“Project 2025”: Conservative master plan to end democracy?

[UNCjigga]

So this is interesting—apparently Trump’s first presidency was always meant to be a trial run for intel gathering purposes. While every sane voter’s anger was focused on Trump, his appointees and their underlings throughout the Executive Branch could quietly see how these agencies tick and find weak spots (read: accountability). Bannon was saying the quiet part out loud.

Now many of these MAGA cabinet and executive branch members have written a guidebook for the next GOP President-Elect—whomever that may be (cough…Trump.) This guidebook is a blitzkrieg of executive actions that need to be implemented in the first 180 days in office. Of course, this was written with the Heritage Foundation’s blessing, so you bet your ass that any “Major Questions” issues won’t even get on the SCOTUS docket thanks to the Foundation’s bought and paid for majority.

As for what’s in the plan—it all starts with a radical application of Unitary Executive Theory that I assume has been blessed by Alito, Thomas and our newest SCOTUS justices. See, the problem with the federal government is that most departments and agencies were already well established before Reagan. Add 16 years of Clinton/Obama + 12 years of Bushes and…well…the Administrative State was “conceived of by liberals for the purpose of promulgating liberal policies.”

So now the Justice Department and various other departments and agencies would be under direct Presidential control for one—including the GSA (direct control over hiring/firing of career government employees—not just appointees.)

Every dollar of funding allocated by Congress to these exec branch functions would be spent or impounded based on the President’s wishes (I.e. he can effectively defund/kill any established program that he doesn’t like.) Congress no longer controls the purse.

End result? “We will expel the warmongers from our government [good luck Ukraine]. We will drive out the globalists. [no Jews] We will cast out the communists, Marxists and fascists [no liberals/career officials installed by liberals/“woke/affirmative action” hires] . And we will throw off the sick political class that hates our country.” [Democrats will never again win a federal office]

Sounds rather nefarious—but they aren’t even hiding their plans. In fact, the Heritage Foundation rolled out the master plan with a press release and a party back in January. It’s all over Trump and other GOP candidates’ campaign sites and you bet your ass support will be a litmus test for the GOP nominee. As a Trump campaign manager said, “Voters will know exactly how President Trump will supercharge the economy, bring down inflation, secure the border, protect communities and eradicate the deep state that works against Americans once and for all.” Of course, they’ll publicly talk about gutting the IRS and EPA and Dept. of Interior. They won’t say too much about the Federal Elections Commission, enforcement of voting rights laws, or using the Fed to artificially pump the economy during election years.

So how would they get it done? After all, Trump tried a lot of this back in his first Administration and was ineffective. Well, the blame for that goes to the feckless revolving door cabinet. This time, Stephen Miller and Heritage have been vetting potential cabinet picks based on support for the plan.

Why haven’t we talked about this? The New York Times is just getting around to digging in: https://www.nytimes.com/2023/07/17/...ytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare

 

[Stokely]

It's been obvious Republicans have been all for Authoritarianism for a long time now.

Look around the world and see what other champs of Democracy are all about a strong central leader, seen often as a glorious hero... Russia...China...North Korea...and a shit ton of banana republics of various sizes. It's no surprise to hear Trump express jealousy that he can't do the things done in Russia or the Philapines, where things happen on a whim of the top dog.

Cult of Personality. Personally, we'd all be way better off thinking of candidates as administrators. Their main skills should be hiring qualified people for positions, and our main focus should be on their platforms. This is why I pay no attention whatsoever for those clown shows we call "debates". Might as well have a hot dog eating contest to decide who wins for all the relevance those things have.

 

[Indus]

Trump unleashed a war on the U.S. government — and he can't control it

This struggle isn't violent, so far — but if states break away from federal control, the United States is finished

www.salon.com

Donald Trump unleashed a war against the U.S. government — and now he can't control it​

This struggle isn't violent, so far — but if states break away from federal control, the United States is finished​

National Security Council spokesman John Kirby explained to me this week, "when the need for America to represent stability and democracy has never been stronger." Wars in Ukraine and Africa, missile tests in North Korea and disarray in the Middle East further sow the seeds of division. "American stability is important for international peace and survival," Kirby explained.

Yet the MAGA world still screams about civil war. Norman Eisen of the Brookings Institution, also a legal analyst for CNN, says it is mostly just that – screaming. "Jan. 6 showed that insurrection won't succeed," he said, but while increased violence isn't necessarily in the offing (this country is already exceedingly violent, with an average of two mass shootings per day this year), many of the states that joined the Confederate insurrection 160 years ago are still trying to undermine the federal government.

In Alabama it's all about voting districts. In Texas it's about our international border. In Florida it's all about history class.

In Texas, the Justice Department filed a suit against the state and Gov. Greg Abbott on Monday, claiming violations of federal law after the state installed a floating barrier in the Rio Grande and the Texas state police said Abbott was having immigrants tossed back into the river, particularly small children.



not a bad read but I do think a national divorce is needed even if it's Putin's wet dream come true.

 

[Stokely]

All good things must end, including most marriages. Or many of them.

Let the red states form Jesusland and be done wit it--it's a win-win. Jesusland can bring back slavery and execute gays and have no higher learning (that's where all the "radical indoctrination" takes place) that isn't Christian school. Whatever the blue states will be named can do things differently. A bunch of us will have to migrate but I'm planning on that anyway.

Right now, you could move to a liberal state like NY and end up surrounded by rednecks. I stayed in upstate NY and I might as well been back in rural FL minus the heat and alligators. Likewise, a god-fearing red-blooded 'Murican might move to Alabama and through no fault of their own get surrounded by a bunch of radical liberals who might be transvestites who drink bud light! It's tough out there!

Let's draw lines and be done with it. At some point. two alternate realities just aren't compatible. As things are, I've cut off any political discussion with the so-called Conservatives I'm surrounded with. It's a mutual decision and it keeps necessary relationships (like with coworkers) from getting hostile. Any optional ones, bye, I'm done at this point.

In retrospect, while I'm glad the Civil war happened to free the slaves, not sure it was a great idea to have one country after that.

 

[Fenixgoon]

i mean mike pence wants to do the same...so i'd just say it's the republican agenda at this point, regardless of who ends up in office.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/07/26/politics/pence-economic-proposal/index.html

 

[Moonbeam]

Calling Chicken Little, come in Chicken Little. There are cracks in the sky.

 

[fskimospy]

This is generally the way by which presidential democracies fall into autocracy, yes. In the face of a weak and ineffectual congress the executive takes more and more power to itself until the legislature becomes an afterthought. This is why presidential democracies are a bad idea.

Basically this rejects the ability of Congress to regulate the operations of federal agencies in any way and gives the president an effective line item veto. The only remaining constraint is that the president still needs congress to appropriate funds for what he wants to do but I’m confident an enterprising president can find a way around that.

 

[nakedfrog]

They don't want to end democracy per se, just restore it to historical traditions of being only accessible to wealthy white land owners.

 

[Moonbeam]

Seems to me there are too many psychopaths out to game the system and being psychopaths they will ruin the game for themselves thus manifesting their inner hell externally for all to experience and it happens because en masse we feel we deserve it.

Year by year the cumulative effects of individual selfishness erode the general welfare drawing us year by year into greater disunity and longing for revenge.

And it is always someone else’s self-centeredness that is the problem, never our own. We are just innocent victims telling ourselves we deserve none of this. Who will feel what we feel today rather than push it down the road or notice thatS what we are doing?

 

[Moonbeam]

They don't want to end democracy per se, just restore it to historical traditions of being only accessible to wealthy white land owners.

What people think they want and what they do to get it does not always equal the desired results.

 

[ivwshane]

The Unitary Executive Theory has been floated for a while now (under bush jr and advocated by Cheney).

Also, before Nixon, did the president not always have the power to say how money congress gave to the various federal agencies was to spend? The president has pretty much always had the power of essentially a line item veto when it came to spending. However that was removed during Nixons tenure with the passage of 1974 Congressional Budget and Impoundment Control Act.

Fun fact; some say the CBA is the cause of the budgetary mess we have now and have had for 40 years.

So... this is Nixon’s fault?

The Budget Act was written to solve one problem—and caused a much, much bigger crisis.

www.politico.com

 

[fskimospy]

The Unitary Executive Theory has been floated for a while now (under bush jr and advocated by Cheney).

Also, before Nixon, did the president not always have the power to say how money congress gave to the various federal agencies? The president has pretty much always had the power of essentially a line item veto when it came to spending. However that was removed during Nixons tenure with the passage of 1974 Congressional Budget and Impoundment Control Act.

Fun fact; some cat the CBA is the cause of the budgetary mess we have now and have had for 40 years.

So... this is Nixon’s fault?

The Budget Act was written to solve one problem—and caused a much, much bigger crisis.

www.politico.com

The main issue I have with that article is the assumption that deficits are inherently bad, which is very obviously wrong.

 

[MrSquished]

I say we play some reverse pscyhology on these regressive red states that encourages them to live out their wet dream of secession thinking they are winning, AND THEN LET THEM DO IT!

let the fuckers leave. otherwise we are all fucked. better that only half the country is fucked than all of us. then start a repatriation program for all decent people stuck in the red fascist white nationalist theocracy, we don't want to leave them there. but first we have to establish a sane country, with no chance of being ruled by the disgustingness that is the entire GQP.

 

[ivwshane]

The main issue I have with that article is the assumption that deficits are inherently bad, which is very obviously wrong.

It’s bad in that they went up even more and seemingly unchecked before the CBA. I don’t know if one of the reasons for the CBA was reducing deficits but if it was then obviously it failed.

 

[nickqt]

I say we play some reverse pscyhology on these regressive red states that encourages them to live out their wet dream of secession thinking they are winning, AND THEN LET THEM DO IT!

let the fuckers leave. otherwise we are all fucked. better that only half the country is fucked than all of us. then start a repatriation program for all decent people stuck in the red fascist white nationalist theocracy, we don't want to leave them there. but first we have to establish a sane country, with no chance of being ruled by the disgustingness that is the entire GQP.

Trump unleashed a war on the U.S. government — and he can't control it

This struggle isn't violent, so far — but if states break away from federal control, the United States is finished

www.salon.com

Donald Trump unleashed a war against the U.S. government — and now he can't control it​

This struggle isn't violent, so far — but if states break away from federal control, the United States is finished​

National Security Council spokesman John Kirby explained to me this week, "when the need for America to represent stability and democracy has never been stronger." Wars in Ukraine and Africa, missile tests in North Korea and disarray in the Middle East further sow the seeds of division. "American stability is important for international peace and survival," Kirby explained.

Yet the MAGA world still screams about civil war. Norman Eisen of the Brookings Institution, also a legal analyst for CNN, says it is mostly just that – screaming. "Jan. 6 showed that insurrection won't succeed," he said, but while increased violence isn't necessarily in the offing (this country is already exceedingly violent, with an average of two mass shootings per day this year), many of the states that joined the Confederate insurrection 160 years ago are still trying to undermine the federal government.

In Alabama it's all about voting districts. In Texas it's about our international border. In Florida it's all about history class.

In Texas, the Justice Department filed a suit against the state and Gov. Greg Abbott on Monday, claiming violations of federal law after the state installed a floating barrier in the Rio Grande and the Texas state police said Abbott was having immigrants tossed back into the river, particularly small children.



not a bad read but I do think a national divorce is needed even if it's Putin's wet dream come true.

All good things must end, including most marriages. Or many of them.

Let the red states form Jesusland and be done wit it--it's a win-win. Jesusland can bring back slavery and execute gays and have no higher learning (that's where all the "radical indoctrination" takes place) that isn't Christian school. Whatever the blue states will be named can do things differently. A bunch of us will have to migrate but I'm planning on that anyway.

Right now, you could move to a liberal state like NY and end up surrounded by rednecks. I stayed in upstate NY and I might as well been back in rural FL minus the heat and alligators. Likewise, a god-fearing red-blooded 'Murican might move to Alabama and through no fault of their own get surrounded by a bunch of radical liberals who might be transvestites who drink bud light! It's tough out there!

Let's draw lines and be done with it. At some point. two alternate realities just aren't compatible. As things are, I've cut off any political discussion with the so-called Conservatives I'm surrounded with. It's a mutual decision and it keeps necessary relationships (like with coworkers) from getting hostile. Any optional ones, bye, I'm done at this point.

In retrospect, while I'm glad the Civil war happened to free the slaves, not sure it was a great idea to have one country after that.

Meh, no need for a "national divorce".

Strong Federalism.

Let Blue States do Blue State stuff.

Let Red States do Red State stuff.

Obligatory link (read it if you haven't. Read it again if you haven't read it in the last week).

Democrats Should Weaponize Federalism

If Democrats truly believe in the power of their policies, they should be ready to weaponize federalism.

www.politicalorphans.com

To be clear, only a delusional person would believe that the US will exist as the current version of the US until the sun goes red giant and makes it all irrelevant.

That said, there is no reason for extra death just yet. And believe that if there is a "national divorce", there will be shots fired, there will be killings, and it won't go quite as smoothly as just drawing a new couple of border lines.

Strong Federalism. It's a step towards a national divorce, but let's see how Strong Federalism works out first.

 

[gothuevos]

Meh, no need for a "national divorce".

Strong Federalism.

Let Blue States do Blue State stuff.

Let Red States do Red State stuff.

Obligatory link (read it if you haven't. Read it again if you haven't read it in the last week).

Democrats Should Weaponize Federalism

If Democrats truly believe in the power of their policies, they should be ready to weaponize federalism.

www.politicalorphans.com

To be clear, only a delusional person would believe that the US will exist as the current version of the US until the sun goes red giant and makes it all irrelevant.

That said, there is no reason for extra death just yet. And believe that if there is a "national divorce", there will be shots fired, there will be killings, and it won't go quite as smoothly as just drawing a new couple of border lines.

Strong Federalism. It's a step towards a national divorce, but let's see how Strong Federalism works out first.

Federalism sounds well and good, but this new plan by Trump is anything but that.

Their hero Ronni Reagan would be spinning in his grave if he saw the GOP today trying to EXPAND Presidential powers. But why are we surprised - we knew that as soon as they started rejecting election results that they would soon start rejecting democracy itself (David Frum quote).

We've lost the consent of the governed, so the sooner we split up, the better. Just balkanize into like 4-5 different regions. We'll all be weaker and poorer for it, but maybe that's a good thing in terms of balance of power? Just make sure each side has at least one nuke to start with and MAD should keep a lid on things for awhile.

 

[gothuevos]

I say we play some reverse pscyhology on these regressive red states that encourages them to live out their wet dream of secession thinking they are winning, AND THEN LET THEM DO IT!

let the fuckers leave. otherwise we are all fucked. better that only half the country is fucked than all of us. then start a repatriation program for all decent people stuck in the red fascist white nationalist theocracy, we don't want to leave them there. but first we have to establish a sane country, with no chance of being ruled by the disgustingness that is the entire GQP.

Would be immediately devastating but arguably worse for blue states as the red states take away significant food supplies and military with them.

Yes the blue states can import their food but this cost gets passed along to us and if you haven't noticed, grocery store prices (or anything, really) still haven't come down. It would be crippling.

 

[GodisanAtheist]

Would be immediately devastating but arguably worse for blue states as the red states take away significant food supplies and military with them.

Yes the blue states can import their food but this cost gets passed along to us and if you haven't noticed, grocery store prices (or anything, really) still haven't come down. It would be crippling.

-Then whole argument is sort of silly across the board and we would all be turbo fucked in such a scenario, but it's far from black and white here.

California alone produces 1/3 of the US' veggie output.

All that neat US Military Gear won't maintain or pay for itself on Red State GDP bucks.

But all that is really pointless when such a separation would essentially mean the end of the modern era and the start of a new dark age for humanity as the world's largest economy shoots itself in the face.

 

[sportage]

Oh, I don't think anything "started" with Trump. It's been an ongoing process beginning after WWII. Remember how life was back after WWII? One income families, one car garages, unions, good wages, family vacations, affordable college, healthy foods, clean waters and a clean atmosphere? Dad worked, mom cooked the meals, kids came home to mom cooking in the kitchen. McDonalds were few and only as entertainment, not a necessity. Roads were paved, factories built cars and washers and dryers and TV sets and socks and shoes and shirts and pants.

Then... something happened. Something happened where the very government who should have protected our way of life decided to become the enemy of the middle class. The enemy of unions. The enemy of labor and factories and mom and dad and the enemy of families. The very government that should have protected the middle class became hell bent on destroying the middle class.

Thus, America became the nation of great wealth disparity. Rich over here, and everyone else over there. And that mindset continuers today however today the enemy has become so skilled at controlling the people, that people actually vote for the evil which encompasses them. The people can no longer decipher between right and wrong, good and bad especially when it comes to deciphering their own lives. Their own families. Deciphering their own best interest.

This has been going on for a long long time, and politics has little to do with it nor has political party. It's been the ongoing and never ending process to create an America where we have the few queen ants and everyone else as the worker ants. Just as the powers that be have planned it to be.
It's in our courts. It's in our Supreme Court. It's in our leaders every one of them. It is.... the system. Like an organization of members all working together while pretending to be separate. Pretending to be a choice, which they are not a choice. Only a choice of one.

Donald Trump? He's just the current phase. The next effort to create a world just as the controlling powers want it to be, and to ensure that America the world remain exactly as they intend.
Hasn't it occurred to anyone how our government has no interest in protecting the people? Only to enable our self destruction?

 

[cytg111]

Why haven’t anyone put Miller out in the sun yet?

Plus The Heritage Foundation is obviously a terrorist fascist 5th column entity.

Leaked video: Dark money group brags about writing GOP voter suppression bills across the country

“We did it quickly and we did it quietly,” said the executive director of Heritage Action.

www.motherjones.com

They’re out to end you. No shit.

 

[Linux23]

Would be immediately devastating but arguably worse for blue states as the red states take away significant food supplies and military with them.

Yes the blue states can import their food but this cost gets passed along to us and if you haven't noticed, grocery store prices (or anything, really) still haven't come down. It would be crippling.

those prices are never coming down, FYI.

 

[hal2kilo]

those prices are never coming down, FYI.

Most things have gone down, with the exception of beef, eggs, and things made with a lot of eggs, like mayo. IMHO.

 

[GodisanAtheist]

Most things have gone down, with the exception of beef, eggs, and things made with a lot of eggs, like mayo. IMHO.

-I can't tell if things are getting cheaper or I'm just getting used to the prices.

I did notice the other day that I had a full basket of items for super tacos and didn't break the $50 barrier after taxes so something is cheaper even if I'm not closely paying attention to what.