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Old 07-01-2010, 08:03 PM   #1
fbrdphreak
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Default 2011 Subaru Forester to get revised DOHC engine with timing chain

It's about damn time. They better not leave the craptastic 4-speed auto in there either.

Quote:
The new engine retains the same displacement as the outgoing mill and achieves the same 170-horsepower, but it's now packing a chain driven double overhead cam versus the belt driven single overhead cam before. The result is maximum horsepower available at a lower RPM and an additional four pound-feet of torque (to 174 lb-ft). The new 2.5-liter helps the Forester post 21 miles-per-gallon in the city and 27 mpg on the highway whether you're sporting the manual or automatic transmission. That's up one mpg versus the outgoing model.

Other changes include a new model; the Subaru 2.5XT Touring, which slots above the Limited model. Among the standard features on the Touring model are HID headlamps, backup camera and dual-zone climate control. Subaru is also adding a 2.5XT Premium model (old model was 2.5X Premium), which includes a 10-way power driver's seat, an upgraded stereo with six speakers, Bluetooth and a USB port for your iPod. Also available is a removable 4.3-inch TomTom Navigation System for directions on the cheap. Hit the jump to read over the Subaru presser if you're interested in all the details.
http://www.autoblog.com/2010/07/01/s...-fuel-economy/
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Old 07-01-2010, 08:58 PM   #2
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Do you still have to move the engine to change spark plugs?
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Old 07-01-2010, 10:14 PM   #3
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You got shafted if you have to move the engine in your Forester I know the Impreza's have to remove crazy shit like the wiper fluid reservoir, but "all" I have to do is pull the battery and the air intake
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Old 07-01-2010, 10:44 PM   #4
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oh really? Good to know! I don't have to change them for another 16k. A friend of mine has a Legacy 2.5GT (same motor) and said he has to rotate the engine to get to the plugs.
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Old 07-01-2010, 11:49 PM   #5
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Subaru fails!

Why are they still using an archaic 4spd auto trans in a $25K vehicle?
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Old 07-02-2010, 12:19 AM   #6
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oh really? Good to know! I don't have to change them for another 16k. A friend of mine has a Legacy 2.5GT (same motor) and said he has to rotate the engine to get to the plugs.
Honestly, your friend is an idiot. I had never done it before so I admit to spending 2 hours changing them on my LGT. The only extra thing I removed was part of the intake.

I don't even know why this whole chain thing is such a big deal to everyone. Its not like they never need attention and they can certainly fail. This really only affects people who are too cheap to properly maintain their vehicles.
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Old 07-02-2010, 01:33 AM   #7
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He's usually pretty good with mechanical stuff - far better than me. Interesting - good to hear it's not a big deal.

I don't see what the big deal is about timing belt / chain either...replacement interval for the belt is 105,000 miles. That's a long time...
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Old 07-02-2010, 05:49 AM   #8
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Chains last longer and no maintenance schedule whatsoever, unlike the belt, but you guys know that
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Old 07-02-2010, 08:41 AM   #9
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Subaru fails!

Why are they still using an archaic 4spd auto trans in a $25K vehicle?
Exactly... My wife wanted to look at one, but I told her I wasn't going to buy a 2010 model with a 4 speed auto.
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Old 07-02-2010, 08:54 AM   #10
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He's usually pretty good with mechanical stuff - far better than me. Interesting - good to hear it's not a big deal.

I don't see what the big deal is about timing belt / chain either...replacement interval for the belt is 105,000 miles. That's a long time...
Plugs are still a PITA, and if you want to disconnect the motor mounts (which IIRC is a PITA) and probably exhaust too, then you can jack the motor up a bit to get easier access to the plugs. But you would still need to remove the battery and probably the intake, at least on the LGT.

But in no way do you HAVE to move the engine. The driver's rear plug is the 45 minute job the first time you do it; the rest are 10-15 minutes each. Once you've done it the first time, it's cake.

And the big deal about the timing chain is that it's likelihood of failure is far less than a belt. This matters because all of the DOHC (and 97+ SOHC) Subaru EJ motors are an interference design - the valves and pistons will collide if the timing is off, i.e. timing belt failure.

105K miles may not be much, but the timing belt job is a huge PITA to do. It costs several hundred dollars in labor alone.
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Old 07-02-2010, 08:56 AM   #11
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Exactly... My wife wanted to look at one, but I told her I wasn't going to buy a 2010 model with a 4 speed auto.
As far as autos go, it's not a bad one. The engine is very torquey down low, compared to most four bangers, and the gears are relatively short, so its not terrible. But it really is just...archaic.
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Old 07-02-2010, 09:02 AM   #12
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oh really? Good to know! I don't have to change them for another 16k. A friend of mine has a Legacy 2.5GT (same motor) and said he has to rotate the engine to get to the plugs.
No you don't.

http://legacygt.com/forums/showthrea...ons-12070.html
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Old 07-02-2010, 09:03 AM   #13
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Subaru fails!

Why are they still using an archaic 4spd auto trans in a $25K vehicle?
My Maxima has a 4spd auto...and it's wrong wheel drive!
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Old 07-02-2010, 09:13 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by fbrdphreak View Post
Plugs are still a PITA, and if you want to disconnect the motor mounts (which IIRC is a PITA) and probably exhaust too, then you can jack the motor up a bit to get easier access to the plugs. But you would still need to remove the battery and probably the intake, at least on the LGT.

But in no way do you HAVE to move the engine. The driver's rear plug is the 45 minute job the first time you do it; the rest are 10-15 minutes each. Once you've done it the first time, it's cake.

And the big deal about the timing chain is that it's likelihood of failure is far less than a belt. This matters because all of the DOHC (and 97+ SOHC) Subaru EJ motors are an interference design - the valves and pistons will collide if the timing is off, i.e. timing belt failure.

105K miles may not be much, but the timing belt job is a huge PITA to do. It costs several hundred dollars in labor alone.
$440 parts and labor at a dealer, plus another $185 for the tensioner. I think I will be doing it..
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Old 07-02-2010, 10:00 AM   #15
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Honestly, your friend is an idiot. I had never done it before so I admit to spending 2 hours changing them on my LGT. The only extra thing I removed was part of the intake.

I don't even know why this whole chain thing is such a big deal to everyone. Its not like they never need attention and they can certainly fail. This really only affects people who are too cheap to properly maintain their vehicles.
Chain > Belt. Timing chains with metal sprockets will easily last 200K or more miles. a Belt you're supposed to change at 90K.
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Old 07-02-2010, 10:06 AM   #16
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Chain > Belt. Timing chains with metal sprockets will easily last 200K or more miles. a Belt you're supposed to change at 90K.
Unless it's a Lambo, then it will stretch at 90K and trash the motor
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Old 07-02-2010, 10:07 AM   #17
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Chain > Belt. Timing chains with metal sprockets will easily last 200K or more miles. a Belt you're supposed to change at 90K.
Nobody's arguing that. Belt service interval will depend on the vehicle - 105K for my Subaru and 60K for my MR2.

Assuming 10,000 miles per year, I don't think a timing belt service every ten years is going to break the bank. Hell I am the second owner of my '04 Subaru at 103k - which means the first owner had it for seven years and never had to change the timing belt.
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Old 07-02-2010, 12:03 PM   #18
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With those crummy gas mileage numbers, why would you not buy a real truck? The idea of an econobox-based softroader getting 21/27 makes me nauseous
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Old 07-02-2010, 12:48 PM   #19
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Nobody's arguing that. Belt service interval will depend on the vehicle - 105K for my Subaru and 60K for my MR2.

Assuming 10,000 miles per year, I don't think a timing belt service every ten years is going to break the bank. Hell I am the second owner of my '04 Subaru at 103k - which means the first owner had it for seven years and never had to change the timing belt.
Well that's good for you. My 1987 Trans Am only has 140K on the clock so around 6K per year, but my 06 Silverado has 100K on it.
I prefer vehicles that aren't designed as a means of selling dealership services.
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Old 07-02-2010, 04:11 PM   #20
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With those crummy gas mileage numbers, why would you not buy a real truck? The idea of an econobox-based softroader getting 21/27 makes me nauseous
My truck gets 14/16, and my FXT is a hell of a lot more fun to drive.

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Well that's good for you. My 1987 Trans Am only has 140K on the clock so around 6K per year, but my 06 Silverado has 100K on it.
I prefer vehicles that aren't designed as a means of selling dealership services.
To each his own. I'm happy with go-anywhere in the winter and a 13 second quarter, but that's me.
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Old 07-02-2010, 05:50 PM   #21
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I was going to say, my dad's 4x2 Tacoma regular cab 4-banger with stick is only rated 21/27 or so. He certainly doesn't get 21 around town.
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Old 07-02-2010, 05:59 PM   #22
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I was going to say, my dad's 4x2 Tacoma regular cab 4-banger with stick is only rated 21/27 or so. He certainly doesn't get 21 around town.
Yeah, I don't know of many (any, really) "real trucks" (I assume he means full size?) that get 27mpg on the highway. Even my Tacoma (V6 4x4 5sp) got maybe 20-21 highway..I don't think you're going to find a full sized truck pulling 27mpg anywhere.
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Old 07-02-2010, 07:14 PM   #23
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My truck gets 14/16, and my FXT is a hell of a lot more fun to drive.



To each his own. I'm happy with go-anywhere in the winter and a 13 second quarter, but that's me.
See how fun it is on a trail!
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Old 07-02-2010, 07:16 PM   #24
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Yeah, I don't know of many (any, really) "real trucks" (I assume he means full size?) that get 27mpg on the highway. Even my Tacoma (V6 4x4 5sp) got maybe 20-21 highway..I don't think you're going to find a full sized truck pulling 27mpg anywhere.
When Jeep starts selling Wranglers with the diesel, we'll have a real SUV that gets equivalent gas mileage to the Subaru.
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Old 07-02-2010, 07:52 PM   #25
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My Maxima has a 4spd auto...and it's wrong wheel drive!
Maxima is from what 2002 or 2003? We are talking about a 2011 car that sells for $25K.
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