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.22LR not a good round for defense?

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TallBill

Lifer
Apr 29, 2001
46,044
62
91
Originally posted by: ADDAvenger
Pretty much what I figured, I may have to rethink my strategy and just put a .22 in them with no warning.
Ah, you are getting close. You want to ambush them with your 12 guage instead though. No warning, maximum damage. Its not a guaranteed one shot one kill, but your odds of survival are much higher then laying in wait with a .22
 

uli2000

Golden Member
Jul 28, 2006
1,257
0
71
Originally posted by: upsciLLion
It doesn't cause enough tissue trauma.
Depends where you put it. In the head, their lethal. As a student I saw a guy in the ER who got shot with a .22 right behind the ear into the skull (was a drug dealer hit). The bullet rattled around inside his head and scrambled his brain into mush.
 

IGBT

Lifer
Jul 16, 2001
17,744
53
91
Originally posted by: TallBill
If you don't practice enough to use your firearm then thats your own damn fault. I'm not recomending using a bolt action 30-06. My wife can put all 15 rounds out of her Glock 19 on a man sized target at 15 feet after just a few trips to the range. Its not that hard.

Anyways, IGBT, I find it hilarious that you say that I know nothing about ballistics, and then instead argue about training. Which is it? Do I know nothing about ballistics or training?

..search your conscience for your own answers on what you know or don't know. Credible fire arm instructors know as sectional density increases in a projectile the difficulty of mastering proficiency increases which is why police are required to "qualify" annually or semi annually with their service weapon.

 

jlee

Lifer
Sep 12, 2001
48,510
219
106
Originally posted by: uli2000
Originally posted by: upsciLLion
It doesn't cause enough tissue trauma.
Depends where you put it. In the head, their lethal. As a student I saw a guy in the ER who got shot with a .22 right behind the ear into the skull (was a drug dealer hit). The bullet rattled around inside his head and scrambled his brain into mush.
Nobody's saying a .22 can't kill you. However, look at the difference when next to, say, a .357Sig...pic

Gun pr0n :D
 

upsciLLion

Diamond Member
Feb 21, 2001
5,947
1
81
Originally posted by: CadetLee
Originally posted by: uli2000
Originally posted by: upsciLLion
It doesn't cause enough tissue trauma.
Depends where you put it. In the head, their lethal. As a student I saw a guy in the ER who got shot with a .22 right behind the ear into the skull (was a drug dealer hit). The bullet rattled around inside his head and scrambled his brain into mush.
Nobody's saying a .22 can't kill you. However, look at the difference when next to, say, a .357Sig...pic

Gun pr0n :D
.357 Sig is no substitute for the original. :cool:
 

jlee

Lifer
Sep 12, 2001
48,510
219
106
Originally posted by: upsciLLion
Originally posted by: CadetLee
Originally posted by: uli2000
Originally posted by: upsciLLion
It doesn't cause enough tissue trauma.
Depends where you put it. In the head, their lethal. As a student I saw a guy in the ER who got shot with a .22 right behind the ear into the skull (was a drug dealer hit). The bullet rattled around inside his head and scrambled his brain into mush.
Nobody's saying a .22 can't kill you. However, look at the difference when next to, say, a .357Sig...pic

Gun pr0n :D
.357 Sig is no substitute for the original. :cool:
I like having 13 on tap, and two sets of 12 waiting.. ;)
 

upsciLLion

Diamond Member
Feb 21, 2001
5,947
1
81
Originally posted by: CadetLee
Originally posted by: upsciLLion
Originally posted by: CadetLee
Originally posted by: uli2000
Originally posted by: upsciLLion
It doesn't cause enough tissue trauma.
Depends where you put it. In the head, their lethal. As a student I saw a guy in the ER who got shot with a .22 right behind the ear into the skull (was a drug dealer hit). The bullet rattled around inside his head and scrambled his brain into mush.
Nobody's saying a .22 can't kill you. However, look at the difference when next to, say, a .357Sig...pic

Gun pr0n :D
.357 Sig is no substitute for the original. :cool:
I like having 13 on tap, and two sets of 12 waiting.. ;)
Your aim's that *****, huh? ;)
 

jlee

Lifer
Sep 12, 2001
48,510
219
106
Originally posted by: upsciLLion
Originally posted by: CadetLee
Originally posted by: upsciLLion
Originally posted by: CadetLee
Originally posted by: uli2000
Originally posted by: upsciLLion
It doesn't cause enough tissue trauma.
Depends where you put it. In the head, their lethal. As a student I saw a guy in the ER who got shot with a .22 right behind the ear into the skull (was a drug dealer hit). The bullet rattled around inside his head and scrambled his brain into mush.
Nobody's saying a .22 can't kill you. However, look at the difference when next to, say, a .357Sig...pic

Gun pr0n :D
.357 Sig is no substitute for the original. :cool:
I like having 13 on tap, and two sets of 12 waiting.. ;)
Your aim's that *****, huh? ;)
Backup is the next town over. ;)
 

JEDI

Lifer
Sep 25, 2001
27,422
1,402
126
Originally posted by: SilthDraeth
*Let me clarify, this isn't a post saying that a .22LR should be purchased as a self defense weapon, there are clearly better choices for self defense. But that doesn't mean it can't double as one.*

I never really understood why so many people believe a .22LR isn't lethal, or can't stop someone trying to hurt you.

I have heard such myths, that the bullets can't even penetrate someones skull. That if you shot a strong guy in the chest, it wouldn't even go through his chest muscle, or sometimes it won't even break his skin...etc etc.

What a bunch of bullshit. Sure, a .357 magnum will knock a guy down if you hit him in the shoulder, and a .22 will just hurt really damn bad. Sure a .22LR isn't going to do much if a guy has full body armor on. It isn't an armor piercing round, and it doesn't have a lot of mass. But against an unarmored person, an accurately placed shot is still very lethal up to 100+ yards away. And I can sure as hell take a 10/22 with a scope, and place 10 shots within 4 inches of each other at 100 yards easily, and rather quickly. Without a scope I could still probably get a head shot on a human being at 100 yards without to much trouble. I know I can hit a paper plate rather easily at that distance.

This is my personal experience. I haven't ever had to shoot a person, but I have shot plenty of miscellaneous objects, from wood, to different gauges of steel, old cars, water tanks, wood, etc.

Plus you can get banana magazines. 25 rounds per magazine, and they are back to back, giving you 50 rounds, and it only takes about 3 seconds or less to flip the magazine over.
pic of said weapon w/dual 25 banana clips?
 

jlee

Lifer
Sep 12, 2001
48,510
219
106
Originally posted by: JEDI
Originally posted by: SilthDraeth
*Let me clarify, this isn't a post saying that a .22LR should be purchased as a self defense weapon, there are clearly better choices for self defense. But that doesn't mean it can't double as one.*

I never really understood why so many people believe a .22LR isn't lethal, or can't stop someone trying to hurt you.

I have heard such myths, that the bullets can't even penetrate someones skull. That if you shot a strong guy in the chest, it wouldn't even go through his chest muscle, or sometimes it won't even break his skin...etc etc.

What a bunch of bullshit. Sure, a .357 magnum will knock a guy down if you hit him in the shoulder, and a .22 will just hurt really damn bad. Sure a .22LR isn't going to do much if a guy has full body armor on. It isn't an armor piercing round, and it doesn't have a lot of mass. But against an unarmored person, an accurately placed shot is still very lethal up to 100+ yards away. And I can sure as hell take a 10/22 with a scope, and place 10 shots within 4 inches of each other at 100 yards easily, and rather quickly. Without a scope I could still probably get a head shot on a human being at 100 yards without to much trouble. I know I can hit a paper plate rather easily at that distance.

This is my personal experience. I haven't ever had to shoot a person, but I have shot plenty of miscellaneous objects, from wood, to different gauges of steel, old cars, water tanks, wood, etc.

Plus you can get banana magazines. 25 rounds per magazine, and they are back to back, giving you 50 rounds, and it only takes about 3 seconds or less to flip the magazine over.
pic of said weapon w/dual 25 banana clips?
Here's pics of 25rd magazines..
http://www.gunaccessories.com/1022/magsloaders.asp
 

Raduque

Lifer
Aug 22, 2004
13,134
135
106
Originally posted by: TallBill
Originally posted by: Kelvrick

Aren't you told 2 to central mass, 1 to the head if its still there? For all we know, he could be wearing body armor.

EDIT: And yea, recoil would help someone miss high. Anyone who's tried rapid firing without training should be able to attest to this.
"Officially" no, I've never been taught that. But those rules don't apply in the civilian world anyways. If 3 shots is what is necessary to stop an attacker/intruder, then so be it. But when they find a bullet entering the brain from the rear you can enjoy your time in prison, unless you can write a really creative sworn statement.
So turn the intruder over :p
 

SilthDraeth

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2003
2,635
0
71
Originally posted by: TallBill
Originally posted by: SilthDraeth

Any how the heck did your friend manage to find himself the target of a glancing blow from a 7.62x39?
Not a friend, but thats what happens during wars. I actually know two people that have been shot in the head and were ok. The glancing blow, then in another instance a round struck the kevlar, rode the interior, and then sliced off a chunk of the back of his head. Just a flesh wound though. About a quarter of an inch lower and his head would have turned into sloppy joe.
Aww, in war time. Fortunately I never got fired at during my time in the service.
 

TallBill

Lifer
Apr 29, 2001
46,044
62
91
Originally posted by: IGBT

..search your conscience for your own answers on what you know or don't know. Credible fire arm instructors know as sectional density increases in a projectile the difficulty of mastering proficiency increases which is why police are required to "qualify" annually or semi annually with their service weapon.

Stop being a retard. If you have any firearm for home defense it is your responsibility to practice with it every so often as well, whether it be chambered in 22LR or 458 socom.

Btw, you are extra retarded for using "sectional density". I've met plenty of "credible firearm instructors" and not one of them has ever said that. Stop talking out of your ass.
 

SilthDraeth

Platinum Member
Oct 28, 2003
2,635
0
71
Originally posted by: CadetLee
Originally posted by: TallBill
Originally posted by: BrunoPuntzJones
When loading the M2 into the truck, the soldier used the palm of his hand on the end of the barrel to push it into the truck bed. The trigger caught on something, discharging the .50BMG round through his hand and into his chest.

The report recounts that the guy stood there for several seconds, kind of looking around, taking in what had happened, before collapsing to the ground. He actually lived a few minutes, but obviously nothing could be done to save him.

So even the mighty ma deuce won't do anything in regards to movement, even at point blank.


You can shoot 15 different people in the same way and get 15 completely different outcomes, regardless of the bullet used.
^ What he said.

Trooper Mark Coates - murdered with a .22 derringer. The attacker was struck with five shots from the Trooper's .357 Magnum and was conscious when paramedics arrived.

However, that doesn't mean I'll trade my .357Sig in for a .22lr. ;)
RIP
 

RadiclDreamer

Diamond Member
Aug 8, 2004
8,621
38
91
Originally posted by: upsciLLion
It doesn't cause enough tissue trauma.
No, but the sound and the small hole will be enough to send most criminals running. The majority are cowards
 

pontifex

Lifer
Dec 5, 2000
43,806
44
91
Originally posted by: uli2000
Originally posted by: upsciLLion
It doesn't cause enough tissue trauma.
Depends where you put it. In the head, their lethal. As a student I saw a guy in the ER who got shot with a .22 right behind the ear into the skull (was a drug dealer hit). The bullet rattled around inside his head and scrambled his brain into mush.
and how often in self defense do you get the chance to shoot a guy right behind the ear??

no one is saying that the .22 can't be lethal. we're saying it's not a good self defense weapon. there are too many factors to make it lethal or it takes tme to make it lethal. in a self defense situation, you want the lethality (is that a word?) to be immediate and not rely on 20 other factors.
 

pontifex

Lifer
Dec 5, 2000
43,806
44
91
Originally posted by: waggy
Originally posted by: BoberFett
Originally posted by: sponge008
Everyone knows the deagle in .50 is best.
Does anybody who actually owns and/or has fired a Desert Eagle actually call it a "deagle" or is that just a term coined by Counterstrike playing nerds?
never fired one but i have got to hold one! My little brother from the big brother program is in the milatary and a gun nut. he has a nice collection of guns. i was shocked at how big and heavy it was. Not to mention how fucking loud it was when fired.
my uncle sells guns as part of his business. he got in a desert eagle once (not sure what caliber though) and I saw it and held it. they are freaking huge and heavy.
 

K1052

Lifer
Aug 21, 2003
37,814
12,551
136
Originally posted by: RadiclDreamer
Originally posted by: sponge008
Everyone knows the deagle in .50 is best.
You play too much counter strike if you are calling it a DEAGLE outside of game
Its a sh!tty gun anyway.
 

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