$250,000 if you can provide proof of "evolution"

[Fausto]

Originally posted by: LordJezo

Originally posted by: notfred

Originally posted by: LordJezo
you put just as much faith in your theory as I do my God.

Not really. over the past 100 years, people have constantly revised evolutionary theory. As people have come up with better explanations for how life came to be, the newer and better supported material was incorporated into a constantly changing scientific theory.

When was the last time your bible/koran/whatever book was updated due to a new scientific discovery?

Explain to me the Cambrian explosion then..

And about creation not being updated.. I guess you don't know to much about creation science then.

"Creation science".

Biggest. Oxymoron. Ever.

 

[johnjohn320]

Looks like it's time for the weekly Creation vs. Evolution thread.

Guys, I mean, c'mon. Does it really matter? Is it worth getting angry about?

Some people (like me) support the theory of evolution. Others believe God created the world 10,000 years ago. Others believe in Allah. Others follow Buddah.

"But when it all comes down to a hole in the ground, does it really matter at all?"

Of course, being agnostic, it's probably pretty easy for me to say all this. Heh, come to think of it, agnostic is sort of the lazy, apathetic belief structure isn't it? Fits me to a tee.

 

[notfred]

Originally posted by: LordJezo

Originally posted by: notfred

Originally posted by: LordJezo
you put just as much faith in your theory as I do my God.

Not really. over the past 100 years, people have constantly revised evolutionary theory. As people have come up with better explanations for how life came to be, the newer and better supported material was incorporated into a constantly changing scientific theory.

When was the last time your bible/koran/whatever book was updated due to a new scientific discovery?

Explain to me the Cambrian explosion then..

And about creation not being updated.. I guess you don't know to much about creation science then.

I can't explain the Cambrian explosion because I'm not a Palientologist. Actually, I had to go to Google to find out what it even was, so as you can see, I'm not the best person to explain it.

"Creation science" as a phrase is an oxymoron.

Science: The observation, identification, description, experimental investigation, and theoretical explanation of phenomena.

You see that in science, a theory is formed based on observation. In your "creation science" the theory is formed beforehand and then the so called "scientist" looks for any possible evidence supporting this thoery. It hardly jives with the scientific method, you can't do it backwards.

 

[Ryan]

While I believe in evolution, I respect others opinions and beliefs and encourage everyone to develope their own ideas of how we were created.

That said, honestly, when I was I child, I thought the idea of a mythical being who has power, etc, to be rediculous. I believe that Humans created gods thousands of years ago out of the neccessity to not feel alone in our universe, and to explain things that they couldn't understand. Another thing that confuses me, why are their so many religions on earth that differ so much. In the large spectrum of human history, Christianity is a relatively new religion.

 

[jaeger66]

Why argue? Religion can be used to explain absolutely anything. One you decide that religion is the ultimate truth there is no more need for logic, as your position has become infallible.

 

[Pacfanweb]

The bible was written by people who thought the earth was flat, knew nothing about the dinosaurs, and we're supposed to simply believe it over everything that has been learned since then?

Not saying that there is not validity to the book, but you can find discrepancies all throughout it without even looking hard.

As for proving evolution doesn't exist, fine. Prove that creation happened. You can't. So neither side can prove it, but evolution can be proved through the fossil record and many, many other ways.

I vote for all religious topics to be banned from now on.

 

[Angrymarshmello]

That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen. No one can truly prove their case, for both sides. One side will say that the Bible is crap, the other side will say that the Australopithecus fossils prove nothing, blah blah blah. What's the point?

 

[Mani]

Why do God and evolution have to be mutually exclusive? Evolution is definitely not proven, but there's a hell of a lot more evidence going for it than saying 6000 years ago two people started the entire human race after listening to a talking snake and eating an evil apple.

 

[Chrishuff1]

I agree, I think all religious topics should be banned, it just gets so many people here in AT pissed off at each other. What do you think mods?

 

[notfred]

Originally posted by: Mani
Why do God and evolution have to be mutually exclusive?

They definitely don't. Anyone who says so is being extremely closed minded.

 

[busmaster11]

I'm glad to see that Creationism or Evolution via Intelligent design as I prefer to call it, has a stronger following here that I expected.

I look at it this way. It is true that out of the following only the last statement has been observed, and the first five are still unproven:

Cosmic evolution- the origin of time, space and matter. Big Bang
Chemical evolution- the origin of higher elements from hydrogen.
Stellar and planetary evolution- Origin of stars and planets.
Organic evolution- Origin of life from inanimate matter.
Macroevolution Origin of major kinds.
Microevolution Variations within kinds.

I also believe that the fossil record that evolution via Intelligent design would leave behind would look very similiar to what we observe today..

- early prokaryotes to help generate an oxygen-rich atmosphere and to get rid of poisonous gases
- sudden spurts of new and different species (known as punctuated equilibrium, its left geneticists with an awful lot to explain)
- no transitional forms
- a general vertibrate template of a spine and four limbs, specialized for the habitat -

Lastly, there are like 50-some constants in the universe, from the mass and charge of an electron to the gravitational constant to the ratio of deuterium to helium or something like that, plus many others, that if a single one was off by even a tiny percentage the universe would fail to support life.

This fact alone - leads strongly to one of two conclusions - an Intelligent Creator, or the anthropic principle, which says basically that the universe is like this simply because we are here to observe it. IOW - we won the lottery...

I tend to go with God, thank you.

 

[Feldenak]

Isn't evolution strictly defined as "change over time"?

 

[reitz]

Originally posted by: LordJezo
Think you can do it?

I doubt it.

That's what make all you evolutionists so great.. you put just as much faith in your theory as I do my God.

Actually, I'd wager that I put a lot more "faith" into my "theory" than you do your god. You've got nothing to go on but a 2000-old-book, blind faith, and profound ignorance of the science of evolution, while I have volumes of scientific research and an entire branch of biology supporting my stance.

If you really wish to debate evolution, why not actually discuss the ideas you take issue with? Posting an error-filled website with an agenda doesn't get a very good point across...but asking intelligent questions and making rational arguments does.

A long the same lines as what the author of that horrid website is trying to do:

I'll pay anyone here $250,000 if he can offer me proof that the bible was divinely inspired, or that any god exists.

 

[Dragnov]

Originally posted by: LordJezo
Think you can do it?

I doubt it.

That's what make all you evolutionists so great.. you put just as much faith in your theory as I do my God.

I agree and I'm agnostic. I don't believe either the existence of God or evolution has or will be proven completeley. Both ultimately seem to rely on "faith" when it boils down to it IMO.

However, I don't enjoy either sides trying to shove their beliefs upon others constantly. Why can't we just let people be?

 

[Barnaby W. Füi]

You can't prove anything. You can't prove that our universe isn't just a speck of dust on some alien elephant's butt. You can't prove that there are only 4 dimensions, you can't prove there are any finite number of dimensions. You can't prove ANYTHING. Every theory about our existance is wrong and small-minded, so I'd call most people idiots just for thinking they have "the answer". People naturally want to be able to answer all of their own questions. Some do it with religion, some do it with science. Either way they're all wrong. So STFU ALREADY!

 

[Barnaby W. Füi]

Actually, I'd wager that I put a lot more "faith" into my "theory" than you do your god.

I'd wager my rusty pickup truck is faster than your rusty pickup truck!

You've got nothing to go on but a 2000-old-book, blind faith, and profound ignorance of the science of evolution, while I have volumes of scientific research and an entire branch of biology supporting my stance.

There were volumes of research and entire branches of science for alot of ideas that are now obsolete.


Not trying to flame or make a personal attack, just trying to help the "scientific minded" people be a little more scientific... Although the original post and link were stupid, he did make a good point that evolutionists rely on faith just as much as creationists.

 

[Antny]

The only thing I have to add to this is that applying the term evolution to anything other than biology is a misnomer. For information on the creation of the universe you need to talk to a physicist. For that reason alone the link at the top is incorrect. Evolution is the change in biological populations over time through natural selection and several other processes.

As far as God and evolution being exclusive, I suggest taking a look at Jane Goodall's book "Reason for Hope". She has a unique balance between the two ideas.

 

[FrustratedUser]

OK, Who hijacked my steak thread?

 

[Spac3d]

Originally posted by: LordJezo
Think you can do it?

I doubt it.

That's what make all you evolutionists so great.. you put just as much faith in your theory as I do my God.

While I believe in evolution, I do not believe in the idiotic, mislead beliefs of religious fanatics, especially the Christian society as they feel their opinion is absolute because they said so.

Clearly you are an uneducated buffoon. First of all you are taking a small minority?s opinion. I have previously had this argument with a Baptist friend of mine. He claimed all Christians believe evolution is a conspiracy. It was really cool this one time he included Catholics in Christendom as they constitute the majority of that faith. Even so, Catholics believe in evolution, even teach it in Catholic school and have been graded highly in national surveys.

Secondly, your proof is clearly defined to be improvable and there are several inconsistencies. The universe forming spontaneously from gas and dust is a separate issue from evolution. I fail to see how evolution pertains to astrophysics. Let us stick to one evolution at a time instead of mixing a bunch of theories together and labeling them as a single ?religious belief.? Evolution is not taught as a fact in public schools. In fact it has always been called the ?theory of evolution.? If we think real hard about what a theory is, we realize it is an idea that has not been disproved for a very long time.

I think you are confusing evolution with La Marck?s theory of acquired characteristics, where the parents stretch their heads to reach higher leaves so that their children are born with longer necks. This is not evolution. Evolution is a very slow process. For example, by evolution standards it took approximately 2 million years for homo sapiens to develop from the first hominids. Even you must admit man has not been around for more than 100,000 years, which is a small amount of time to notice changes.

This I found particularly interesting:
?It is my contention that evolutionism is a religious worldview that is not supported by science, Scripture, popular opinion, or common sense.?
So your contention is that science is a religion that does not support its own belief as a majority of scientists believe in evolution? I also do not see where scripture disputes evolution. And if the majority of the civilized world accepts evolution with their common sense, what the fvck are you talking about?

How you can accept microevolution and not macroevolution is beyond me. Can these minor differences and variations add up over billions of years? Oh but you believe the earth is one or so million years old I?m sure. What proof you have of this is beyond me, aside from careful and tedious speculation based from the Bible. You fools need to burn that book. You only pull it out to find a phrase that supports your opinion and ignore the other who knows how many (yeah I know you do).

I suggest you step out of the Middle Ages because you are wasting your life. You know there are further extremes of your group; going as far as to believe the world is flat. One of the heads of this organization was shown a picture of the earth from outer space. I would think that would be empirical evidence enough for him to admit his err. His response was, however, ?I guess I can see how that might confuse some of you.? So you can take your $250,000 and shove it. Do you have this money? or do you just think that offering a fake prize that is unattainable is going to convert people to your sad, mislead world?

 

[Spac3d]

Not trying to flame or make a personal attack, just trying to help the "scientific minded" people be a little more scientific... Although the original post and link were stupid, he did make a good point that evolutionists rely on faith just as much as creationists.

Evolutionists do not rely on faith. They rely on thousands of man hours studying things I find rediculously boring like Finches, bones, and earthworms. Creationists rely on blind faith. They are a dying breed and should stop fighting.
I offer 10 million dollars if anyone can provide empirical evidence God even exists. (By the way the Bible is out. Its circular logic is neither empirical or evidence).

 

[Ryan]

Originally posted by: Spac3d

Not trying to flame or make a personal attack, just trying to help the "scientific minded" people be a little more scientific... Although the original post and link were stupid, he did make a good point that evolutionists rely on faith just as much as creationists.

Evolutionists do not rely on faith. They rely on thousands of man hours studying things I find rediculously boring like Finches, bones, and earthworms. Creationists rely on blind faith. They are a dying breed and should stop fighting. I offer 10 million dollars if anyone can provide empirical evidence God even exists. (By the way the Bible is out. Its circular logic is neither empirical or evidence).

I'll chip into that amount too - Make it $10,000,001

 

[tweakmm]

Originally posted by: Spac3d

Originally posted by: LordJezo
Think you can do it?

I doubt it.

That's what make all you evolutionists so great.. you put just as much faith in your theory as I do my God.

While I believe in evolution, I do not believe in the idiotic, mislead beliefs of religious fanatics, especially the Christian society as they feel their opinion is absolute because they said so.

Clearly you are an uneducated buffoon. First of all you are taking a small minority?s opinion. I have previously had this argument with a Baptist friend of mine. He claimed all Christians believe evolution is a conspiracy. It was really cool this one time he included Catholics in Christendom as they constitute the majority of that faith. Even so, Catholics believe in evolution, even teach it in Catholic school and have been graded highly in national surveys.

Secondly, your proof is clearly defined to be improvable and there are several inconsistencies. The universe forming spontaneously from gas and dust is a separate issue from evolution. I fail to see how evolution pertains to astrophysics. Let us stick to one evolution at a time instead of mixing a bunch of theories together and labeling them as a single ?religious belief.? Evolution is not taught as a fact in public schools. In fact it has always been called the ?theory of evolution.? If we think real hard about what a theory is, we realize it is an idea that has not been disproved for a very long time.

I think you are confusing evolution with La Marck?s theory of acquired characteristics, where the parents stretch their heads to reach higher leaves so that their children are born with longer necks. This is not evolution. Evolution is a very slow process. For example, by evolution standards it took approximately 2 million years for homo sapiens to develop from the first hominids. Even you must admit man has not been around for more than 100,000 years, which is a small amount of time to notice changes.

This I found particularly interesting:
?It is my contention that evolutionism is a religious worldview that is not supported by science, Scripture, popular opinion, or common sense.?
So your contention is that science is a religion that does not support its own belief as a majority of scientists believe in evolution? I also do not see where scripture disputes evolution. And if the majority of the civilized world accepts evolution with their common sense, what the fvck are you talking about?

How you can accept microevolution and not macroevolution is beyond me. Can these minor differences and variations add up over billions of years? Oh but you believe the earth is one or so million years old I?m sure. What proof you have of this is beyond me, aside from careful and tedious speculation based from the Bible. You fools need to burn that book. You only pull it out to find a phrase that supports your opinion and ignore the other who knows how many (yeah I know you do).

I suggest you step out of the Middle Ages because you are wasting your life. You know there are further extremes of your group; going as far as to believe the world is flat. One of the heads of this organization was shown a picture of the earth from outer space. I would think that would be empirical evidence enough for him to admit his err. His response was, however, ?I guess I can see how that might confuse some of you.? So you can take your $250,000 and shove it. Do you have this money? or do you just think that offering a fake prize that is unattainable is going to convert people to your sad, mislead world?

Tell us how you really feel

 

[Barnaby W. Füi]

Originally posted by: Spac3d

Not trying to flame or make a personal attack, just trying to help the "scientific minded" people be a little more scientific... Although the original post and link were stupid, he did make a good point that evolutionists rely on faith just as much as creationists.

Evolutionists do not rely on faith. They rely on thousands of man hours studying things I find rediculously boring like Finches, bones, and earthworms. Creationists rely on blind faith. They are a dying breed and should stop fighting.
I offer 10 million dollars if anyone can provide empirical evidence God even exists. (By the way the Bible is out. Its circular logic is neither empirical or evidence).

They rely on thousands of man hours of studying things with the five senses humans possess. You may believe what you want, but I believe that our view of the universe and everything else that makes up reality is an infinitesimally small one. You can think you have the answers all you want, but I'd hate to be that closed minded.

And yeah, for me, it's a given that most any religiously based beliefs about even somewhat scientific things are usually ridiculous. Not even worth wasting breath on IMO.

 

[her209]

You can prove evolution through mathematical induction.

 

[0roo0roo]

isn't that like trying to prove where an electron is at any moment around an atom? u cant.

doesn't mean the electron doesn't exist.


fools errands.

people unwilling to put their own believes up to the lofty standards they put on others. its like me believing in santa yet laughing at you for not proving the existence of jesus and his divinity to my satisfaction