1: Go to BYU. 2: Get a GF 3: Have sex. 4: Get kicked off the bball team

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Oct 19, 2000
17,860
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I love ATOT sometimes, I learn so much. I wish I had known about this magic underwear stuff a few months ago, would've made for some good ribbing at a friend. This friend cheated on his wife with a Mormon girl and got her pregnant....they just recently got married before she told the family she was pregnant. She even got mad at me once and deleted a comment I made on her Facebook about naming her kid...this was before she had told anybody.
 

child of wonder

Diamond Member
Aug 31, 2006
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Seriously? You're going to call something fraudulent because it was "discredited" by another hoax?

http://www.fairlds.org/Misc/How_Do_We_Explain_Early_Comments_about_the_Kinderhook_Plates.html

Even if you don't believe what has been written here, it's clear that, by your definition, the kinderhook plates are no more factual than the Book of Mormon and Book of Abraham.

So this Mormon concludes the Kinderhook plates are of no consequence because sources are in disagreement over whether a skeleton was buried with the plates and that no translation is shown to have occurred.

This is all an immaterial straw man argument considering Joseph Smith saw the Kinderhook plates, said the symbols were similar to those from the plates he claimed to translate to create the Book of Mormon, and stated he believed he could translate them.

Again, this is clear evidence of the fraudulent origins of the Mormon church. Had Joseph Smith actually seen and translated the golden plates, he would have immediately identified the Kinderhook plates as a fraud, especially since their symbols were based on Chinese symbols copied from teabags while the symbols Joseph Smith claimed to translate were supposedly similar to Egyptian hieroglyphics.

This is the same as with the Book of Abraham which, too, is evidence of his scam since we can now compare the original Egyptian document with the Book of Abraham and can see Joseph Smith's translation is nowhere near what the document actually portrays.
 

edro

Lifer
Apr 5, 2002
24,326
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I'd like to see how Scientology pans out in another 200 years.
If Mormonism has taken over an entire state in 200 years, Scientology will take over the world.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,125
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"BYU's honor code also requires students to be honest; abstain from alcoholic beverages, tobacco, tea, coffee and substance abuse; and attend church regularly"

Abstain from tea? Sorry, but the people who run that school are just stupid.

Mormons.

see, SEE people of America?! THis is what will happen if Mitt Romney is elected president! No more caffeine--all of your tea and soda will be confiscated. The return of prohibition! No more premarital sex, which will be prosecuted as a FEDERAL CRIME!!

:D
 

Proprioceptive

Golden Member
Feb 27, 2006
1,630
10
81
So this Mormon concludes the Kinderhook plates are of no consequence because sources are in disagreement over whether a skeleton was buried with the plates and that no translation is shown to have occurred.

This is all an immaterial straw man argument considering Joseph Smith saw the Kinderhook plates, said the symbols were similar to those from the plates he claimed to translate to create the Book of Mormon, and stated he believed he could translate them.

Again, this is clear evidence of the fraudulent origins of the Mormon church. Had Joseph Smith actually seen and translated the golden plates, he would have immediately identified the Kinderhook plates as a fraud, especially since their symbols were based on Chinese symbols copied from teabags while the symbols Joseph Smith claimed to translate were supposedly similar to Egyptian hieroglyphics.

This is the same as with the Book of Abraham which, too, is evidence of his scam since we can now compare the original Egyptian document with the Book of Abraham and can see Joseph Smith's translation is nowhere near what the document actually portrays.

Well, clearly you are more educated on the matter than I am, so I'll have to do some research and learn some more about it myself. I think the important thing here, though, is that even if it turns out that what I believe is all wrong and completely falsified, I at least know that I was happy with the lifestyle and faith I chose to live as to which I have no regrets.
 

child of wonder

Diamond Member
Aug 31, 2006
8,307
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Considering they're rituals founded by the church for our own use, I'd hardly call them ignorant. I am very familiar with the fact that some of the original church leaders were freemasons and they temple rituals do borrow from them, but to a very minimal extent. The symbols are not there to "ward off danger". They're there as a physical reminder of the covenants we make with god as well as a physical protection.

"Ward off danger" was meant to be a synonym for "protection" which you confirmed for me. Thank you.

Can you please describe for us how the garments have provided you physical protection or how it has helped you resist temptation?
 

mugs

Lifer
Apr 29, 2003
48,920
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lol you really think this is going to hurt BYU? if anything this is going to help them.

as i said its a win-win for both the student and the school. the kid gets his name out and will get more attention. the school shows they stick to what they say. but it amuses me that you think it will hurt them hehe

Don't you think playing for the number 3 ranked basketball team in the NCAA tournament would be a better way to "get his name out" than being from dismissed from the number 3 ranked basketball team?
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,125
30,076
146
I'd like to see how Scientology pans out in another 200 years.
If Mormonism has taken over an entire state in 200 years, Scientology will take over the world.

It didn't take over that state. The Utah territory was "claimed" by the Mormons before it was even a state.

Basically, any new religion would have to do what the Jonestown people did--find some non-incorporated territory and declare sovereignty. The Mormons were kicked out of 4 or 5 towns before they eventually realized that they need to start their own country, their own home, b/c no one would tolerate them.

Of course, taking Utah in as a state was a rather messy affair with governor Brigham Young...
 

Vette73

Lifer
Jul 5, 2000
21,503
8
0
Well, clearly you are more educated on the matter than I am, so I'll have to do some research and learn some more about it myself. I think the important thing here, though, is that even if it turns out that what I believe is all wrong and completely falsified, I at least know that I was happy with the lifestyle and faith I chose to live as to which I have no regrets.


So you admit your religion is a sham and know its a sham but thats ok?

Damm edro is right, Scientology is going to own us. :eek:
 

edro

Lifer
Apr 5, 2002
24,326
68
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It didn't take over that state. The Utah territory was "claimed" by the Mormons before it was even a state.

Basically, any new religion would have to do what the Jonestown people did--find some non-incorporated territory and declare sovereignty. The Mormons were kicked out of 4 or 5 towns before they eventually realized that they need to start their own country, their own home, b/c no one would tolerate them.

Of course, taking Utah in as a state was a rather messy affair with governor Brigham Young...
They pretty much own all of Utah now and most of the government officials are Mormon.
 

zebano

Diamond Member
Jun 15, 2005
4,042
0
0
Good for BYU. I'm impressed that they stuck to their guns on this one, it shows their commitment to their religion and their word.
 

child of wonder

Diamond Member
Aug 31, 2006
8,307
176
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Well, clearly you are more educated on the matter than I am, so I'll have to do some research and learn some more about it myself. I think the important thing here, though, is that even if it turns out that what I believe is all wrong and completely falsified, I at least know that I was happy with the lifestyle and faith I chose to live as to which I have no regrets.

That's fine and that's an honest answer.

However, I wish more Mormons held that viewpoint as the church has no qualms with using its financial power to influence public policies.
 

Jeffg010

Diamond Member
Feb 22, 2008
3,435
1
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Mormons.

see, SEE people of America?! THis is what will happen if Mitt Romney is elected president! No more caffeine--all of your tea and soda will be confiscated. The return of prohibition! No more premarital sex, which will be prosecuted as a FEDERAL CRIME!!

:D

Ya but we can have 25 wives as long as I can have a new hot 18 year old each year I think I would be set. So he can't be all bad.
 

Blackjack200

Lifer
May 28, 2007
15,995
1,686
126
Ok, I may be missing something rediculously obvious here, so anyone (not just mormons) can answer.

What is wrong with extra-marital sex? Honestly? You have a penis, she has a vagina; You both agree that it would be fun to use them for a few minutes (or seconds, in my case).

What about this behavior is harmful or destructive?
 

child of wonder

Diamond Member
Aug 31, 2006
8,307
176
106
It didn't take over that state. The Utah territory was "claimed" by the Mormons before it was even a state.

Basically, any new religion would have to do what the Jonestown people did--find some non-incorporated territory and declare sovereignty. The Mormons were kicked out of 4 or 5 towns before they eventually realized that they need to start their own country, their own home, b/c no one would tolerate them.

Of course, taking Utah in as a state was a rather messy affair with governor Brigham Young...

VERY messy. Google the "Mountain Meadows Massacre."
 

edro

Lifer
Apr 5, 2002
24,326
68
91
Ok, I may be missing something rediculously obvious here, so anyone (not just mormons) can answer.

What is wrong with extra-marital sex? Honestly? You have a penis, she has a vagina; You both agree that it would be fun to use them for a few minutes (or seconds, in my case).

What about this behavior is harmful or destructive?
Sex is meant only for making babies.
Making babies out of wedlock is forbidden.

Again, it goes along with the "can't have fun" lifestyle.
 

child of wonder

Diamond Member
Aug 31, 2006
8,307
176
106
Ok, I may be missing something rediculously obvious here, so anyone (not just mormons) can answer.

What is wrong with extra-marital sex? Honestly? You have a penis, she has a vagina; You both agree that it would be fun to use them for a few minutes (or seconds, in my case).

What about this behavior is harmful or destructive?

The demonization of sex outside of marriage has a long tradition in human history. In fact, sex, in general, seems to historically frowned upon. So many mythological gods throughout history are born of virgins, for example.

Personally, I like the idea of people waiting until marriage to have sex to reduce the number of STDs and unwanted pregnancies but I see nothing wrong with two consenting adults having sex if they feel like it.
 

Cogman

Lifer
Sep 19, 2000
10,283
134
106
VERY messy. Google the "Mountain Meadows Massacre."

http://newsroom.lds.org/article/150th-anniversary-of-mountain-meadows-massacre
http://lds.org/ensign/2007/09/the-mountain-meadows-massacre?lang=eng

Yep, sucked. To bad it wasn't sanctioned by church leaders. Are you really surprised that people that were just driven out of their homes, torchered, raped, had their leader killed, etc. would all the sudden snap when a group of people that look and sound like those that had earlier attacked them.

Yes, Evil, terrible mormons. They are so militant!
 

FelixDeCat

Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
29,592
2,257
126
Ok, I may be missing something rediculously obvious here, so anyone (not just mormons) can answer.

What is wrong with extra-marital sex? Honestly? You have a penis, she has a vagina; You both agree that it would be fun to use them for a few minutes (or seconds, in my case).

What about this behavior is harmful or destructive?

Before marriage - chance of an accidental babby that might be aborted or left in a single parent home, STDs, and cheapening / not strengthening the relationship.

After marriage (adultry) - obviously wrong.
 
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edro

Lifer
Apr 5, 2002
24,326
68
91
I'll give it to you Mormons on here.
You have a lot of balls defending your religion to this crowd.
 

child of wonder

Diamond Member
Aug 31, 2006
8,307
176
106
http://newsroom.lds.org/article/150th-anniversary-of-mountain-meadows-massacre
http://lds.org/ensign/2007/09/the-mountain-meadows-massacre?lang=eng

Yep, sucked. To bad it wasn't sanctioned by church leaders. Are you really surprised that people that were just driven out of their homes, torchered, raped, had their leader killed, etc. would all the sudden snap when a group of people that look and sound like those that had earlier attacked them.

Yes, Evil, terrible mormons. They are so militant!

lol

I never said any of that.

But, you're right. We should look the other way when an oppressed people murder men, women, and children. Two wrongs make a right.
 

sao123

Lifer
May 27, 2002
12,650
203
106
Ok, I may be missing something rediculously obvious here, so anyone (not just mormons) can answer.

What is wrong with extra-marital sex? Honestly? You have a penis, she has a vagina; You both agree that it would be fun to use them for a few minutes (or seconds, in my case).

What about this behavior is harmful or destructive?

Since you clearly do not respect the sacredness of virginity/sex/etc, how about these:

Breaking a legal/binding exclusive permanent contract?
Feelings of Jealousy Distrust & Inadequacy created in your spouse?
Feelings of Jealousy Distrust & Inadequacy created in his/her spouse?
the potential for spreading of disease?
the potential for unwanted pregnancy?