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2 million American cars outfitted with remote kill switches

If i was selling something expensive to a person with nothing but a promise that he'll pay me over the next 3 years but has a bad track record of doing so I would probably want some sort of insurance that I'd get paid for it or know where it is.

This does not surprise or bother me. People who have proven themselves to not be very trustworthy shouldn't be surprised if this happens to them.
 
SparkyJJO said:
If i was selling something expensive to a person with nothing but a promise that he'll pay me over the next 3 years but has a bad track record of doing so I would probably want some sort of insurance that I'd get paid for it or know where it is.

This does not surprise or bother me. People who have proven themselves to not be very trustworthy shouldn't be surprised if this happens to them.
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While I agree with you, we have a society that is centered around entitlements and false assumptions of what our "rights" are. It's no surprise that many would take a dim view of institutions that are owed a debt taking these measures.
 
You have to wonder how difficult it would be to disable the device though. And the debtor still has to find the car to recover it after they kill the ignition.
 
JulesMaximus said:
You have to wonder how difficult it would be to disable the device though. And the debtor still has to find the car to recover it after they kill the ignition.
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Finding the car is easy if they're tracked via GPS. Disabling it likely wouldn't be too hard, but your average person is going to be clueless.

I read an article on this the other day and it seems a lot of people miraculously manage to pay what's due once their car stops working, so I doubt they end up physically repossessing vehicles most of the time.
 
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OnStar can slow or disable vehicles and OnStar uses GPS information to locate cars. There are a lot more than 2M cars with OnStar... this is not unprecedented.
 
Its not like the average buyer is getting saddled with these. Its people with seriously bad credit. I don't think its really a question of if the disabling and tracking is a bad idea. I think that's brillant. I think the real question is if we should be offering these type of people credit at all. They're the same one who use the payday loan stores and get raped by the interest rate there as well. It more about the culture of preying on people with bad credit. I think we'd be better off not doing it and expecting them to learn how to live within their means.
 
Midwayman said:
Its not like the average buyer is getting saddled with these. Its people with seriously bad credit. I don't think its really a question of if the disabling and tracking is a bad idea. I think that's brillant. I think the real question is if we should be offering these type of people credit at all. They're the same one who use the payday loan stores and get raped by the interest rate there as well. It more about the culture of preying on people with bad credit. I think we'd be better off not doing it and expecting them to learn how to live within their means.
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I'd rather they have transportation so they have the capability of supporting themselves so I don't have to support them. It's a contract between two parties. If the lender wants to lend and the borrower wants to borrow and no laws are being broken in the transaction, so what?
 
JulesMaximus said:
You have to wonder how difficult it would be to disable the device though. And the debtor still has to find the car to recover it after they kill the ignition.
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I've done work for a local lot (part of a large chain), and the stuff is pretty laughable. Their 'installer' would get fired from Best Buy- GPS boxes hooked into the wrong power sources. Poorly crimped butt connectors. Grounds secured to painted metal with a loose self-tapping screw.

In their case, the 'kill switch' part is a relay hooked into the starter solenoid wire. That's it- they would get sued if they actually wired it into the PCM, antitheft, ignition switch...any way that could kill the car while it's going down the road. So all they can do is inhibit starting.

The relays are obvious, too. So all you have to do is find a random aftermarket relay in the engine bay, and connect the two wires going to the switch portion.
 
Midwayman said:
Its not like the average buyer is getting saddled with these. Its people with seriously bad credit. I don't think its really a question of if the disabling and tracking is a bad idea. I think that's brillant. I think the real question is if we should be offering these type of people credit at all. They're the same one who use the payday loan stores and get raped by the interest rate there as well. It more about the culture of preying on people with bad credit. I think we'd be better off not doing it and expecting them to learn how to live within their means.
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Yeah, and there's two sides to this: some people are good people and just have bad credit for whatever reason (medical, job loss, etc.), so they still need a ride into work & to the grocery store. And then there are people who are leeches, but this is a capitalistic society, so it's a business!

I don't think it's a bad thing - they can remotely kill the car & use GPS to find it. I've read some interesting stories about car repo men & how people try to hide the cars & stuff. Seems like a good techie feature to have if you're going to be in that business.
 
phucheneh said:
I've done work for a local lot (part of a large chain), and the stuff is pretty laughable. Their 'installer' would get fired from Best Buy- GPS boxes hooked into the wrong power sources. Poorly crimped butt connectors. Grounds secured to painted metal with a loose self-tapping screw.

In their case, the 'kill switch' part is a relay hooked into the starter solenoid wire. That's it- they would get sued if they actually wired it into the PCM, antitheft, ignition switch...any way that could kill the car while it's going down the road. So all they can do is inhibit starting.

The relays are obvious, too. So all you have to do is find a random aftermarket relay in the engine bay, and connect the two wires going to the switch portion.
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Majority of people (as previously stated) do not have the knowledge to locate an unexpected relay inside the engine bay. There probably is not a big red tag on it.
 
I wonder how all you believers would feel if your car was accidently disabled long after it was paid for, lol.
 
Doomer said:
I wonder how all you believers would feel if your car was accidently disabled long after it was paid for, lol.
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I wonder how you'd feel if you loaned someone $10,000 to buy a car and they decided to stop paying you back, and then ran away with the car.
 
Doomer said:
I wonder how all you believers would feel if your car was accidently disabled long after it was paid for, lol.
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I think that would entirely be your fault. I know that if I had one of these devices on my car and that I had paid off the loan, I would make damned sure they removed the device pronto. Duh!
 
Isn't this actually a good way for someone with poor credit to get a car loan? I could see this being a huge help for someone that's gone through a tough time and is trying to get back track. Though I think the interest rate should be lower as well since risk of losing the asset is very low.
 
Greenman said:
Isn't this actually a good way for someone with poor credit to get a car loan? I could see this being a huge help for someone that's gone through a tough time and is trying to get back track. Though I think the interest rate should be lower as well since risk of losing the asset is very low.
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Agreed. I have no problem with this as it lowers the risk of the lender. But since the risk is lowered, the interest rate should be lower also
 
Aharami said:
Agreed. I have no problem with this as it lowers the risk of the lender. But since the risk is lowered, the interest rate should be lower also
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Not really; the risk is still there, you still have to pick the car back up, try and refurb it to sell, and hope it was not destroyed after you flipped the kill switch.

Same risk but the person loses the car right away vs them driver for a while longer till you get it. If anything they may destroy the cars more with the kill switch since they know and can't use it.
 
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