15 miles on eletric for plug-in Prius

[JTsyo]

Impressive.

15 miles on a charge and 2.5 hrs to charge. The price at $32K is a bit steep though.

Hopefully Ford will have something similar for the Fusion with 5-7 mile range.

 

[halik]

Amortize the $11K for just the plugin factor... hmm

 

[vi edit]

Amortize the $11K for just the plugin factor... hmm

Napkin math says over 60 months it'll cost you $183 a month more.
At 15 miles a day, an average of 30 days a month you'll "save" 450 miles of driving worth of gas. At 45 miles per gallon that's 10 gallons. At $4 a gallon that's $40.

So.....$140 or more a month for the luxury over 5 years.

And that's not even adding back in the kw/hr cost of the charge.
Yeh. Utility not found.

Somebody can double check or refute my math.

 

[SuperSix]

But it's so COOL!!!

 

[Plugers]

It's funny how the Volt was bashed for only going 40 miles on electric only, but the Prius is praised for going 15

 

[Doppel]

It's funny how the Volt was bashed for only going 40 miles on electric only, but the Prius is praised for going 15

You sure? The Volt is a piece of sh*t when running on gas. It requires premium and gets 35 mpg. It was always sold as an electric vehicle with extended gas range because you do not want to run it on gas (due to its inefficiency). The Prius is simply a plug-in.

This number is about where most people thought Toyota would settle. GM can now finally stop pretending. The Volt is damn near dead in the water. Its sales are a completely catastrophe this year and unless it pulls a rabbit in Q4 its 10k sales estimate will be squashed.

This Prius vs a Volt:
1) 5 seats instead of 4
2) Toyota quality
3) MUCH cheaper to run on gasoline once battery runs out (50 mpg vs 35 on cheaper fuel)
4) $10k cheaper purchase price
5) Shorter range on electric (though also more practical on standard electrical outlets, too)

I'm unclear now on whether this qualifies for tax credits, but it should to some degree.

EDIT: It appears $2500 tax credit applies, so $29,500 for this car. You'll be unlikely to make money back any time soon vs a normal Prius but this isn't that bad, you're looking at $5-6k over the regular prius to be able to plug it in. Looks like it actually drops 1 mpg in combined driving when the battery charge is up.

EDIT: Base also has nav, so the plug in is a pretty small premium in cost.

 

[Tristicus]

Not impressed at all. 15 miles? Really?

 

[Doppel]

Not impressed at all. 15 miles? Really?

It was always going to be about 15 miles. This is NOT AN EV CAR. It is a Prius at heart. The intent of this plug-in is merely to supplement the much higher capacity battery so that you can start your drive with a full charge. Even with a full battery if you are going fast enough or accelerating hard enough it will kick the gas motor on, but in many normal conditions you can do that 15 miles on EV, thereby saving the fuel. This was always the design and Toyota used to actually say the EV range would be 13. Unlike a certain other company hyping up their competitor Toyota has met the specs laid out long, long ago.

 

[Eli]

Yeah, 15 miles is pretty good for a PHEV.

Does anyone know how many miles people can get out of their current generation Prii with a PHEV system?

Once I get my grid charger setup, I'll only be able to do about 6 miles on "pure electric". I quote that because the Insight isn't capable of running without using a drop of gasoline, but the overall MPG over those miles will be 150+.

 

[Pulsar]

You sure? The Volt is a piece of sh*t when running on gas. It requires premium and gets 35 mpg. It was always sold as an electric vehicle with extended gas range because you do not want to run it on gas (due to its inefficiency). The Prius is simply a plug-in.

This number is about where most people thought Toyota would settle. GM can now finally stop pretending. The Volt is damn near dead in the water. Its sales are a completely catastrophe this year and unless it pulls a rabbit in Q4 its 10k sales estimate will be squashed.

This Prius vs a Volt:
1) 5 seats instead of 4
2) Toyota quality
3) MUCH cheaper to run on gasoline once battery runs out (50 mpg vs 35 on cheaper fuel)
4) $10k cheaper purchase price
5) Shorter range on electric (though also more practical on standard electrical outlets, too)

I'm unclear now on whether this qualifies for tax credits, but it should to some degree.

EDIT: It appears $2500 tax credit applies, so $29,500 for this car. You'll be unlikely to make money back any time soon vs a normal Prius but this isn't that bad, you're looking at $5-6k over the regular prius to be able to plug it in. Looks like it actually drops 1 mpg in combined driving when the battery charge is up.

EDIT: Base also has nav, so the plug in is a pretty small premium in cost.

Put down the bias my friend.

Prius? 5 seats? Perhaps if you have 2 dwarves and a newborn. That wouldn't even work, because 3 car seats won't fit in a prius.

Toyota quality? As compared to GM or Ford quality, which are at last check dead-even or ahead of Toyota in close to everything?

The volt was never sold as an electric vehicle with extended gas "due to it's inefficiency". It was sold that way because nearly everyone on the planet understands they're going to have to drive more than 40 miles on occasion.

I live very close to work, but 15 miles won't cut it. This is a half-assed attempt by Toyota to provide a plug-in, but with that mileage it's pretty much a non-starter.

I won't argue that the Volt is a perfect car. It's a very niche car that doesn't make any more financial sense than any other 'green' vehicle does. However, 15 miles is worthless.

The Prius can only do 15 miles as compared with the volt's 40 on all electric because of it's inefficiencies. Unfortunate they couldn't do any better.

PS - I realize that 15 is pretty good for a PHEV. Doppel's ridiculous attack post just set me off. I have nothing against the Prius, but he pretty clearly has something against the Volt.

 

[Bignate603]

You sure? The Volt is a piece of sh*t when running on gas. It requires premium and gets 35 mpg. It was always sold as an electric vehicle with extended gas range because you do not want to run it on gas (due to its inefficiency). The Prius is simply a plug-in.

This number is about where most people thought Toyota would settle. GM can now finally stop pretending. The Volt is damn near dead in the water. Its sales are a completely catastrophe this year and unless it pulls a rabbit in Q4 its 10k sales estimate will be squashed.

This Prius vs a Volt:
1) 5 seats instead of 4 - Kind of, you may get 3 kids in the back seat but there's no way 3 adults are going to fit well.
2) Toyota quality - Look at the comparisons done on quality lately, Toyota's quality isn't the selling point it used to be.
3) MUCH cheaper to run on gasoline once battery runs out (50 mpg vs 35 on cheaper fuel) - If you're planning on driving regularly it for long distances on gas the volt was not designed for you. It's made for the majority of people who drive 40 miles or less on a typical day but sometimes drive longer distances.
4) $10k cheaper purchase price - Sure, if you don't count the tax credits. If you do it's only about $3k more for the volt.
5) Shorter range on electric (though also more practical on standard electrical outlets, too) - So you're pretty much guaranteed to use some gas every day, whereas the majority of people would use no gas with the volt on a typical day.

I'm unclear now on whether this qualifies for tax credits, but it should to some degree.

EDIT: It appears $2500 tax credit applies, so $29,500 for this car. You'll be unlikely to make money back any time soon vs a normal Prius but this isn't that bad, you're looking at $5-6k over the regular prius to be able to plug it in. Looks like it actually drops 1 mpg in combined driving when the battery charge is up.

EDIT: Base also has nav, so the plug in is a pretty small premium in cost.

I didn't realize we had a Toyota apologist on the board. See responses above in bold.

15 miles on electric doesn't justify the cost. It really needs to be enough to make it through a typical day without gas or it's not worth the trouble.

 

[Pariah]

You sure? The Volt is a piece of sh*t when running on gas. It requires premium and gets 35 mpg. It was always sold as an electric vehicle with extended gas range because you do not want to run it on gas (due to its inefficiency). The Prius is simply a plug-in.

This number is about where most people thought Toyota would settle. GM can now finally stop pretending. The Volt is damn near dead in the water. Its sales are a completely catastrophe this year and unless it pulls a rabbit in Q4 its 10k sales estimate will be squashed.

This Prius vs a Volt:
1) 5 seats instead of 4
2) Toyota quality
3) MUCH cheaper to run on gasoline once battery runs out (50 mpg vs 35 on cheaper fuel)
4) $10k cheaper purchase price
5) Shorter range on electric (though also more practical on standard electrical outlets, too)

I'm unclear now on whether this qualifies for tax credits, but it should to some degree.

EDIT: It appears $2500 tax credit applies, so $29,500 for this car. You'll be unlikely to make money back any time soon vs a normal Prius but this isn't that bad, you're looking at $5-6k over the regular prius to be able to plug it in. Looks like it actually drops 1 mpg in combined driving when the battery charge is up.

EDIT: Base also has nav, so the plug in is a pretty small premium in cost.

Lowest cost Prius runs about $22k now, plug-in after tax credit is about $29.5k. So you're paying $7,500 for the ability to save 15 miles worth of gas a day, or as someone above calculated about $40 a month? What's the point of that? You're far better off getting a fully loaded regular Prius which would still be cheaper than the base plugin.

There's also going to be a "premium" version of the plugin that will cost about $40,000 before credit which puts it right in line with the Volt. Why on earth would someone buy a piece of crap car like the Prius (and don't tell me it isn't, no one buys a Prius because they think it is actually a good car), when they can get a Volt for the same price?

 

[fr]

15 miles isn't close to being worth 2.5 hours to charge.

 

[Doppel]

I don't want to point by point respond on all counts, I'm not paid enough for that. I will respond to a few, though:

That wouldn't even work, because 3 car seats won't fit in a prius.

Wrong. I've seen pics. The Prius will take 3 car seats.

there's no way 3 adults are going to fit well.

Fit will is subjective. It's not a very large car, albeit technically a midsize. Three adults can fit in the back, though. Again, seen it myself.

I didn't realize we had a Toyota apologist on the board.

lol not even sure what that means.

What's the point of that? You're far better off getting a fully loaded regular Prius which would still be cheaper than the base plugin.

There isn't a point. It's very hard to envision a scenario in which plug in makes sense. Many will buy it anyway. It's only within the last year or two that Prius prices came down low enough to make economic sense and prior to that thousands still bought them.

15 miles isn't close to being worth 2.5 hours to charge.

Similar to volt of leaf, really. There's just only so much juice you can pull out of a house in a period of time, particularly on a 120V receptacle.

In the end this car will sell well, that's what I'm pretty sure about. It will give huge bragging rights for the kind of person interested in that. People can pretend that Toyota quality isn't still very high but that's all it is, pretending. Maybe people internalized the driver-error runaway Toyota problems too much, who knows.

True it ain't much cheaper after rebates than a Volt, though. I think it's a better car even at the same price.

 

[exar333]

Not impressed. A Volt, regular Prius, or Leaf are ALL better than this. Too many compromises.

Drive between 15-35 miles every day? Volt or Prius
Drive 10-20 miles every day, and do not often need to go further? Leaf
Need to spend 10k more than a regular Prius for almost no gains? Get Plug-in Prius!

 

[boomhower]

Not enough range. I like the Volt much better. I could almost get by with no gas, my commute is right at 40 miles round trip but I know my driving wouldn't get the whole range. Both are overpriced but as soon as a 40 mile plug in comes down to $25k I'll be game.

 

[LTC8K6]

http://www.ford.com/electric/focuselectric/2012/

Supposed to have 100 mile range, but who knows the cost? Looks very nice though.

 

[Doppel]

Unfortunately batteries are still absurdly expensive. It's why the Leaf, which has no ICE components at all, still costs quite a bit of money. I doubt that focus electric will be under $30k, either.

 

[Pariah]

There isn't a point. It's very hard to envision a scenario in which plug in makes sense. Many will buy it anyway. It's only within the last year or two that Prius prices came down low enough to make economic sense and prior to that thousands still bought them.

I'm sure people will buy it, I didn't even really mean what's the point in buying it. I meant what was the point of Toyota designing it in the first place? Toyota should sell the rights of the Prius to Apple. Arguably revolutionary at initial release, now paying for the image more than the substance, overpriced for what you get, with regular incremental improvements that don't really add much but are promoted as the greatest thing since sliced bread would make it a perfect fit for Apple's lineup.

The 40 mile range of the Volt covers the majority of people's daily work commute, which means it has a theoretical use. The 15 mile range of the plugin doesn't, so why go through the hassle of developing it? Wait until you reach a useful range, then release it.

 

[hanoverphist]

it says 15 miles at top speed. what is the top speed? is it plausible to think that driving it at a less than top speed would extend the range? is that with all accessories on? are there any accessories? i wonder what the range would be if you dropped a couple 10s and a 450w amp in the trunk.

 

[hanoverphist]

why dont we make roads out of that matting stuff for charging cell phones and small devices? then we can charge as we drive.

 

[alfa147x]

lol and it's a shitty toyota. I miss the old toyota

 

[sdifox]

what a waste of time.

 

[Doppel]

I'm sure people will buy it, I didn't even really mean what's the point in buying it. I meant what was the point of Toyota designing it in the first place? Toyota should sell the rights of the Prius to Apple. Arguably revolutionary at initial release, now paying for the image more than the substance, overpriced for what you get, with regular incremental improvements that don't really add much but are promoted as the greatest thing since sliced bread would make it a perfect fit for Apple's lineup.

The 40 mile range of the Volt covers the majority of people's daily work commute, which means it has a theoretical use. The 15 mile range of the plugin doesn't, so why go through the hassle of developing it? Wait until you reach a useful range, then release it.

I guess the question will be answered when we find out if it sells or not. I think it will. Toyota has been able to sell Prii when they were extremely costly for what they were and made no sense, so simple number crunching isn't the only factor (nor is it for most cars).

it says 15 miles at top speed. what is the top speed? is it plausible to think that driving it at a less than top speed would extend the range? is that with all accessories on? are there any accessories? i wonder what the range would be if you dropped a couple 10s and a 450w amp in the trunk.

It's 15 miles at speeds up to 62 mph. Or is it EV-capable only up to 62, but if you actually did a 62 mph trip its range would be less? I think the latter. Anyway, when going faster than 62 mph the ICE has to kick in, has something to do with the weird powertrain and not spinning the electric motor(s) too quickly. The actual top speed of a 3rd gen Prius is 112 or 117 mph (can't remember which), electronically governed.

 

[theeedude]

Is it going to get HOV stickers? That may be enough to sell it in CA.