$1000 for game rig budget, pls advice

[lorlabnew]

Hi all,

I got a task to build a new rig (or rebuild the old one) for a friend; he wants to play sports games only (Madden 2003, NHL, NBA etc- EA Sports & SEGA stuff - and future releases), no office work or anything similar. The rig should last (be able to handle everything at max. detail and resolution - preferably 1600*1200*32) for approximately 2 years.

He's about to shell out up to thousand bucks for this solely gaming machine (monitor & speakers excluded), so I need recommendation for the motherboard, CPU, RAM, video, audio, HDD, DVD-ROM, and possibly an ATX mid-tower case (not sure if I'll be able to re-use his old case, either way I'd need new PS at least).

As for the OS, I could reload his Win2k, but would consider to buy him XPHome (he doesn't need Pro) if the rig would gain from it noticeably (I personally use both Win2k and XPPro, and don't see a speed difference in gaming really, except for compatibility with some older titles maybe, where XP does better job).

I'd almost send him to get a retail build machine from major brands with this money, but then I know he'll get bunch of stuff he doesn't need, and won't get the important stuff like fast enough videocard, good drive, quality sound and enough & fast memory (all those he'd have to pay extra, and there the advantage of seemingly low priced retail boxes completely diminishes) ; for those features he'd need to buy from Alienware and such , and there $1000 isn't even remotely enough...

So I agreed to have a look what we can do....; not too much hassle for me, since I like to build rigs occasionally. I know we can get a fairly fast machine going with this budget, which should easily beat any similarly priced retail box in performance (probably not in the variety of features, but it's not the goal here).

I'd like the machine to be capable of some 13000+ 3D2001Marks. I wouldn't mind to get overclockable parts, but rather as a reserve if needed in the future; the system should do those 13k on default & with stock HS/fan.

For the 100% compatibility & stability he wants Intel CPU, no other limitations... could be RDRAM or DDR based, whatever offers best performance & biggest bang for that mentioned budget

Sorry for the longer post & thanks in advance for suggestions, I need to start ASAP, will get the money tomorrow...
dave

 

[everman]

AMD doesn't offer 100% compatability/reliability? news to me.
Anyway, I"d probably get a geforce 4 since from what I see most sports games aren't incredibly taxing usually or a ATI 9500 pro.
512 ram and buy quality stuff., 40+ gig hd. There are no real performance differences between win2k sp3 and XPsp1.

 

[lorlabnew]

thx everman,

I don't wanna argue whether AMD is compatible or not of course; but what the "client" wants is what matters here.... he wants Intel ; his choice ...

I think I should be able to fit at least the GF4600, or maybe even R9700Pro in the budget, shouldn't I ?

dave

 

[dpopiz]

here's a wishlist I put together on newegg. I dunno if it's possible for anything to last for 2 years at your specifications. anyway, the following system should be good for 2 years, except the video card (9500). I think he'd best off just getting the 9500 now and upgrading the video in a year or so.

http://secure.newegg.com/app/WishR.asp?ID=228800

 

[CallTheFBI]

Originally posted by: lorlabnew
thx everman,

I don't wanna argue whether AMD is compatible or not of course; but what the "client" wants is what matters here.... he wants Intel ; his choice ...

I think I should be able to fit at least the GF4600, or maybe even R9700Pro in the budget, shouldn't I ?

dave

Yeah, easily. I built my system for $800 but the entire thing cost $1,300 since I spent $500 on the display alone. Adding another $200 would give me $300 for a video card. Can't help you though, I'm not familiar with Intel. I don't like Intel for the time being. Sorry.

 

[Sniper82]

According to what kind of speakers and monitor you plan on getting with it. If your just getting some cheap 2-3 piece speakers and a cheap 17-19" CRT you prob could. But if your planning on some nice 4.1 speakers and a flatpanel you would be cutting it very close. Is he the type that would expect tech support if something goes wrong? Or do you not care if you have to make 5 trips to his house a week if something crashes?

A sweet complete system can be bought for $1000 if you ain't picky on the monitor. I myself am happy with CRT monitor and ain't in no hurry to buy flat panel till prices come down more(17" and bigger).

 

[CallTheFBI]

Originally posted by: ^Sniper^
According to what kind of speakers and monitor you plan on getting with it. If your just getting some cheap 2-3 piece speakers and a cheap 17-19" CRT you prob could. But if your planning on some nice 4.1 speakers and a flatpanel you would be cutting it very close. Is he the type that would expect tech support if something goes wrong? Or do you not care if you have to make 5 trips to his house a week if something crashes?

A sweet complete system can be bought for $1000 if you ain't picky on the monitor. I myself am happy with CRT monitor and ain't in no hurry to buy flat panel till prices come down more(17" and bigger).

I agree. Forget about flat panel display with that budget if you are planning on playing games. Games require fast response time to avoid ghosting so you need something like a Hitachi which would eat up more than half your budget.

 

[Wolfsraider]

Qty Product Item # Unit Price Qty x Price

Cases (Computer Cases, ATX Form)
ANTEC SOLUTION SERIES Model# SLK2600AMB w/ANTEC SMART POWER 300W P4/AMD POWER SUPPLY ATX12V - RETAIL
Offering a large 8-drive capacity in a convenient mini tower. This cost-effective new Super Mini Tower comes in an attractive color - Antec Metallic Bronze - with the features and quality you expect from Antec.
Specifications:
Driver Bays: External 4 X 5.25" - 2 X 3.5" (Tool-less Drive rail system for 5.25 Devices) Internal 2 X 3.5" (Quick Release Drive cage for 3.5" Drive bays)
System Board: Standard ATX
Expansion Slot: 7 Slots
USB/IO: 2 X USB (front)
Optional Fans: 2 X 80mm (front & rear)
Case Dimensions: 16.75" (L) X 8.25" (W) X 16.75" (H) more info>
N82E16811129117 $56.00
$56.00

CD/DVD ROM Drives
LITE-ON XJ-HD166S 16X DVD ROM Drive - Retail48X CD-ROM Access all format DVD-ROM/R/RW ,CD-ROM/R/RW title & disc Comes with Audio Cable, Manual and Power DVD Software. more info>
N82E16827131113 $40.99
$40.99

Hard Drives
WD WESTERN DIGITAL 60GB 7200RPM EIDE HARD DRIVE MODEL # WD600JB - OEM, DRIVE ONLY
Specifications:
Size: 60 Gigabytes
Interface: IDE ULTRA ATA133
Seek time: 10.9 ms
RPM:7200
Cache 8MB
OEM(Drive alone) 3 Year Manufacturer Warranty more info>
N82E16822144127 $99.00
$99.00

Memory (System Memory)
CORSAIR MEMORY XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series 512MB 64MX64 PC-3200C2PT With Platinum - Silver Heat Spreader OEM
Specifications:
Speed 400 MHz
Organization 64M x 64
CAS Latency 2-3-3-6-T1
Memory type DDR
Part number: CMX512-3200C2PT more info>
N82E16820145420 $183.00
$183.00

Motherboards - Intel
ALBATRON INTEL 845GE Chipset ATX Motherboard Model PX845GE Pro II Retail
Specifications:
Supported CPU:Intel Pentium® 4 Processor (Willamette/Northwood)
Chipset:Intel 845GE/ ICH4
FSB:400/533MHz
RAM:3x DDR333/266 Memory Slots up to 2GB
IDE:2 ATA100/66 channels, up to 4 ATA 100 IDE Promise RAID 0,1
Slots:1 x AGP 4X slot (Supports AGP 1.5V only) 6 x PCI slots (PCI 2.2 compliant)
Ports:1xFDD,2xUSB,2xPS2,2xCOM,1xRJ45 and Audio
Onboard Audio:6 channel AC 97 Audio
Onboard LAN: Intel Pro 100 EV LAN more info>
N82E16813170107 $129.00
$129.00

Processors
Intel Pentium 4 2.4BGHz 512K 533MHz CPU Northwood P478 Processor Retail Box
Specifications:
CPU: Pentium 4 P4 2.4BGHz Northwood
Type: Northwood
Cache: 512K
BUS: 533MHz
Socket: P4 478
Retail Box (with Heatsink and fan) more info>
N82E16819116139 $191.00
$191.00

Video Cards
FIC AT010 RADEON 9700 PRO 128MB DDR 8X AGP OEM
Specifications:
VPU: RADEON 9700Pro
MEM:128MB DDR
Core clock:325MHz
Memory clock: 310MHz
Advanced 3D Features: SMARTHEADER 2.0, SMOOTHVISION 2.0, HYPER Z III, TRUFORM 2.0, VIDEOSHADER,
RAMDAC 400MHz
OS Support: Windows® ME Windows® 2000 and® XP
Maximum 3D Resolution: 2048 x 1536 x 75Hz
Ports: VGA DB-15 + S-Video Out + DVI
OEM (comes with sofware and cables See pic) more info>
N82E16814137001 $295.00
$295.00


Subtotal » $993.99


how is this

mike

 

[lorlabnew]

Originally posted by: ^Sniper^
According to what kind of speakers and monitor you plan on getting with it. If your just getting some cheap 2-3 piece speakers and a cheap 17-19" CRT you prob could. But if your planning on some nice 4.1 speakers and a flatpanel you would be cutting it very close. Is he the type that would expect tech support if something goes wrong? Or do you not care if you have to make 5 trips to his house a week if something crashes?

A sweet complete system can be bought for $1000 if you ain't picky on the monitor. I myself am happy with CRT monitor and ain't in no hurry to buy flat panel till prices come down more(17" and bigger).

sniper,

the $1000 budget is for the box itself (monitor & speakers he's going to pay extra, as well as any other peripherals as keyboard, mouse, gamepad etc), so I think I've got enough $$$ to play with.... he'll be getting some better quality 19" CRT ... btw .speakers I'll grab at Fry's tomorrow, CL 6600's 6.1 for $89 on sale ..

If something goes wrong, he'll bring it to me and I'll fix it; the previous box I built him (D815EEAL/PIII850/256MB RAM/32MBTNT2) didn't have a single issue since I completed it some 2 years ago or so, so I had no extra work with that. .. I'd prefer to make it as stable as possible again as well.

dave

 

[KidChaos]

Motherboard: ABIT IT7 MAX2 ver.2.0 Intel 845PE chipset ATX motherboard Retail $167

CPU: Intel Pentium 4 2.4BGHz 512K 533MHz CPU Northwood P478 Processor Retail Box $191

RAM: CORSAIR MEMORY XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series 512MB 32MX8 PC-2700C2PT With Platinum $159

video: SAPPHIRE ATI OEM RADEON 9500 PRO 128MB DDR DVI BULK $180

audio: Hercules Fortissimo III 7.1 $42

HDD: WD WESTERN DIGITAL "SPECIAL EDITION" 80GB 7200RPM EIDE HARD DRIVE MODEL # WD800JB - OEM $109

DVD-ROM: LITE-ON LTD-166S16X DVD ROM Drive - Retail $40.99

ATX mid-tower case: ANTEC PERFORMANCE II WORKSTATION TOWER ATX Model# SX835II (BEIGE) w/350W SMART POWER ATX12V P4 COMPLIANT POWER SUPPLY - RETAIL $86

Total: $974.99

vendor(s): NewEgg.com

May want to add a CD-burner (i.e. Lite-On). Excellent overclocking potential. The more I revise this part list, the more the word "AMD" comes to mind.

 

[CraigRT]

AMD not compatible.. haha. that's so late 90's.

I have nothing bu good luck with AMD.. that's fine.. let the man overpay on an equal product!!

 

[lorlabnew]

Originally posted by: Wolfsraider
Qty Product Item # Unit Price Qty x Price

Cases (Computer Cases, ATX Form)
$56.00

CD/DVD ROM Drives
LITE-ON XJ-HD166S 16X DVD ROM Drive - Retail48X CD-ROM Access all format DVD-ROM/R/RW ,CD-ROM/R/RW title & disc Comes with Audio Cable, Manual and Power DVD Software. more info>
N82E16827131113 $40.99
$40.99

Hard Drives
WD WESTERN DIGITAL 60GB 7200RPM EIDE HARD DRIVE MODEL # WD600JB - OEM, DRIVE ONLY

N82E16822144127 $99.00
$99.00

Memory (System Memory)
CORSAIR MEMORY XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series 512MB 64MX64 PC-3200C2PT With Platinum - Silver Heat Spreader OEM
$183.00

Motherboards - Intel
ALBATRON INTEL 845GE Chipset ATX Motherboard Model PX845GE Pro II Retail
$129.00

Processors
Intel Pentium 4 2.4BGHz 512K 533MHz CPU Northwood P478 Processor Retail Box
$191.00

Video Cards
FIC AT010 RADEON 9700 PRO 128MB DDR 8X AGP OEM

$295.00


Subtotal » $993.99


how is this

mike

thx mike, looks pretty sweet... like most except:

1/ WDC drive; I can't stand WD anymore (prone to bearing whine - have 3 new ones, 2x 40GB, 1x80GB JB), wanna get Seagate, Maxtor or IBM instead (in this order); hold on - just noticed, it's JB as well, hmm, maybe
2/ 845GE chipset, not sure about this one; is it like 845PE but with extreme graphics included? I have 845PE myself

thx
dave

 

[SilentRunning]

Originally posted by: Yield
AMD not compatible.. haha. that's so late 90's.

I have nothing bu good luck with AMD.. that's fine.. let the man overpay on an equal product!!

I still haven't figured out how to fit an AMD processor in a 478 pin socket.

 

[lorlabnew]

Originally posted by: KidChaos
Motherboard: ABIT IT7 MAX2 ver.2.0 Intel 845PE chipset ATX motherboard Retail $167

CPU: Intel Pentium 4 2.4BGHz 512K 533MHz CPU Northwood P478 Processor Retail Box $191

RAM: CORSAIR MEMORY XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series 512MB 32MX8 PC-2700C2PT With Platinum $159

video: SAPPHIRE ATI OEM RADEON 9500 PRO 128MB DDR DVI BULK $180

audio: Hercules Fortissimo III 7.1 $42

HDD: WD WESTERN DIGITAL "SPECIAL EDITION" 80GB 7200RPM EIDE HARD DRIVE MODEL # WD800JB - OEM $109

DVD-ROM: LITE-ON LTD-166S16X DVD ROM Drive - Retail $40.99

ATX mid-tower case: ANTEC PERFORMANCE II WORKSTATION TOWER ATX Model# SX835II (BEIGE) w/350W SMART POWER ATX12V P4 COMPLIANT POWER SUPPLY - RETAIL $86

Total: $974.99

vendor(s): NewEgg.com

May want to add a CD-burner (i.e. Lite-On). Excellent overclocking potential. The more I revise this part list, the more the word "AMD" comes to mind.

this looks interesting too; how is the ABIT board? any issues with it?

I was considering something with PE chipset if I'd go DDR way; was thinking ASUS P4PE, but will lookup ABIT's board as well,
thx
dave

 

[CraigRT]

Originally posted by: SilentRunning

Originally posted by: Yield
AMD not compatible.. haha. that's so late 90's.

I have nothing bu good luck with AMD.. that's fine.. let the man overpay on an equal product!!

I still haven't figured out how to fit an AMD processor in a 478 pin socket.

oh, okay, so THAT'S this compatibility problem i've been hearing about.... haa!

 

[magomago]

Originally posted by: Yield

Originally posted by: SilentRunning

Originally posted by: Yield
AMD not compatible.. haha. that's so late 90's.

I have nothing bu good luck with AMD.. that's fine.. let the man overpay on an equal product!!

I still haven't figured out how to fit an AMD processor in a 478 pin socket.

oh, okay, so THAT'S this compatibility problem i've been hearing about.... haa!

Well, tell him it'll cost more going an intel solution.



By the way - there is NO computer out there that can run EVERYTHING at 1600*1200 max resolution for two years - even if you do some heavy duty overlcocking

You are rasing hopes for your friend. You can make a really good pc, but 2 years from now even the best Falcon will look slow

 

[lorlabnew]

Tx to your suggestions guys, so far it is narrowing down to:


Antec mid-tower with SmartPower or TruePower PS
Lite-On XJ-HD166S 16X DVD ROM Drive
CORSAIR MEMORY XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series 512MB, PC-2700 or 3200
CPU Intel P 2.4B
R9500Pro/R9700Pro (non-ATI) / or GF4Ti4600

motherboard - not sure; hmm, s o m e 845PE based most likely? are there other good choices? is there any dual channel, Intel based DDR board?
HDD - not sure, but 8MB buffer would be nice, I don't really want WDC (but I do have a brand new WDC 80JB avail., just got RMA replacement 2 days ago, and they sent a brand new one, no refurb as they normally do; could let him have this one for some nice discount); maybe a Barracuda V with 8mb cache if I'd fit it in the budget...

this is good amount of suggestions here, but at least it's pretty clear about 5 items out of 7,
thx again to all

dave

...also, apologize to all AMD fans (I didn't mean to discriminate your favorite CPU at all); with Intel requirement as a "100% compatible CPU" - there are simply no issues with Intel; no cooling issues, no voltage issues; he's not willing to tweak anything himself or observe the system stability, temperatures etc.; he picks the (maybe) overpriced CPU which he trusts, but sorry it's his choice & right

 

[lorlabnew]

Originally posted by: magomago
By the way - there is NO computer out there that can run EVERYTHING at 1600*1200 max resolution for two years - even if you do some heavy duty overlcocking

You are rasing hopes for your friend. You can make a really good pc, but 2 years from now even the best Falcon will look slow

Yes, I'm afraid you're right here; but it also depends whether his favorite EA will introduce some new rendering engine for their PC - based EASports series ... I think they were using pretty much the same stuff for quite a while, just polished a bit with every years release of Madden etc. I may be wrong, but it looked the same to me always; but it's not what I play, so who knows..

dave

 

[KidChaos]

Originally posted by: lorlabnew
Motherboard: ABIT IT7 MAX2 ver.2.0 Intel 845PE chipset ATX motherboard Retail $167

this looks interesting too; how is the ABIT board? any issues with it?

Everyone I know who has the ABIT IT7 MAX2 board loves it.

 

[KidChaos]

is there any dual channel, Intel based DDR board?

All of them, that I've seen, are over $200.

 

[lorlabnew]

Originally posted by: KidChaos

Originally posted by: lorlabnew
Motherboard: ABIT IT7 MAX2 ver.2.0 Intel 845PE chipset ATX motherboard Retail $167

this looks interesting too; how is the ABIT board? any issues with it?

Everyone I know who has the ABIT IT7 MAX2 board loves it.

Looking at ABIT's site; that board is pretty loaded with features...

beside others : ATA 133 RAID 0/1/0+1 ; with that I could toss 2 cheaper Maxtors Series9 (Fry's has them periodically on sale for some $60 recently, I already bought 2) in the box for striped set... wonder if it would help to eliminate any "stutter" I noticed on occasion after I loaded Madden 2003 demo on my P 2.4B rig; it's this kind of small fraction of second hesistation, like if the larger textures are loaded or something..

anyway I'll look closer at ABIT IT7,
thx
dave

just one more thing; how is the IT7's audio? is it somehow decent? I'm using 6channel audio in my i845pebt2 and I like it, it's pretty sufficient for my needs, and this guy wouldn't mind quality similar to mine I'd say

 

[KidChaos]

just one more thing; how is the IT7's audio?

It all depends on the individual. At this point, I wouldn't put my trust in any integrated audio solution, except nforce2's nvidia APU.

 

[lorlabnew]

Originally posted by: KidChaos

just one more thing; how is the IT7's audio?

It all depends on the individual. At this point, I wouldn't put my trust in any integrated audio solution, except nforce2's nvidia APU.

KidChaos,

I checked some other forums regarding the mentioned Abit, and it seems to be referred as the pretty much fastest 845PE board around...interesting. I can't find it locally, but maybe I could get it shipped overnight from Newegg or Googlegear (both I have to pay CA tax & fast shipping, so thats why I buy retail usually). Btw, I wouldn't mind dual channel DDR Asus, but it's nowhere to be found, not in stock.

So I'm really narrowing down to Abit IT7 Max2 v.2 or Asus P4PE for DDR lineup. Whatever is fast and stable at default, and even faster and still stable overclocked...

Still not sure whether I shouldn't give a closer look to some RDRAM boards as well Could someone recommend a good one? I know that RDRAM isn't really that popular, but it's stable & fast at just stock speed ... (my older P 1.6A/D850MVL with 512MB of Samsung PC-800 is STILL rocking very well, despite being a year old build) How about Asus P4T533-C ($175) or maybe Intel EMV2L ($160)? I'm able to get half gig of PC1066 16bit - $99 per stick - Samsung brand I think, so pricewise it 's about the same as XMS DDR ...). not sure if I could use PC4200 , which is 20% more expensive, and whether it offers speed benefit over PC1066 ...

thx
dave

dave

 

[KidChaos]

I would pick the Abit IT7 Max2 v.2. Devastating overclocker. Abit has good tech support also. This is a winner!

 

[tapir]

Here's my choice for an Intel system under $1000. A few notes, you'll note I picked a cheap case (CG Group). I've had recent personal experience with this case and power supply and it's the best generic brand out there, IMO, you're getting a lot of value for the $35 and Antec or other high-end cases don't allow you to make the most out of a budget... also I included a 16X DVD only, no CD-RW although you could add or replace depending on what your friend wants.

Also instead of a 9700 Pro I used a 9700 vanilla, i.e. same feature set but lower clocks, you can overclock with any 9700 to 9700 Pro or beyond speeds and there's little difference anyway. I didn't think it was worth it to spend an extra $100 for an identical card clocked a little bit higher. Also if I were you I'd look for a deal on the hard drive but I've included one anyway. This should meet your budget.

This is a 32-bit RDRAM based solution.

From NEWEGG:
CODEGEN Model# 6057L-C9 (BEIGE) MID-TOWER PC CASE w/ 300W P4 READY POWER SUPPLY - RETAIL
$35

LITE-ON XJ-HD166S 16X DVD ROM Drive - OEM
$39.99

SAMSUNG 1.44MB BLACK FLOPPY DRIVE Model# SFD321B/KEB - OEM, DRIVE ONLY
$7.99

WD WESTERN DIGITAL "SPECIAL EDITION" 120GB 7200RPM EIDE HARD DRIVE MODEL # WD1200JB - OEM, DRIVE ONLY
$148

Epox Motherboard for Intel Pentium 4 Processors, Model# EP-4T4A+
$139

ATI OEM RADEON 9700 ATLANTIS 128MB DDR 8X AGP BULK
$236

SHIPPING $20
TOTAL $625.99

From GOOGLEGEAR:

Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 Processor (Northwood) 2.4BGHz, 533MHz FSB, Socket 478 Retail
$191


Samsung Original Rambus 256MB 32bit 1066MHz Memory ((2, or 512MB total))
$176

SHIPPING $1.50
TOTAL $368.50

Your total should be $994.99
Happy building.

EDIT.
Some more ideas:
Dual channel DDR:
Replace the motherboard with an AOpen AX4R Plus for $180 @ myaopen.com

Replace the memory with 2x
Kingston KHX3000/256 256MB DDR370 PC3000 Memory w/Heat Spreader Retail
from Googlegear at $62 each.

or, if you feel like going slightly overbudget, you could have 1GB of PC2100.
2x Crucial Technology 512MB DDR266 PC2100 Memory
also from GG at $86 each.

With 1024MB PC2100 your total turns out to $1031.49. Not bad at all IMO. You get the best chipset on the market with 1 GB of RAM, plus a decent CPU and a 9700.

The 512 PC3000 should be a little less, affording you room to get a better case/PSU and then crank up the FSB and get some of the insane bandwidth other GB E7205 users have witnessed.