fry in a matter of seconds
 
I keep my apartment at about 64F during the day and 70F at night or when I'm home (weekends)... As such, my processor temp is typically 30-35C at idle be that from running all day/night (or several days) or after being off for a while and booting up. Load temps are typically under 45C during the same conditions.

I'd say you either need to get some better thermal grease, a better heatsink/fan combo, or both. I used AS Ceramique on my XP-120 with an Enermax 120mm fan on it (set to suck, not blow).With your processor, you should get as good, if not better temps than I do (believe the 90nm chips run cooler, pipe up if I'm wrong here).The XP-90 cooler should fit your mobo no matter which you have. Installation is fairly easy with it (as long as you read the instructions, not feed them to your pet) and you don't even need to remove the stock backplate (provided it's not plastic). The XP-120 used the stock backplate, even though the 948U that I had tested before needed a different one.
 
Reading through your post, I would guess you are using to much thermal compound. Artic Silver recommends less then a BB worth. I can't find thermaltake's compound instructions yet, but on their faq for cpu temperature they show a picture of someone putting on a tiny amount of compound:

http://www.thermaltake.com/support/faq.htm#q04

Try removing the heatsink again, cleaning off the heatsink and cpu, reapplying a tiny bit of thermal paste, spreading it around, and checking the temp.

To clean off the heatsink and cpu, use rubbing alcohol and lint free paper, like a coffee filter. Put the alcohol on the paper and gently wipe the heatsink and cpu. Make sure it is completely clean.

Here is a link to arctic silver's instructions (since I still can't find thermaltake's):

http://www.arcticsilver.com/ar...ilver_instructions.htm

If you are looking to try a different thermal compound then thermaltake, I noticed the CompUsa's in my area have arctic silver. If there is a CompUSA near you, check there.
 
The reference I've seen on the AS site mention 1/2 a BB worth, or an uncooked grain of rice (that's small)... You also need to put some on the heatsink, rub it in really well, then wipe off the excess (so that it just fills in the grains in the metal). Put the 1/2 BB worth on the processor heat spreader and seat the heatsink onto it. They give more detailed instructions, with pictures, so that just about anyone can do it. I really don't think AS could have made it any easier to follow their instructions.
 
Originally posted by: akira34
The reference I've seen on the AS site mention 1/2 a BB worth, or an uncooked grain of rice (that's small)... You also need to put some on the heatsink, rub it in really well, then wipe off the excess (so that it just fills in the grains in the metal). Put the 1/2 BB worth on the processor heat spreader and seat the heatsink onto it. They give more detailed instructions, with pictures, so that just about anyone can do it. I really don't think AS could have made it any easier to follow their instructions.
Click to expand...

Actually according to their website you no longer need to put any on the heatsink when you use AS 5, just put it on the center of the heatsink. The instructions might be different for AS Ceramique, though I am not sure. When I recently reapplied my arctic silver I did rub some into the heatsink (and cleaned off using just a cloth) and it works fine even though the instructions say you don't have to.

-spike
 
Originally posted by: akira34
The reference I've seen on the AS site mention 1/2 a BB worth, or an uncooked grain of rice (that's small)... You also need to put some on the heatsink, rub it in really well, then wipe off the excess (so that it just fills in the grains in the metal). Put the 1/2 BB worth on the processor heat spreader and seat the heatsink onto it. They give more detailed instructions, with pictures, so that just about anyone can do it. I really don't think AS could have made it any easier to follow their instructions.
Click to expand...



The instructions for an A64 are different. The link I posted explains it. It is 3/4 of a BB put in the center of the heatsink. Once the heatsink is mounted, twist it once in each direction one to two degrees if possible. No putting it on the heatsink, no rubbing it in really well, and no wiping off the excess. Just put on a bit on the center, make sure there are no foreign contaminants, mount the heatsink, twist heatsink if possible. The only thing I am unsure of is what to do if you can't twist the heatsink after it is mounted? I am guessing that you might hold the heatsink onto the cpu and twist and then mount. I don't think you want to place the whole weight of the heatsink on the cpu,but if you are supporting it, I would guess twisting it would be ok.
 
I followed that Athlon64 instuctions when I re-applied the grease. The only difference was that it is impossible to twist the heatsink at all on the motherboard. I think it would be near impossible to remove the CPU and twist it onto the heatsink then re-sit it in the motherboard again without seperating the two of them. (which would defeat the point of the action I believe)

Well, it now runs 51C idle so its better than it was!...But not much. Think I may order some Arctic Silver as it could be just poor thermal paste I have, and knowing the retailer where I bought it probably the cheapest he could get. 😉
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

TRENDING THREADS

Back
Top