14 Christians Killed in Indonesia

etech

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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14 Christians Killed in Indonesia

>>JAKARTA, Indonesia (AP) - Assailants in black masks hacked, shot and burned to death 14 Christians, including a six-month-old baby, in the religiously divided capital of Indonesia's Maluku province Sunday, threatening a fragile peace pact.

Carrying automatic rifles, grenades and daggers, about a dozen men yelling "kill them all" stormed the mainly Christian village of Soya on Ambon's outskirts, 1,600 miles east of Jakarta, witnesses said.

They set 30 homes and a Protestant church on fire, and went from house to house, shooting into those that were occupied, witnesses said. Six Christians, including the baby, were stabbed to death and six others were killed in fires. Two more were believed to be shot to death.

The killings came two days after a militant Islamic group, Laskar Jihad, rejected the February peace deal, which was meant to end three years of fighting between Muslims and Christians here that has left 9,000 dead.

"It may be the end of the peace deal," said Christian pastor Cornelius Bohm in Ambon. "There is no doubt that it was Laskar Jihad" behind Sunday's attack in Ambon.

Laskar Jihad share Osama bin Laden (news - web sites)'s anti-Western stance but its commander, Jafar Umar Thalib, has denied any links to international terror. The group could not be reached for comment Sunday.

A senior police officer in Ambon, speaking on condition of anonymity, said 14 people were killed Sunday. He refused to speculate on the religion of the killers.

Survivors said they initially thought the intruders, dressed in military camouflage, were soldiers carrying out a security sweep but fled when the assailants started tossing grenades and shooting at anyone who moved. Those interviewed only described the attackers as "terrorists" and said they were unsure if they were Muslim.

"The scene is horrible," said one witness on condition of anonymity. "I saw six bodies burned so badly you couldn't recognize them."

He said police were searching the burned homes for more bodies.

Later Sunday, security officers in Ambon fired warning shots to disperse a crowd of about a dozen Muslims, a witness said. They had gathered after seeing several banned flags of the mostly Christian, separatist Maluku Sovereignty Front being flown. No one was injured.

Tension has run high in Ambon since the Front celebrated the 52nd anniversary of a failed independence bid Thursday. The group flew its independence flags angering Muslims who responded by burning down a partially rebuilt church and threatening to resume attacks on Christians.

Bohm said Indonesia's government was trying to end the violence, but did not have the power to clamp down on Laskar Jihad and other Muslim extremist groups in the province.<<


Peaceful and tolerant?
 

Murphyrulez

Golden Member
Mar 24, 2001
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The KKK claim to be Christians. They aren't peaceful and tolerant either.

But that is bad. Very bad.
 

Skyclad1uhm1

Lifer
Aug 10, 2001
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Just as tolerant and peaceful as the KKK, RealIRA, ETA, RAF, France and the Catholic church. There are millions of people whom we could do without, and they operate under the name of any religion or ideal.
 

Kilgor

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
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<< Just as tolerant and peaceful as the KKK, RealIRA, ETA, RAF, France and the Catholic church. There are millions of people whom we could do without, and they operate under the name of any religion or ideal. >>



When was the last time any of those groups went around hacking babies up?
 

Lucky

Lifer
Nov 26, 2000
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<<

<< Just as tolerant and peaceful as the KKK, RealIRA, ETA, RAF, France and the Catholic church. There are millions of people whom we could do without, and they operate under the name of any religion or ideal. >>



When was the last time any of those groups went around hacking babies up?
>>





Dont know about hacking babies up but I can probably find quite a few instances where the catholic church did other things.
 

Tripleshot

Elite Member
Jan 29, 2000
7,218
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Etech posts an article with link to an atrocity in a part of the world that parallels the war on terrorism issues, and morons like Murphyrulez and Skyclad1uhm1 want to blame the victims. I cannot believe this is the best you can offer, unless you are freaking terrorist sympathizer's yourselves.


:disgust:
 

etech

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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RAF? Royal Air Force is what comes to mind but I don't think that is correct.


Skyclad1uhm1

Please answer the question that Kilgor asked as I would like to know your answer also.
 

Lucky

Lifer
Nov 26, 2000
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morons like Murphyrulez and Skyclad1uhm1 want to blame the victims.


Would you care to detail how they blamed the victims? Both simply pointed out that hate and murder is carried out in many names and that it might not be indicative of the true believers of that religion (or group.)

Or are you just trying to stir sh*t up?
 

AreaCode707

Lifer
Sep 21, 2001
18,447
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<<

<<

<< Just as tolerant and peaceful as the KKK, RealIRA, ETA, RAF, France and the Catholic church. There are millions of people whom we could do without, and they operate under the name of any religion or ideal. >>



When was the last time any of those groups went around hacking babies up?
>>





Dont know about hacking babies up but I can probably find quite a few instances where the catholic church did other things.
>>



Okay, what horrible things can you find that the currentCatholic church condones? You can go through history and blame people now for things their ancestors did - blaming white people now for black slavery for instance, but you don't. So why do you do it to a religious group?

My prayers for everyone who died, and everyone who lived through both those experiences, both the attack on Christians and the attack on the Muslim women.
 

Texmaster

Banned
Jun 5, 2001
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<< The KKK claim to be Christians. They aren't peaceful and tolerant either.

But that is bad. Very bad.
>>



then dont take some STUPID and petty shot at Christians you half wit. :|
 

etech

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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Lucky

From your link.

"Police have not made any arrests, but Pakistan, and eastern Punjab province in particular, has been wracked by religiously motivated violence in recent years. Attacks by rival radical elements of the Sunni and Shiite sects of Islam have killed hundreds."

My question still stands.
 

Lucky

Lifer
Nov 26, 2000
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Dont know about hacking babies up but I can probably find quite a few instances where the catholic church did other things. >>



Okay, what horrible things can you find that the currentCatholic church condones?




Er, my comment was supposed to be a light-hearted jab about its molestation practices, not anything historical.
 

Lucky

Lifer
Nov 26, 2000
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<< Lucky

From your link.

"Police have not made any arrests, but Pakistan, and eastern Punjab province in particular, has been wracked by religiously motivated violence in recent years. Attacks by rival radical elements of the Sunni and Shiite sects of Islam have killed hundreds."

My question still stands.
>>




First off, I've yet to find any question you've asked in this thread.

Second, I just posted the link. Didnt say christians did it.
 

Kilgor

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
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<< Previously Hasan Turabi, the head of a banned Shiite Muslim group, Tehrik-e-Jafria, blamed the upsurge in killings of Shiite Muslims on the return to Pakistan of militant Sunni Muslims from neighboring Afghanistan following the collapse of the Taliban. >>




<< Turabi said the Taliban, a movement dominated by Sunni Muslims, espoused the same philosophy as Pakistan's radical Sunni Muslims, and harbored those who had killed Shiite Muslims in Pakistan. With the fall of the Taliban these radical elements returned home, he said. >>



What does Muslims killing Muslims have to do with it? Killing is the national sport in some Muslim countries I guess
 

etech

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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Peaceful and tolerant?

That is a question. It is somewhat rhetorical in this case but still a question.

Lucky, if you can't follow these threads and comprehend what is being discussed why don't you stick to the AOL chatroom threads.
 

Lucky

Lifer
Nov 26, 2000
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What does Muslims killing Muslims have to do with it? Killing is the national sport in some Muslim countries I guess



And black-on-black inner city violence is rampant here in the US. Killing sucks under any conditions, does the reason matter? At the end of the day you still have dead bodies and hurting families. :(
 

Lucky

Lifer
Nov 26, 2000
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<< Peaceful and tolerant?

That is a question. It is somewhat rhetorical in this case but still a question.

Lucky, if you can't follow these threads and comprehend what is being discussed why don't you stick to the AOL chatroom threads.
>>





Well jesus, since when did incomplete sentences become a question? If you are going to bash someone on comprehension you might want to write a complete sentence at the very least!
 

bsobel

Moderator Emeritus<br>Elite Member
Dec 9, 2001
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> Okay, what horrible things can you find that the currentCatholic church condones

Child abuse comes to mind ;)

> and morons like Murphyrulez and Skyclad1uhm1 want to blame the victims

I didn't see anyone blaming the victims, I saw two people pointing out that (unfortunately) the Moslims don't have a lock on killing in the name of religion. Can't we all get together and realize maybe religion isn't such a hot idea afterall?

Bill
 

Kilgor

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
3,292
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<< And black-on-black inner city violence is rampant here in the US. Killing sucks under any conditions, does the reason matter? At the end of the day you still have dead bodies and hurting families. >>



What does that have to do with anything? How is that in anyway relevant to this discussion? Black on Black crime is not taught to kindergartners in school, it?s not promoted as a way to solve problems. What we are talking about is a religion that claims to be peaceful and tolerant promoting killing seemingly any living thing that doesn?t agree with them including themselves.
 

Lucky

Lifer
Nov 26, 2000
13,126
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<<

<< And black-on-black inner city violence is rampant here in the US. Killing sucks under any conditions, does the reason matter? At the end of the day you still have dead bodies and hurting families. >>



What does that have to do with anything? How is that in anyway relevant to this discussion? Black on Black crime is not taught to kindergartners in school, it?s not promoted as a way to solve problems. What we are talking about is a religion that claims to be peaceful and tolerant promoting killing seemingly any living thing that doesn?t agree with them including themselves.
>>





I just explained how it was relevant. At the end of the day, no matter who is killed for what reason, people are still dead. And yet we have people like you grossly generalizing 1.5 billion people who practice islam as all being identical to a couple hundred thousand whackos who claim to be islamic.
 

etech

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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Are the 1.5 billion who are being distorted by this "minority" doing anything to stop them? If my faith and I were being badly distorted by a few I think I would try to rein them in and control them.

Do you have any examples of that sort of action by the majority?


The Catholic church is in trouble for ignoring the actions of a few of it's leaders, why should Islam be any different? At least the Catholic Church is belatedly taking some sort of action.
 

Tripleshot

Elite Member
Jan 29, 2000
7,218
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>>>>And yet we have people like you grossly generalizing 1.5 billion people who practice islam as all being identical to a couple hundred thousand whackos who claim to be islamic. <<<<

If the 1.5 billion reined in these couple hundred thousand whackos, they wouldn't be generalized as being identical. But they haven't done that,have they? They have had plenty of time to do so, but you don't see them doing that,do you? Instead, children are taught to hate Jews and Christians and are raised to believe suicide is honorable,and killing Jews and Christains is acceptable and benifical to their salvation.

Do you care to dispute that, motormouth?

This thread was started to reveal an atrocity in Indonesia, and you are trying to lead the topic away from the subject of what is really the end result of this fouled education.

What did Bush say now, you are either with us, or against us. What side are you on? There is no middle ground here, bubba!:frown: