2017 had the worst job growth since 2012

Commodus

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 2004
8,615
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Over the February-to-November period, there were 1.7 million new jobs, which sounds good... until you realize that it's the lowest growth since 2012, when there were 1.54 million added over the same period. There was significantly higher growth through, well, most of Obama's tenure -- including earlier (1.83 million added in 2011).

Now, this doesn't mean the Trump administration is singlehandedly to blame, but it does mean that its claims of boosting job growth are (surprise!) blatant lies. At best, there were circumstances outside of its control; at worst, what measures it has implemented haven't been effective.

So if the vote for Trump was supposedly about jobs, and this trend keeps up, that means Trump is failing at his core objective.
 
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HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
28,886
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Plenty here think Trump gets credit for record stock market so I guess he owns this one.
 

Bitek

Diamond Member
Aug 2, 2001
9,871
4,032
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Clearly we need you have our trillions to corporations to keep the gravy train flowing...


All in all this makes sense though in the long are off the recovery since 2009. Unemployment has fallen dramatically, wages are stubbornly showing some movement (due to being an employee's market) and inflation is registering a pulse.
How much further can we expect unemployment to fall?

I'm wondering how far we have until the next recession. Looks to me we are near the end of the cycle.

What bad timing this could turn out to be. Trump pass useless tax cuts, kicks the legs out from the economic stabilizers, and we hit recession with soaring deficits and little room or competence to maneuver.
At least it could make elections decisive.
 
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Nov 30, 2006
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I'm just sure that full employment has nothing to do with it. /s

But by all means continue with your lunacy...it's quite entertaining to watch.
 

cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
17,533
7,090
136
I'm just sure that full employment has nothing to do with it. /s

But by all means continue with your lunacy...it's quite entertaining to watch.
OP was so very clinical and objective. Leave it to the toddler disciples to throw their own feces around though
 
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Thump553

Lifer
Jun 2, 2000
12,017
1,370
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I'm just sure that full employment has nothing to do with it. /s

But by all means continue with your lunacy...it's quite entertaining to watch.
But if we are at full employment, why was the GOP/Trump tax cut heavily promoted as an employment booster? Or was that just last week's talking point, now expired?

BTW I have seen next to no evidence of rising wages, which is the best indicator we are reaching "full" employment.
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
74,259
26,777
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I'm just sure that full employment has nothing to do with it. /s

But by all means continue with your lunacy...it's quite entertaining to watch.
Wait, I thought we were nowhere close to full employment and that unemployment was a lie because of low workforce participation rates? Did that mysteriously change in January, 2017 too?
 
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Thebobo

Lifer
Jun 19, 2006
18,592
7,668
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But if we are at full employment, why was the GOP/Trump tax cut heavily promoted as an employment booster? Or was that just last week's talking point, now expired?

BTW I have seen next to no evidence of rising wages, which is the best indicator we are reaching "full" employment.
It's like if border crossing has pretty much stopped why do we need to build a wall?

Because Trump!
 

tweaker2

Lifer
Aug 5, 2000
12,664
4,098
136
Over the February-to-November period, there were 1.7 million new jobs, which sounds good... until you realize that it's the lowest growth since 2012, when there were 1.54 million added over the same period. There was significantly higher growth through, well, most of Obama's tenure -- including earlier (1.83 million added in 2011).

Now, this doesn't mean the Trump administration is singlehandedly to blame, but it does mean that its claims of boosting job growth are (surprise!) blatant lies. At best, there were circumstances outside of its control; at worst, what measures it has implemented haven't been effective.

So if the vote for Trump was supposedly about jobs, and this trend keeps up, that means Trump is failing at his core objective.
Doesn't matter what the facts point to. As we all know, there is this special bond, this spiritual connection between Trump and his disciples. Whatever lies....errr, prophesy and sermon comes out of that sewer pipe below his nose is held as the the indisputable truth, confirmed and authenticated by none other than FOX News from which Trump got his sermon material in the first place.

This tight little loop, this pact of faith is made impenetrable by all parties involved as it is understood that there is no other source of guidance and comfort of higher authority, thus the scripture disseminated from within is the exclusive, genuine word from on high, the President of the Divided States of America.

The beauty of this arrangement? Once The Word comes out of Trump there is no need to verify. No desire to confirm. He has spoken and for all intent and purpose that's all his followers need to know. For some, their voting for Trump is their confirmation of loyalty and now their duty is done. They can now completely divorce themselves from the information chain until the next rally group hug Trump calls for or until it's time to vote again.
 
Nov 30, 2006
15,456
389
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Wait, I thought we were nowhere close to full employment and that unemployment was a lie because of low workforce participation rates? Did that mysteriously change in January, 2017 too?
I assume you're talking about something I said in the past. Care to enlighten us as to context...and especially the unemployment level at that time?
 
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fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
74,259
26,777
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I assume you're talking about something I said in the past. Care to enlighten us as to context...and especially the unemployment level at that time
I don't know if you said it in the past, but lots of conservatives did. Basically unemployment has been at 5% or less for the last two years, which is a very low level. Until this year we were repeatedly informed by conservatives that number was a sham because workforce participation rate was low. It still is, but suddenly that doesn't seem to matter to conservatives anymore and I find the motivated reasoning interesting.
 
Nov 30, 2006
15,456
389
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But if we are at full employment, why was the GOP/Trump tax cut heavily promoted as an employment booster? Or was that just last week's talking point, now expired?

BTW I have seen next to no evidence of rising wages, which is the best indicator we are reaching "full" employment.
Many economists are indeed predicting increased wage growth...it's just taking a little longer than expected to develop. But now that people coming back into the work force appears to be diminishing, we should start seeing wage growth in the next year or so.
 
Nov 30, 2006
15,456
389
121
I don't know if you said it in the past, but lots of conservatives did. Basically unemployment has been at 5% or less for the last two years, which is a very low level. Until this year we were repeatedly informed by conservatives that number was a sham because workforce participation rate was low. It still is, but suddenly that doesn't seem to matter to conservatives anymore and I find the motivated reasoning interesting.
I'll speak for myself...I'm not going to speak for conservatives.
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,306
1,205
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Many economists are indeed predicting increased wage growth...it's just taking a little longer than expected to develop. But now that people coming back into the work force appears to be diminishing, we should start seeing wage growth in the next year or so.
Would those economists be from the Heritage Foundation or actual honest to god economists?
 
Nov 30, 2006
15,456
389
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Would those economists be from the Heritage Foundation or actual honest to god economists?
Why don't you look for yourself and come to your own conclusions? Then maybe we'll have a good foundation for discussion on the issue rather than horseshit partisan banter based on bias and misconceptions.
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,306
1,205
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Why don't you look for yourself and come to your own conclusions?
Honestly I don't give a shit. That is short term garbage. Given what Trump and the Republicans have done thus far and are poised to do, I have a rather high level of confidence that we will have the next Great Depression in a few short years (possibly endangering United States solvency). GW almost accomplished it, it looks to me like Trump is gonna get 'er done. I just hope to fuck that I can time the crash so that I can profit on other people's misery.
 
Nov 30, 2006
15,456
389
121
Honestly I don't give a shit. That is short term garbage. Given what Trump and the Republicans have done thus far and are poised to do, I have a rather high level of confidence that we will have the next Great Depression in a few short years (possibly endangering United States solvency). GW almost accomplished it, it looks to me like Trump is gonna get 'er done. I just hope to fuck that I can time the crash so that I can profit on other people's misery.
Who are these economists predicting the next Great Depression in a few short years...just you or any "actual honest to god economists"?
 

bshole

Diamond Member
Mar 12, 2013
8,306
1,205
126
Who are these economists predicting the next Great Depression in a few short years...you or "actual honest to god economists"?
Oh me AND... the leading experts on the topic. The educated people that conservatives loathe so much.

The fucktard Republicans are using the exact same playbook that was used just prior to the Great Depression..... the exact same playbook..... the exact same playbook....

Professor Robert McElvaine, a leading expert on the Great Depression, said the Republicans are “sprinting towards an economic cliff” as they attempt to introduce sweeping tax cuts that will be “catastrophic” for the US economy.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/donald-trump-tax-bill-plan-budget-recession-financial-crisis-great-depression-1929-robert-mcelvaine-a8086781.html
 
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Commodus

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 2004
8,615
5,810
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I'm just sure that full employment has nothing to do with it. /s

But by all means continue with your lunacy...it's quite entertaining to watch.
But if we're at full employment, then why does Trump obsess with job creation?

This is the great part: you either have to admit that Trump lied about job creation being a vital issue, or admit that he lied about being able to create jobs more effectively than Obama.
 
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VirtualLarry

No Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
52,639
7,332
126
You know who's keeping down wage growth, and preventing full-time employment? Amazon. They "employ" (but not really... according to them), so many thousands of people, in so many states, but they are all working "gig jobs", but more-or-less permanent Amazon employees, but they get NO employee benefits, of the sorts that a traditional full-time employment agreement would give.

Basically, the new face of capitalism. Where finding a full-time job with benefits, is impossible, unless you're born into the 1% CEO crowd.
 
Nov 30, 2006
15,456
389
121
But if we're at full employment, then why does Trump obsess with job creation?

This is the great part: you either have to admit that Trump lied about job creation being a vital issue, or admit that he lied about being able to create jobs more effectively than Obama.
I have no idea what Trump thinks about this or much of anything....and I'm definitely not going to defend him.
 

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