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Old 06-08-2012, 03:57 PM   #25901
emperus
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Originally Posted by Druidx View Post
I'm not surprised you're a fan.

Mr. Sharpton has made a name for himself with race baiting. GZ/TM is only one of many crimes he's used over the years to further his agenda. For example the 1987 case of Twanda Brawley


http://nlpc.org/sites/default/files/...cialReport.pdf
page 19.
What is his agenda?
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Old 06-08-2012, 03:59 PM   #25902
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I'll let someone else address #1 but for #2.
Horizontal was in reference the bullet travailing straight thru TM not at an angle, the plane of the bullet was perpendicular to TM.
It was discussed about 5 pages back
That's my point. So explain how the bullet travels perpindicular to TM's heart if he is straddling Zimmerman?
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Old 06-08-2012, 03:59 PM   #25903
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The more I think of Zimm's story the more it makes little sense.
Two thoughts.

1.) Zimm, said he was on his back and TM on top of him. He also said TM saw the gun first and that is why he remembered he had a gun. How does he unolster the gun, point it at TM's chest and shoot him. Again, if I see a gun first, it's a life and death struggle at that point. How does he get the gun to the point where he shoots TM especially when TM is straddling him and I'm sure holding the gun down with every ounce of force his 17 year old body can muster.

2.)Someone here said the bullet went horizontally throught the heart. How is that possible if TM is straddling Zimm? Horiontally would mean there chests are parallel to each other. So, either Zimm is sitting up and TM is sitting up as well, TM's chest is straddling him such that his chest is parallel to the ground (which is unlikely or TM is hovering over the ground chest down (which is more unlikely.)

Thoughts?
And this is why you should really stop thinking...

1. It's a struggle, T lost as he should have

2. It was horizontal to his body, meaning a direct shot and not from an angle...there is no ballistic test in the world which could tell the orientation of the gun to the ground, TM straddling him and beating him when he got shot is simple to understand
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:00 PM   #25904
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That's my point. So explain how the bullet travels perpindicular to TM's heart if he is straddling Zimmerman?
You either don't understand simple angles or you'll just never admit anything lines up with the likely truth...I suspect the latter
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:02 PM   #25905
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Thoughts?
You should start answering other people's questions addressed towards you first before you expect others to reply to your hypotheticals. Those are my "thoughts".
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:05 PM   #25906
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And this is why you should really stop thinking...

1. It's a struggle, T lost as he should have

2. It was horizontal to his body, meaning a direct shot and not from an angle...there is no ballistic test in the world which could tell the orientation of the gun to the ground, TM straddling him and beating him when he got shot is simple to understand
1.) THat's easy to say. How did he lose? There were no marks on his body so Zimm wasn't punching him. He had a head start as he saw the gun first. How did he lose a LIFE AND DEATH struggle for a gun? And how did he allow Zimm to orient it perpindicular to his heart.

2.) Again, lay on the ground, pretend someone is on top of you straddling you, trying to stop you from pulling out your gun in your holster on you hip. Then try to move it across your body and orient it so you can fire it at an intermediate range in a perpindicular direction to someone's heart. See if you can do that.

Geez, this isn't that hard. I would think most of you here would be math and science guys.
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:12 PM   #25907
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1.) THat's easy to say. How did he lose? There were no marks on his body so Zimm wasn't punching him. He had a head start as he saw the gun first. How did he lose a LIFE AND DEATH struggle for a gun? And how did he allow Zimm to orient it perpindicular to his heart.

2.) Again, lay on the ground, pretend someone is on top of you straddling you, trying to stop you from pulling out your gun in your holster on you hip. Then try to move it across your body and orient it so you can fire it at an intermediate range in a perpindicular direction to someone's heart. See if you can do that.

Geez, this isn't that hard. I would think most of you here would be math and science guys.
1. That's super easy, T IS DEAD, maybe Z isn't the big old pussy you want to make him out to be after all

2. Yes I most definitely can...and it wasn't on his hip as has been discussed so very many times already, appendix carry is the most likely which is just off center, which happens to be how I carry as well, and you know the range was basically the distance his shirt hung off his body since it was contact range to the shirt, which would mean he was leaning over at the time, you know like if he was on top of somebody like witnesses say he was
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:13 PM   #25908
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That's my point. So explain how the bullet travels perpindicular to TM's heart if he is straddling Zimmerman?
Do you not understand what perpendicular means, the gun was pointed straight at TM, it wasn't pointed at an angle. The gun wasn't down by TM hips and firing up into his chest. The gun wasn't at TM's head firing down into his chest. The shot was fired straight into TM. That is all the report really says. Which could have happened while they were still on the ground. In fact the report shows the entry point was slightly off to the side, about what I guess if the two where in close contact.
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:17 PM   #25909
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Do you not understand what perpendicular means, the gun was pointed straight at TM, it wasn't pointed at an angle. The gun wasn't down by TM hips and firing up into his chest. The gun wasn't at TM's head firing down into his chest. The shot was fired straight into TM. That is all the report really says. Which could have happened while they were still on the ground. In fact the report shows the entry point was slightly off to the side, about what I guess if the two where in close contact.
Some people will never understand simple angles...or ever admit what is the most obvious conclusion here is more the point
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:22 PM   #25910
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And this is why you should really stop thinking...

1. It's a struggle, T lost as he should have

2. It was horizontal to his body, meaning a direct shot and not from an angle...there is no ballistic test in the world which could tell the orientation of the gun to the ground, TM straddling him and beating him when he got shot is simple to understand
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Originally Posted by emperus View Post
1.) THat's easy to say. How did he lose? There were no marks on his body so Zimm wasn't punching him. He had a head start as he saw the gun first. How did he lose a LIFE AND DEATH struggle for a gun? And how did he allow Zimm to orient it perpindicular to his heart.

2.) Again, lay on the ground, pretend someone is on top of you straddling you, trying to stop you from pulling out your gun in your holster on you hip. Then try to move it across your body and orient it so you can fire it at an intermediate range in a perpindicular direction to someone's heart. See if you can do that.

Geez, this isn't that hard. I would think most of you here would be math and science guys.
1.) He (TM) lost the struggle for the gun. I'm no gun expert, but based on police holsters, and my logical assumptions about holsters in general, I would think the person that was wearing the holster (GZ) would have the advantage as far getting the gun out, and pointing it away from themselves. It was a life and death struggle though, so of course it was in no way scripted, and there's no telling how it actually played out. It's not as if it could have only happened one way.

2.) I would imagine GZ's elbows were pulled back, flanking the side of his ribs, with two hands on the gun. TM wouldn't have had his arms at full extension, as that would have given him less leverage to try to pull the gun out of GZ's hands. So, that means TM likely had pulled himself closer to GZ's body, and was probably more in parallel with GZ at that time. I don't think GZ aimed at all. I believe that GZ was able to fire the weapon, and the placement of the bullet was purely coincidental.

Thoughts?
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:37 PM   #25911
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Do you think I give a damn? Your boyfriend Zimmerman is going to have many surprise sex while in jail. His asshole may be a little too big for you when he gets out, if he gets out.
Too bad your fantasy can't and won't take place as GZ isn't in the general population, in fact he's the only one in the cell. I bet your panties will be half way up your ass should he get released on bail again which I suspect the probabilities are quite high he will be released again.
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:39 PM   #25912
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Originally Posted by Infohawk View Post
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/06/08...ed-with-death/

Looks like some Martin supporters want Zimmerman dead without the benefit of a trial.
I strongly suspect this will be shown to the judge at the bail hearing on the 29th.
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Old 06-08-2012, 04:41 PM   #25913
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I strongly suspect this will be shown to the judge at the bail hearing on the 29th.
Why is that?
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Old 06-08-2012, 05:01 PM   #25914
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Why is that?
To help illustrate how this case is vastly different compared to most cases where the person returns to their own house after making bail. Spike Lee tried his best to tell people where GZ may have been living, there was a bounty on his head from an organization that should not have been doing so, and receiving death threats. Due to these circumstances and the need to find/pay for a safe haven was the main reason the Zimmerman's weren't truthful about their finances.
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Old 06-08-2012, 05:08 PM   #25915
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To help illustrate how this case is vastly different compared to most cases where the person returns to their own house after making bail. Spike Lee tried his best to tell people where GZ may have been living, there was a bounty on his head from an organization that should not have been doing so, and receiving death threats. Due to these circumstances and the need to find/pay for a safe haven was the main reason the Zimmerman's weren't truthful about their finances.
I honestly don't care all that much about their intentions there, I can guess why which is basically what you're saying but I can't get behind the lie itself regardless of intention...though I think they can get around any real penalties for it on technicalities...besides, how often is anyone really charged with perjury anyway? Shit happens all the damn time sadly...
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Old 06-08-2012, 05:09 PM   #25916
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1.) He (TM) lost the struggle for the gun. I'm no gun expert, but based on police holsters, and my logical assumptions about holsters in general, I would think the person that was wearing the holster (GZ) would have the advantage as far getting the gun out, and pointing it away from themselves. It was a life and death struggle though, so of course it was in no way scripted, and there's no telling how it actually played out. It's not as if it could have only happened one way.

2.) I would imagine GZ's elbows were pulled back, flanking the side of his ribs, with two hands on the gun. TM wouldn't have had his arms at full extension, as that would have given him less leverage to try to pull the gun out of GZ's hands. So, that means TM likely had pulled himself closer to GZ's body, and was probably more in parallel with GZ at that time. I don't think GZ aimed at all. I believe that GZ was able to fire the weapon, and the placement of the bullet was purely coincidental.

Thoughts?
Then how did he get the gun out initially if both elbows were flanked to the side?

Do we know?
1.) Where Zimm was wearing the holseter?
2.) If Zimm was Right or Left handed?
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Old 06-08-2012, 05:10 PM   #25917
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To help illustrate how this case is vastly different compared to most cases where the person returns to their own house after making bail. Spike Lee tried his best to tell people where GZ may have been living, there was a bounty on his head from an organization that should not have been doing so, and receiving death threats. Due to these circumstances and the need to find/pay for a safe haven was the main reason the Zimmerman's weren't truthful about their finances.
The judge is not going to care.
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Old 06-08-2012, 05:12 PM   #25918
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Then how did he get the gun out initially if both elbows were flanked to the side?

Do we know?
1.) Where Zimm was wearing the holseter?
2.) If Zimm was Right or Left handed?
You would never admit it was possible so why do you keep asking questions?

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The judge is not going to care.
Not in the least, it has zero bearing on anything at all except to show how many assholes there are on a particular side of this issue
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Old 06-08-2012, 05:14 PM   #25919
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I honestly don't care all that much about their intentions there, I can guess why which is basically what you're saying but I can't get behind the lie itself regardless of intention...though I think they can get around any real penalties for it on technicalities...besides, how often is anyone really charged with perjury anyway? Shit happens all the damn time sadly...
It won't hurt for the Zimmerman's to apologize to the judge for not being truthful and explaining why they weren't truthful. I feel this judge is fair enough that he will consider their circumstances as well their apology when he decides whether to allow GZ out on bail again..
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Old 06-08-2012, 05:15 PM   #25920
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The judge is not going to care.
So says the story teller.
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Old 06-08-2012, 05:15 PM   #25921
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It won't hurt for the Zimmerman's to apologize to the judge for not being truthful and explaining why they weren't truthful. I feel this judge is fair enough that he will consider their circumstances as well their apology when he decides whether to allow GZ out on bail again..
Won't hurt in the least, and should certainly counter the idea they were doing it so he could possibly flee which is absurd...if he wanted to do that he would have long ago
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Old 06-08-2012, 05:20 PM   #25922
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Won't hurt in the least, and should certainly counter the idea they were doing it so he could possibly flee which is absurd...if he wanted to do that he would have long ago
Not really. Wait to see how trial goes, if poorly, flee. If well, stay and hopefully win.
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Old 06-08-2012, 05:37 PM   #25923
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You would never admit it was possible so why do you keep asking questions?


Not in the least, it has zero bearing on anything at all except to show how many assholes there are on a particular side of this issue
I have my own mind. I'm an Engineer and love math. So, if I can't visualize it. It doesn't make sense. Unless you have a plausible explanation how he got his gun free from the holster, away from TM and shot TM in a perpindicular maner, I won't believe it.
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Old 06-08-2012, 05:37 PM   #25924
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Won't hurt in the least, and should certainly counter the idea they were doing it so he could possibly flee which is absurd...if he wanted to do that he would have long ago
Blah Blah Blah. Your hero LIED.
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Old 06-08-2012, 05:41 PM   #25925
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I have my own mind. I'm an Engineer and love math. So, if I can't visualize it. It doesn't make sense. Unless you have a plausible explanation how he got his gun free from the holster, away from TM and shot TM in a perpindicular maner, I won't believe it.
Then use your mind, or just stop by and see me sometime, I'd be glad to show you I can draw and shoot you square in the chest when you're on top of me

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Blah Blah Blah. Your hero LIED.
Blah Blah Blah...he allowed his wife to lie, derp

And he ain't my hero
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